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Castelli Reviews:

This Blog will only occasionally be updated, it will contain my thoughts on numerous aspects of out hobby. Some of the content will be taken from my website www.castellireviews.com .
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On Review Copies.

JAMES CASTELLI
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Review copies are something I have seen discussed by reviewers on occasion but not often in a lot of detail. With this blog I hope to give the viewers of my show insight into my personal experiences with both playing games and reviewing games, today I’ll be discussing review copies.

It’s worth noting that review copies are something that for each reviewer will likely be different; my experiences might not reflect other reviewer’s experiences in any way shape or form.

When I began reviewing games the concept of getting a game for free for the purposes of a review was unknown to me. The "Review copy" was something I only learned of much later. It would be about a year after my first video was uploaded that I would get my first review copy, it would have been not long before that time that I started making inquiries about them to publishers. As you will soon learn getting review copies and making inquiries are two separate things.

When I first received a positive response to a request for a review copy it was exciting, more so for the fact that the game I was about to receive was, and still is in Australia hard to come by. The first issue I had to face was how to disclose this relevant information during the review without it taking up much time, or taking the focus away from the review itself. There was never really a question of whether I should disclose the information or not. I decided to flash a note at the beginning of the review saying *Review Copy, as opposed to saying it during the review or placing the note at the end of the review. I had become aware from numerous threads I had come across here on the geek, that disclosure was important to many and even legal in some circumstances. I’m not sure that video reviews fall into one of the legal circumstances or not, but I saw no harm in disclosing it anyway.

I can understand why people think that review copies may lead a reviewer to give a bias positive opinion; after all they are getting a game for free. However, if I uploaded a positive review of a game I disliked, instead of setting out to provide a service to the gaming community, I’d be doing the exact opposite by providing a disservice. It benefits no one by me stating I enjoy a game when in fact I don’t; I’m also not going to take the time to write a fictional review for the sakes of popularity or in hopes to get free games. If all I wanted were games I’d just spend the time that I spend on reviews, at work instead, the overtime would earn me enough to get me as many games as I desired.

The way I make an inquiry is in most cases by contacting the publisher about the possibility of a review copy of a particular title of theirs. It is just a short and polite email sent to them accompanied with a link to my latest review, website and a small write up of some statistics, such as where the majority of my viewers are from, number of views etc. (I will in another post, show you guys these statistics, as some of the statistics are probably not what you’d expect). I never expect a company to provide review copies either. It’s great if they do, but I completely understand that they may have other existing relationships with reviewers or it may just not be of interest to them.

Over the past year or so I have written to a number of publishers about review copies and it is easy to become discouraged, the most common response I have had is no response at all. I have also had some that cannot for several reasons send goods to Australia, some that politely reply that it’s not something they do, and in one circumstance the reply was and I quote, "(insert companies name here) likes to give out review copies of games to serious reviewers". I’m not sure if I should have taken offense to that response or not, I'll admit I did, but replied politely and I still look forward to playing their game if I get the chance too. There have been several times I have inquired about review copies and my request has been denied and I still have ended up purchasing the game I inquired about.

I do not have a relationship with a company where I receive games that I have no personal interest in. Nothing shows up on my doorstep that I am unaware of, or that I am not excited about getting to the table. All the games I have received to this date were games that I had researched and had thought that both my group and I would enjoy playing. I’d like to keep it that way too. Out of the 5 review copies I have received, 4 have been at my request, 1 of which I had already done a written review on, another was a prototype for www.kickstarter.com in which I ended up pre-ordering it anyway. In only 1 rare occasion a publisher approached me with a game that I liked the look of and I was obviously happy to accept. I have refused a review copy of a game that was offered to me because I had no interest in it after researching it. The Bottom line is, if I am sent review copies of games that I "have" to play, not "want" to play, I’ll be pushing the boundary of this becoming work. Work is something I "have" to do, not "want" to do. You can tell how much I love my job.

I ask this question to the readers of this post, I am about to receive a couple of games from an overseas publisher, they were not free review copies though, I did have to pay some money, although admittedly they were discounted for review purposes. Taking into consideration I did pay something for them, are they still review copies? or should I put a note *discounted copy. It makes little difference to me, but it might make a difference to others.

Thanks for taking the time to read this, any questions or comments are always welcome.

Regards,
James.

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Subscribe sub options Sun May 29, 2011 4:43 am
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Warren Smith
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Very interesting! I especially like how you so clearly define the bottom line. That same wisdom can by applied to games in one's collection that don't see as much table time as one might like - are we playing the games because we feel we have to justify their purchase or do we want to play?

About disclaiming a discounted copy, I think that it should be noted in the review to inform those who care. I personally don't, but neither do I think that the disclaimer would detract from the review. Better to cross all tees and dot all eyes.
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  • Posted Sun May 29, 2011 7:43 am
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JAMES CASTELLI
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Quote:
About disclaiming a discounted copy, I think that it should be noted in the review to inform those who care.
I will certainly be disclaiming it, just not sure If it should be *Review copy or *Discounted copy.

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are we playing the games because we feel we have to justify their purchase or do we want to play?

That is interesting I never thought of it like that. I've been really hard on what stays in my collection lately, but I have had that exact problem in the pastthumbsup.




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  • Posted Sun May 29, 2011 7:54 am
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That was cool. I like your reviews and agree with your tastes from what I can tell (Played my first game of Twilight Struggle last night - it was indeed fab.) . I'm glad you go the effort you do.

How about....

"Discounted Review Copy" !? Yeah, radical, I know..
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  • Posted Sun May 29, 2011 9:54 am
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Yeah, "Discounted for review" since you did pay something for it.
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  • Posted Sun May 29, 2011 12:55 pm
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Andy Andersen
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I'm not sure you need to mention a "discounted copy." "Review copy" yes. As for "serious reviewers" I had to laugh. They obviously did not take the time to watch your video reviews. Quite likely lost a good amount of potential revenue also. On the other hand, maybe they had a crappy game and didn't want it reviewed.

Thanks for the reviews and the blog. Entertaining.thumbsupthumbsup
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  • Edited Mon May 30, 2011 9:47 pm
  • Posted Mon May 30, 2011 9:47 pm
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Jeremy Salinas
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Let me preface this by saying that I love me some James Castelli review videos, but I HATE this topic on BGG....it always seems to spring up every few months and I still can't wrap my head around why people care one way or the other.

Personally, I could care of less if someone ever states if they got the game for FREE or had to pay for it...to me it simply doesn't matter one ounce. Maybe it's because I worked professionally in the Video Game Industry where EVERY reviewer that was someone got their games for FREE so it never carried weight with me. Or the fact that 90% of Movie Reviewers get free passes, sneak peeks and "screener" copies to review at their leisure, and they never once state how they got the chance to see the movie. It just reeks of how youthful/undeveloped this industry still is in comparison to the heavy weights.

I am like you James, I only ASK for the games I wish to review, therefore, inherently 90% of my reviews are going to be positive since I don't solicit people sending me just anything to review. Having said that, whether I got the game for free or not doesn't sway my opinion one way or the other....and I think any reviewer who is worth their weight in talent has the kind of confidence in themselves and their end product to not have to justify their opinions to people on how they received the game.....reviews should be strictly focused on the review and nothing else.





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  • Edited Thu Jun 2, 2011 4:24 pm
  • Posted Thu Jun 2, 2011 4:21 pm
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Drakkenstrike wrote:
and I think any reviewer who is worth their weight in talent has the kind of confidence in themselves and their end product to not have to justify their opinions to people on how they received the game.....reviews should be strictly focused on the review and nothing else.


I must either weigh too much or am just not confident then...



It takes me 10 seconds max to tell my viewers that the game I got was free or if I bought it, and I have always felt I owed it to them in the spirit of full disclosure. I always felt there was a small percentage of people out there that felt that it mattered to them, and since I didn't care either way, I may as well satisfy their unspoken question.

As a side note, this is my feelings for my reviews and no one else's. Anyone else can do whatever the heck they want, and they should.
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  • Edited Thu Jun 2, 2011 5:04 pm
  • Posted Thu Jun 2, 2011 5:04 pm
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UndeadViking wrote:
Drakkenstrike wrote:
Personally, I could care of less if someone ever states if they got the game for FREE or had to pay for it...to me it simply doesn't matter one ounce. Maybe it's because I worked professionally in the Video Game Industry where EVERY reviewer that was someone got their games for FREE so it never carried weight with me. Or the fact that 90% of Movie Reviewers get free passes, sneak peeks and "screener" copies to review at their leisure, and they never once state how they got the chance to see the movie. It just reeks of how youthful/undeveloped this industry still is in comparison to the heavy weights.


Hoo-boy...let me weigh in here.

It is also MUCH easier to review a movie or a video game. Sit and watch the movie, make a few notes, type it up when you get home. Play the video game, maybe even complete it, say what you think. We all know boardgames are a time investment. It takes time to get people to your house, read the rules, set it up, play the game. Play the game again to make sure you got the rules right. Play it again with a different number of people. Maybe now you can actually do your review.


I would definitely NOT say that reviewing a video game is easier than reviewing a board game. Video Games can be a huge investment of time...and again, any reviewer worth their weight will play the game from start to finish. This is an completely FALSE response. If anything, they can be equal, but MUCH EASIER is ridiculous....utterly. Video games aren't an investment? At $60/pop? Really? REALLY? They can't "literally" consume you and your free time? MUCH EASIER? REALLY????

UndeadViking wrote:
If you spend $60 on a board game, it feels like it is worth more than if I go and pick up a $60 game for my PS3. In fact, I will gladly drop $100 every couple of weeks or so on a box of games from an etailer, but I will second guess myself for a month before I will pull the trigger on a $20 value classic video game because I think it is a waste of my money. This, once again, is a viewpoint that I share with many of my fellow board game enthusiasts.


Completely non-relevant to the question at hand. How and why you spend your money is up to you, but has no bearing on your merits as a Reviewer....not even sure where that comment is coming from.

UndeadViking wrote:
Now then - why do I feel like I need to tell the people who watch my reviews whether or not I have received the game in question for free? Because I feel it is an important distinction to make as to whether or not I have invested my money in the game. It is an added level of information that my viewers may well want to know. Also, it prevents them from thinking I am trying to hide any sort of information from them in any way. How many times has Tom Vasel come under fire because people say he gets his games for free and doesn't say so? How many times would it happen if he just said so one way or the other in his reviews?


Then I agree 100% with Tom Vasel on this stance.....I don't think the Industry cares one way or another if people state how they acquired their games. Maybe we just have completely different mindsets here, but this feels like amateur hour when we start putting information into our reviews that doesn't serve the review one bit...if you want to divulge how you got the game, who you contacted, how they shipped it and what wonderful conversations you shared with the Publisher/Designer then go right ahead, but I'll pass on that thank you very little. I'd rather keep the commentary in my videos to the GAME itself and not all the surrounding circumstances that normal people could care or less for.

UndeadViking wrote:
To me, and this is just to me, I see it like this. It takes me 10 seconds maximum to say I got the game for free, or to say I bought it with my own money. It literally takes no effort on my part whatsoever. For a small percentage of people that matters to them one way or the other, and thus it takes care of that portion of my audience. For me, those 5-10 seconds are worth it to do so, it is as simple as that.


Yeah, but your reviews are already pushing 45 minutes sometimes...if you feel SO STRONGLY about it, then find another way to share it.....put it on your Geeklist....put it in the comments section....and stop blanketing your mission to enforce your values or a "everyone should divulge everything" mentality on other reviewers. Sheesh.
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  • Posted Thu Jun 2, 2011 5:13 pm
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Jeremy Salinas
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Oh....an before I get off my soap box, in 106 Video Reviews, I have had a total of 3 people ask me to share "HOW" I received my games......3. Of those 3, one of them was you.
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  • Posted Thu Jun 2, 2011 5:15 pm
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Interesting to see all the prolific reviewers on The Geek weigh in on this one. Just wanted to play some devil's advocate here:

Quote:
It just reeks of how youthful/undeveloped this industry still is in comparison to the heavy weights.


This may be true, but I don't know if that means the point is inherently less valid. Just because other industries have adopted the practice as widespread (and thus it is assumed that every reviewer got their copy for free), doesn't necessarily mean that it is a good idea.

Board games also have a significantly lower level of exposure than movies, or even video games. I mean, this website just had a contest to make videos for games listed that had none (loved your entry by the way Jeremy). If there are significantly fewer viewpoints available than for other media, and we accept the premise that a reviewer could be swayed positively by a free game (not sure I accept this myself, but just playing devil's advocate), then one can see the impact a review copy could feasibly have on a game's popularity.

Great blog post, James! It got us all thinking, at least
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  • Posted Thu Jun 2, 2011 5:26 pm
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Geoffrey Mulder
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Drakkenstrike wrote:
Maybe it's because I worked professionally in the Video Game Industry where EVERY reviewer that was someone got their games for FREE so it never carried weight with me. Or the fact that 90% of Movie Reviewers get free passes, sneak peeks and "screener" copies to review at their leisure, and they never once state how they got the chance to see the movie.


One doesn't expect a movie or video game review to disclose how they got the game, because as you point out, you can assume _every_ review was written for a free game or movie ticket and be correct most of the time. Board games simply aren't as visible or as large a business, and giving out a free game (with a nontrivial production cost for each copy) is probably much more difficult than giving out a (practically free) movie ticket or disk with a few bytes on it. As such, you can't assume that every review was written for a free copy of a board game. Since it doesn't go without speaking, it doesn't hurt to say it. Some people simply like to know how skeptical they should be when watching a review. I don't think that's unhealthy in any way.

Quote:
It just reeks of how youthful/undeveloped this industry still is in comparison to the heavy weights.


I really don't understand why you think that the board game industry being smaller than film or video games is a big problem. We're a niche hobby that will probably never be as large as video games and movies, but we get along fine. Such a negative response seems a little strange to me.
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  • Posted Thu Jun 2, 2011 5:34 pm
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Jeremy Salinas
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imyourskribe wrote:


Quote:
It just reeks of how youthful/undeveloped this industry still is in comparison to the heavy weights.


I really don't understand why you think that the board game industry being smaller than film or video games is a big problem. We're a niche hobby that will probably never be as large as video games and movies, but we get along fine. Such a negative response seems a little strange to me.


There is a level of professionalism that is found in other types of visual media in both those industries that the Board Game Industry can't hope to compete with at this point in time. Niche hobby or not, professional courtesy requires me to try and provide a form of media that is not currently available to the market.

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  • Posted Thu Jun 2, 2011 5:42 pm
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Great post James. Thanks for sharing your thoughts with us.

I love this paragraph especially:

jamesmckane wrote:
I can understand why people think that review copies may lead a reviewer to give a bias positive opinion; after all they are getting a game for free. However, if I uploaded a positive review of a game I disliked, instead of setting out to provide a service to the gaming community, I’d be doing the exact opposite by providing a disservice. It benefits no one by me stating I enjoy a game when in fact I don’t; I’m also not going to take the time to write a fictional review for the sakes of popularity or in hopes to get free games. If all I wanted were games I’d just spend the time that I spend on reviews, at work instead, the overtime would earn me enough to get me as many games as I desired.
(Bolded for emphasis by me)

I think this summarizes the issue quite well - a free game influences the reviewer minimally.

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  • Posted Thu Jun 2, 2011 5:49 pm
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Jeremy - you are my friend and I respect your opinion a great deal. Of anyone that I have met on the 'Geek, you more mirror my opinion on life, games, and what have you than anyone else. I say this because I am going to respond to your comments and I want you to know that I took no personal hurt feelings over what you said, and I hope you feel the same.

Also - I ammended my comment while you were responding to it...maybe out of hindsight, so I apologize to anyone wondering what the heck is going on.

Quote:
I would definitely NOT say that reviewing a video game is easier than reviewing a board game. Video Games can be a huge investment of time...and again, any reviewer worth their weight will play the game from start to finish. This is an completely FALSE response. If anything, they can be equal, but MUCH EASIER is ridiculous....utterly. Video games aren't an investment? At $60/pop? Really? REALLY? They can't "literally" consume you and your free time? MUCH EASIER? REALLY????


First - you didn't even bother responding to my statement when it came to movie reviews, so I can only assume you agree with me. Secondly, it is my opinion that you can get the feel of a video game from playing for a good five or six hours. You can also pretty much know everything there is to know about a video game without finishing it, but even so, games with "endings" can sometimes only take 10 hours to finish. They add "completionist" stuff to extend the gametime, but you don't have to to finish them. I personally think they are easier to do, judging by the ones that I have seen and watched. Maybe much easier is a stretch, and so I will chalk that up to hyperbole.

As far as the investment goes, please go back and read what I said. I said that a board game feels like it is "intrinsically" more of an investment just because of all the preperation needed to actually GET your value out of it. You have to get people to your house, travel to a gaming outing, sit down, read the extensive rules, sleeve the cards, teach the game, etc. To play a video game you put it in your console and turn it on. THAT is why I feel that spending $20 on a video game for 10 hours of fun sitting on my couch feels like I threw my money away but $60 on a game that I might play 5 times in the year doesn't. It is an investment of my time that I feel enriches my life. Video games feel like something I do when I am bored and no one in my family is awake.

Quote:
Completely non-relevant to the question at hand. How and why you spend your money is up to you, but has no bearing on your merits as a Reviewer....not even sure where that comment is coming from.


The previous paragraph hopefully explains why I feel this comment was valid.

Quote:
Then I agree 100% with Tom Vasel on this stance.....I don't think the Industry cares one way or another if people state how they acquired their games. Maybe we just have completely different mindsets here, but this feels like amateur hour when we start putting information into our reviews that doesn't serve the review one bit...if you want to divulge how you got the game, who you contacted, how they shipped it and what wonderful conversations you shared with the Publisher/Designer then go right ahead, but I'll pass on that thank you very little. I'd rather keep the commentary in my videos to the GAME itself and not all the surrounding circumstances that normal people could care or less for.


Well I don't know one way or another what the industry thinks, but I do know that you yourself have stated that this topic comes up a fair amount of time here on the Geek (and I am sure elsewhere) earlier in this thread, so if not the industry, than a percentage of the consumers care. Plus your characterization about the divulsion of the info makes it seemd very elaborate and explanatory, when all I ever say is "so and so sent me a review copy". I realize this was added for effect, but let's try not to obfuscate the situation.

Also, your usage of the word "normal people" is a bit troubling to me. Am I to understand that if someone is concerned over revealing review copies this is negative in some way? I can see that this could be explained in such a way that if the vast majority of people don't care, than you could categorize that as being the norm, and those that are different would not fall under that heading. I assume that is what you meant but you can see where someone could construe it as being different.

Regardless, I doubt you are ever going to find anyone that is ever going to say that, after reading or watching a review, that every single bit of that review was exactly what they wanted and needed to see. There is going to be fluff in every review that people are not going to care about, but the vast majority, if not all, of the listeners/readers are going to just get past the parts they don't care for and watch/read what they want.

Quote:
Yeah, but your reviews are already pushing 45 minutes sometimes...if you feel SO STRONGLY about it, then find another way to share it.....put it on your Geeklist....put it in the comments section....and stop blanketing your mission to enforce your values or a "everyone should divulge everything" mentality on other reviewers. Sheesh.


If you go back and read what I said, I said that my feelings on this were for me and me only. I don't think I ever tried to impose my will on anyone or told anyone what they had to do. We talk all the time, when have I ever had that attitude about anything? I am sorry if you got that impression from my statement, no sarcasm, I really am, it was not implied by me in any way, at least not intentionally.

My reviews are long because I am both long winded and I try to do thorough rules observations. I found a style slowly, but surely, that I enjoy, and I like to think is enjoyed by my audience. If my review is going to last 40+ minutes, what is ten seconds more?

As far as the three comments about where you got the games, I think, if I recall correctly, my comment was about 51st state (I could be wrong) and you had a copy of it before it even existed...anywhere! I was stunned that you had it. Regardless, I truly believe people don't ask you because your videos are just that good, they just don't care one way aor another.

Sorry eating up your blog post with this stuff James. Keep up the great work.

Jeremy, you have my utmost respect as my friend and as a reviewer. I honestly think the passion you have for this hobby and the work you put into your reviews has enhanced the hobby as a WHOLE, and you should be very proud of your accomplishments.

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  • Edited Thu Jun 2, 2011 6:26 pm
  • Posted Thu Jun 2, 2011 6:22 pm
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Tom Vasel
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Yay! I love this topic!


I have a question for those who think reviewers are swayed by review copies. Have you ever met anyone in the board gaming industry who reviewed a game, and you are positive that their review was unduly positive because the copy was free?

I'm curious - the only time I've ever seen this was the old reviews on www.gamingreport.com, and they are no longer around.

Secondly, have you ever read a review by someone who spent a lot of money on a game, and you are positive that their review was unduly positive because they needed to justify their purchase.

I've said it before, and I say it again. Assume that I get all my games for free (not true, but mostly), and that it doesn't affect me. (In fact, I recently got 2 emails berating me for being negative. Yay!) I'm telling you this - I make a blanket statement on every podcast saying such nonsense.

Trust me. Or don't. It's your choice. If I felt that it bothered more than a couple dozen people, I would worry about it. But if you need me to spell out whether it's a review copy or not, then you don't trust me that I'm unbiased anyway. It has no bearing. You insisting that I disclose whether it's a review copy simply mean that you THINK there's a bearing. I disagree, so I'm not going to bother, and again, just ask that you trust me.

And if you don't? I'll survive.

Besides, everyone tells me I'm wrong in my opinions anyway!
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  • Posted Thu Jun 2, 2011 6:42 pm
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Lance said

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Also, your usage of the word "normal people" is a bit troubling to me. Am I to understand that if someone is concerned over revealing review copies this is negative in some way? I can see that this could be explained in such a way that if the vast majority of people don't care, than you could categorize that as being the norm, and those that are different would not fall under that heading. I assume that is what you meant but you can see where someone could construe it as being different.


Well, he might not say it - but I'll say it outright. It IS negative. It displays a blatant lack of trust in the reviewer. For a new reviewer, think what you want, but if you don't believe me after 8 years, you never will.
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  • Posted Thu Jun 2, 2011 6:44 pm
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TomVasel wrote:
Lance said

Quote:
Also, your usage of the word "normal people" is a bit troubling to me. Am I to understand that if someone is concerned over revealing review copies this is negative in some way? I can see that this could be explained in such a way that if the vast majority of people don't care, than you could categorize that as being the norm, and those that are different would not fall under that heading. I assume that is what you meant but you can see where someone could construe it as being different.


Well, he might not say it - but I'll say it outright. It IS negative. It displays a blatant lack of trust in the reviewer. For a new reviewer, think what you want, but if you don't believe me after 8 years, you never will.


OK, let's stir up the pot a little for the sake of discussion.

Tom, does that mean you think that new reviewers should reveal it until they obtain a certain level of trust? What level? At what point do you achieve that "level"?

Scott Nicholson regularly stated he got review copies in his reviews, usually as a footnote at the end. In your opinion, did he do this because he felt that people lacked trust in his opinions, or just because he felt it was the right thing to do, or something else entirely?

Let me reiterate, my opinions on this are mine and mine alone. I by no means feel that anyone else should HAVE to reveal where they got their games, and no one should get that implication.
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  • Posted Thu Jun 2, 2011 6:52 pm
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Drakkenstrike wrote:
Let me preface this by saying that I love me some James Castelli review videos, but I HATE this topic on BGG....it always seems to spring up every few months and I still can't wrap my head around why people care one way or the other.

I'll give you a hint. It's one of the 7 deadly sins.
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  • Posted Thu Jun 2, 2011 7:04 pm
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Drakkenstrike wrote:
Oh....an before I get off my soap box, in 106 Video Reviews, I have had a total of 3 people ask me to share "HOW" I received my games......3. Of those 3, one of them was you.


That's an interesting statistic. I'd be curious to know if that's because fewer people care about purchased vs. free review copies or because the understanding in the board game world is that reviewers usually purchased the game unless stated otherwise.
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  • Posted Thu Jun 2, 2011 7:04 pm
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UndeadViking wrote:


OK, let's stir up the pot a little for the sake of discussion.

Tom, does that mean you think that new reviewers should reveal it until they obtain a certain level of trust? What level? At what point do you achieve that "level"?


No, I don't care if someone never reveals it. Just like I don't care how many times they've played the game. Or what country they played it in. Or what group they played it with.

Quote:
Scott Nicholson regularly stated he got review copies in his reviews, usually as a footnote at the end. In your opinion, did he do this because he felt that people lacked trust in his opinions, or just because he felt it was the right thing to do, or something else entirely?


If I recall correctly, he did it because he felt forced into it by the new law. That's the reason, and the ONLY reason we do the same thing on our audio podcast. But I can't speak for Scott here, so I'm just guessing.

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  • Posted Thu Jun 2, 2011 7:11 pm
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Thanks for the response Tom

New law?
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  • Posted Thu Jun 2, 2011 7:19 pm
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I find it amusing that people still have a hard time grasping that reviews are merely big fat opinions. They can be based on whatever the reviewer wants. Perhaps, I didn't like that the game didn't include orange as a player color. Perhaps, I didn't like that the box farted when I opened it. Perhaps, I didn't like the font used on the game board. It doesn't matter, it's my opinion.

My friend said something a few years ago that enlightened me. He said that there is never any reason to ever start or end a statement with "...in my opinion...", because everything that comes out of your mouth, whether verbal or written, is your opinion. I loved that.
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  • Edited Thu Jun 2, 2011 7:56 pm
  • Posted Thu Jun 2, 2011 7:35 pm
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I would like to thank Tom, Lance, Jeremy, James and all the video reviewers for the time and effort they put forth - it certainly makes our community better.
I don't judge my opinion on a game because the reviewer likes it. Moreover, I try to read between the lines and formulate my own opinion. How long does it take to play, how much interaction is there, does the theme work?...it is part of the research process I do when looking at new games. Though I don't know any of the above mentioned reviewers personally, I think I have a feel for what games they like and favour and therefore can make a more informed decision on whether it is a game I will like.
THEREFORE I DON'T GIVE A RAT'S A## IF IT WERE FREE OR NOT!!!

Disclaimer: Clive was not paid by any game publisher, video reviewer or any other third party to make these comments.
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  • Posted Thu Jun 2, 2011 10:15 pm
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But I did tip you, Clive. Hopefully not enough to influence you
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  • Posted Fri Jun 3, 2011 3:25 am
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UndeadViking wrote:
New law?

http://weblogs.about.com/b/2009/10/06/ftc-enacts-new-laws-fo...
I'm not really sure if it is relevant to what we do or not though Lance. It may just be for web Bloggers, Law isn't one of my strong points.

Quote:
Sorry eating up your blog post with this stuff James. Keep up the great work.
Mate, I'm not worried. I'm honored some of my favorite reviewers have taken the time to read this blog.

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but I HATE this topic on BGG....it always seems to spring up every few months and I still can't wrap my head around why people care one way or the other.
Quote:
Yay! I love this topic!


I just want to make sure people reading this do not skip over the original post. I didn't create this thread to raise the question of if it was ethical or required for reviewers to disclaim review copies. This was not "another" one of those threads on that topic, or at least that was not my intention. I personally don't care if others mention a game is a review copy during a review, it makes no difference to me. I do however understand that some people want to know that information, I don't know who they are, or how many there are that want to know it. I made the decision to disclaim it because I saw no harm in doing so. The only question I raised during this thread was whether or not I should disclaim a discounted copy as a *Review Copy or a * Discounted Copy. Not if others should.

I thought people might like to learn more about the behind the scenes activity of my reviews and review copies are just a part of that. I wanted people to understand that the process at least for me might be different than they may have expected. Some people did find it interesting too. The following is from a geekmail in regards to this thread.

Quote:
Thanks for writing the article about review copies on your BGG blog. I've often wondered what other people's experiences were. I thought I was the only one that got completely ignored by most publishers when I asked


That was more the audience this post was aimed at. Anyway, I'm glad to hear from you all.








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  • Edited Sun Jun 5, 2011 7:44 am
  • Posted Fri Jun 3, 2011 11:41 am
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Blott wrote:
Drakkenstrike wrote:
Let me preface this by saying that I love me some James Castelli review videos, but I HATE this topic on BGG....it always seems to spring up every few months and I still can't wrap my head around why people care one way or the other.

I'll give you a hint. It's one of the 7 deadly sins.

Yes, but not most people's favorite.
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  • Posted Fri Jun 3, 2011 4:25 pm
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Personally, I think using these icons is the simplest way to solve the problem:

http://blog.louisgray.com/2009/12/ftc-disclosures-made-simpl...

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  • Posted Fri Jun 3, 2011 9:56 pm
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In all seriousness though, the FTC laws are the reason that I disclose any review copies in a footnote. My reviews tend to be positive, because I don't want to spend 4 hours on a review of a game that I dislike (and I'm not swimming in review copies like some of you heavy hitters).

The board game industry might not be as evolved as the video game industry when it comes to review copies (Board game publishers seem to ignore requests, whereas the video game publishers will point to your alexa.com ranking, and tell you no.). But the board game industry is also more personal, and reviews tend to be more constructive instead of hyperbolic for the sake of humor. I mean, no one in the board game space is likely to trash a game, and throw it off of the roof or anything.

http://cmp.ly/Publish/user/howToDisclose.php has a set of images to tag posts with, to stay FTC compliant. The fact that it's just a little image doesn't really bring undue attention to the disclosure, so might be a decent alternative for some people.

As for whether or not you should disclose a discounted copy? Personally, I wouldn't think that is necessary. Odds are the publisher is selling the game to you at cost, so you are still paying for the game, just not for the publisher's markup.


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  • Edited Fri Jun 3, 2011 11:08 pm
  • Posted Fri Jun 3, 2011 10:16 pm
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Drakkenstrike wrote:
imyourskribe wrote:


Quote:
It just reeks of how youthful/undeveloped this industry still is in comparison to the heavy weights.


I really don't understand why you think that the board game industry being smaller than film or video games is a big problem. We're a niche hobby that will probably never be as large as video games and movies, but we get along fine. Such a negative response seems a little strange to me.


There is a level of professionalism that is found in other types of visual media in both those industries that the Board Game Industry can't hope to compete with at this point in time. Niche hobby or not, professional courtesy requires me to try and provide a form of media that is not currently available to the market.



All of this is a game. Companies want reviews to be positive and will do whatever it takes to make that happen. "Level of professionalism" is a bit much because everyone is trying to make a reviewer happy.

I was on the business end of Broadway theater before I made a career change (teaching and now professional Dad) and they play all sorts of games. On opening night when the major reviewers show up (read New York Times) the theater will be filled with ticket holders that paid nothing. Cast members, techs, producers, interns....everyone gets tickets to give to family members/friends and people are sometimes told clap loudly, cheer, whatever. The producer wants the reviewers to write that the crowds were "on their feet" "excited" "laughing from beginning to end" (you would not want the last quote for King Lear...) and the reviewers know that this is being done. Find an opening night on Broadway when there is no standing ovation and that show is an absolute stinker. Then there are the gifts, opening night parties, exclusive interviews with stars, etc.

Reviewing is a game. It is the same in every business. I assume everyone gets their games for free, except for me...cry
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  • Edited Sat Jun 4, 2011 6:27 pm
  • Posted Sat Jun 4, 2011 12:22 pm
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I don't think you have to disclose legally or otherwise, but I always do because it removes any illusion of impropriety.

As for "getting games you like" sometimes you don't know. When you get to a certain point in your writing, especially if you have an interesting, readable style, you end up getting people calling or writing you asking you to review their product. I had one of my "friends" ask me to write an article for their site as a "guest writer", and this is what can happen:

http://www.boardgamegeek.com/thread/640355/toe-to-toe-nuklr-...

So, it's better to be like you and only review those you think you'll like to reduce the possibility of having to write a very critical review, but remember that it's your duty to report to your readers PRECISELY how you feel about it, no softballs because you got free stuff.
 
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  • Posted Sat Jun 4, 2011 11:52 pm
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TomVasel wrote:
Secondly, have you ever read a review by someone who spent a lot of money on a game, and you are positive that their review was unduly positive because they needed to justify their purchase.

Tom, I think this is the magical point here, but not in the way I suspect you intended. I've read SO MANY reviews where people bitched that they had to pay X$ for a game and hated it, and you can totally sense that the critique is harsher than you'd otherwise anticipate due to the spite factor.

Quote:
I've said it before, and I say it again. Assume that I get all my games for free (not true, but mostly), and that it doesn't affect me. (In fact, I recently got 2 emails berating me for being negative. Yay!) I'm telling you this - I make a blanket statement on every podcast saying such nonsense.

There's dickheads everywhere. I got shit all over left and right for beig too negative in a recent article....oh well, like any of us make any money at this shit anyhow. I give every last one of my review copies away to friends, family, and readers, so I literally do this for the fun of it. If someone doesn't like my style, my tastes, or the fact that I'm too negative or not negative, well, to paraphrase a favorite film, "If I throw you a fucking bone I don't want to know how it tastes." Change the channel.

Quote:
Trust me. Or don't. It's your choice. If I felt that it bothered more than a couple dozen people, I would worry about it. But if you need me to spell out whether it's a review copy or not, then you don't trust me that I'm unbiased anyway. It has no bearing. You insisting that I disclose whether it's a review copy simply mean that you THINK there's a bearing. I disagree, so I'm not going to bother, and again, just ask that you trust me.

The best part about ALL of this is that all of this bollocks is about your OPINION. You're not attempting to explain how you calculated the value of pi to the thousandth decimal place, you're creating an entertaining video that may or may not be informative to the person, and what they take away is for them to decide. I will honestly never understand why people get so damned worked up over this stuff.[/q]
 
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  • Posted Sun Jun 5, 2011 12:48 am
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Legally, the FTC requires bloggers to disclose any material connection with an advertiser. If a review copy is provided by a publisher, that's considered a material connection and must under FTC rules be disclosed. Whether or not there's a realistic expectation that violating those rules will result in any sort of penalty worth worrying about is a separate question - fact is that for bloggers in the USA any review copies must be disclosed as such in order to be compliant with FTC regs.

Bloggers outside of the USA would, I assume, be unaffected by the rulings but I'm not clear on how that works.
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  • Posted Sun Jun 5, 2011 1:42 am
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