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Peter Howitt
United Kingdom

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The Really Nasty Horse Racing Game » Forums » Reviews
A game dominated by luck
All the existing reviews of this game on BoardGameGeek have been positive, albeit acknowledging one or two flaws. For me, the various flaws add up to make this game a highly frustrating experience.

The biggest problem is that the game is highly luck dominated:

Luck issue 1 – If you roll high numbers you win. Virtually any tactical thinking you might have had is scuppered by the guy next to you rolling consecutive sixes and storming to victory by a country mile. Each race is nowhere near long enough for luck with the dice to even out. Wait, you say, surely a really nasty card can even that up? Well no, because if a horse gets into a sizeable lead then it can normally avoid landing on fences and only the slipped up on the flat card can stop them. Which brings me on to issue 2…..

Luck issue 2 – Some of the really nasty cards are miles better than other. The aforementioned slipped up on the flat card is easily the best card – used properly it should get you a first place and/or secure victory for the horse you have bet on. As there is only one of these, being dealt it is a huge advantage. Other cards with some use include the Faller at Briars Brook cards (much better than the other faller cards as Briars Brook is two spaces wide so horses are more likely to be forced to land on it). Compare that with the largely useless riderless horse card or the objection cards (gambling £10,000 on rolling a 1 does fit with the game mechanics)!

Luck issue 3 – The Lane Draw. The lane draw is random, but has a large impact on the result. It is very difficult to win if you are in Lane 6 as you are often forced to land on fences by not being able to move across. Even if you play the full six races (see below) luck of the lane draw is unlikely to even up. Although you can obviously make money through betting on a race even if your horse hasn’t got much of a chance, you generally need to earn a couple of place finishes initially to give you the cash to make meaningful bets.

Luck issue 4 – The final race is everything. Most money is the only thing that matters for victory, so the final race betting normally follows a pattern whereby everybody except the current leader wagers everything on a horse. If that horse wins then the person who had put the most money on it wins. Nothing else matters. Of course, you have had to accumulate enough money over the previous races to be able to place a large bet, but the multipliers are such that it can be far less than the leader has won and you still have a chance if you are lucky enough to back the correct horse in the final race.

Other problems –

Odds' calculations make little sense: Odds are calculated by multiplying the horse grade and the lane draw (with some adjustments for large outsiders). Whilst lane draw does affect the result, horse grade rarely does, as a) there are relatively few spaces where you can “double up” your roll through having a good horse and b) everybody plays their best horses in the same races, i.e. the ones with good prize money. Issue b) also means that there are fantastic odds on offer for the low value races, as all the horses have high multipliers. Yet this does not make any sense – your local bookies won’t offer 12:1 on the second favourite just because all the horses in a race are rubbish. Nor will the rank outsider only be 6:1 in a race with lots of good horses. Odds should be relative to the other horses, yet the game is not sophisticated enough to do this.

Length: The game is best played with 5 or 6 players as that can lead to more excitement with blocking and also prevents boring races where everybody is guaranteed a prize just because one or two horses have been taken out. Yet if you play with a full complement of races and a full roster of players you are looking at 3 hours or so for a game that lacks the depth to justify such a long playing time. As I’ve noted above, it all comes down to the final race anyway, so much of that time is wasted.

Perhaps I’m being over-critical for a game which is light and accessible, however I feel its flaws are such that it is not fun to play.
Stven Carlberg
United States
Atlanta
Georgia
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I agree with your assessment of the overwhelmingly luck-driven nature of this game and salute your dedication in slogging through the details!
Anthony Linforth
United Kingdom
Edinburgh
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I would say that if you find this a highly frustrating experience you may be taking the game too seriously. It's light-hearted and fun and takes us a little over two hours with 6 races - we sometimes play only 5. There's always some good laughs along the way, though I admit it's not a game I'd want to play too often and definitely not when I'm in the mood for some serious gaming.
Nick Case
England
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Surrey
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Ditto what Toni said. It's got a die roll and random card draw as the main mechanisms so of course its heavily reliant on luck. But two things keep this game in my collection;

1/ Its a light hearted gambling game, just because you might not have rolled many high numbers, there's a chance you may have bet on the next horse. Usually its the gambling that nets most cash, not the prize money.

2/ When my gaming group have played hard all weekend and are too full of beer to focus and think, this game is perfect for rounding the session off.

Chess it aint, a great laugh with the right people it is.
Was George Orwell an optimist?
United States
Corvallis
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Rougie wrote:

The biggest problem is that the game is highly luck dominated:

Luck issue 1 – If you roll high numbers you win. Virtually any tactical thinking you might have had is scuppered by the guy next to you rolling consecutive sixes and storming to victory by a country mile.


The fact that the horse wins doesn't guarantee that the player controlling that horse will win. Players can, and often do, bet on other player's horses.

Rougie wrote:

Luck issue 3 – The Lane Draw. The lane draw is random, but has a large impact on the result. It is very difficult to win if you are in Lane 6 as you are often forced to land on fences by not being able to move across.


Which is why you factor the lane draw in when placing your bets.

Rougie wrote:

Luck issue 4 – The final race is everything. Most money is the only thing that matters for victory, so the final race betting normally follows a pattern whereby everybody except the current leader wagers everything on a horse.


The last race isn't everything, but it is indeed the most important. The 'glass half full' consequence is that everybody still has a chance. It wouldn't be much fun for players who have done poorly in the earlier races if they had zero chance to win, would it?

Rougie wrote:

Perhaps I’m being over-critical for a game which is light and accessible, however I feel its flaws are such that it is not fun to play.


Clearly the game isn't much fun to you, but I don't accept that an element which fails to suit your taste is therefore a flaw. Luck is a factor that some players detest and others enjoy - chacun à son goût.
Mark Jackson
United States
Fresno
California
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Another thought: You don't win by winning races, you win by betting well. You do have a bit more control over this (though not too much), as you can bet against yourself & then run a poor race w/your horse and use your cards against other horses to try & influence the outcome of the race.

Still, it's a game with very powerful action cards & lots of dice-rolling... if you don't like that kind of stuff, you're not going to enjoy Really Nasty Horse Racing Game.
steve perkins
United Kingdom
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I totally agree with you on this Peter, I've played it twice and the second time our resident luck-meister was completely unstoppable.

I and a friend both marked it very low after this. For the time spent you could play Totopoly. At least in Totopoly there is some tactics and the better horses have more opportunity to show that they are.

It's a game I won't be playing again and for me that is a rare beast.
Oliver Brettschneider
Germany
Mainz
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Have you tried out the "Really really nasty" variant from the "Variants" document in the files section? It's the only way we play the game, and one of the rules changes is that you can let a horse fall whenever it *jumps* over a fence, not just when it lands on it.

It makes the game tons more interesting.
:D
Peter Howitt
United Kingdom

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Oliver, I haven't tried out the "Really really nasty" variant. It looks interesting and we may give it a go. Downside is that it would mean if you are in lane six a throw of three at the start would automatically take you out.
Oliver Brettschneider
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You're right. I think in all the many games we played with this variant, we had that happen once and it was accepted as bad luck (you still have your bet, and you can still play most cards). However, you can fix that by allowing that player to roll again.

I agree that this is a flaw, but since we are really happy by the way this variant improves the game, it never even occured to us until just now.
Brad Redfield
United Kingdom
Scarborough
North Yorkshire
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So you are saying this is a completely random gambling game? Who would have guessed it. :D goo
Roland Wood
United States
Visalia
California
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Played my first game of this last night and there were six of us-- five of whom had never played before and the one who had needed to refresh himself on the rules. With learning the rules, going over the nasty cards twice, and playing the game, we came in easily under 2 hours.

I find it hard to conceive how any group could drag this beyond 3 hours. No wonder you guys didn't enjoy...
Anthony Baldassar
United States
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California
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The truth is all games have some luck with the play of the game. If luck is the reason to flaw a game I wouldn't play any games. You can increase your chances to win any game by the more you play and understanding the rules, but in the end even the most inexperienced player could win at almost any game. Would you call that luck or skill?
Last edited on 2009-05-24 19:06:18 CST (Total Number of Edits: 1)
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