The Peloton | Leader 1 | BoardGameGeek

Andrew Saunders

(Wittmann222)

United Kingdom

Blackpool

love the concept and can't wait to try it out. Well done!

Posted Tue Jan 11, 2011 6:38 pm
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TH Jensen

(Gubban)

Denmark

Thank you so very much! Im very keen on getting feedback from anyone, on what their experience have been playing with the peloton-doublehexagon.....so don't hesitate dropping me a line when you've tried it out!

Posted Sun Jan 23, 2011 2:37 pm
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Andrew Saunders

(Wittmann222)

United Kingdom

Blackpool

I don't have the turn sequence in front of me, but just to be sure, where does this peleton part fit into the sequence.

Also, during set up, is there any particular order of play over who gets to place there cyclists in th epeleton

How about an overview of a game turn. Is that something you would be willing to do?

I still think the idea is great btw and is what this game was perhaps lacking

Thanks

andrew

Posted Wed Feb 16, 2011 8:08 pm
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TH Jensen

(Gubban)

Denmark

Hi Andrew,
Answers to your questions:
There is no order of play for who gets to place their riders first in the peloton, since it is not needed. All riders start the stage/race in the same place - on the gray area in the center section of the peloton.

The turn order is:
1. Movement of riders that have broken away (if there are any) in lead order.

2. Movement of riders in the Peloton, beginning with the Peloton Leader (holder of the peloton token) and continuing clockwise. Each player has the opportunity to do one or more of the following moves, in any particular order:
a. Move one or more of his riders around inside the Peloton.
b. Breakaway with one or two of his riders.
c. Voluntarily drop riders of the peloton.
Note: riders do not necessarily need to be moved.

3. The Peloton Leader rolls the peloton dice and adds any increased speed to the result of the dice (the increased speed being the current number of riders in the front section of the peloton).

4. Movement of the Peloton.

5. Movement of riders situated behind the peloton (if there are any) in lead order.

6. Determining who will be the Peloton Leader for the next turn:
a. If there a no riders in the front section of the peloton, then the peloton token is passed clockwise to the next player.
b. If there are other players than the current Peloton Leader, who have a rider in the front section of the peloton, then the peloton token is handed clockwise to the first of these players.
c. If the current Peloton Leader is the only player who has riders in the front section of the peloton, then he will keep the peloton token for the next turn.

Ill properly be adding this turn order to the 'The Peloton'-file at some point.
Im pretty tied up for the time being, so can't promise that ill be doing an overview card of the turn order - but ill like to, so ill keep it in mind

Edited Thu Feb 17, 2011 9:58 pm
Posted Thu Feb 17, 2011 7:58 pm
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Andrew Saunders

(Wittmann222)

United Kingdom

Blackpool

Thank you - most helpful

Posted Fri Feb 18, 2011 7:00 pm
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TH Jensen

(Gubban)

Denmark

Ive now made an overview card for the game turn order, which u asked for, and included it into the 'The Peloton'-file.

Edited Sun Feb 20, 2011 2:50 pm
Posted Sun Feb 20, 2011 2:49 pm
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Holger Doessing

(holgerd)

Denmark
Horsholm

Excellent! I do have a few questions, though:

In section 5, you stress how the peloton token is passed between players. However, it seems to me that in the original Leader1, having the peloton token allowed the player to chose whether to push the peloton (+1) or not. Using the new rules presented here, the pace of the peloton is determined by the number of riders in the peloton front, thus making the peloton token redundant. Am I missing something here?
After re-reading the new rules, I realize that the move order within the peloton is still determined by who has the peloton token.

Second, section 3 says: "Replace one number '3', with one black number '6' on the peloton dice. (No reduction of the starting energy is then needed)." I think that this suggestion adds odd burst of excessive speed to the peloton and I prefer to do without this modification. What is then your recommendations on the "reduction of the starting energy" and why do you feel it is called for when using the peloton dual-tile?*

Third, could you elaborate on your technique for preparing the dual-tile for the peloton. You actually apply glue to the front of the printout, then (heat?-)laminate, then peel off the back layer of the laminate? Perhaps a few sketches or photos would help out.

*) I was thinking of simulating 'good/bad legs' by having each rider draw 1 or 2 energy bidon(s) before starting the race, but your rules seem to clash with this?

Edited Sun May 1, 2011 2:12 am
Posted Sun May 1, 2011 1:42 am
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Holger Doessing

(holgerd)

Denmark
Horsholm

A couple more questions:

What are your thoughts on riders at the front of the peloton, who learn that they have become unable to pay the cost of pacing the peloton?
For example:
1. Alice has the peloton token.
2. She moves a rider to the peloton front, knowing that the maximum cost will be (die roll of 6 & 1 peloton pacer = move 7) 3 energy; she can just afford that.
3. Bob is next, and he decides to move two of his players to the peloton front.
4. The maximum cost of being in the peloton front is now (die roll of 6 & 3 pacers = move 9) 5 energy.
5. The peloton moves: The die is rolled and shows 6.
6. The cost of riding in the peloton front now exceeds what Alice can pay (and what she signed up for in the first place)!
How is this situation resolved?

Another question: If a die roll of 6 results in such high speed that riders may drop off the peloton, why does nothing happen when the peloton moves e.g. 8 (die roll 5 & 3 pacers)? Would it not make more sense to allow an aggressive pacing of the peloton to actually attempt to force slower riders to drop off?

Posted Mon May 2, 2011 3:08 am
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TH Jensen

(Gubban)

Denmark

Hi, I believe Ill be answering all of your questions in the version 1.7 of the rules, which will be online one of the next days

Regards, Tonni

Posted Wed May 4, 2011 8:38 pm
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Holger Doessing

(holgerd)

Denmark
Horsholm

Great!

Regarding the aforementioned case where a rider suddenly finds himself unable to pay the cost of being in the peloton train (e.g. because additional riders have joined the train, thereby increasing the potential cost of being in the peloton): After all players have taken turns in moving the riders inside the peloton any riders in the peloton train that are unable to pay the putative maximal cost must move back to the peloton center. (This is a rare event, though.)

Regarding the drop risk: I will be using a variation, where the drop risk is defined as the rider's current risk number (5, 8, or 11) minus the rider's free movement in the current terrain (as determined by the position of the peloton figure's front). This takes rider type and strain into account and does not require another lookup table.

Regards

Edited Sun May 22, 2011 9:58 pm
Posted Sun May 22, 2011 9:02 pm
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Nicolas FAIVRE

(Atomnik)

France

A little review after our first game with this variant:

We played 2 short stages in a row (12 and 8 hexes/ intermediate and mountainous stages). 5 players, 3 riders each.

The Peloton rule works very well and we find it very realistic. Maybe too much realistic. What I meen is that with that rule, the peloton is very tough and it's very hard for a breakaway to succeed in winning the stage. Due to the possibility to move 8 spaces in a turn, it's very hard to make long breakaway. The real big idea is to add a lot of tactics inside the peloton. This is done quite simply and without slowing the game indeed.

The good points are:

- excellent quality of the edition: rules, peloton board, player's aid....near professional work.
- the free energy chart is more balanced than in Leader 1 with rouleur very polyvalent, sprinter, strong finishers but stuck in big climbs, and climbers ruling in hills and mountainous hexes.
- great tactics with the peloton rule adding more possibility and very realistic situations in the game.
- the drop risk rule is very fine
- the turn delay rule (conversion of each turn with time) is very good and much better than the original General Classification rule.

The negatives points are:

- The peloton seem to be too strong. Maybe it's because we played too much riders (15 at all) but it was quite impossible to breakaway. This is not so important in flat/intermediate stages as it's quite realistic to have a strong peloton but in our short mountainous stage, the winners finished in the same turn as the peloton even with a 1st category climb and a short HC climb to finish. Maybe you could moderate the peloton move in categorized terrain. Our idea is to moderate the bonus of the peloton move with the same number of the difficulty. i.e: if you are in a 1st category climb, the peloton can't move better than a +1 (even if they are 3 riders in the front section).
- The mass sprint rule is a good idea but maybe 6 hexes is too much ? 5 could be enough ?

In conclusion:

A great variant, very well edited and adding even more tactics in Leader 1 races. Thank you for the great job.

Edited Sat Jul 9, 2011 11:56 pm
Posted Sat Jul 9, 2011 9:18 pm
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Holger Doessing

(holgerd)

Denmark
Horsholm

I really like the idea of capping the peloton's speed according to category. It's simple and doesn't add tables*; it emulates actual race conditions, where non-climbers cannot automatically hide themselves in the peloton and just wait for the peloton to catch an attack; and it may further increase the tactical aspect of section 3: "High speed breaking the peloton into pieces":

I presume that the drop risk roll should be executed when the peloton moves at its top speed in the current terrain (and not just when it moves 8). Hence, the peloton will stand a much higher risk of breaking up on tough climbs. This should really help wear out the rouleurs on mountain stages. I have seen some odd races, where rouleurs hiding in the peloton crossed the mountains with lots of energy points in reserve and subsequently went for the stage win from afar. Higher risk of drop means that more energy is expelled to just stay with the peloton.

(* I use the peloton tile without the back section and Protected riders. I only use the peloton speed bonus and "+1" cost for front riders, as well as a modified drop risk (crack number minus free movement in current terrain), and I leave out sprinter/downhill bonuses; everything else is standard Giro d'Italia rules.)

Edited Wed Jul 13, 2011 11:16 pm
Posted Tue Jul 12, 2011 2:20 am
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Holger Doessing

(holgerd)

Denmark
Horsholm

Looks like the next edition of Leader 1 a.k.a 'Hell of the North' introduces something along the lines of The Peloton. I am looking at the component photo found here: http://boardgamegeek.com/image/1094424/leader-1-hell-of-the-...

From what I can tell there seems to be some sort of differential cost of riding in the peloton - perhaps dependent of the rider's position within the bunch. Also, given this edition's focus on one-day classics the arrow in the top right might be something concerning wind?

I don't care much for the components (most of the redesigns seem quite ugly to me) save the new tiles, but it will be interesting to see what concepts the developers have implemented this time.