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Kurt Runco
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Tikal » Forums » Reviews
The Two-Minute Review: Tikal
The Two-Minute Review Series:
http://www.boardgamegeek.com/geeklist/31672

Do we really need another review of Tikal? The game has been around for a while now, you know.
I know, but I want to address a particular aspect of it – the analysis paralysis reputation.

Ah, that. Yes. What had you heard about it?
Well, I was looking for a new game a few months ago and did a lot of research on about a dozen games, and Tikal was one of them. I like to joke that researching which game to buy is actually my favorite game!

(…?)
Yeah, no one ever laughs at that... Anyway, Tikal’s reputation preceded itself as one of the games that suffers the most – if not THE most -- from AP.

Wait, didn’t you learn from your Dungeon Twister review not to confuse Action Points (AP) and Analysis Paralysis (AP)?
Oh yeah. Let’s use AP for Action Points and AnalSis for Analysis paralysis… Wait, lemme change that. AnalP. No. OK, AnPar. Is that OK?

That’s better.
Good. So anyway I was playing four-player games of Catan where it was taking people forever to take their turn (just build a road, dammit!) and AnPar was really bugging me to the point where I swore I’d never play another 4P game of Catan.

Maybe you just play with, ahem, “slow” people.
Maybe. Anyway, Tikal’s reputation made me cross the game off my list as even a candidate for my next purchase. Fortunately, a friend bought it recently and I was able to try it, and I found I loved it. Like, surprisingly so. Amazingly so.

Really? And what about the AnPar reputation? By the way, I don’t like “AnPar”.
I don’t either but I can’t use AP and I’m too lazy to type it out each time. Anyway, that’s what I want to talk about. The game doesn’t “suffer” from AnPar. “Suffering” from AnPar means that you’re not engaged by the game between turns and the wait is annoying. That is simply not the case with Tikal. You want a game that suffers from AnPar and should be ding'd for it? Try Settlers.

HOW DARE YOU!
Hey, Catan is my one 10 ranked game. I love it, but the fact is in Catan, you don’t know what you can buy until it’s your turn because you might collect more resources or someone might rob from you or you might be able to trade. So people are hindered as far as working ahead. The 4P game is a wait-fest. I will go so far as to say – you ready for this? – that I would much more quickly play a 4P game of Tikal than Catan.

This cannot be. You, sir, are a charlatan. This game has a serious AnPar rep.
I know, but I’ve played 3P and 4P games of Tikal and each of us was completely engaged by the other player’s turns because a) you advise them in ways that help you and/or hurt other opponents, and b) there are some moves that are neutral to you and other players and it’s in everyone’s best interest to help the active player plan, count, etc. And it’s fun to do all that.

Furthermore, in Tikal you know you’re always going to have 10 APs to use, so you can start working on your turn while it’s someone else’s turn, e.g., “I’m gonna go there and get the treasure, so that 6 APs, I have 4 left…” You’re never bored or disengaged from the game – you’re either participating in the active player’s turn or working on your next one.

Hmm. Your ideas are intriguing to me and I wish to subscribe to your newsletter... But there must be something to Tikal’s AnPar reputation?
Well, I will say that the game requires a lot of math checking and you have mistakes and redos, e.g., “Wait, how many was that, 8? I have 2 left. Oh, that was 6? I have four left. Wait, let me start over…” But even so you’re engaged and incented to help dumbasses like me count the APs accurately.

Well, what about the game itself?
Read other reviews for a description of play, but I want to say that it’s just damn fun. It somehow captures the theme of exploring – I think it’s all the green -- while being a great tactical game of spending your “moves”.

Who would like/not like this game?
“Brilliant.” “Much more accessible than Puerto Rico.” “Easy to learn.” These were some of the comments from my group of mixed experience players. We have a newbie (wedgie time!) who played this and Puerto Rico the same night and he preferred this saying, “I got this down pat". And he came in second (ahead of me) in his first game. At the same time, us vets love it as well.

Parting Thoughts?
Components are great -- did I mention the green? As to length, I’d plan on a half hour per player... ”Guess, what? I got a fever, and the only prescription… is more Tikal!”

Bottom Line?
Buy. No reservations.
Last edited on 2008-06-15 00:10:13 CST (Total Number of Edits: 4)
Simon Lundström
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070809
Nice review. I seldom have problems with analysis paralysis in Settlers, though (if you get AP there, you'd not want to play Dungeon Twister!), and I had no idea Tikal had such a reputation. However, I can imagine that some people really take their time.

(On a comletely different note, I'd suggest Analysis Paralysis = AP and Action Points = Action points (or actions). Reason? You don't type it as often…)
Kurt Runco
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Hey Simon!
You're the one who pointed it out to me in the first place. Yeah, that's a good idea. I was having a bit of fun here. I'll definitely look out for it in future reviews.

Yeah, DT definitely has its share of AP (per your definition) but as I described in my review, I still like the game. I can deal with some downtime if it's a 2P game. Waiting in a 4P game of Catan and hearing, "Let's see how much does a settlement cost?" three times before my turn drives me nuts. :D
Gary Keifer
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As one of the participants in the 4P game of Tikal (with enzo) I can say that I'm hooked. I loved it and it took me only about twenty minutes in to feel confident in my strategy. I suffered no paralysis as I waited for the others to plan their moves.
As far as being subjected to wedgies. There was no such threat hanging over my head and had I known that was a possibility I would have worn an Obama for president thong.
Simon Lundström
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enzo622 wrote:
Yeah, DT definitely has its share of AP (per your definition) but as I described in my review, I still like the game. I can deal with some downtime if it's a 2P game.

Although I hate AP, it's sort of part of the idea in low-randomness 2P games. Look at chess or go…
Usually, I am so bad at those games they tend to stress the hell out of me and Dungeon Twister is no exception. Evenso, I really like the theme. I'd like to play a bit more by the gut. Think I'll enjoy it more then.

enzo622 wrote:
Waiting in a 4P game of Catan and hearing, "Let's see how much does a settlement cost?" three times before my turn drives me nuts. :D

Well, that's more a case of "I can't even remember the rules" which is a different form of irriation…

Would actually like to bring Tikal more to the table… it's one of those mid-cases that sort of never gets selected, which is sad.

Edit: Your link in your review goes to this review. Was that intentional?
Last edited on 2008-05-24 14:34:48 CST (Total Number of Edits: 2)
Bruce Murphy
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I have to highly recommend picking up 10 yellow cubes to use as action point counters. They get passed around to the current player and are then counted out as actions are taken. Suddenly a fiddly part of the game becomes really easy.

B>
Duck Farmer
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thepackrat wrote:
I have to highly recommend picking up 10 yellow cubes to use as action point counters. They get passed around to the current player and are then counted out as actions are taken. Suddenly a fiddly part of the game becomes really easy.


Agree with this. We give each player 10 poker chips which are discarded as action points are used (no backtracking). I haven't noticed analysis paralysis to be a significant issue in games I've been in.

I'd be interested on your views on Tikal after you have played it a few more times. I thought it was absolutely fantastic the first time I played it - a tour de force of great components, immersive theme, and elegant gameplay. A bit of the shine has worn off after playing it a few more times (although I still enjoy playing it). In my opinion it also doesn't scale down well for 2 players, although I haven't yet tried the two-player variant.

p.s. I like your review format and style.
Last edited on 2008-05-24 19:23:47 CST (Total Number of Edits: 1)
Dan Conley
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Nice, well-written review! VERY cool style! I'll be watching for more in the "Two-Minute" series (it IS a series, yes?!?)!

GREAT ideas re. using cubes or chips to track actions. While the game has yet to see any action on our table, one of the guys wants to play. Of course, he's our SEVERE AP player... :shake: This sounds like a great way to help that...

Thanks again for the review! Tikal is heading to the table soon!!!
Last edited on 2008-05-24 19:32:40 CST (Total Number of Edits: 1)
Kurt Runco
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Thank you all for your friendly comments. It's really appreciated and incents me to write more.

Simon, good catch (again -- you are now my official proofreader! Tack så mycket.). The link has been updated to point to my other 2MRs. I'll also include it here. I hope you all like them as well.

http://www.boardgamegeek.com/geeklist/31672

Quote:
bit of the shine has worn off after playing it a few more times (although I still enjoy playing it). In my opinion it also doesn't scale down well for 2 players, although I haven't yet tried the two-player variant.


Good point, Duck, as I've played less than a handful of times. I too wonder how it will hold up. In any case, it's always fun to find a new game that you're really, really excited about. I haven't been this excited about a new game in a couple of months.

I wonder if in the 2P game there's too much luck as to who pulls what tile. I think the 3P game (like Catan) is the sweet spot for me (but that's subject to change too).

As to the use of cubes, that's a great idea. Although I wasn't referring to the fiddliness of the game as much as to my own propensity to get confused and have to start over. I was using the wrong factor in counting improvements and had to be told three times that I had only spent 6 points instead of 8. D'oh!
Kurt Runco
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GKPhilly wrote:
As one of the participants in the 4P game of Tikal (with enzo) I can say that I'm hooked. I loved it and it took me only about twenty minutes in to feel confident in my strategy. I suffered no paralysis as I waited for the others to plan their moves.
As far as being subjected to wedgies. There was no such threat hanging over my head and had I known that was a possibility I would have worn an Obama for president thong.


I still can't believe you beat me... :p

And I hope to never see that thong (and NOT for any political reasons!).
Kurt Runco
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Zimeon wrote:
Although I hate AP, it's sort of part of the idea in low-randomness 2P games. Look at chess or go…
Usually, I am so bad at those games they tend to stress the hell out of me and Dungeon Twister is no exception.


You know, that's a good subject for another thread, as I find that I react to my opponent. I have one friend who admits he doesn't like to chat, joke around, or talk about his life while he plays. He gets his fun by shutting out everthing and focusing on the game. He likes to win, and hates to lose. It ends up making me tense and nervous and feel all this pressure to beat the silent foe across from me.
Last edited on 2008-05-24 23:24:14 CST (Total Number of Edits: 1)
Joe Kundlak
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I totally agree with the review. I never get any AnPar :cool: in Tikal (that is, any significant, or other than in other games) and I am playing it exclusively online until now.

So in a regular play I would guess there would be even less AnPar...
\m/ >_< \m/
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thepackrat wrote:
I have to highly recommend picking up 10 yellow cubes to use as action point counters. They get passed around to the current player and are then counted out as actions are taken. Suddenly a fiddly part of the game becomes really easy.

B>


Brilliant idea! :D
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