Game: Pylos

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pete belli — 2008-10-20T23:12:53+00:00

Pyraos Classic -- contents of a complete set

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Ashlar — 2008-09-28T20:01:07+00:00

The gigantic Pylos was a hit - BrainGames booth at Kids & Family fair

Thread: Re: Pylos with Abalone pieces?

kfas — 2008-08-07T19:25:40+00:00

I created some Pylos boards for glass balls from clay. They are not perfect, but the pyramid does not fall apart. There was a problem of coloring the balls. I thought of using the Abalone marbles which are colored already. The problem is that you really need 15 of each color to form the pyramid. Abalone set has only 14 of each color.

For testing the gameplay its OK, as you can imagine putting the last balls on the pyramid and you know who wins, but lacking the two balls I don't know if making the board is worth the effort.

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tickwang — 2008-08-04T08:46:43+00:00

Balls of Pylos, to be opened

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tickwang — 2008-08-04T08:07:23+00:00

pylos with rules and bag

Thread: Re: Rules?

drunkenKOALA — 2008-08-01T05:29:47+00:00

I posted the rules in my review. Ask if you have further questions.

Thread: Rules?

Daddys_Home — 2008-08-01T04:50:16+00:00

I found a copy of this at the thrift store, but no rules. Can someone please post? Thanks ahead of time.

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herman_the_german — 2008-07-18T16:41:09+00:00

Box comparison. Pylos travel and regular editions. The marbles do not all fit in the small board's border.

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Angry Duck — 2008-07-09T05:46:36+00:00

game setup

Thread: Replay my games: A Notated Pylos Session

chrisjwmartin — 2008-06-01T21:47:57+00:00

PLEASE READ THIS THREAD FIRST

Introduction

As you will see from the above thread, I previously created a notation for the game Pylos, based on algebraic chess notation. Having organised a session of abstract games, I thought that this would be the perfect opportunity to try out my new notation, and so it turned out to be, with some interesting games. All games were played using the basic rule set (i.e. without the rules for rows of four or three). I would like to thank my gaming buddies, who were not experienced in Pylos, for agreeing to let me notate the games.

Game One

This game was played between me (yellow / “white”) and X, who had never played Pylos before but who is a talented abstracts player. I wrote this notation from white's perspective.

1c2 1c3
1b3 1a2
1b1 1c1
1d4 1d2
1b4 1a3
1a1 1a4
1b1-2a3 1b1
1d1 1a2-2c1
1a2 1c4
1a2-2b3 1a2
1d3 1b1-2c2
1a1-2c3 1b1
1a1 1b2
2b2 1b1-2a2
2c3-3a2 1b1
1d4-2a1 1d4
2c3 2c1-3b2
1d1-2b1 3a1
1d1 2c1
3b1 ---
4a1

As you can tell from playing it through, the game had a number of interesting features. Firstly, the explicitly passive opening of oppositional white balls {1c2 1c3 / 1b3} [to be described further in a forthcoming article on opening strategy in Pylos]. Secondly, the five holes in the bottom grid formed by {1d4 1d2 / 1b4}. Thirdly, the lack of squares despite having a beginner playing, a consequence mostly, I believe, of the passive opening, but also my generally negative, closed-down style of play: I focus more on flattening my opponents!

Game Two

X and I reversed positions and I played as brown / “black”, thus writing the notation upside down, perhaps making it more likely to be wrong!

1b3 1c2
1c3 1b4
1d2 1d4
1a3 1a2
1b1 1a1
1c1 1d1
1c3-2c1 1c3
1d3 1d4-2c2
1d4 1a4
1d4-2a3 1d4
1c4 1d4-2b3
1b2 1a1-2b2
1b1-2a2 1a1
1b1 1a1-2b1
2a3-3b1 1a1
2a1 1a4-3a1
1a4 2a3
3a2 1d4
2c3 3b2
--- 4a1

Another interesting game, with the same unusual (to me) five holes pattern, and again a close scoreline.

Game Three

I now suggested that X played Y, who had played rather less than I had. This resulted in a much more open game with both players making slightly “kerazy” moves. X was black and Y was white. I notated this game from the side (all good practice).

1b2 1c3
1b1 1a2
1c2 1c1
2b1 1d2
1b4 1a3
1a4 1d4
1c4 1d3
1a4-2c2 1a3-2c3
1a3 1a4
1b3 1a4-2b2
1a4(1a4,1a3)O 1a2-2b3
1a3 1d1
1a2(1a2,1a3)O 1a3
1a1 1a2
1a1-2a2 1d1-3b2
1d1 1a4
1d1-2a3 3a2
1a1 2a1
3a1 1d1
2c1 ---
3b1 ---
4a1

Unfortunately my tutelage had not demonstrated the absolute importance of not letting your opponent get a square, and X thus fell into that trap a couple of times against Y. However even so this was not a complete walkover and was an exciting and free-flowing game.

Summing Up

These may not be all-time classic games of Pylos, but they were interesting and help raise a number of points for people interested in the strategy of the game. In particular the first game raises the question of the passive opening which will form the basis of (hopefully) my next article.

Thread: Towards A Pylos Notation

chrisjwmartin — 2008-04-06T17:31:13+00:00

Introduction
Pylos, being a conceptually simple game with, nonetheless, many different play positions and possible game pathways, seems well-suited to being notated, both for purposes of recording games and also for the purposes of discussing strategy. In this article I will seek to describe the system of notation which I use for describing my own games of Pylos, and give some examples of use. I will assume at all times that the reader is already familiar with the game of Pylos; this article on notation is not the right place to also attempt an in-depth description of what is anyway a remarkably easy game to learn. If you are not familiar with Pylos, I recommend reading the reviews here www.boardgamegeek.com%2Fforum%2F63%2Fboardgame%2F1419%5Dlink...">url=http://www.boardgamegeek.com/forum/63/boardgame/1419]link[/url or, better yet, playing the game yourself: it is easy to learn, but very rewarding.

Terminology
I shall refer to the colours as white and black, and the players as the white player and the black player (or, white and black), where the white player plays first. I will use masculine pronouns for the white player and feminine pronouns for the black player. [No racial or sexual connotations are implied - these conventions are adopted solely for the sake of clarity.]

I shall refer to levels, columns and rows. By levels, I mean the vertical dimension of the board; by columns, I mean the breadth of the board (from an orthogonal perspective); by rows, I mean the depth of the board. Thus, the columns are all equidistant from the player; the rows are progressively further from him; and the levels are progressively built up. I will be inconsistent in my use of the term 'bottom', which can variously mean lowest level or nearest row. I will use the term 'slot' to mean a space in which a ball can be placed within the game.

A Tridimensional Algebraic Notation
Just as in Chess, where there are standard notations used for the purposes of notating games and also discussing strategy, I will be using a notation that I have created for Pylos. I will be using an algebraic notation based upon a board placed orthogonally to two players sat opposite to each other. (Although there is some merit, both strategically and diagnostically, to considering the board diagonally, it is easier to notate orthogonally.)

I have chosen to use a tridimensional notation: as such, the notation gives a number-letter-number, indicating level-column-row. As in algebraic chess notation, this is done from the perspective of the white player. e.g. 1a1 for the bottom level, the left-most column (as facing white) and the bottom-most row (as facing white); or 1c4 for the bottom level, the centre-right column (as facing white) and the top-most row (as facing white); or 2b2 for the central spot on the second level; or 4a1 for the top of the pyramid.
The exact details of this scheme are entirely arbitrary, even within the premisses of tridimensionality and algebraicity: it would have been perfectly possible to refer to the levels with a Greek, Hebrew or other non-Latin letter, in order to differentiate it better from the other dimensions, but I felt that this would be too arduous to type, and that capital letters would be too confusing, especially since I wanted to retain letters for columns from chess notation. Also, one could have referred to the higher levels according to different standards for their rows and columns: I chose to take the bottom-left of each level as a new starting point, but it would not be irrational to refer to each level's columns and rows in absolute terms, that is, since the four slots of level 3 are directly above the central slots of the bottom level (level 1), it makes a degree of sense to refer to them as b2, b3, c2 and c3 respectively; however, this becomes problematic when combining even and odd levels; though the problems are not insuperable, I elected to adopt the simpler convention of restarting the notation of each level with a1 for its bottom-left slot.

It is also possible to use other-dimensional, or non-algebraic notations. I toyed with the idea of a bidimensional notation, treating the levels as adjuncts of each other, and with the idea of a unidimensional notation, especially useful for inputting data into spreadsheet analyses of game positions. But ultimately I decided that a tridimensional notation would do the most justice to the game, and be the most easily comprehensible "at-a-glance".
Similarly, one could use non-algebraic notations. This would use the same kind of descriptions as I have used in describing the algebraic positions; for example, 1a1 in my system becomes something like BFL1, for Bottom level, Far Left column, 1st row - and these notations would be written perspectively. However, I reject this for the same reasons that it is rejected in modern chess notation, that algebraic notation is less ambiguous and more compact, while not being overly more difficult to read.

Here is a "map" of what all of the slots are called:
[c] Level 1 Level 2 Level 3 Level 4
Black Black Black Black
1a4 1b4 1c4 1d4
1a3 1b3 1c3 1d3 2a3 2b3 2c3 3a2 3b2
1a2 1b2 1c2 1d2 2a2 2b2 2c2 3a1 3b1 4a1
1a1 1b1 1c1 1d1 2a1 2b1 2c1
White White White White[/c]

Other Notation
The remaining notation in Pylos is relatively simple. Unlike in chess, there are no different types of piece, and unlike chess there are only two "special" moves (or possibly three/four with the alignment rules, though really these simply give extra possibilities for using the same special move).

For the first special move, that of raising a ball to a higher level, I will use a standard method of describing from where the ball came, then adding a dash, and then describing, as normal, to where the ball went. Thus, 1a1-2b2 describes a ball being raised from the bottom-left slot on the bottom level to the central slot of the second level; 2b2 by itself describes a ball being placed into the central slot of the second level from the player's ball pool.

For the second special "move", that of removing two balls after the formation of a square of one's own colour (or of an orthogonal line on one of the bottom two levels in the advanced game), I will describe the removed balls in brackets after the placed ball. Thus, a move could be 1d3(1d3,1d2), to describe a ball which was placed, resulting in a square and the removal of the ball and its partner on 1d2.
It is possible to distinguish between the three different types of reason for the second special move if necessary, though this information would be purely descriptive, and not necessary for a recreation of the game (much like the + notation for check in chess, which is superfluous but interesting). My concern in picking appropriate symbols is ease of typing on a standard QWERTY keyboard; though it would be possible to pick e.g. □, ║ and ═ from the Unicode set to represent squares, four-long lines on level 1 and three-long lines on level 2 respectively, these symbols are not immediate to type. Therefore, I would suggest O, + and Y respectively, which hopefully bring clearly to mind the ideas of a square (or ring) of balls, of four balls and of three balls. the above described move would then become 1d3(1d3,1d2)O; I place the O at the end on the principle that necessary notation should come before merely interesting notation.

Improving the Notation
This notation is still a work in progress; though I think it is quite sound, there are bound to be improvements that can be made. For example, I have considered dropping the initial 1 from moves on the bottom level: this is because the majority of moves in the game are made on the bottom level, and thus dropping that prefatory 1 could make our notation approximately 17% more concise across the course of a game, while, one may feel, not losing much by way of readability - much as the P is usefully abbreviated out of descriptions of pawn moves in chess. Alternately, it may be decided that my special move notation is misleading; for example, it might make more sense to describe the raising a ball move with the destination first, in line with the other moves.

Others may consider that the level-column-row protocols which I adopted are misleading or insufficient; others yet may have entirely new, original ideas. However, until such time as a sound case is made for a superior notation system for Pylos, I will remain content with the system described in this article.

A Sample Game (standard rules)
[c]White Black
1b2 1c3
1c4 1c2
1d2 1b3
1d2-2b2 1d2
1d3 1c1
2c2 1d1(1c1,1d1)
1c1 1a4
1b1 1a4-2b1
1a2 1a1
1c4-2a1 1b4
1c4 2b3
1a4 1d4
1a4-2c3 1a4
1a3 2b1-3b2
1c1-2a2 1c1
1d1 1a4-2b1
1a4 2c1
2a2-3b1 2a3
2a2 3a1
3a2 4a1
0-1[/c]

Thread: Re: Pylos with Abalone pieces?

Furan — 2008-04-03T18:25:42+00:00

Well, I've been thinking about the same before buying Pylos.
I've tried to do so, using small cardboard-box, but Abalone marbles are to heavy.
Anyway... I think you should try to take massive,solid tea box, glue some net (to make sure, that the marbles won't move) into it, and give Pylos-Abalone a go

OH! Right, try to use plasticine (plastelina) marbles

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Meat — 2008-02-29T10:52:07+00:00

Game End

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Meat — 2008-02-29T10:50:38+00:00

Box Front - 1994 "Classic" edition

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aluepke — 2008-01-03T11:36:54+00:00

The box and the game itself

Thread: Re: some Q

drunkenKOALA — 2007-12-18T06:16:02+00:00

A. Yes as long as it is supported by four other balls from the level below it.

B. Yes but you probably don't want to.

C. When you raise a ball that completes a line/square on the same move, you also get to remove one or two balls. So this can potentially save you up to three balls.

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osplva — 2007-12-16T12:57:43+00:00

Thread: Re: Pylos with Abalone pieces?

unic — 2007-12-15T18:31:27+00:00

You don't have to use marbles to try it out necessarily - before buying it, I tried it out using discs instead of marbles. That solved the problem of requiring a special board to keep the marbles in place.

Of course - all of the aestethics of the original are lost.

Thread: Pylos with Abalone pieces?

steady — 2007-12-15T17:43:56+00:00

Is it possible to play Pylos using the Abalone marbles? Does anybody have the idea, how to make board for the marbles? I am interested in Pylos but i want to try it first.

Thread: some Q

fmoros — 2007-12-06T09:53:46+00:00

Hi!

I have just played my first game.
I dont have other rules than the ones printed on the back of the box, so a few questions arised, which i would be thankful if any kind soul want to answer:

A- Can a player place a ball from the reserve directly into a higher level? (whether there is vacant spaces on lower levels or not)

B- When you make a square you can take 2 balls: Can you take 2 balls that are part of the square?

C- Now i dont remember the third question.. but there was sthing else...

thanks and happy games !!

Thread: Re: Similar game is . . .

Dingus — 2007-08-15T04:53:21+00:00

Pyramids now has its own listing here on BGG.

Thread: Re: Computer version

shagiephoto — 2007-06-02T07:38:03+00:00

With some digging, found an applet to play it.

http://multivac.fatburen.org/~ivan/pyraosapplet.html

However, it looks like it is only against other players on a server few (if anyone) connect to (no one was on when I connected).

For that matter, given that the docs on the server protocol were last updated in '01, the server might not be up either.

Still, a stop closer to online play for those looking for it.

Thread: Piling it up

Randall Silver — 2007-05-06T11:31:46+00:00

Pylos is an abstract strategy game for 2 players. The object of the game is to be the last person to put a ball at the top. The game lasts for about 10 to 20 minutes, all depending on the players, of course.

For once, one of my reviews will tell you all the rules of the game. Even then, this rather short review will be bigger than the rulebook itself

The rules

One player is chosen to start (and pick a colour), and the game is on.
Players take turn in putting one of their balls on the board.

The board has a hollowed out 4X4 grid, so they won't roll off. By filling up the holes, you create enough space for a second "floor" and so on, until there's only one space left: the one on top.

As usual with Gigamic games, the rules are very simple, but it doesn't make the game dull at all.

If there is a possibility to put balls on a higher level, players can take a ball (of own colour) already on the board, as long as it will be put higher on the pyramid.
Also, every time a player gets a square of 4 balls of his own colour, one or two balls can be taken back in "stock".

An advanced rule is that you can also form 4 in a row on the bottom level, or 3 in a row on the second level, to take back 1 or 2 balls.

The look and feel of the game

You can't go wrong with the look. Put this on your coffee table, and people will want to play it. The wooden board and balls are very pretty to look at. I own the large version myself, and it looks great. There's also a normal version, a travel version, and I heard there's some cheaper plastic version as well. I would go for the wooden one. I saw pics of the plastic (or whatever it is) version, and it's not nearly as aesthetically pleasing.

Odds are, people seeing this on your table will also like to play it. It's good for 3 plays in a row, and it can actually be very involving if you use the advanced rules as well.

It's quite possible to get to the third layer, and then starting a chain reaction so you're both back to the bottom layer.

This is a great game for abstract strategy players. It's fast, it's fun, but you still have to think, despite the very easy rules.
Getting to the top isn't nearly as easy as it sounds, and after playing it a few times, I'm sure you'll agree with the many prizes this game has won.

Thread: Re: Computer version

Maksimov — 2007-03-27T23:20:58+00:00

The link doesn't work anymore.

Thread: Re: a portrait of the koala as a ...

molnar — 2006-09-14T21:47:25+00:00

Cute review. Or something. I will keep an eye out for this one...
But, I guess one would need at least four of these to play Akron.
Although,

drunkenKOALA wrote:

...MATH PROFESSOR

I can´t really explain why, ...

I never said that.

Thread: a portrait of the koala as a ...

drunkenKOALA — 2006-09-12T20:12:53+00:00

...LACONIC REVIEWER
Pylos is a perfect information game played by 2 players. Games last around 15 minutes. The game is also known as Pyraos.

...LICENSED LAWYER
The board is a 4x4 array of dented holes. There are 15 black and 15 white balls. Using the board as the base, a 4 level (4x4, 3x3, 2x2, 1x1) pyramid is built as the game progresses.

On each turn, a player can either 1)place a marble from his reserve or 2)relocate one of his balls on the board to a higher level. Balls can stack on top of others only if it is being supported by 4 balls. A ball that is supporting another ball cannot be moved.

Whether it be by placing or relocating, if you form a 2x2 square or an orthogonal line that spans the first or second level, you get to (and must) remove 1 or 2 balls of your own from the board.

The player to place the top ball and finish the pyramid wins.

reduced variants
Instead of applying all 3 methods to save balls, some variants only use 1 or 2 of them.

...AVID GAMER
The player who keeps a bigger reserve of balls wins, because the player who runs out of balls first will be unable to complete the pyramid. But that is easier said than done, because the larger your reserve, the less balls you have to play with on the board!

Forming squares, completing lines and raising balls are fairly straightforward and simple in and of themselves. However, the catch is to threaten to do so, and guard the opponent from doing so, while using as few balls as possible. Moreover, the 3 methods of conserving balls interplay quite well with each other to add another level of depth to the game. By blocking an opponent from completing a line, you might be creating a platform for him to raise one of his balls to. When you raise one of your balls, you may be leaving behind an empty space which, if taken by your opponent, can lead to his forming a square/line. All these add up to a very dynamic and exciting game.

One drawback to Pylos is that the opening and endgame are usually mere formalities, because the possibilities and consequences one needs to consider are very limited in these situations. The midgame, however, is where Pylos really shines. The gameplay can be quite intense and cut-throat, with many shifts in momentum leading up to a dramatic victory. I´ve won many games where the outlook was grim up until the very last couple of moves, and vice versa. In a tightly, well fought match, one move can turn the game around.

...MATH PROFESSOR
A position to strive for, and prevent the opponent from achieving, is the cross or T on the first level. A cross uses 5 balls, and requires 6 balls to block all the square and line threats. A T uses 4 balls, and requires 4 balls to block. Having a cross is obviously good because it lets you save one more ball in your reserve than your opponent. A T is also good, because he cannot move his blocking balls before you remove one of your balls making the T. This gives you more versatility of movement. Suppose a platform is formed, you might be able to use it for a raise before he does because his balls are ¨pinned¨.

After completing a square/line, one can remove 1 or 2 balls. It´s almost always best to remove 1 ball that is part of the newly formed square/line, so you can keep reforming the square/line until he blocks it. Removing the 2nd ball is a lot trickier, and this goes for raising a ball as well: if all the removable/raisable balls are in key and vital positions, it´s better to not remove/relocate any at all. If one of them is expendable, then remove/raise that one.

Everything else being equal, don´t place a ball that will complete a platform if the opponent has an ¨unpinned¨ ball that he can raise.

I can´t really explain why, but experience indicates that it´s usually not worth it to raise a ball to the 3rd level. Not until everything else is ¨settled¨ anyways (all the balls are locked/pinned, no more ball saving moves available).

player advantage
One of the neat things about Pylos is that it´s not clear which player has the advantage. Going first obviously gives you the edge in terms of controlling the board and creating lines and squares. However, your reserve is always one ball short of your opponent´s, until you manage to pull a ball saving move.

...COFFEE TABLE DECORATOR
I have the Gigamic wooden version. The color of the black balls seem more artificial than natural (not very pleasant, glossy). But overall, the pieces have a decent quality and a nice solid touch to it. Verdict: coffee table quality.

...QUIRKY MARSUPIAL
I never play with the reduced variants.

Thread: Re: Short and to the point

drunkenKOALA — 2006-07-23T10:07:46+00:00

I think pylos is a bit deeper strategically than you seem to think. I play with the line rule.

Thread: Short and to the point

Gecko23 — 2005-06-03T15:07:03+00:00

I picked up a copy of this game for cheap off of ebay, attracted by both its aesthetics, as well as its cheapness.

Now, my set is a bit unusual. It *is* made by Gigamix, but it isn't wood. The whole thing is 100% plastic. And instead of light and dark wooden marbles, I've got yellow and gray. Doesn't hurt the playability at all, but wouldn't look all that pretty sitting on a shelf or coffee table.

The set is simple, a truncated pyramid base with a ditch around the base for holding the out-of-play marbles, and 16 depressions on top making up the playing field. Playing pieces consist of 30 marbles in two colors.

The box also contains instructions in 8 languages (see if I can remember them all...): English, Spanish, Italian, Portugese, German, Dutch, French, Japanese. All on a single sheet of paper.

The goal of the game is also simple: place the top marble on the pyramid, or be the last player able to place a marble at all.

The strategy is pretty simple too: try not to use all your marbles before your opponent does.

But, like many good games, all this simple adds up to an interesting, and more complex whole.

There are special plays, such as forming squares, that either compel you to stack marbles, or allow you to retrieve them from the board. This is the only real mechanism you have for trying to steal the lead. These things also can cascade, so the marble you stack may compel you to stack more.

So you have to keep track of the situation on your current level, and worry about what the upper levels will potentially look like as well. Admittedly, this isn't rocket science, but it is entertaining.

The typical game takes 5-10 minutes, maybe longer if either of you is trying to play seriously.

In the end, Pyraos, like a lot of Gigamix games, is a short, simple, and satisfying abstract. Not enough depth to play all night, or even for hours, but simple enough to get into to work well to plug those 15-20 minute lulls. (Me and the kids played 4 times while waiting for fish-sticks to heat up last night. )

The only downside I can see is that the wooden versions, also like the rest of the gigamix line, can be pretty pricey. But of course they look really good, so use your own judgement there.

Thread: Re: Similar game is . . .

Gecko23 — 2005-06-03T02:47:12+00:00

Be aware that there is a plastic Gigamix version of this game as well. I didn't even know that Gigamix made plastic games until I got mine.

Thread: Session Report

vitas — 2004-05-08T01:24:14+00:00

Pylos

Players were Nancy, myself. Nancy was a new player to the game.

This game caught Nancy's eye, so we gave it a go.

We played three games. As usual, I won the first game, because it
takes my opponent one play to catch on to the strategy and tactics of
the game.

I had to point out moves she would've wanted to make the third game,
though they turned out no the best moves. Is that a sly way of saying
I was persuading her to lose?

Final scores were:
* Nancy: lose/win/lose
* Vitas: win/lose/win

Thread: Re:Similar game is . . .

Aardvark — 2004-04-09T23:49:55+00:00

I think Pyramids is actually a better game than Pyraos. The components are marginal however.

Thread: Computer version

Lertulo — 2004-04-09T16:34:16+00:00

Try http://www.randomly.com/pyraos for a computer version of this one.

Thread: Similar game is . . .

Dingus — 2003-08-25T17:12:53+00:00

I have a game called Pyramids by Hilco Corporation that has 25 "hollows" for the marbles instead of 16. In its rules you can place a marble on a square if three of the four marbles are your color. No removing marbles. Hollow plastic red and blue marbles change the look/feel from Pyraos - not sure of the gameplay. I will try using only 16 hollows to see.