Game: TAMSK

Thread: Re: How does it compare to the other Gipf Games?

matthulgan — 2008-11-18T15:06:43+00:00

spearjr wrote:
My copy of Tamsk still has a GIPF logo on the box, so my GIPF series goes to 7.

I'm with you. As far as I'm concerned TAMSK is a GIPF game and TZAAR is #7. Additionally- the TAMSK potential is still an official part of the GIPF series.

Thread: Re: How does it compare to the other Gipf Games?

spearjr — 2008-11-18T13:41:53+00:00

cferejohn wrote:
Just becuse ~~I'm a nitpicking nerd~~ of my attention to detail, TAMSK has actually been removed from the GIPF series and replaced by TZAAR. Next you'll be saying Pluto ain't a planet.

My copy of Tamsk still has a GIPF logo on the box, so my GIPF series goes to 7.

Thread: Re: How does it compare to the other Gipf Games?

OutpostGamma — 2008-11-18T11:55:07+00:00

Thx for the review. I picked up Tamsk at Essen this year and I'm glad I did before it disappears completely (thx for the tip on where it was hiding, Kris).

It's deceptively easy to learn but after just one play it reveals its depth.

Quick note: The timers are meant to have a variance of +/- 15%.

Take Care,

Gene Z

Thread: Re: How does it compare to the other Gipf Games?

cferejohn — 2008-11-18T06:14:25+00:00

Just becuse ~~I'm a nitpicking nerd~~ of my attention to detail, TAMSK has actually been removed from the GIPF series and replaced by TZAAR.

-Picky Chris

Thread: How does it compare to the other Gipf Games?

Karmic_devil — 2008-11-18T05:14:11+00:00

I really like the Gipf games that I have played: Zertz, Dvonn, Punct, Yinsh. This game always looked cool to me because of the hourglass pieces and I recently acquired it in a trade. Here's my thoughts on it as a fan of other games in the series.

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(image by icheyne)

Components:
Thick plastic board, nice insert, sturdy rings (Bakelite? plastic?) on plastic holder, are all of very nice quality. The Gipf games have a wonderful feel and quality to them and are as much a joy to look at as to play.

Tamsk feels a little 'cheaper' by comparison to the others. The big plastic board seems a little cheesy though it is perfectly functional for it's purpose - it just doesn't seem as elegant as the components from the other Gipf games I have played.

Many have mentioned the hourglasses do not have consistent amounts of sand in them. I can certainly see this being a drag but mine all appear pretty even and this has not affected play.

Mechanics:
The winner is the player who plays the most rings.

Hourglasses start in the corners of the board, alternating between red and black (the player colors)
Players take turns moving an hourglass of their own color to an adjacent space (and flipping it in the process) and then dropping a ring over it.
The first 3 moves of each player must use the 3 different hourglasses to get the time running on all of them.

When playing with the full rules you layers get 15 seconds per turn and can enforce this by flipping the 15 second hourglass on their opponent who must act in that time or take a penalty.

The outer ring of spaces can hold 1 ring
The second ring of spaces can hold 2 rings
The third ring of spaces can hold 3 rings
And the center space may hold 4 rings.

A space that is already holding its capacity of rings can not be moved into. If an hourglass has no where to move which isn't full it is stuck and can not be moved.

If an hourglass runs out of time it is stuck and can not be moved.

So, the gameplay becomes about keeping our hourglasses moving longer than your opponents in order to play more rings.

The strategy of it reminded me a bit of Hey That's My Fish!
My fiancee said it was like "Dots and Boxes"

Essentially you are trying to keep your movement as open as possible while leaving your opponent with fewer moves and therefore fewer opportunities to place rings.

How it plays:
The gameplay is simpler than any of the other Gipf games I have played.
Perhaps this is necessary because of the 15 second turns.

The game plays in about 5 minutes and really is fun, there is opportunity for blocking and clever plays but not the same depth that permeates the other Gipf games I have played.

Final Thoughts:
The game is a lot of fun and I rate it a 7.5/10.

That is half a point lower than I have rated the other Gipf games I have played, perhaps because it feels to have a bit less depth to me.

Gipf fans will like it if they are prepared for something a bit lighter and can appreciate the time aspect.

I recommend it for more than just Gipf fans though. It looks cool, can be taught in just a couple of minutes and plays equally as fast.

It's a nice game and I hope it gets the reprint with quality components it deserves. If you like abstracts, dots and boxes, hey that's my fish, or just any old game with a unique concept and simple rules, check out Tamsk.

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LostLukas — 2008-06-01T12:31:15+00:00

Tower made of rings

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LostLukas — 2008-05-31T20:45:05+00:00

Sidewall of the box

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Icefyst — 2008-05-24T23:09:36+00:00

Thread: Re: Tamsk: the Pluto of the Gipf Series (a eulogy)

Angry Duck — 2008-05-22T16:32:57+00:00

It's my personal favorite of the GIPF series. The uniqueness, both asthetically and play-wise, make TAMSK one of the most unforgetable games ever made.

Thread: Re: A Game Like No Other!

MENAREUS2000 — 2008-05-13T21:19:59+00:00

If you were a chess fan and played chess but found your queen would just suddenly vanish, every hundred games or so, the infrequent occurence would pratically make it a non-issue, but I doubt you'd find as many chess players as you do today.

By Smart's own admission, they may not re-release the game if they can't fix the timer problem. Obviouly, the timer issue affected sales.

I'm not saying the game still isn't fun but it has a flaw that might cause one to lose a game that they might not have otherwise.

Thread: Re: A Game Like No Other!

Ambrose — 2008-05-13T19:48:21+00:00

orangeblood wrote:
In practice, however, it doesn't make much of a difference if the timers are slightly different. Once you start turning them over, you're then keeping an eye on how much time is remaining. You begin managing that aspect of it, and it really doesn't matter if one has a bit more sand than the other.

I'm not saying it makes *no* difference, but assuming we're talking differences of just a few seconds, it's practically a non-issue.

Cheers!
Absolutely, orangeblood!

Thread: Re: A Game Like No Other!

orangeblood — 2008-05-13T19:08:05+00:00

In practice, however, it doesn't make much of a difference if the timers are slightly different. Once you start turning them over, you're then keeping an eye on how much time is remaining. You begin managing that aspect of it, and it really doesn't matter if one has a bit more sand than the other.

I'm not saying it makes *no* difference, but assuming we're talking differences of just a few seconds, it's practically a non-issue.

Cheers!

Thread: Re: A Game Like No Other!

MENAREUS2000 — 2008-05-13T12:16:39+00:00

Phlegm wrote:
Why do you guys think the timers had to ahve the same amount of time in each?

Maybe they were supposed to be a bit different.

An interesting thought, but even Kris Burm hinmself admits to not being happy the way the timers turned out and looked for ways to correct the problem, but the cost factor made it impossible.

Thread: Re: Tamsk: the Pluto of the Gipf Series (a eulogy)

latindog — 2008-05-13T02:42:02+00:00

Shhhhh....nobody tell Kris Burm but I consider all 7 games to be part of Gipf. I do, I really do.

My daughter (who's now nine) literally cried when she learned that Pluto was no longer to be considered a planet. It had been her favorite.

Thread: Re: A Game Like No Other!

Phlegm — 2008-05-13T02:00:31+00:00

Why do you guys think the timers had to ahve the same amount of time in each?

Maybe they were supposed to be a bit different.

Thread: Re: A Game Like No Other!

minordemon — 2008-05-12T16:59:02+00:00

MENAREUS2000 wrote:
Upon opening my box, you could actually visibly see the differences in the amounts of sand in the various Egg Timers.

Mine are also visibly different, but when I time them they are pretty close.

Thread: A Game Like No Other!

MENAREUS2000 — 2008-05-12T14:02:39+00:00

When I recently picked up the game "Tzaar", I finally said to myself that I might as well finally pick up a copy of "Tamsk". I'd read they were re-releasing the "Tamsk" game in 2008 with a new look and name. Then I'd read, if they couldn't fix the Egg Timer Problem, they might not release it at all.

So, with "Tamsk" being the only game from the "Gipf" series not in my collection, now seemed like a perfect time to get a copy, which I did.

When I'd read the timers could be a little off, I assumed some would be a few seconds off, more or less, than some of the other timers. Upon opening my box, you could actually visibly see the differences in the amounts of sand in the various Egg Timers. I quickly thought it would only be fair to play a series of four straight games, with each sides switching colors, to make the game a fair one.

But lets talk about the game itself.....

I took the recommendation of the instructions and played the first game without turning over the timers. Lost that one by just 1 ring. The second game I played, we turned over the timers and yet I still managed to lose by a single ring. The third game, I won by 4 or five rings and I began to wonder if I was getting the hang of this game. The game was certainly fun, even without turning over the timers, but using the timers, really created a much greater sense of tension in the game.

It's just amazing with all Kris Burn's games in the series, how such simple components and rules, still manages to crate a fairly complex game, that still manages to be fun. "Tamsk" was certainly no exception.

Everything is nicely packaged in the box and the stands, board and rings were all sturdy and nicely made.

I do hope they decide to release a new addition of the game, although I'm a bit sorry they may change the name of it, which I'm sure we've all gotten so use to.

TO SUM UP

If they ever do fix the timer problem, I'd be more than glad to get the new edition but with that up in the air apparently, I thought It best to get my hands on the original "Tamsk", while they're still around. So if you're anything like me and love perfection in your abstract strategy games, trying playing the four game series, while switching sides each turn to solve the timer problem. Just keep track of the number of rings you're left with after each game and take a total at the end of the series.

I have to imagine, the egg timers were a manufacturing problems, that might have been too costly to correct. In an e-mail I'd sent to Kris Burm a couple of years ago, I'd suggested having the timers with ends that screw off and have the game come with a bag of extra sand, so players could calibrate them to their hearts content. I still hope that's what they decide to do, if they indeed come out with a new one, because "Tamsk" is a wonderful game like no other.

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gutrie_es — 2008-03-31T21:20:45+00:00

moving on

Thread: Re: Time keeps on slipping, slipping, slipping into the futu

rubberchicken — 2008-02-01T01:32:00+00:00

Yinsh may be more deep than Tamsk, but Tamsk is more fun.

Without the timers it is an OK game but the timers add a whole new aspect to the game. You can play a blocking move with a timer (but eventually you have to move it or lose it. So you are forced to unblock.) This adds whole new level of thinking to the game. Also there is no real downtime since the timers are running. Fun.

The strategy seems to be a bit like go. Wall off an area where you will be the only one to place rings.

Thread: Re: Time keeps on slipping, slipping, slipping into the future

stormseeker75 — 2008-01-31T03:31:13+00:00

Thanks. This game is pretty unique, but if you would like to try some of the others, just check out BSW. www.brettspielwelt.de You can play YINSH and DVONN and possibly some of the others.

Thread: Re: Time keeps on slipping, slipping, slipping into the future

Blademaster777 — 2008-01-31T00:57:08+00:00

Great review. I am very interested in the GIPF Project and would like to find someone in my area that has copies of some.

I REALLY liek the idea of the sand timers in TAMASK

Thread: Time keeps on slipping, slipping, slipping into the future

stormseeker75 — 2008-01-30T21:12:23+00:00

The GIPF project has changed the way people approach abstracts. Kris Burm's family of games has shown us that one single idea can spawn an entire series of games that share a similar concept yet are diverse in their goals and different in their approaches. This is the fundamental idea behind the GIPF project and it works extremely well. Some of the games, such as Yinsh (28), DVONN (61), and ZERTZ (95) are popular enought to reside in the top 100 of Boardgamegeek which is quite an accomplishment. However the other games haven't quite attained the status of their 3 big brothers. TAMSK is one of these and is often looked at as the worst of the GIPF family. Burm has even gone so far as to officially remove it in favor of his new creation TZAAR which he feels better fits the GIPF family. Does TAMSK deserve to be excommunicated, or does it deserve a spot on your shelf?

Rules

TAMSK is a game for 2 players. The goal is to use more rings than your opponent.

To start the game, each player takes 32 rings and places them on a ring holder. Each player also chooses one of the colors of sand timers and places them on the corners of the board alternating between red and black.

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There are 3 levels of complexity to the game which provides a way for players to learn the ropes.

The basic game is the easiest way to play and gets players used to the basic mechanics. On a player's turn, he will move one of his pieces to an adjacent space. He may then place a ring on that space. Pieces may only move to unoccupied spaces that are still open. A space closes when the rings around it match its height. The outer spaces are 1 ring high, the next spaces are 2, the inner ring is 3, and the center space is 4. Once a space is closed, pieces can no longer move into it. This ultimately creates a situation in which pieces get trapped with no more moves. If a player cannot make a move, he may pass. The player who has less rings left at the end is the winner.

The second step of the game is where the real fun comes in. The same rules apply as the basic game but every time a timer is move, it must be flipped over. If a timer runs out of sand, it's dead an cannot move for the rest of the game. Additionally, each player must move all 3 of his pieces on his first 3 moves of the game. He can move any pieces after all three have been moved once. The win condition is the same, but in addition to losing pieces to being trapped, a player can lose pieces when they run out of time.

The third level has all the rules of step 2 but adds on last layer of complexity. On a player's turn, his opponent can flip a 15 second timer. If the acting player does not finish within the 15 seconds, he must skip his next turn. He may finish his current turn and place a ring as normal, but he must forego his next one. The 15 second timer cannot be flipped again until it runs out of time.

Additionally, any time a player chooses not to place a ring or forgets to, his opponent may place a ring on the space which the acting player skipped.

Components

TAMSK doesn't have a lot of components but what it does have is solid and attractive in its own abstract way.

To start, the ring holder is made of a reasonably strong black plastic that matches the look and feel of the board. Its not spectacular, but its basically just a rack to store your rings.

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The rings themselves are made of a plastic that feels heavier than it looks like it should be. For such a small piece of plastic it has considerable weight and almost feels like stone instead of plastic. They are polished to a glossy finish which adds to the presentation.

The board is made of a semi-rigid plastic. The spaces are raised holes that allow the sandtimers to sit firmly in place without fear of knocking them over. Each of the spaces is connected by raised lines so you can always see where you are allowed to move your pieces. My board seems to have a slight warp to it, but I think that's because it was in the box the wrong way. I have corrected it and I think it will work out fine.

The most important part of this game is the timers. They look pretty much like any timer you would find in any other game, but a bit taller. The height is actually a bit of a problem because when turned over they tilt in the spaces. They also seem to have a bit of a channel through each end. The timers could really benefit from a slightly wider base, but this could impede the ease with which they go in and out of the spaces. The tilt doesn't seem to affect the sand running through so I don't feel like its a problem. I'm sure there are occassional issues with timers not being equal but I haven't noticed that issue with my pieces.

Gameplay

Frantic. In a word, thats how I would describe TAMSK. On a player's turn, all you need to do is move one piece and place a ring. But the constant falling of sand gets inside your head. This game has a huge psychological factor because you constantly feel like you don't have enough time. Even though the sandtimers have 3 minutes worth of sand, it never seems like there's any left so you constantly feel rushed to make a move and this often leads to sub-optimal maneuvers.

The key to playing TAMSK is to stay calm. You need to make the time work for you instead of working against it. If you can manipulate your opponent's use of the 15 second timer as well, you will be ahead psychologically and probably on the board too. The psychological game here is just as important as the actual gameplay.

While the sandtimers are great the game plays surprisingly well without them. The gameplay boils down to a simple game about position and timing in which each move is more important than the last. While simple, the base game is still a challenge. This is surely one of the key reasons why the full game is so good. When you add the extra dimension of time as a limited resource to a solid base mechanic you have a winning combination of simplicity and depth that many games strive to reach and fail.

Theme

TAMSK is an abstract strategy game so there's no theme here.

Compare it to...

The other GIPF family of games. Although TAMSK is a bit different from the other games due to its use of sand timers, the basic principle is the same. Simple rules with deliciously tough decisions.

Overall

TAMSK is a wonderfully different game that really stands out. While some people see the timers as a gimmick, I see it as a unique way of adding resource management to an abstract. If abstracts stepped out of the box like this one does there would probably be a lot more people that would enjoy them.

I can't really understand the decision to remove TAMSK from the GIPF Project. I've played YINSH and DVONN and TAMSK is on par with them. If its purely for aesthetic reasons then that is a poor choice. Just because TAMSK doesn't look like its siblings doesn't mean that its not just as good and as deserving of a home.

For me, TAMSK is everything I could want in an abstract. The playtime is really quick which allows for multiple plays in one sitting. The basics of gameplay are really quite simple but its a tough game to play well. The game is pure strategy without any luck and it's the players' skill that will ultimately decide the outcome. I'm happy to rate TAMSK 7.5/10. I will certainly play this at least once if asked and I'll probably suggest it pretty frequently as well.

TAMSK is a winner that is outshined by its siblings' success. This game is just as good as the others in the GIPF Project and deserves a home there as well as on your game shelf.

Thread: Learning TAMSK step by step

stormseeker75 — 2008-01-26T14:41:47+00:00

Bianca had recently seem TAMSK in one of the Math Trades that was going on and she was really intrigued. This game has had me interested for quite a while as well. Having played Yinsh and read about other GIPF games, I figured it was time to give this one a go. We placed our order and received our games shortly thereafter.

I sat down and read the rules which took all of 15 minutes. I was glad that they layed out a 3-step plan to play TAMSK because the initial thought of moving under a time limit was daunting.

To start our first game, we decided that we would play without tipping the timers and just move them for ring placement. Bianca chose red so I was left with the black timekeepers. As we moved cautiously around the board it became clear that the goal of the game was to block your opponent so that you could have an unimpeeded run of ring dropping later in the game. Bianca caught on to this quickly and started manuevering towards 2 of my pieces in the corner. She quickly locked down one which gave her an immediate advantage. She ended up winning by one ring because she had killed one of my pieces early. Now that we felt comfortable it was time for Step 2.

Step 2 involves flipping each of your pieces every time you move it. I could tell that Bianca was immediately unnerved at the thought of all that pressure. I was too to some degree, but it didn't bother me nearly as much. As soon as we started moving pieces though, the steady rhythm of dropping sand got in both of our heads. We were moving around frantically relying more on feel than analysis. I was able to trap one of Bianca's pieces early so I had free run down one of the sides which allowed me to win by two rings. Since we had both won one game we decided to play a third to determine the match.

We thought about using the 15 second timer but decided that we were playing fast enough that it wasn't really an issue. So we decided to skip it just to make sure we were comfortable with the game before adding the final layer. Bianca started first again and quickly moved to establish a central position. I was trying to close off one side to give myself a clear run of rings, but in my planning I neglected one of my timers which ran out of sand! It hurts tremendously to lose a piece early in this game, but it hurts even more when its your own fault. Since I was down one so early, I was sure that I had lost. Bianca however made a wrong move that allowed me to sneak through a place I thought had been closed to me. I was wrong in thinking she made a mistake because her following move locked me into a place where I was going to get less rings than before. She hadn't made a mistake at all. She had tricked me. Her move indicated a choice that I felt doomed her but apparently she saw something I did not. I was really impressed that she made such a great move so early in our learning of this game. Needless to say, she went on to win, but only by 2 rings. I fought hard despite being down a piece early on.

Bianca's second win gave her the match. She played incredibly well. I can honestly say that I got outplayed. But I'm looking forward to my rematch. I see TAMSK getting played a lot around here and I'm sure I'll have my chance at redemption.

Here's what I learned in my first TAMSK session:

1. The sand moves through the pieces slower than you think. The pressure of time is mostly an illusion if you play right.

2. The game is actually quite good even without the time pressure. Its a little simple without the time constraint, but it works and it forces you to think. Adding the time mechanism is just icing on an already delicious cake.

3. The game's a bit expensive for what you get. But its really quite unique and I'm glad that I have it. Still, $5 less would be a lot more reasonable especially when you consider the prices of the other GIPF games.

4. Once again, I learned that Bianca is tricky. I often underestimate her and I really should know better by now.

Thread: Re: TAMSK to be retired from series

weishaupt — 2007-12-19T23:59:18+00:00

cradleofmilk wrote:
Roping new "players" into the Project sounds like some crazy cult recruitment program.

Well, isn't that exactly it?

I for one feel pretty brainwashed once I start playing those games. Especially when playing Ultimate GIPF.
My brain is still throbbing from last time.

Thread: Re: TAMSK to be retired from series

cradleofmilk — 2007-12-19T22:26:34+00:00

Roping new "players" into the Project sounds like some crazy cult recruitment program.

Thread: Re: TAMSK to be retired from series

weishaupt — 2007-12-19T16:29:07+00:00

I agree with those reasons too. I'm just sad to see it go, especially since I've used TAMSK on many occasions to rope new players into the Project. Granted, I can still use my copy of TAMSK, but I'll be sad to see this attractive gateway leave the Project GIPF shelf.

Thread: Re: TAMSK to be retired from series

cradleofmilk — 2007-12-19T15:21:27+00:00

The anal retentive in me totally agrees with all of those reasons. TAMSK (check out the pretentious all-caps move) shouldn't be a part of the GIPF project. Way too messy. Not a bad game, of course, but not the cool crispness that is the rest of the project.

Thread: Re: TAMSK to be retired from series

weishaupt — 2007-11-03T13:39:18+00:00

The actual reason is that Smart (and designer Kris Burm, who wholeheartedly agrees with Smart) got the impression that most "serious gamers" (i.e. tournament folks) tend to distrust TAMSK because of the analog conditions found in the game. Not all timers are guaranteed to run at exactly the same speed, I can drop a ring when playing my turn, which leads to lost time, I can revolve my timer quickly or slowly, etc.
Also, they realized that TAMSK was the game casual gamers liked the most in the Project -- but casual gamers are somewhat afraid to try something like this.
So they decided to take TAMSK out of the official Project (replacing it with TZAAR) and republish TAMSK as a standalone game under a different name and a different look.

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folko — 2007-11-01T20:45:23+00:00

Weronika

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folko — 2007-11-01T20:42:17+00:00

Sand 2

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ArtEmiSa64 — 2007-10-28T15:18:51+00:00

readable back of box in 6 languages

Thread: Re: Tamsk: the Pluto of the Gipf Series (a eulogy)

GreatWolf — 2007-10-23T14:49:52+00:00

GaryP wrote:

Would not seven games make the most sense? Gipf is supposed to be the base game; the others build around it. A hexagon with six other hexagons tiled around it makes seven. And, after all, seven is the number of get over yourself.

Well, there's no reason that we can't add Tzaar to our own Gipf Project and still keep Tamsk, especially if there are new Tzaar potentials. It would make *me* happy.

And Tamsk is teh awesome. That's all there is to it.

Seth Ben-Ezra
Great Wolf

Thread: Re: Tamsk: the Pluto of the Gipf Series (a eulogy)

ekted — 2007-10-23T13:47:30+00:00

Thread: Re: Tamsk: the Pluto of the Gipf Series (a eulogy)

GaryP — 2007-10-23T13:41:57+00:00

Extra bonus points for not typing the titles in all caps.

Would not seven games make the most sense? Gipf is supposed to be the base game; the others build around it. A hexagon with six other hexagons tiled around it makes seven. And, after all, seven is the number of get over yourself.

Thread: Re: Tamsk: the Pluto of the Gipf Series (a eulogy)

Ychor — 2007-10-23T12:55:22+00:00

Well said, Cornjob, well said...

Thread: Re: Tamsk: the Pluto of the Gipf Series (a eulogy)

ekted — 2007-10-23T06:30:55+00:00

TAMSK is alive and well, and I'll be damned if I'm gonna let them steal her clothing.

Thread: Tamsk: the Pluto of the Gipf Series (a eulogy)

cornjob — 2007-10-23T05:56:13+00:00

I was severely disturbed to learn that Tamsk has been demoted and is no longer a "Gipf game". It will be replaced by a forthcoming new game, which I'm sure will be very nice and all that. But what of Tamsk?

It still exists! My box is still there on the shelf, with the variable sand-timers and everything. I even have Tamsk potentials to use with my Gipf game. (Hell, you don't think Gipf could get kicked out of the Gipf series do you?) Come to think of it...the side of the box says, "Gipf project" right there in English (or whatever language that is....maybe Myst).

Note the lower right-hand corner for Exhibit A.
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One must ask the question, why must a game be "kicked out" of the Gipf Project for a new game to be added? Couldn't the new game join the happy family? Can't we all just get along? OK, I see there is a sense of SIX. I mean, the boards have 6 sides to them (well, Dvonn kind of does) but the others definitely do.
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So MAYBE you can argue that there is a recurring theme of the number, so that's why. But, may I point out, the shape of the board from Tamsk is more fitting than Dvonn's:
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And WHAT OF THE CHILDREN?! I mean, what of the orphaned Tamsk potentials? Are we supposed to pretend these poor bastard game pieces no longer exist? See them proudly there, the 3rd from the left:
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I just don't understand how people can stand idly by and allow this travesty to take place without saying a word.
"Good men need only to stay silent for evil men to prosper"

Please join me in my eulogy for Tamsk. Its the least we can do, since the die is cast. (Again with the six-side reference, sorry.)

Tamsk. We hardly knew you. Once upon a time, you were a grail. The print run exhausted, many of us toyed with completionist compulsion....whither to eBay or ignore. Yet the reprint came and we were filled. Then Punct, and the symmetry was closed, the set was one, the universe whole. Now we find that our universe is not what we thought it was. Pluto is not, after all, a planet. Gipf is not, after all, complete. Tamsk is not, after all, Gipf. We are pained. We feel a sense of loss. Silently, we weep lonely tears which cling and fall even as the last grains of simulated sand cling and fall in the great minute-timer of life. A beloved friend is no more....and yet, there I think I see him. A square golden flash in the corner of my vision! Methinks it is the Tamsk box in its rightful place on the game shelf. But reason answers, "It cannot be. For thou knowest that Tamsk is no more." And I bitterly close my eyes and turn away, knowing that I didn't see what I thought I saw.

Tamsk, we weep for thee. Honored friend, you will be missed.

Thread: Re: The 15 second timer works how, exactly?

minordemon — 2007-10-10T08:18:31+00:00

For example you can shorten the other player's move by turning the timer.
But you can also extend your own playing time, by turning the timer just before the other player moves.

Thread: Re: The 15 second timer works how, exactly?

Spielguy — 2007-10-09T23:23:14+00:00

No. The penalty only applies if you flip the timer on their turn and it runs out on the same turn before they finish. In that instant the timer ran out in your example you have the ability to flip it. But should you flip it? That is the question. It is likely there are plenty of moves in the game where the 15 second timer isn't flipped. It is still a very integral part of the game.

TAMSK is more a game of waiting than most casual players realize.

Thread: The 15 second timer works how, exactly?

elcomadreja2 — 2007-10-09T22:52:08+00:00

That 15 second timer seems straightforward, but what about this?
I set the timer on my opponent, he finishes, but cannot yet turn over the timer for me because it has not yet run out...
I finish my turn and the timer runs out a second after that... is this a timer penalty for my opponent?

Thread: Re: Quality of components

elcomadreja2 — 2007-10-06T12:51:36+00:00

I had only one timer in my copy of TAMSK that was out-of-whack with the others, and not by that much, and while it doesn't matter *that* much during play it can make a big difference when it comes down to the tie-breaker
All mine are reasonably close, except for one black timer that is a full 30 seconds off.

Thread: Re: TAMSK to be retired from series

rholzgrafe — 2007-09-28T18:03:42+00:00

Tamsk is reputed to be expensive and difficult to produce because of the sand timers. It's important that they be fairly uniform (all keep the same time) and that's hard to do. This may be the real reason it's being dropped.

I've never had the opportunity to play Tamsk, but it looks fascinating. The sand timers were a great idea in theory, even if they've proven to be troublesome to produce in practice.

Thread: Re: TAMSK to be retired from series

elcomadreja2 — 2007-09-28T03:16:53+00:00

I'm almost as depressed as when they kicked pluto out of the planets.
On the one hand, it doesn't seem to fit with the rest of the series... on the other hand it sounds like a marketing scheme. It's probably just both.

Thread: Re: TAMSK to be retired from series

minordemon — 2007-09-28T03:16:17+00:00

Gnomekin wrote:
Does this mean it's no longer going to be made?

The press report said it will stay available, but seperated from the GIPF series. Although TAMSK was always too expensive to product while it was under Schmidt spiele. So maybe it will not last long.

Thread: Re: Discovering TAMSK just as it gets kicked out of GIPF

Bearcat89 — 2007-09-27T13:31:25+00:00

Gnomekin wrote:
http://boardgamegeek.com/thread/213312

http://www.boardgamenews.com/index.php/boardgamenews/comment...
And now I know too...thanks for that information.

As different as TAMSK is from the rest of the GIPF project, I still enjoy it and am glad that I own a copy (especially since the sand timers in my copy are all within a few seconds of each other).

I am looking forward to a new game from Kris, though. He has not failed to deliver a fun and challenging game yet. Now all we need if for him to get off his duff and update the Project GIPF website.

Thread: Re: Discovering TAMSK just as it gets kicked out of GIPF

Henry Rhombus — 2007-09-27T05:37:25+00:00

Gnomekin wrote:
I think it’s a shame that TAMSK is being taken out of the project and, no doubt, going out of print.

As mentioned in the Boardgame News item linked to above, TAMSK will be redesigned to stand on its own and reissued in 2008 by Belgian publisher Smart.

Eric
Editor, http://www.BoardgameNews.com

Thread: Re: Discovering TAMSK just as it gets kicked out of GIPF

docreason — 2007-09-27T03:58:19+00:00

b5mith wrote:
Although I love Tamsk, the biggest issue with the game in my mind is unsuitability for competitive play; And that's something which separates it from the rest of the series. Due to the nature of the sand timers it can be difficult to tell if a move was legal, and there's no stopping to resolve the issue mid-game!

I am sure there is also a cost factor. Maybe Tamsk goes off and anchors down a second series of games. Do a series of real-time and time based games, linked together.

Thread: Re: Discovering TAMSK just as it gets kicked out of GIPF

b5mith — 2007-09-27T00:18:37+00:00

Although I love Tamsk, the biggest issue with the game in my mind is unsuitability for competitive play; And that's something which separates it from the rest of the series. Due to the nature of the sand timers it can be difficult to tell if a move was legal, and there's no stopping to resolve the issue mid-game!

Thread: Re: Discovering TAMSK just as it gets kicked out of GIPF

Gnomekin — 2007-09-26T18:58:21+00:00

http://boardgamegeek.com/thread/213312

http://www.boardgamenews.com/index.php/boardgamenews/comment...

Thread: Re: Discovering TAMSK just as it gets kicked out of GIPF

Bearcat89 — 2007-09-26T18:35:54+00:00

I don't know where you are getting your information from, but the official GIPF Project website has no news about TAMSK being removed or replaced.

Thread: Discovering TAMSK just as it gets kicked out of GIPF

Gnomekin — 2007-09-26T15:33:43+00:00

Last night, I finally broke in my copy of TAMSK. I am slowly acquiring all of the GIPF Project and working my way through them. Since I have helped form a small Go group, I have been becoming more and more interested in abstracts and the GIPF Project is the poster child of the modern abstract.

I had put off getting TAMSK for a while. It is the most expensive game in the project and it is clearly the most fragile as well. On top of that, it also comes in a box too large to fit into my usual gaming bags. However, when I saw it on sale, I knew I had to get it since I knew I was eventually going to get all of the GIPF Project.

So, I found an extra large bag and took TAMSK over to Nate’s place.

TAMSK is a game about time. Each player has three pieces that are also sand timers. In all but the most basic ways to play, every time you make a move, you flip your piece. If a piece runs out of sand, then it can no longer be moved. When you move a piece, you place a ring on the new space. However, each space can only hold so many rings. Once it is full, no one can move into that space. When no one can make any more moves, whoever has placed the most rings wins.

In short, TAMSK is a pretty simple abstract strategy game. Not a bad game in and of itself but one that definitely becomes more interesting when you add the time factor.

Nate and I read through the rules and started off with the most basic set of rules, which did not involve flipping the timers at all. I won that game by one point and we had an idea of how the game worked.

We then ratcheted up the tension and played a game with the second set of rules, which is where you start flipping over the timers. That added some tension to the game. Nate won that game by four points.

Finally, we felt we were ready for the real TAMSK experience and got out the fifteen second timer. On your opponent’s turn, you could flip that timer over and they would be forced to complete there move before it ran out of time or you got to place two rings instead of one. Not only did this really add some heat to the fire, it also meant that you couldn’t stall to try and let one of your opponent’s pieces run out of sand. I won that game by one point.

While we agreed that other games in the GIPF series are better, we also agreed that TAMSK was fun and would hit the table again.

This morning, I learned that TAMSK is being pulled from the GIPF series and a new game will be taking its place. I’m glad that I managed to get my first games in before I learned that so that I got to play TAMSK while it was still part of the project, at least in my heart.

I think it’s a shame that TAMSK is being taken out of the project and, no doubt, going out of print. It’s biggest issues, size and price, really don’t reflect on its actual game play. On the other hand, I already have a copy and the potential pieces for it so that doesn’t really affect me and I have a new GIPF game to look forward to.

Thread: Re: TAMSK to be retired from series

Gnomekin — 2007-09-26T13:25:18+00:00

Great. I finally get TAMSK and get to play it, only to learn it's getting kicked out of the GIPF project.

Does this mean it's no longer going to be made? That's a shame since it actually is a pretty good game. Although, if that is the case, I am quite glad I got a copy.

Thread: Re: TAMSK to be retired from series

minordemon — 2007-09-24T06:34:15+00:00

It looks like they are going to replace every game untill they all have logical explainable names...

pünct = german for point (oops, that's with a k and without a heavy metal umlaut)
tzaar = is a mashup op german (Zar) and dutch (tsaar) which ofcourse means tsar.

Edit: my mistake

Thread: Re: TAMSK to be retired from series

uiek — 2007-09-23T18:12:03+00:00

I think there is other problem. Since Smart got rights for GIPF Project from Don & Co, many things have changed. Now you can see one of them.

I think their decision was based on weak sell of TAMSK (in comparison to other titles from the series). But I do not understand why they have decided to throw it out!

I know that GIPF Project from the very beginning was series of six games, and I can imagine, that when Kris designed new game similar to others he wanted to add it to the "family". And TAMSK was the bad one that had to be thrown out.

Thread: Re: TAMSK to be retired from series

redgamer — 2007-09-23T05:13:44+00:00

I’ve always thought that TAMSK was severely underrated (especially when compared to its sister games), and giving it the boot from the series seems kind of weird. Still, there ain’t nothin’ wrong with a new Burm creation!

Thread: Re: TAMSK to be retired from series

Tsaar — 2007-09-22T19:02:59+00:00

Tzaar?

Grmbl...

Thread: Re: TAMSK to be retired from series

BaSL — 2007-09-22T18:31:27+00:00

Just when I thought I had the series complete...

Image

BaSL — 2007-04-19T13:44:08+00:00

Image

BaSL — 2007-04-19T13:43:35+00:00

Boxback

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BaSL — 2007-04-19T13:42:32+00:00