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Sam Butler
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Well, I did it! Got the game. I will post a review once I play; don't have the time tonight, with the late day at work, but I want to get something posted!

I will assume you have read the other rules thread with the translation. Hopefully the rules will be posted online soon for all to read.

First thing I noticed--The game comes ready for any one of three languages: English, German, and French. There is essentially no difference between the expansion, other than the cover of the box. The rules and cards are both printed in all three languages, and the boards do not use language-dependent stuff. So, if you can pick up the German or French editions easier, they will have English components as well. (The reverse is also true -- the English version will also have German and French.) This is true at least for the US English version, and I would imagine it is true in general.

For gameplay, there are a few things to point out:

* Each board has a total of 5 enemies of different colors. Some of the enemies are normal, some deal double damage (execute the space it lands on twice), and some have "surge" capability (where they cannot be blocked, except by Aragorn).

* For Fellowship pieces, the details are as follows:
-- Gandalf (2 jokers) destroys the piece that moves onto its space, and itself. You receive a reward for destroying the piece in this manner, dependent upon the enemy.
-- Aragorn (3 fights) blocks all enemies, including surge enemies, from entering a space.
-- Gimli & Legolas (2 fights) block all normal enemies from entering a space, but do not block surge enemies. If a surge enemy attempts to enter the space, then Gimli/Legolas is removed, but the damage from that space is not dealt.
-- Boromir (1 fight) does not block any enemies, but the damage on that space is not dealt.
-- Each fellowship piece, and each enemy piece, may be used once per battle.
-- Fellowship pieces cannot be played on filled spaces (generally these are numbered entry spaces, spaces with a vanish symbol, and the big red eye in Mordor -- although there are a couple boards with other spaces like this)

* Along the lines of destroying pieces, there are two other methods besides Gandalf:
-- Pay 2 jokers to destroy an enemy that is within a square space
-- Play the appropriate Gandalf card
-- Destroying a piece in either of those two manners, or with Gandalf, gives you a reward depending upon the enemy destroyed.

* Trigger tiles almost always will have something on them. Some of them can be quite devastating, it would appear. There are 3 blanks -- not much. The 6th event became worse (as if it weren't bad enough already), in that all leftover trigger tiles are assumed to be placed on the 6th event.

* When drawing a trigger tile with something on it, enemy movement occurs. This cannot be interrupted by the ringbearer. (I assume it can be interrupted by Gandalf, though, since the rules do not state otherwise.) All trigger tiles are executed, even if a hobbit dies. (Of course, if the ringbearer dies, the game is over.) Swords are executed from top to bottom, and have various colors. There are anywhere between 0 and 5 swords, though most have at least 1.
-- If the appropriate colored enemy for that board is not in play, then it enters play on a space from 1 to 4 (as indicated on the trigger tile). If that space is taken, enter on the next higher number (cycle back to 1 if 4 is taken). If all numbered spaces are taken, then the enemy does not enter.
-- If the sword is in play, then advance the appropriate colored enemy along the red arrow if possible (not blocked); otherwise, advance along the white arrow.

* There are plenty of new symbols.
-- Most interesting IMHO, it is possible to move the Sauron figure backward on the influence track, as symbolized by the outlined eye symbol.
-- There are spaces which move you backward on the main event track. Trigger events and board symbols are not executed again when moving backwards; however, they *are* executed again when you move forward across them again. Depending upon where you are on the board, this can make things quite difficult. Or, it also makes it possible to employ a strategy where you collect rings, spend them to destroy a life token foe or prevent an event, move backwards on the main track, then collect the rings again. (You can't collect more than 5 rings at any one time, though.)
-- The sword symbol means you draw another trigger tile from the 6th event stack and execute it immediately (provided there is still more than one trigger tile on the 6th event stack).
-- The big eye space on Mordor's battle board is now red.

These changes appear to have made the game more difficult, as it appears there is a lot more bad stuff added to the game than good. There is no reason why you can't play this with the Sauron expansion, although there is no direct tie-in like with F&F. You can also play simply the base game + Battlefields.

It looks extremely exciting! I can't wait to play the game!

Sam
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Bryan Stout
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Congrats! I won't get mine until the end of next week (after I get back from a conference ).

Could you give us more info on the nature of the components? E.g.:
- 3 tiles are blank; how many have 1,2,...5 swords?
- Is there a correlation between enemy color and their symbols? Between color and starting number?
- Besides the Big Eye in Mordor, do the battleboards tend to have the same mix of harmful symbols, or are they significantly different?
- What do the new yellow cards do?

Or, if you could post a picture or two of representative details, that would be great.
 
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Sam Butler
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Lord of the Rings: Battlefields » Forums » Rules
Re: Rules
Barliman wrote:

Could you give us more info on the nature of the components? E.g.:
- 3 tiles are blank; how many have 1,2,...5 swords?
- Is there a correlation between enemy color and their symbols? Between color and starting number?
- Besides the Big Eye in Mordor, do the battleboards tend to have the same mix of harmful symbols, or are they significantly different?
- What do the new yellow cards do?

Sure thing; breakout is as follows: (For multiple swords, they are listed in the order executed. The starting square for a new enemy is listed in parens):

3 blank tiles
7 tiles with one sword
-- red (4)
-- red (1)
-- black (3)
-- green (2)
-- violet (2)
-- white (1)
-- white (1)
6 tiles with two swords
-- double green with surge (3) (makes enemy have surge capability for that turn, even if it normally does not)
-- double violet (3)
-- double black (4)
-- violet/black with surge (4)
-- green/violet (1)
-- red/green (2)
3 tiles with three swords
-- triple black (2)
-- red/white/violet (3)
-- green/white/black (4)
(no tiles with 4 swords)
1 tile with five swords
-- white/red/green/violet/black (1)

There are 6 enemies per color (1 per color each scenario; 5 enemies total per scenario). Rewards vary per enemy, but there are a couple of general inferences that can be made:
-- All red enemies do double damage when they land on a damaging space (they execute a tile's instructions twice). One red enemy is particularly evil, with a double damage and surge, in Shelob's Lair.
-- All white enemies have permanent surge capability
-- All black, violet, and green enemies do not have any special characteristics

The battle boards are structured quite differently. Mordor, for instance, has no squares, so the only ways to defeat an enemy in Mordor is with the Gandalf figure or the Gandalf card. (All other boards have at least one space with squares.) Actually, for Mordor, the red eye is a square, but the game ends immediately according to p. 7 of the rules, so you can't defeat a foe there.

The Bree board appears most tame, with 6 bad spaces out of 15.
Moria: 8 bad spaces out of 16.
Isengard: 8 bad spaces out of 16. (different bad stuff than with Moria, although they appear to be roughly equal in difficulty)
Helm's Deep: 10 bad spaces out of 17. (Some of the bad stuff is quite bad -- such as rolling the die twice for active player or for ringbearer).
Shelob's Lair: 10 bad spaces out of 17. (There is a ringbearer roll die twice space, and a double-eye space, of particular brutality; plus a ringbearer gain 3 corruption space -- this one's worse than Helm's Deep)
Mordor: 11 bad spaces out of 15. (Literally ever space is marked -- either as a starting space or a bad space.)

The difficulty progresses as the game moves on.

New cards are as follows:
Celeborn (Lothlorien - white): double joker
Elessar Telecontar (Lothlorien - white): triple fight
Quickbeam (Lothlorien - gray): double fight
Bow of the Galadrim (Rivendell - yellow): ignore all damage caused by one enemy on one space on the Battlefield board
Corsair Ship (Rivendell - yellow): Active player places one fellowship piece on the Battlefield board (it sounds like this placement is free, but the card and rules do not specify)
Beacons (Rivendell): Discard any two face-down trigger tiles from the Scenario board
Gandalf Onslaught: Defeat any one Enemy on the Battlefield board
Gandalf Wizardry: Ignore one trigger tile after turning it face up
Reinforcement: Place any two Fellowship pieces on the Battlefield board (again, I assume it is free placement)

One very important note is that "At any time during your turn, particularly after turning up a trigger tile and before activating an Enemy piece, you may discard cards with the required number of fighting or star symbols to place a Fellowship piece on to the Battlefield board. " So you can place the Fellowship piece after you know how the enemies will move, but before they actually do move. You can't place a fellowship piece on a shaded space, or on a space with an enemy already.

Finally, my list of new symbols above was done from memory, I missed a few. Here is the comprehensive list of new symbols:
-- Lightning bolt: Charging enemy (Surge)
-- Double damage looks like the double wound icon from Beowulf (hard to describe -- two side-by-side explosions)
-- Vanish -- remove an enemy from the board, but no reward is given. Generally, spaces with a "Vanish" icon also have additional bad consequences
-- Shield with X -- active player loses all shields
-- Big red eye -- lose immediately (in Mordor)
-- Yellow arrow w/ number -- move back the indicated spaces on the Activity line
-- Sword -- draw a trigger tile
There are also the familiar symbols from the other games.

Rewards for defeating enemies:
-- Yellow figure -- place a fellowship piece
-- Outlined eye -- Sauron moves away from Hobbits on corruption track
-- Red number -- Draw the indicated number of cards
-- Blue number -- Gain the indicated number of shields
-- Two hands w/ an X -- Defeat the two leftmost foes (F&F only -- the enemies with this icon only appear in F&F; one in Isengard, one in Bree)

It looks like we are in for a real challenge! Mordor in particular will be quite difficult, as one could expect. The battle boards get progressively more difficult as scenarios pass on. This may also make side tracks more valuable, since they do not generate trigger tiles -- but you must be careful to not let the events pile up too badly. I can also anticipate at least my initial gut strategy is that it is now worth it to put the ring on in every scenario (except possibly Bree), since that is the only way to prevent trigger tiles from being executed. I also can see it valuable to get rid of or contain the white and red enemies especially quickly -- red in particular, and white to a somewhat lesser, though still high priority, extent.

Sam
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Sam Butler
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There's one more thing I forgot to say. You can also elect to take your turn in order to place a Fellowship player. (I assume this is free -- since the payment is 1 turn.)

Sam
 
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Bryan Stout
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Thanks a heap for the details! It's interesting to see the trend of greater damage in the later boards. That parallels the trend in Scenario boards to have more Activity line spaces to traverse in the later boards.

I'm already noticing some interesting patterns in the tiles and pieces, but I'll wait to share my observations until I've had the game and played it for a while.

In the picture section, we see part of the Helm's Deep Scenario board art as the background to a trigger tile. Do all tiles have that same background, or does it vary?

Thanks again.
 
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Michael Kröhnert
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Barliman wrote:

In the picture section, we see part of the Helm's Deep Scenario board art as the background to a trigger tile. Do all tiles have that same background, or does it vary?


It is always the same illustration (without any symbols or icons on a couple of tiles).
 
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Derek Coon
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Thank you for the tile list. (If you have some time and want to give the symbols on the enemies, I promise to read it!) One of the questions that I felt would be important was "Where is the first enemy most likely to appear?" This is because the placement of Aragorn by the first player as his end of turn action (when the board is completely empty) could turn out to be a keystone for the battlefield board. So I did a quick tabulation of the tiles and the answer is "anywhere."

Starting position 1 4 tiles
Starting position 2 4 tiles
Starting position 3 4 tiles
Starting position 4 4 tiles

First enemies color
white 3 tiles
red 4 tiles
green 4 tiles
violet 3 tiles
black 3 tiles

So my current thinking is that pre-emptively placing a Fellowship marker will depend more upon which tiles have been drawn since the initial probabilities are relatively even. Placing markers reactively might be a better bet in most cases, however there are some boards where the choke points are obvious and you would still want your FSP markers there.
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Sam Butler
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I'll get the full list of enemy symbols up soon (just have a brief second right now, though) -- but for now, let me give the general impression that usually, the "worse" an enemy is, the less it is actually worth to kill. For instance, the Balrog in Moria (double damage) is only worth 1 shield if you kill it. This makes for an intriguing balance -- getting rid of the Balrog is nice, but would you rather use the Gandalf piece to get rid of something that gives you a better benefit? Then again, that means the Balrog may do more damage...

Let me reiterate again that there are a few different ways to place pieces:
* At any point in the game, including after a trigger tile is revealed but before it is executed, the active player may pay the cost indicated on the Fellowship piece in order to place it.
* In place of drawing 2 hobbit cards or moving 1 in the light, you can skip your "good" portion of the turn in order to place any remaining Fellowship piece. This does not cost any cards.
* You may call Gandalf at any time to place 2 remaining Fellowship pieces for free (once per game).
* You may play the Yellow card that allows you to place a remaining Fellowship piece for free (once per game).

There are also a few ways to kill enemies and get the reward:
* Play 2 jokers while an enemy is in a square space. (Frodo's ability just became even more valuable than it already was! Likewise, the double joker Gandalf card just increased in value also!) -- Right now, I await an answer from FFG on whether you can kill an enemy in the red eye space in Mordor, but Barliman and I agree this is not possible. It is possible to use Gandalf or a Yellow card to kill an enemy at the red eye, however.
* Have an enemy collide with the Gandalf piece (this also removes Gandalf from the scenario)
* Call Gandalf to kill an enemy

More to come later with enemy details; I'm glad it's almost the weekend!
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Sam Butler
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As promised, here are the enemy details. The format is: Enemy - Special Abilities (Reward if killed). So, for example, Moria Red: double damage (1 shield) means the Moria red enemy does double damage, and killing it yields 1 shield.

Bree:
Red - Double damage (heal 1 corruption)
White - Charge (2 shields)
Black - None (defeat 2 foes)
Violet - None (2 hobbit cards)
Green - None (3 shields)

Moria:
Red - Double damage (1 shield)
White - Charge (5 shields)
Black - None (heal 2 corruption)
Violet - None (2 hobbit cards)
Green - None (place 1 Fellowship piece for free)

Isengard:
Red - Double damage (place 1 Fellowship piece for free)
White - Charge (heal 2 corruption)
Black - None (3 hobbit cards)
Violet - None (Sauron moves 1 space backward)
Green - None (defeat 2 foes)

Helm's Deep:
Red - Double damage (heal 2 corruption)
White - Charge (Sauron moves 1 space backward)
Black - None (3 shields)
Violet - None (place 1 Fellowship piece for free)
Green - None (3 hobbit cards)

Shelob's Lair:
Red - Double damage, Charge (1 hobbit card)
White - Charge (heal 1 corruption)
Black - None (Sauron moves 1 space backward)
Violet - None (3 shields)
Green - None (heal 3 corruption)

Mordor:
Red - Double damage (5 shields)
White - Charge (place 1 Fellowship piece for free)
Black - None (3 hobbit cards)
Violet - None (heal 2 corruption)
Green - None (Sauron moves 1 space backward)

I have placed the enemies in order for what I think (based on only 1 play, so take with a grain of salt) is the rough order of difficulty of the enemies. Red are most difficult, white #2, etc. Violet and Green are about the same difficulty. Black is slightly more difficult because of all the black swords on the triggers. (There is in particular a triple black sword that is quite difficult to deal with.)

Sam
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Sam Butler
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Bullroarer Took wrote:

Starting position 1 4 tiles
Starting position 2 4 tiles
Starting position 3 4 tiles
Starting position 4 4 tiles

First enemies color
white 3 tiles
red 4 tiles
green 4 tiles
violet 3 tiles
black 3 tiles

Minor correction -- Starting position 1 has a total of 5 tiles. I think you missed the 5-sword tile on my list when tabulating. Nonetheless, the distribution is still roughly equal, and your other points are valid.

If you are both willing and able to give up fight cards (which is more likely when playing a F&F board, or on the Mordor track), then your conclusions are somewhat irrelevant, since you might as well wait to see what triggers are drawn prior to placing any FSP pieces. Keep in mind that if you are willing to pay the indicated cost, you can play FSP pieces at any time, on any free square that is not shaded -- including after the trigger tile has been revealed but before it has been acted upon.

Still, if you don't want to (or can't) pay the cost, you are correct in your analysis.

Sam
 
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Sam Butler
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Here is one other useful tally:

Total number of swords broken down by color:
* 5 Red
* 5 White
* 9 Black
* 7 Green
* 7 Violet

Black pieces can really move rapidly; red & white pieces are deadly but slower in movement; green & violet pieces are average in movement.

Of course, this will not always be the case, as it is possible to avoid certain tiles (before you know what they are). But on average, this is true.

Sam
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Matthew M Monin
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I'd give this thread three more thumbs up if I could. Licking my chops Thanks for all of the interesting analyses.

Would you care to hazard a guess on what baddie each token represents? Who are the big mean Red tokens for each board? What about the unstoppable whites? And the quick black creatures? Interested to see how much they tried to incorporate theme, given the language constraints, and how well it works.

-MMM
 
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Douglas Buel
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Octavian wrote:
Would you care to hazard a guess on what baddie each token represents?


Some of them are very clear from the pictures, while some are a little more ambiguous:

Bree
Red - The witch king
White - A black rider still on a horse
Green - Black rider with a knife
Purple - Black rider with a sword
Black - Black rider with a two-handed sword

Moria
Red - The balrog
White - A cave troll
Green - Not sure. He looks almost like a zombie. He seems to have sharp teeth, so perhaps he's a not-so-ugly orc
Purple - An orc with an open-face helmet
Black - An orc with a full helmet, perhaps elite

Isengard
Red - Orc (Uruk?) in full helmet (perhaps a commander or elite)
White - A orc in chainmail and half-plate
Green - An orc pikeman in a formation
Purple - An orc with an elaborate helmet
Black - Orc in full chainmail with half-plate and a polearm

Helm's Deep
Red - The same orc as the white one from Isengard
White - An orc beside a worg
Green - The same orc with elaborate helmet as the purple from Isengard
Purple - The same orc pikeman in formation as the green from Isengard
Black - A Dunlending

Shelob's Lair
Red - Mumak
White - Figure in Gondorian armor -- same picture as Gothmog in BotTA
Green - Bronze (or is it brass?) armor, serpent on helmet, face is turned away
Purple - Nazgul on winged beast
Black - Witch king

Mordor
Red - Nazgul on winged beast, same as purple from Shelob's Lair
White - Same as green in Moria
Green - The Mouth of Sauron (extremely cool picture, I think)
Purple - Orc in open-face helmet, same as purple from Moria
Black - Same full-helmet orc as black in Moria
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Derek Coon
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butsam wrote:
Bullroarer Took wrote:

Starting position 1 4 tiles
Starting position 2 4 tiles
Starting position 3 4 tiles
Starting position 4 4 tiles

First enemies color
white 3 tiles
red 4 tiles
green 4 tiles
violet 3 tiles
black 3 tiles

Minor correction -- Starting position 1 has a total of 5 tiles. I think you missed the 5-sword tile on my list when tabulating. Nonetheless, the distribution is still roughly equal, and your other points are valid.
Sam


You're right, I missed that one. So it's ever slightly better to presume an enemy will appear at space 1 if nothing has happened yet, but wait...

White always appears at space 1.
Red appears at spaces 1,2,3 & 4.
Green appears at spaces 1,2,3 & 4.
Violet appears at spaces 2,3 &4.
Black appears at spaces 2,3 & 4.

So the "badder" enemies are more likely to appear further down the line - if the space is open. Remember that this analysis is for the first tile. What about after the first tile? I'm drawing this up now.
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Bryan Stout
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Okay, since people are going there anyway, here's what I noticed. Here is a list of each enemy color, the number of times it appears on the trigger tiles, and space numbers for each appearance. (An entry like "33" means the color appears twice on the same tile, which is numbered 3.)

White (5) 1 1 1 3 4
Red (5) 1 1 2 3 4
Green (7) 1 1 2 2 33 4
Violet (7) 1 1 2 33 3 4
Black (9) 1 222 3 44 4 4

Here are some things to note:

A) This is the order of the colors on the 5-sword tile.
B) The later colors appear more often.
C) The earlier colors are more weighted to the smaller numbers (1, mainly), while the later colors are more weighted to the later numbers (3,4).

My conclusions are:

D) The colors are in increasing order of speed. Fairly obvious, since the later colors will move more often on average. Black can really sprint - it has not only the most total swords, but it has both a double and triple tile.
E) The colors are in decreasing order of strength. The White pieces, always able to surge, and the Red pieces, doing double damage, are definitely the strongest. (Which is better? I don't know; it probably depends.) You can argue that Green is stronger than Violet or Black because it can surge over two moves (on its double tile), while they only surge once (on their shared double tile).
F) On the Mordor battleboard at least, the higher numbered spaces lead the enemy into the flow further along. Therefore the faster enemies sprint ahead to the end while the slower, stronger enemies cover more ground and and do more damage. (The other boards don't seem to have an obvious correlation between number and path length.)

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Bryan Stout
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Thanks for the increasing details! I got an email yesterday saying that my copy is on the way, but I'd still like to know more right now robot. (Besides, I'll be out of town next week when it arrives.)

So here's another question: could someone list the number of types of spaces for each board? For example, for Moria (the one I can fully see in the German rulebook), I could say:
(1) - 2 rectangles
(1) - black spot
(1) - black square
(1) - eye
(0) - X shields
(1) - sword
(1) - back 2
(2) - nothing (blank circle)
(2) - battle spaces (blank square)
(1) - vanish / ring & 3 spots
(1) - vanish / black square

I omitted the "(4) - start spaces" since that is constant.

Thanks yet again!
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dbuel wrote:

Shelob's Lair
White - Looks like Gondorian soldier to me, so I don't get it (perhaps he's loyal to Denethor and he's killing Faramir!)

I don't have the game with me, but if memory serves this guy is Gothmog, Lieutenant of Minas Morgul. It's the same artwork used for that character in the War of the Ring expansion.
dbuel wrote:

Green - Bronze (or is it brass?) armor, serpent on helmet, face is turned away

I'm pretty sure this guy is an easterling or southron.

 
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Bryan Stout
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Barliman wrote:
Could someone list the number of types of spaces for each board?

I'd still like to know! soblue. And not just for my own enjoyment: I'll be away from home during this week, and I'd like a chance to think about some player aids while I'm gone, but I need the details. (And my copy of BF won't arrive until around 3/8.)

Here's a table that would be easy to fill in ("blank" is a blank circle, "battle" a blank square):

________Bree____Moria___Isen____HDeep___ShLair__Mordor
2 rect___0_______1_______0_______0_______0_______0
spot____0_______1_______0_______0_______0_______0
square__0_______1_______0_______0_______0_______0
eye_____0_______1_______0_______0_______0_______0
big eye__0_______0_______0_______0_______0_______1
X shld___0_______0_______0_______0_______0_______0
sword___0_______1_______0_______0_______0_______0
back 2__0_______1_______0_______0_______0_______0
blank___0_______2_______0_______0_______0_______0
battle___0_______2_______0_______0_______0_______0
vanish__0_______R3spot___0_______0_______0_______0
vanish__0_______square___0_______0_______0_______0
vanish__0_______0_______0_______0_______0_______0
vanish__0_______0_______0_______0_______0_______0
other___0_______0_______0_______0_______0_______0
other___0_______0_______0_______0_______0_______0

Each vanishing space is probably unique, so I'd like to know what's in each one. ("R3spot" means a ring w/ 3 black spots.) In fact, if the vanish space contents were all someone wanted to post, that would still please me. The "other" spaces are for spaces not covered, e.g. two spots, a ring symbol with a square, etc.; if there are any such spaces, please say what's in them.

Thanks again, very much!
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