Game: Toppo

Thread: Re: Hello Rules Lawyers: Definition of a legal Top!!!

msaari — 2008-12-01T18:38:46+00:00

I would have an exclusive or there, so no matching cards in tops. Of course, a top can include a matching card, if it tops another card.

Thread: Re: Hello Rules Lawyers: Definition of a legal Top!!!

pusboyau — 2007-10-18T09:25:43+00:00

Well last night I mentioned that no matching card was allowed for a top, which resulted in a few incorrect calls and 5 extra cards being dealt out. So far me it improved the play as it increased anxiety and much shuffling.

Nick

Thread: Re: Hello Rules Lawyers: Definition of a legal Top!!!

pusboyau — 2007-08-09T10:00:33+00:00

Thanks for take Doug; I think in the next game I'll play to the "or" condition and see how that goes, may increase the frustration

Thread: Re: Hello Rules Lawyers: Definition of a legal Top!!!

dougadamsau — 2007-08-09T03:36:31+00:00

Nick, that's a great question. I've always played you can "Top" that set, with the option just to place the matching card if you want.

Thread: Hello Rules Lawyers: Definition of a legal Top!!!

pusboyau — 2007-08-09T01:01:44+00:00

I just need a confirmation regarding Tops and Matches: can you make a legal Top which includes a Matching card?

For example: in the central display is a blue wave card, red square card and yellow cross card(as on box cover). Can I call "Top" if I have arranged in front of me a white wave card, red circle card and a matching yellow cross card.

From reading in the "Top" paragraph, part of the qualifying sentence states "must coincide in symbol or in colour" which would disqualify the yellow cross example. Also there are no examples to support this assumption.

Also the fact "Matching" is discussed in a seperate paragraph reinforces my "Top" is illegal.

Any thoughts?

Nick

Thread: Re: The Pajama party

Fad23 — 2007-06-09T16:16:46+00:00

Oh, shut the front door!

I did realize that "swing" might be misconstrued, but I didn't remember that "top" had a completely different meaning in that context. While I have known gamers who enjoyed the local fetish club, this wasn't them.

For the purposes of the post, I meant "Swing" as in Jitterbug, not as in wife swapping. "Top" as in the game, not as in....

Thread: Re: The Pajama party

UhhhClem — 2007-06-09T10:26:45+00:00

I will confess I thought the phrase "swing club" meant something quite different from what it actually does in this context. The fourth paragraph in particular had me raising my eyebrow.

Thread: The Pajama party

Fad23 — 2007-06-09T09:11:06+00:00

At the last second I found out that a local swing club was having a pajama party and game night. There was going to be a DJ and a bunch of people swing dancing. So I brought a bag full of games that I thought I'd be able to teach people quickly and in dim light with blaring music.

After the event organizer did a quick demo of cupstacking (it's harder than it looks) I pulled out my box of Toppo and asked the two ladies sitting at the table, Kristine and her non-dancing cousin Glenda if they wanted to learn a new game. At a booth nearby, a few college kids were playing that old standby Uno.

So after explaining the game to them they seemed to mostly get it. There was the initial confusion about which cards could be singly played. Once that was remedied (no penalties for first time offenses) the game was underway. Of course, I won the first hand. Afterwards, I suggested we try it again and then take a dancing break. I put out four cards to the center and we found it a bit harder to call "Top," but the game was making more sense for everyone. Pretty soon we had another player at the table. I think his name was Matt. After we finished that round, Kristine was ready to go again.

Anyway, I got pulled away from the table by a young lady from Riverside, and the three others kept playing. Then Kristine got up for a dance (game and music gave her a headache) and Glenda and "Matt" kept playing. I stopped to check in on them and they found that it was easier to get stuck waiting for a Top when there were fewer players. So in some ways, this game moves faster with more people at the table. They didn't keep score between rounds, but they were enjoying the activity. They seemed to have an easier time topping than playing identical singles or especially mixing it up, but they were able to notice when penalties needed assignment. That wasn't very often.

I left again because they played my request of "Rehab," by Amy Winehouse. Fun stuff. I danced with my friend Angel and then played Khet for a while.

It was good to have dancing nearby, because I usually need to find a reason to get out of my chair and move. A couple of times the club turned on their blacklight and the cards took on an eerie hue. The colors became more vivid and easier to tell apart. Then the blacklight would go out and we'd have to adjust.

I dropped in a few more times later on, but by then they'd already gotten faster than me. In the last game when Glenda called "Toppo" I had 19 cards still left in my hand. Just before the last songs of the night were played I suggested we change games, but there wasn't really enough time to teach and play something new.

Thread: Re: Toppo

Fad23 — 2007-05-29T16:47:49+00:00

I just bought this game last weekend, and don't remember seeing a rule that says that the stacks can be cleared if nothing matches. When we were playing the game without knowing we could shuffle, the game was an exercise in tedium. After we corrected the rule, it became much more enjoyable.

The reason I bring up the notion of clearing is because it would eliminate the need to look for Tops (for those who haven't played, each players ordered groups of cards that match the center cards in color or shape). Creating Tops seems to me should be the only way to change the center cards.

There is some text in the rules about clearing, and I believe that when players call "Top" that all other players are required to clear their display and add those cards back into their deck.

Still, a very fine game that mixes Speed, Set and Crazy Eights. Some day I'll be able to play a game with multiple rounds, where the hand winner gets to choose the number of cards in the center. That should be interesting.

edit:
And then another rule that I missed - I didn't realize that players could rearrange their sets. That makes forming a Top that much easier!

Thread: One of these things is not like the other...or is it?

swandive78 — 2007-01-03T03:14:08+00:00

If you've clicked on this review, you're either:

a) wondering if Toppo might be a game you'd like to play or buy; or

b) wondering if my opinion of Toppo will agree with your own, if you've already played it.

I'll do my best to give you a good answer. But first, a bare-bones description of play.

The Toppo deck has 150 cards. Each card has two properties: shape and color. The shapes are circles, squares, a plus sign, two wavy lines, or a capital "I." The colors are green, blue, yellow, red and white. A card might have a white plus sign, another card might have a green circle, and a third might have a blue square.

Each player is dealt a personal deck of 33 cards, which are kept face-down in their hands. A line of three face-up cards are dealt from the unused cards to the playing area between the players.

Each player lays out a line of three face-up cards in front of himself.
This is where the game begins. A player examines the line of cards in the center of the table, to which he compares his line of three cards.

If all three of his cards can be matched to the cards in the center of the table, so that there is a one-to-one correspondence so that each card bears at least one property (shape or color) to one specific card in the center of the table, the three cards from his hand are now placed to cover the line of cards in the center, and his opponent's upturned cards go to the bottom of his opponent's face-down deck.

A player may also play one or two cards to the center, if they exactly match cards in the center line in both color and shape.

When one player gets down to less than ten cards in his hand, he calls for the end of the hand, and his opponent is penalized the number of cards still left in his hand.

This is all being done simultaneously. You can speed your play up, but that makes your pattern-recognition degrade pretty quickly. It's an interesting trade-off.

With the exception of various penalties for sloppy, incorrect, or mis-timed plays, that's it.

Toppo has an odd variety of positives and negatives going for it.

POSITIVE: Reiner Knitzia created this game. He's often brilliant in his creation of math-based game mechanics. Some of his simpler games are quick and easy to learn, teach and play, remarkable in their simplicity and depth of play.

NEGATIVE: Reiner Knitzia created this game. Some of his games just don't hit a home run with some people. Even the best players strike out occasionally, and you sure can't please everyone.

POSITIVE: Toppo is a pattern-recognition game. Easy idea, easy to grasp. Even children can play it with adults.

NEGATIVE: Toppo is a pattern-recognition game. Some players just don't have the gift of discernment.

POSITIVE: Can be played by the colorblind. The five colors can be distinguished from each other by a player with any type of colorblindness.

NEGATIVE: The art is entirely appropriate to the game, and is well-done, but as a result of the tupe of game, it is very uninteresting. The Toppo cards end up looking like they were plucked from an ESP test in 1969.

POSITIVE: Not an aggressive, take-that game. Often feels like playing double solitaire. Potentially a good couples game, or a good game to play with kids.

NEGATIVE: This is not gonna feed your need to obliterate your opponent.

POSITIVE: Fast play. Good for a filler or warm-up or cool-down game. If you don't do well in one game, it'll be over in a minute or two.

NEGATIVE: "Toppo" is simply a silly name. It sounds like a name for a pet monkey: "Here, Toppo, come here and get the yummy banana." What was Knitzia thinking?

POSITIVE: Actually playable as a solitaire. My wife says she could play it by herself while talking on the phone to her mother.

IS IT WORTH THE COST?

I think so. The cards are nicely designed (though a bit bland by necessity), and are fairly sturdy with a linen finish. The box has a nice insert that has three wells designed to hold about fifty cards each. The box is brightly colored and simply, but attractively designed.

WILL YOU ENJOY IT?

If you like Set or Blink, you will probably like this. Not quite as brain-burning as Set, nor quite as frenzied as Blink. If you can't stand either or both of those, stay away.

DID I LIKE IT?

Yes. Even my wife, who is essentially a non-gamer, liked the puzzle aspect of the game. She's playing it solo as I write this review. I can pretty much guarantee she will never play Squad Leader with me, but I would bet money that she will ask me to play Toppo with her.

Image

Sinister Dexter — 2006-09-18T23:34:33+00:00

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dougadamsau — 2006-07-22T04:08:35+00:00

"Top" - colours or symbols match

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dougadamsau — 2006-07-22T03:48:51+00:00

Colours and symbols

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dougadamsau — 2006-07-22T03:48:35+00:00

Thread: Toppo

qzhdad — 2006-07-21T04:07:00+00:00

I can't believe that this hasn't been reviewed yet, but I'll give it a shot. It's the most played game that I picked up at Origins. Partly because it's one of the shortest, but this is a fun little speed game.

Story of Game Purchase

When I looked at the demo of Toppo at Rio Grande's booth on Sunday at Origins, I wasn't overly impressed after looking at the cards and reading the back of the box. It sounded like Speed or Blink and I was surprised to see that Dr. Knizia would design something like that or that Rio Grande would pick it up. They are pretty good games, but they've been done.

So I am really glad that Jay Tummelson saw me looking and asked if I wanted to try it! He explained the rules and about halfway through the explanation, I knew I was going to buy the game.

I played a game or two with a friend that wandered by and then we moved over to try Aton. Dr. Knizia showed up at the booth again and Jay pointed out that if I bought Toppo then I could get it autographed (I'd earlier asked him to sign Pickomino to my son). So I bought Toppo and another game (to be discussed later) so that I could get it signed to my daughter (who was wandering the Great Hall with her brother and my wife at the time), because I knew it would be Z's type of game.

Review of Toppo

Toppo won't be for everyone, but it's a hit at our house and to most of the people to whom we've introduced it (at least one secondary sale already).

It is a speed game. There are no turns, players deal out cards and try to match the faceup cards in the center. If they do, they put the matching cards in the center and deal some more. The object is to play enough of your thirty-three cards to get to under ten cards.

Components

Each of the 150 cards has a single symbol on it enabling two, three or four players to enjoy Toppo. With another set, up to eight could be accommodated. There are five shapes and five colors in the game and all are easily distinguishable (and I am speaking from a color blind perspective). The bridge sized cards are good quality plastic (possibly really nicely finished cardboard, easy to shuffle and deal. They may not be quite Kem card quality, but close. They are made to take the rapid shuffle and dealing required for the game and I think that they will hold up well.

Play

After each player received thirty-three cards, three target cards are placed face up in the center of the table. Players hold their stack in one hand and deal three cards. Then players try to match their dealt cards to the target cards. If no cards match, the player scoops the three dealt cards and puts them on the bottom of his stack then deals the next set of three as quickly as possible. If any of the cards match exactly (color and shape) they may be played on the appropriate center pile and the others are returned to the bottom of the stack and then deal some more. This play doesn't change the target three cards. If the three cards (in any order) each match color and/or shape of each of the center piles, the player calls "Top," and places the three cards on the stacks. This usually changes the target cards. The other players pick up the cards they've dealt, put them on the bottom of their stack and wait for the Top player to start dealing again. This continues until a player gets to less than ten cards and calls "Toppo."

The other players receive points equal to the number of cards they have remaining. The Toppo player chooses whether the next round will be played with three, four or five piles in the center. (Only three or four with two players.) Players decide ahead of time whether to play a certain number of hands or to a total score and the lowest score at the end wins. We've played with single hand games and by specifying a number of hands and both are satisfying.

Players are free to shuffle or count their stack of remaining cards whenever they want. If everyone agrees that no matches can be made with the current target cards, new target cards are dealt. Players draw penalty cards for calling Top or Toppo in error or starting to deal before the player that called Top.

Set is a favorite at our house and Toppo feels a lot like Set. We also like speed games in general, so Toppo is a great addition to our speed game collection. It's listed as for 10 and up, but our eight year old enjoys it. I suspect that the recommended age is to assure that the players can deal the cards without getting frustrated more than for the complexity of the rules.

I suspect that this may become one of our "gift games," because it is very accessible. Teaching the rules and playing a one hand game can be done in ten or fifteen minutes. However, I've yet to teach it and not have a "few more hands" suggested, so budget a half hour minimum.

Conclusion of Story of Purchase

If customers purchased $25 or more at the booth, they received a free copy of Diamond Joe (Niagara expansion). So I picked up the new Kosmos two player game to get over $25, figuring that I'd have it eventually. So after my purchase I opened Toppo and asked Dr. Knizia to sign it to my daughter. Later that evening, I looked more closely at my new Kosmos game, Times Square, and smacked my head! Maybe at Gencon. :-)

Thread: Toppo - Quick Review

dougadamsau — 2006-07-21T03:17:43+00:00

Toppo is a simultaneous play card game from Reiner Knizia, for 2-4 players.

Inside the colourful box are three decks of cards. Each card has an illustration of a simple pattern (e.g. circle, square) in a colour (e.g. blue, red). The cards are thoroughly mixed and each player is dealt a deck of 33 cards. The remaining cards form a base deck that seeds the play area, and additionally forms the penalty deck.

Toppo is a game where everyone plays together. Playera are attempting to reduce their deck of cards to below 10 cards, at which point they can declare "Toppo" which ends the round. At the end of the round, all players but the player declaring "Toppo" score one point for each card remaining in their deck. Points are bad!

The first round begins with three cards being flipped up from the penalty deck. This forms the play area. Players begin playing at the same time, flipping up three cards in front of them from their own decks. These cards are compared to the play area cards, and are cleared into the play area in real time. Cards are played into the play area in one of two ways...

- if any of your cards exactly match (colour and shape) any of the play area cards, you can discard them onto the corresponding play area card. Any unmatching cards are picked up and put under your deck; deal yourself another set to play from.

- if all of your cards match, in either colour or shape, all of the play area cards, then you can declare "Top" which immediately stops play. You prove your declaration by placing your cards on each of the play area cards, most likely changing the colours and shapes of the play area. All other players pick up their current set of cards. Player who went "Top" starts the new round off.

If your cards can't be matched for "Top"'d, you can put them back on the bottom of your deck and deal yourself a new set to play from.

Penalties are assigned for errors (adding one to five cards to your deck). Game play continues over several rounds. In subsequent rounds, the trailing player can set the play area size to 3, 4 or 5 cards.

This is a fast playing, fun filler. It is certainly one of the better games of the genre that I've tried. Recommended.

Thread: Re: Any info on this yet?

dougadamsau — 2006-07-21T02:46:19+00:00

Shawn - that T&T was Anna's!

Toppo's not bad. You're playing simultaneously, trying to get your deck of 33 cards below down below ten. What that happens you can declare "Toppo", score nothing while all other players have to take a penalty point per card still held.

Cards have a shape and colour. Three to five "base" cards are displayed for all to see. Everyone then plays the same number of cards from their own deck in front of them. You can discard your cards in two ways...

- if any of your cards exactly match any of the base cards, you can discard them onto the base (not changing anything on the base cards). Any unmatching cards are picked up and put under your deck; deal yourself another set to play from.

- if all of your cards match in either colour or shape, all of the base cards, then you can declare "Top" which immediately stops play. You prove your declaration by placing your cards on each of the base cards, changing colours and shapes of the bases. All other players pick up their current set of cards. Player who went "Top" starts the new round off.

Penalties are assigned for errors (add more cards to your deck). Takes about half a sample hand to "get it".

We played it at Gamers @ Dockers last night and I think we all had a good time.

Thread: Re: Any info on this yet?

shawn_low — 2006-07-21T02:10:37+00:00

Spotted at FLGS in Melbourne today. Thurn and Taxis also spotted (I got the last copy).

Thread: Re: Any info on this yet?

Noaceyet — 2006-07-10T23:53:57+00:00

I should have a copy on Wednesday. My son likes Blink when they played it at school. I assume this is going to be similar from what I have seen.

Thread: Re: Any info on this yet?

SwedeLad — 2006-07-07T10:34:24+00:00

I didn't see anybody playing this at the Gathering, but it is indeed now available from ThoughtHammer.

Thread: Re: Any info on this yet?

chuckimus — 2006-06-28T21:31:34+00:00

That is a bit odd... strangely silent around this neck of the woods.

Anyways... Thoughthammer shows that they expect this game to be in stock on 07/05/06. http://thoughthammer.com/product_info.php?products_id=1808

Now... back to your regulary scheduled silence.

Thread: Any info on this yet?

Favre4MVP — 2006-04-19T16:32:12+00:00

Does anyone have any info on this yet? Was it played at the Gathering at all?

I would expect a Knizia game being released by Rio Grande in less than a month (?) to have at least a little bit of information available; even if it is just a light card game.