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Subject: In Which I Claim that Agricola is Only Slightly Above Average. rss

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Dan Vore
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While I'm dying to play this game, I appreciate your thoughts. I just laugh at how people take something personal over someone's opinion on a game. Thanks for taking the time to share your thoughts.

quick q: how long does this game take to set up?
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Justin Redmon
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chang1701 wrote:
While I'm dying to play this game, I appreciate your thoughts. I just laugh at how people take something personal over someone's opinion on a game. Thanks for taking the time to share your thoughts.

quick q: how long does this game take to set up?


I've never understood it, either. It seems more common on BGG than anywhere else, really. And yes, I'd suggest that you try this game soon. While I don't love it, I understand why many people do.

It's been so long since I've played it that I can't give you a truthful estimate about how long it'll take to set up. You'll have to give each player a board, their family members and fences, occupation cards, minor improvements. Then for the action cards (maybe the other's, too, I can't remember), depending on the number of players some of these will need to be set aside.

You'll also need an area for a common board for the action cards and the major improvements and an area to store all the resources that will be added to the board as the game progresses.
 
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Geoff Burkman
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Man, oh, man, I knew there was a reason I chose not to respond to this review.












Ah, crap...gulp
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Brad Morgan
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chang1701 wrote:
I just laugh at how people take something personal over someone's opinion on a game.


Although I disagree with this reviewer that Agricola is an average game, I understand that these are his personal feelings about this game. Aren't all reviews just one person's personal feeling about a game?

Again, I don't personally find this reviewer's rating system all that satisfying, again, he has taken the time to explain it over and over again. And this is the beauty of the wonderfully interactive user-base here at BGG. If we don't find a review to be all that helpful for one reason or another, it is usually pretty simple to find another 25 reviews. Very infrequently do I read 1 review and make up my mind on a game. I look for a couple of positive reviews and a couple of negative reviews, and I than make an educated decision about whether a game may be something I want to try or not.

In conclusion, I didn't find this review all that helpful. I didn't like the grading system that was used. But, I will say that I have played this game probably 100 times, and I have never taken the time to write a review, so I would like to thank
Justin Redmon
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for taking the time and effort to be an active participant in the BGG community.

And I would just like to politely say that as a couple of reasonable gentlemen, we are just going to have to agree to disagree on this one. As my wife is fond of saying, "Different people like different things".
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Paul Sapiro
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Agricola » Forums » Reviews
Re: In Which I Claim that Agricola is Only Slightly Above Average.
BMinNY wrote:
chang1701 wrote:
I just laugh at how people take something personal over someone's opinion on a game.


Although I disagree with this reviewer that Agricola is an average game, I understand that these are his personal feelings about this game. Aren't all reviews just one person's personal feeling about a game?

Again, I don't personally find this reviewer's rating system all that satisfying, again, he has taken the time to explain it over and over again. And this is the beauty of the wonderfully interactive user-base here at BGG. If we don't find a review to be all that helpful for one reason or another, it is usually pretty simple to find another 25 reviews. Very infrequently do I read 1 review and make up my mind on a game. I look for a couple of positive reviews and a couple of negative reviews, and I than make an educated decision about whether a game may be something I want to try or not.

In conclusion, I didn't find this review all that helpful. I didn't like the grading system that was used. But, I will say that I have played this game probably 100 times, and I have never taken the time to write a review, so I would like to thank
Justin Redmon
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for taking the time and effort to be an active participant in the BGG community.

And I would just like to politely say that as a couple of reasonable gentlemen, we are just going to have to agree to disagree on this one. As my wife is fond of saying, "Different people like different things".


Couldn't agree more
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Its a good thing we all have different tastes. Otherwise, the gaming industry would fall flat on its face.

Really, the only time a review can epic fail is when the reviewer cheesed a rule or two and based the review on that experience. That certainly happens often on BGG enough to pose some questions at times.

Not sure that is the case here.
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Manuel Pasi
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dlikos wrote:
Jabbing my eye out with a silver spoon

Players 1-10

Components - 10 - Hell Yeah, the spoon is silver!

Rules - 10 - Jab spoon in eye...twist. Pretty easy to learn!

Setup - 10 - Takes less than 10 seconds to set up.

Area required to play - 10 - I can play this on the bus on my way to work!

Fun - 1 - This game sucks!

Theme Integration/Mechanics - 10 - Doesn't get more real than this!

Replay Value - 1 - Pretty sure I don't want to play again!

Storage - 10 - Fits right in with my silver ware!

Accessability - 10 - Anyone can play!

Overall Bonuses/Bias - 0

72!

7.2



Pretty Awesome Rating System





I can't remember the last time that I laughed so hard...actual flowing of tears was involved!

Though one word on replayability: if you play this by the rules you can't play more than twice anyway...
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Sean Shaw
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Thanks for your review and you're rating. Don't let some of the people here get on your back, then again, you know that as you've been around for awhile.

Some cannot take criticism of their favorite games...at all.

I appreciate that some reviews are more than what these people typically say which is....

"I love this game and so should you...anyone who doesn't love it is a potty potty poo poo..."

Or at least that's the major mentality that goes around.

You didn't actually even criticize the game that much...and your score is still a fair score overall.

So thanks for sharing.


PS: On the otherhand, my wife loves Agricola...and if I don't love it to I'm a...well...you know....

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Justin Redmon
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GreyLord wrote:
Thanks for your review and you're rating. Don't let some of the people here get on your back, then again, you know that as you've been around for awhile.

Some cannot take criticism of their favorite games...at all.

I appreciate that some reviews are more than what these people typically say which is....

I love this game and so should you...anyone who doesn't love it is a potty potty poo poo...

Or at least that's the major mentality that goes around.

You didn't actually even criticize the game that much...and your score is still a fair score overall.

So thanks for sharing.


PS: On the otherhand, my wife loves Agricola...and if I don't love it to I'm a...well...you know....



Thank you! I feel like a lot of my responses online are kind of lost in translation. People tend to think that I'm expressing offense when often times I'm only showing humor. Offending me is actually a very difficult thing to do, and I try to ignore my ego as much as possible.

Yet, while it's hard to hurt my feelings, it's just as easy to boost feelings of positivity. So again, thank you for the kind words.
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JrStrange wrote:
GreyLord wrote:
Thanks for your review and you're rating. Don't let some of the people here get on your back, then again, you know that as you've been around for awhile.

Some cannot take criticism of their favorite games...at all.

I appreciate that some reviews are more than what these people typically say which is....

I love this game and so should you...anyone who doesn't love it is a potty potty poo poo...

Or at least that's the major mentality that goes around.

You didn't actually even criticize the game that much...and your score is still a fair score overall.

So thanks for sharing.


PS: On the otherhand, my wife loves Agricola...and if I don't love it to I'm a...well...you know....



Thank you! I feel like a lot of my responses online are kind of lost in translation. People tend to think that I'm expressing offense when often times I'm only showing humor. Offending me is actually a very difficult thing to do, and I try to ignore my ego as much as possible.

Yet, while it's hard to hurt my feelings, it's just as easy to boost feelings of positivity. So again, thank you for the kind words.


Freakin' tree-hugging, kumbaya Honey Badger...

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Justin Redmon
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Bro, why you so mad?
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markgravitygood wrote:
JrStrange wrote:
GreyLord wrote:
Thanks for your review and you're rating. Don't let some of the people here get on your back, then again, you know that as you've been around for awhile.

Some cannot take criticism of their favorite games...at all.

I appreciate that some reviews are more than what these people typically say which is....

I love this game and so should you...anyone who doesn't love it is a potty potty poo poo...

Or at least that's the major mentality that goes around.

You didn't actually even criticize the game that much...and your score is still a fair score overall.

So thanks for sharing.


PS: On the otherhand, my wife loves Agricola...and if I don't love it to I'm a...well...you know....



Thank you! I feel like a lot of my responses online are kind of lost in translation. People tend to think that I'm expressing offense when often times I'm only showing humor. Offending me is actually a very difficult thing to do, and I try to ignore my ego as much as possible.

Yet, while it's hard to hurt my feelings, it's just as easy to boost feelings of positivity. So again, thank you for the kind words.


Freakin' tree-hugging, kumbaya Honey Badger...



Don't get me started on how the Honey Badger represents the very worst in all of us! The Honey Badger, the most party ready creature in nature, is a hairy manifestation of the "It" the "Id". It's as if nature killed his ego, but instead of it being replaced with a loss of individuality and a connection to all things, perhaps an inflated super-ego, all that was left was his urge to fulfill the desire of the moment. Really, he's like a LaVeyan Satanist without any regard whatsoever to self control.

My personal philosophy is centered on the teachings of the Christ, don't take me wrong. I keep the Honey Badger there as a reminder of just how easy is it to be unintentionally evil.
 
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I feel ya...there is a strawberry blonde I work with known as the honey badger. You describe her perfectly!

meeple

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Jim Cobb
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Svartisen wrote:

...
(ii) Farming theme. It takes place after the Thirty Years' War, and not in the Middle Ages.
...


Not sure where you got this idea. On the cover of the rulebook, right underneath "Agricola", is this quote:

"The 17th Century: Not an easy time for farming"

Then this opening:

"Central Europe, around 1670 AD. The Plague which has raged since 1348 has finally been overcome. The civilized world is revitalized."


 
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Bryan Thunkd
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Jim Cobb wrote:
Svartisen wrote:

...
(ii) Farming theme. It takes place after the Thirty Years' War, and not in the Middle Ages.
...


Not sure where you got this idea. On the cover of the rulebook, right underneath "Agricola", is this quote:

"The 17th Century: Not an easy time for farming"

Then this opening:

"Central Europe, around 1670 AD. The Plague which has raged since 1348 has finally been overcome. The civilized world is revitalized."



The Thirty Years' War ended in 1648, so Agricola is indeed after it. And that would not be the Middle Ages which ended in the 15th century, so I'm not sure where you are getting your ideas.
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Jim Cobb
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Thunkd wrote:
Jim Cobb wrote:
Svartisen wrote:

...
(ii) Farming theme. It takes place after the Thirty Years' War, and not in the Middle Ages.
...


Not sure where you got this idea. On the cover of the rulebook, right underneath "Agricola", is this quote:

"The 17th Century: Not an easy time for farming"

Then this opening:

"Central Europe, around 1670 AD. The Plague which has raged since 1348 has finally been overcome. The civilized world is revitalized."



The Thirty Years' War ended in 1648, so Agricola is indeed after it. And that would not be the Middle Ages which ended in the 15th century, so I'm not sure where you are getting your ideas.


("Really? Wikipedia, Wikipedia... Aw, rats!")

Ah, well, if you're going to go and get all accurate on me...

Then I think we can guess where I pulled my ideas from.

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Just call me Erik
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Justin,

Thank you for reviewing Agricola! Even though I agree with the sentiment that your rating system is kind of I like that you posted it there for us to read, and I also like that you're so good natured about the replies it's gotten! Keep it up!

I agree that Agricola is above average at best, but for different reasons. I may review it if I ever play it again.
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dlikos wrote:
Jabbing my eye out with a silver spoon

Players 1-10

Components - 10 - Hell Yeah, the spoon is silver!

Rules - 10 - Jab spoon in eye...twist. Pretty easy to learn!

Setup - 10 - Takes less than 10 seconds to set up.

Area required to play - 10 - I can play this on the bus on my way to work!

Fun - 1 - This game sucks!

Theme Integration/Mechanics - 10 - Doesn't get more real than this!

Replay Value - 1 - Pretty sure I don't want to play again!

Storage - 10 - Fits right in with my silver ware!

Accessability - 10 - Anyone can play!

Overall Bonuses/Bias - 0

72!

7.2



Pretty Awesome Rating System


You, sir, have won the internets
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Robin Walters
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What an uninformed reader might deduce from the above discussion is that it is a pretty close run thing between Agricola and Eye Jabber (TM), and that it all depends on your personal weighting of the different factors.

I must agree that this is a fairly accurate conclusion. Even with drafting (absolutely essential for Agricola to be playable at all IMHO), Agricola is thematically broken - specialisation is a completely non-viable strategy, which makes no sense at all. That it marginally beats spooning your eyes out with a spoon is entirely due to the fact that it only wastes 3 hours of your life rather than permanently disabling you.
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Wow. Why didn't I think of that?shake
 
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Matt N

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To beat a dead horse here, people would presumably like to see a scale that's more reliable and less dependent on biases. I do consider numbers to be a good thing, as long as people interpret them within reason (4/10 and 5/10 are basically the same).

If you set a sensible weighting scale in advance, and then add a bias at the end that's not bigger than 10%, people will probably respond more positively.

My personal weighting would probably be something like:

Components: 3%
Rules: 5%
Setup: 5%
Area required: 1%
Fun: 40%
Theme: 5%
Replay value: 30%
Storage: 1%
Accessibility: 10%

I had to fudge the numbers a bit to get 100%. You would want to come up with some reasonable weighting yourself (perhaps valuing components more).

By that measure using your ratings, Agricola comes out to 8.54. Silver spoon comes out to 3.7, but I don't agree with the suggested ratings for that... (1/10 for replay value and 10/10 for theme? That guy's obviously biased because he got a free copy from the manufacturer...)
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Dan Likos
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3.7 Much better

Right between 4 - This game doesn't get me, would need serious convincing to play again, and 3 - Will not Play again...Bad.
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Donald Duck
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How did this game end up as 3rd best on BGG?
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Mathue Faulk
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Epicus Donaldus wrote:
How did this game end up as 3rd best on BGG?

Because for some, it's an awesomely tense and strategic game filled with tough decisions...
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Bryan Thunkd
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Epicus Donaldus wrote:
How did this game end up as 3rd best on BGG?


Because quite a few people have rated it highly? Like my rating of 10?
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Manuel Pasi
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Epicus Donaldus wrote:
How did this game end up as 3rd best on BGG?


It has to do with the fact that the farmers' lobby is much stronger than you'd believe.
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