Just to clarify: you are talking about ancient Asian religious swastikas, not the Nazi version, right? At least I have a hard time believing that businesses throughout Asia display the Nazi swastikas. The swastika has been around for as a symbol for many centuries, long before Hitler used it. (The word itself comes from Sanskrit.)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Swastika

(PS: no offense intended, but watch out for the spelling of "swastika".)

This is so politically incorrect... but ROFL!

So, in an odd sorta way, it was almost a "lack of gratitude" for the real engine of production that irked them?

And as such, we should be giving more thumbs up if we can at the top of this post so that others could share and observe the worth of the discussion. Heck even the 'Puerto Rico v. San Juan' thread [ http://www.boardgamegeek.com/thread/192016] has a lot more thumbs. ; )

But let's not mix those threads -

I wonder if Catholics get offended about all the Bishop-killing (sorry, capturing) going on in Chess...

That would depend on their language ... that diagonal-moving chess piece is not called a Bishop in many languages. (E.g. I know that in Polish and in Esperanto it is the Courier.)

Touché... in Spanish we call it Alfil, which means nothing at all (except that specific piece in Chess. Yes, it has it own word all to itself).

Then again, I'm sure you know what I meant...

It's not quite the same is it...

Regarding the whole slave thing. I don't mean to offend anyone here but, talk about being over-sensitive. What people seem to not understand is that African tribes collected people from rival tribes and "sold" them to the whites to be slaves. Both sides were at fault: the whites and the blacks. To assume otherwise displays ignorance of the history of slavery. It wasn't just the whites....

It's just a game people--just sit down, play, and enjoy it.

Talk about stereotyping. Can you give any evidence that "most african americans" don't know that some Africans enslaved other Africans?

I don't think so much 'over-sensitive' so much as noting that game themes can be "under-pluralistic." And I, and presumably some others, not only knew the historical detail of the intraregional slave trade, but other complications like a few Cherokee with slaves and African-American Buffalo Soldiers participating in the Wars on Indians during the U.S.'s late 1800's. There are always ironic exceptions that reflect (or less likely, not) the dominant culture paradigm o' the time.

I'm still playing and enjoying but also evaluating and challenging ourselves.

Lets make a game about the holocaust and another about 911 and lets see if the cool heads here will still be so nonchalant about it.

Which is worse...a game about the old world subjugating the new world that acknowledges that the practice of slavery helped colonial success or a game that doesn't acknowledge this fact at all?

Enslaved peoples contributed massively to the development of the new world, but they weren't allowed to really profit from their contributions. Nor did they receive much historical credit either because the winner/dominator usually tells the story.

There are already games about the holocaust (any game in which one player manages or takes the fruits of the German WWII economic and productive system obviously includes that part of German production which was contributed by slave labour in the death camps and by the bodies of the slain: Of course, this is completely and utterly sanitised in the vast majority of such games, much like in Puerto Rico the slavery issue is brushed aside) and 9/11 (there are War on Terror games where players can play the terrorists).

It's a Spanish word that was taken directly from the Arabic name for the piece, al-feel (الفيل) "the elephant".

To make things worse, the German equivalent of the Craftsman role card is called "Aufseher" which translates into "Overseer" (although it does not have quite the connotation of the English word). Then again, if the "colonists" travelled to P.R. for the joy of it, why would they need to be pressed into bringin in the harvest?

So, yes, the brown pieces represent slaves, at least in fraction, and yes, slavery was a vital part of colonial economy in the period.

People who consent to slavery do, in absence of a better word, suck. However, you can play a game of P.R. and even enjoy it without being a supporter of slavery.

I would prefer a game of P.R. with an open minded individual who is aware of the theme over a game of , say, innocent Bohnanza with a racist any old day.

We noticed the slavery issue day one with PR.

Since no one here seems to think the current game IS offensive, how far would it have to go before it WAS offensive?

How about two types of worker.
The current `brown chit` that works outside.
And a second `white chit` that works inside.

The brown chits could be bought by using a new job.
The Slaver!

It might even be an improvement, it does sound a bit more tactical. There could be an expansion in this. We could make money out of Slavery! Well, only the people that own the rights to Puerto Rico could. It would be wrong to steal someone elses intellectual ownership of the idea of Slavery, after all.


Speaking of slavery, chocolate really is quite Yummy.
Eating it makes me feel so bad mentally that I need more physically.
What, You thought chocolate was currently made by happy brown chits?
Maybe we could rebadge PR as a modern Africa remake.
Ever had a Black Chocolate Hand? , MMMmmmmm... . .
I am a slave to my guilt, addiction, guilt.


I read somewhere that 'the church' demanded representation on the Chess board, and renamed the Bishop.
Makes some sense the Spanish would keep the Arabic word, being Muslim.
Maybe a game based on blowing up trains would work, while detectives hunt them down.
Would children count double?
Would clergy get a reroll?

Something I have always wanted to hear in a news report. . .
(deep voice) '. . .killing 14 people, 12 of which were men.'


Is laughing at a calamity only OK if it hasn't happened yet?
How about we all play gods and try to destroy the world.
Fancy a game of Nuclear War?

(I won a 108 real person game of Late Night Nuclear War once. Started at midnight, finished in a new dawn).
(not.the.nine.o'clock.news said something like 'the Americans would like to apologise for being late to the last two world wars by being really punctual for the next one)

Lighten up it is only a game.