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Gideon Marcus
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War At Sea » Forums » Reviews
Surprisingly good game, perhaps not much of a sim...
The Game

War at Sea is a classic. It's that game that everyone has in the bottom of their collection, a rarity in the consim world--the war game which can be played in two hours. It's also rather ugly, and because of its age, is likely to be unfairly neglected.

War at Sea is a two player "simulation" of the Atlantic War in WW2. One side plays the Allies, including the UK, USSR, and the US. The other side plays the Axis: Germany, Italy, and Vichy France. It is a tactical game, with each counter representing a single ship, generally. A game lasts eight turns, each spanning roughly nine months. There are three pages of rules and two pages of play examples.

The Bits

The board is a depiction of Europe, the Atlantic and Mediterranean, with inserts showing the Americas. It's an ugly affair but quite usable. The counters, which come in three colors (Allied, German, and Italian) are very nice, oversized pieces with silhouettes of their ships on them.

Gameplay

Victory goes to the player with the most points at the end of the game. Points are earned by controlling the various sea spaces. Control is defined as having the only surface vessels in the area. German U-boats deny Allied control, but cannot gain control by themselves. Different sea spaces are worth different amounts to each player.

Control is important strategically as well. A ship can always move one space away from its harbor, but can only move two spaces if the first zone it moves into was not enemy controlled on the previous turn.

The Allies have to place first each turn, allowing the Germans to choose the most advantageous placement of their fleet.

There are some colorful additions--each side gets air strikes every turn, and the Allies get three convoys to escort, worth VPs if they arrive at their destination intact, but generally the game is a capital ship slugfest. Combat is done in rounds, each ship getting its own attack die, hits resolved by another roll of the die. After both sides get to fight, simultaneously, there is the option to disengage or keep firing.

Both sides receive reinforcements, but the Allies receive far more than the Axis. The Italian ships are largely worthless--most can't leave the Med.

To mitigate the difficult German position, undamaged surface ships get a +1 on all "to hit" rolls.

Review/Strategy

This game generates a lot of flagrantly unrealistic (but exciting!) fleet battles. The Allies have a crushing numerical superiority, but they have to cover every single sea space if they want to succeed. The German strategy is to mass forces in one area and make the Allies bleed. The North Sea is especially critical as denying Allied control there allows German ships to break out all over the Atlantic, further dividing the enemy's forces.

There's a lot of luck in this game. A lot. Even perfect strategy can be rewarded by a sunken fleet on Turn 2. You roll dice to see if your ships can move two spaces, you roll for air strikes, you roll to hit, you roll for damage, you roll to see if the Americans contribute ships, you roll to see if the Russian ships are active...

But that's why you own lots of dice, right?

As a simulation, it's tenuously connected to reality at best. Actually, I tried a game with no bonus for German captains, and the flow of that game was much closer to that of reality. I still lost as the Germans, but it was a more satisfying experience in some ways.

Always helps to have a good WW2 soundtrack...

Conclusion

I like War at Sea a lot. It's quick, fun, and atmospheric. I'd hardly call it an introductory wargame as it doesn't really introduce a new player to many typical wargaming concepts. But it is a tight little game which can be played in no time.

If you can find it, play it--don't let the dated graphics turn you off.

7.5 out of 10
Last edited on 2007-10-19 00:47:05 CST (Total Number of Edits: 2)
Lance McMillan
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Good review -- you captured the essence of the game quite nicely. But calling WaS a "wargame" is really stretching that definition; it would be like calling 'Risk' a wargame. Calling WaS a simulation is so absurd it's laughable.

Don't get me wrong -- WaS is a good game and it's *GREAT* fun to play. I own two copies because I nearly wore out the first one I played it so often. But aside from the counters having the names of actual WWII warships on them, it bears almost no relationship to the conduct of the naval war in the Atlantic.
Gideon Marcus
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Thank you!

I think WaS is definitely a kind of war game. It's very simple and silly, but it does sort of simulate something, particularly if you play without the German uber-gunnery rule.

I'd call it an abstract, first-order approximation of the Atlantic War.

Risk is a wargame, albeit it probably the simplest one I'd give the name. It really has no relation to reality, but the building forces and conquering countries aspect feels wargamey to me.

Your mileage may vary ^_~
David Knepper
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L2 Design Group is releasing an upgraded version of WaS; in fact, it is shipping at the end of this week.

http://www.boardgamegeek.com/game/31198

http://www.l2designgroup.com/War%20at%20Sea.html

Brad Miller
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Aging One wrote:
L2 Design Group is releasing an upgraded version of WaS; in fact, it is shipping at the end of this week.

http://www.boardgamegeek.com/game/31198

http://www.l2designgroup.com/War%20at%20Sea.html



Sadly, the price is what $85? No freaking way. I remember buying this when it came out and it was like $14.95! In spite of all the stuff they added to this new version, I'm afraid I'm going to have to look to eBay for a copy of the AH version. Sorry L2.

And if you like WAS, get Victory in the Pacific. It's a slightly more complex game of the pacific war, with extra stuff, but the same basic system. A great game...
Jim Marshall
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Windopaene wrote:
Aging One wrote:
L2 Design Group is releasing an upgraded version of WaS; in fact, it is shipping at the end of this week.

http://www.boardgamegeek.com/game/31198

http://www.l2designgroup.com/War%20at%20Sea.html



Sadly, the price is what $85? No freaking way. I remember buying this when it came out and it was like $14.95! In spite of all the stuff they added to this new version, I'm afraid I'm going to have to look to eBay for a copy of the AH version. Sorry L2.

And if you like WAS, get Victory in the Pacific. It's a slightly more complex game of the pacific war, with extra stuff, but the same basic system. A great game...


Yup, both WaS and VITP are great old school wargames. Simulations no (although VITP probably ranks higher on that score), but great games.

I'd be interested in versions with cleaned up graphics, but price would indeed come into it as I've still got my old AH copies of both games.
Barry Kendall
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L2's releases are graphically very attractive, but I'm flabbergasted at the pricing.

I'm also surprised that they're so hard to find. My FLGS checked and his distributors don't even carry the product. One online seller I contacted said he had a prior bad experience with an L2 shipment that came in reeking of cigarette smoke, and he has small children he doesn't want exposed to that.

I did not preorder because this title (and Waterloo: Fate of France), although reported as available for preorder, showed no activity on their website for a full year and this did not give me confidence. I'd like to preorder "Zulu" from them but either there is an error on their price display, or there is no price break for preorders on that item.

Perhaps I can find a copy at a convention sometime.
David Knepper
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If you want to consider a components upgrade, you can check out 2XS Industries, http://www.2xsindustries.com/ (scroll down to the "War at Sea" section). Again, not cheap, but many show up on eBay: http://rover.ebay.com/rover/1/711-53200-19255-0/1?type=4&cam...
Richard Pardoe
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Barry Kendall wrote:
My FLGS checked and his distributors don't even carry the product.

L2's USA distributor is Blackhawk Hobby Distributors.
Source: CSW Post
Mark Humphries
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Aging One wrote:
If you want to consider a components upgrade, you can check out 2XS Industries, http://www.2xsindustries.com/ (scroll down to the "War at Sea" section). Again, not cheap, but many show up on eBay: http://rover.ebay.com/rover/1/711-53200-19255-0/1?type=4&cam...


It seems that guy just pirates articles and counters that appeared in the Avalon Hill General magazine.
Leo Zappa
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Mark_WH wrote:
Aging One wrote:
If you want to consider a components upgrade, you can check out 2XS Industries, http://www.2xsindustries.com/ (scroll down to the "War at Sea" section). Again, not cheap, but many show up on eBay: http://rover.ebay.com/rover/1/711-53200-19255-0/1?type=4&cam...


It seems that guy just pirates articles and counters that appeared in the Avalon Hill General magazine.


Well, perhaps, but he is making things that are no longer available anywhere else or ever will be (no one is going to reprint a variant!). I've bought three or four items from him to upgrade my AH games (for D-Day, Afrika Korps, Turning Point: Stalingrad, among others) and I'm very satisfied. I'd been eyeing his upgrade kit for WaS but wanted to wait to see L2's offering. Given the huge price disparity, I'll probably upgrade my current WaS rather than pay $85 for L2's offering.
Mark Humphries
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Quote:
Well, perhaps, but he is making things that are no longer available anywhere else or ever will be (no one is going to reprint a variant!).


That may be his opinion but that still doesn't give him the right to steal someone else's IP and profit from it. If he didn't think a book or movie would ever be republished, would that automatically give him the right and sufficient justification to make and sell pirates, and you to purchase them?

Quote:
Given the huge price disparity, I'll probably upgrade my current WaS rather than pay $85 for L2's offering.


I'd rather pay $85 for a legitimate game than pay $10 for pirated game materials.
Leo Zappa
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Mark_WH wrote:
Quote:
Well, perhaps, but he is making things that are no longer available anywhere else or ever will be (no one is going to reprint a variant!).


That may be his opinion but that still doesn't give him the right to steal someone else's IP and profit from it. If he didn't think a book or movie would ever be republished, would that automatically give him the right and sufficient justification to make and sell pirates, and you to purchase them?

Quote:
Given the huge price disparity, I'll probably upgrade my current WaS rather than pay $85 for L2's offering.


I'd rather pay $85 for a legitimate game than pay $10 for pirated game materials.


I don't know if he has express permission to make these supplements, but his stuff has been out in the open on eBay for the last five years and no one from Hasbro/AH/WOTC have forced him to cease and desist, so at the very least, they have not defended their "IP" and at this point, it does not appear that they have any great interest in defending it. I have no problem whatsoever in purchasing his products and will continue to do so when they interest me.

I think it's also worth pointing out that this vendor does not reprint entire games. He only reprints variants and supplements, most of which were never made available for direct purchase anyway. Most of these were buried in various editions of AH's The General magazine. As such, I am pretty confident that, if it weren't for someone like 2X Industries, these little supplements would never, ever see the light of day again. No one, be it MMP, Valley Games, or L2, is going to bother to acquire the rights to P500 a set of freaking variant counters for Afrika Korps. Even with this WaS supplement, it would do one no good unless they already own the game, since all it is are new, prettier ship counters.
Last edited on 2007-10-20 22:06:55 CST (Total Number of Edits: 1)
Mark Humphries
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If you do a search on Consimworld you will find that he has used IP not only from AH/Hasbro but also from private individuals without their consent or permission and he is being pursued with legal action from various quarters. But all that is besides the point. He is selling property that does not belong to him without the consent of the rightful owners, no matter how he or his customers attempt to gloss over and rationalize it for their own self-interest, such behavior seems clearly unethical.

I don't see how either his or your estimation of how likely the rightful owners are to reprint, or license this material to be reprinted by someone else, has any bearing. They are still not his to sell regardless.

Anyway, I have no dog in this fight either way.

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