Game: Colosseum

Thread: Trading with virtual market variant

barnyams36 — 2008-11-25T17:03:06+00:00

Here comes another possible variant for the trading phase.
I have played Colosseum two times now, and I think it is a great game with a part I don't like. I don't like trading with "humans" in such an open way (I mean, you know what everybody has and may need, so trading may become really nasty). I would prefer some kind of lighter version of trading, specially not involving people, so I thought of a "trading market". It may also solve another problem we have experienced: very long play time (nearly three hours using the intensive auction variant, 5 players).

At the beggining of the trading phase, four tokens are taken from the bag to create the market. Now, following the normal order, anybody is allowed to trade with the market, instead of people. Trading works this way:

Tokens are divided in two groups, the living ones (you could get a +4 star), and the non living ones (jail, flowers... no +4 star for them). You may exchange a living one for a living one, and a non living token for a non living token.

Besides, if you give gladiators to the market for another token, you have to give two of them, since gladiators are esentially two times more abundant than the rest. One would go to the market, the other would go out of the game. But if you want to get a gladiator, you may not take two of them for one of the other tokens...

Finally, you may adjust the "price" with coins. Let's say you need a lion and have poet. If there are 10 lions and 12 poets, (I am inventing these numbers, I don't have the game with me right now), that means that lions are somehow more valuable. So, you would need to give one poet to the market, ant two coins to the general supply. As with the gladiators, giving a more expensive token to the market does not provide you with any coin.

You are allowed to do as many changes as you want (ok, maximum would be four exchanges as the number of tokens originally at the market), and it would be the turn of the following player.

I still have not tried this variant, so it could not work properly. But I think it would eliminate some kind of King-making effect in the last turn, and would shorten the playing time. I hope you find it useful.

Thread: Re: Special Event Asset Tokens

patisneat — 2008-11-21T18:24:11+00:00

I was wondering about trading the Special Tokens too. I guess I missed this post and sent an email to DOW. Brian is right on. Here is what I got back:

Summary of my Question and Answer from DOW wrote:
Me: Can you trade Special Event Asset Tokens (Joker or Additional Action) with another player? Emperor Asset Tokens cannot be traded because those become Medals before trading right?

Frank from DOW Customer Service: Nothing forbids trading the special ones (except, as you specified, the Emperor Asset Token as you don't actually keep it).

Thread: Re: Trading aspect

tloomis — 2008-11-11T02:30:33+00:00

Thank you for your response. I haven't seen the game yet ... does the trading aspect generally dominate the playing time with back and forth negotiating? Or does only trading money and events assets keep the game moving quickly?

Thread: Re: Trading aspect

Jarvis — 2008-11-09T16:47:28+00:00

Under Phase 3 rules:

"Only money and events assets can be used to make trades and all trades must be delivered immediately. No trades can be based on future promises."

Thread: Trading aspect

tloomis — 2008-11-09T15:30:59+00:00

Is the trading phase of this game open 'wheeling and dealing', where players can negotiate many types of things? Perhaps including future commitments? Or is the trading tightly constrained by the game system?

Thanks in advance,

Tim

Thread: Re: Obsessed Board Gamers - Episode 12: Video Introduction and Review for Colosseum

provence — 2008-10-17T21:00:14+00:00

So is the game broken per this review?

How is it that no one else has commented about this in their reviews?

Thread: Re: Question about buying a new event program

rmanning — 2008-10-14T15:25:40+00:00

infoflow wrote:
So does this mean that it is not possible to purchase a new Event Program during the first turn? Because as I read it, no player will have produced an event prior to the Investment phase during the first turn.
I think that if "no event" has been produced it would have "no value" or zero. So any event would be greater than zero and purchasable during the first investment phase.
puck71 wrote:
I can't say I've read the rules closely enough to know for sure though, as I haven't seen a good reason to ever buy an event first turn.
About the only reasonable reason I can think of offhand is that after seeing the initial distribution of assets a player might realize that a particular event will be desired by several players, and so makes the first round purchase to prevent someone else from getting it.

Thread: Re: Question about buying a new event program

puck71 — 2008-10-14T02:47:26+00:00

infoflow wrote:
So does this mean that it is not possible to purchase a new Event Program during the first turn? Because as I read it, no player will have produced an event prior to the Investment phase during the first turn. As printed above, I'd say that's correct that no events can be purchased first turn. I can't say I've read the rules closely enough to know for sure though, as I haven't seen a good reason to ever buy an event first turn.

Thread: Re: 10 tiles, 2 event cards: Which event to buy?

Balthus_Dire — 2008-10-12T16:13:23+00:00

The best focus is not on the events at all, I've found. Run your highr small show repeatedly, buy a high mid level program (Circus Maximus if possible) on round four, and spend your energy on trading, star performers, breaking other peoples star performer locks, and manipulating the dignitaries to be in the perfect place for your fifth round.

This strategy regularly nets me a 80-85 final score. I think the big shows are overrated.

Image

HandEyeProtege — 2008-10-11T21:38:32+00:00

The gladiator star performer with an army

Image

HandEyeProtege — 2008-10-11T21:15:41+00:00

The priest star performer

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HandEyeProtege — 2008-10-11T19:59:05+00:00

The horse star performer and his herd

Image

HandEyeProtege — 2008-10-11T19:38:35+00:00

A mediocre rendition of "The Galleys of Apollo" -- the show is missing a gladiator and two ships

Thread: Re: Emperors Medals - limited resource?

rmanning — 2008-10-06T23:56:32+00:00

It's 16 months late, but since the thread has been necromancied...
Sylvus wrote:
Once they are obtained and used are the removed from the game...?
They are removed from game after use.

Thread: Re: Emperors Medals - limited resource?

dwculp — 2008-10-06T23:24:25+00:00

DELETED - Found the answer to my question in another post.

Thread: Re: Made in . . . ?

aquabob79 — 2008-10-06T23:12:21+00:00

Thanks again.

I was not necessarily faulting Days of Wonder for their manufacturing decisions - unless, however, it makes a difference - like it did with Ticket to Ride: Switzerland.

There are, however, two pictures in the gallery of "Made in Germany" box bottoms of English editions. I was just wondering if these exist and if so, where.

Thanks,
Bob

http://www.boardgamegeek.com/image/211759

and

http://www.boardgamegeek.com/image/199216

Thread: Re: Made in . . . ?

aramis — 2008-10-06T23:00:23+00:00

Further, a great many games are merely Assembled in whatever coutry from parts manufactured elsewhere.

It might say "Made in USA" and be made from Chinese made pawns, mexican made dice, and Canadian printing. (One game I bought detailed just that inside... the Box said "Product of USA")

DoW has never hid the fact that they used Chinese printing on Colosseum. They cited that eruopean printing would have almost doubled the cost.

Thread: Re: Made in . . . ?

aquabob79 — 2008-10-06T19:42:15+00:00

Thanks for the info.

Bob

Thread: Re: Made in . . . ?

ackmondual — 2008-10-06T14:31:09+00:00

As I understand the whole process.... many of these designer games are designed in Germany/Europe/England/US, and the like, but are manufactured in China. Even these days, dunno if you can get around the latter.

Thread: Re: Made in . . . ?

Aljovin — 2008-10-06T03:02:11+00:00

My copy was made in China, so I cannot help you. However, I doubt that DOW could afford 2 different printing of the game. The only copies are probably made in China.

Thread: Made in . . . ?

aquabob79 — 2008-10-05T21:33:21+00:00

Greetings all,

This is my first post. Yay. I have, however been a lurker for the past three years or so. So, here goes . . .

All of the pictures of the English box backs in the gallery show that Colosseum is made in Germany. However, every time I have gone to buy this game, the box on the shelf says "Made in China." This is a big no-no for me - game-wise and otherwise.

My question, I guess is this, are there actually English copies of this game that were made in Germany, or am I chasing a wild goose?

Thanks for your answers,
Bob

Thread: Re: Love the theme, love the game

TheNakedPirate — 2008-10-05T03:25:20+00:00

shebby wrote:
Excellent review Petey Pirate Boy. I really enjoyed playing this one with you last night, and I know John and I are going to want to play it with you again very soon... And drink your very fine brew too.

Thanks, it was a good session. Definately need to have another game.

Thread: Re: Love the theme, love the game

shebby — 2008-10-05T00:42:24+00:00

Excellent review Petey Pirate Boy. I really enjoyed playing this one with you last night, and I know John and I are going to want to play it with you again very soon... And drink your very fine brew too.

Thread: Re: Question about buying a new event program

infoflow — 2008-10-04T15:34:33+00:00

So does this mean that it is not possible to purchase a new Event Program during the first turn? Because as I read it, no player will have produced an event prior to the Investment phase during the first turn.

Image

Toynan — 2008-10-04T14:37:42+00:00

close up

Image

HandEyeProtege — 2008-10-03T20:52:23+00:00

The lion star performer and his pride

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HandEyeProtege — 2008-10-03T20:51:38+00:00

A fully realized performance of "Caesar's Triumphal March", making use of two wild tiles

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HandEyeProtege — 2008-10-03T04:04:32+00:00

A completed performance of "The Cavalry of Spartacus"

Thread: Re: Party Like It's Nineteen

moakm — 2008-09-29T17:57:24+00:00

Loved the game and the review. I just played this for the first time at Games Day Memphis. How many days are there until Christmas? This is definitley going on the list.

Image

silvanus321 — 2008-09-29T07:05:17+00:00

Box cover inspiration from the painting "Pollice Verso, 1872"

Thread: Re: Loge or Season Ticket in 1st turn?

Balthus_Dire — 2008-09-27T20:13:16+00:00

I've never played a big event, I've stuck with the middle events, and have won almost all of my games, with scores in mid-80's. I don't think you ever need two arena expansions.

Spend the money on season's tickets (with 7 actions, my goal in most games, I usually pile the season's tickets on) and perfecting your program. Most people are a little timid when it comes to trading--you need to throw everything onto the fire in trades to grab those star performers or deny them to others, I've found.

Image

muzfish4 — 2008-09-22T00:04:08+00:00

Chums playing Colosseum - note that the Empeoror a consul and a senator are all in the green arean!

Thread: Re: Why I Almost Love Colosseum

Matthias_K — 2008-09-17T10:42:44+00:00

HandEyeProtege wrote:
Matthias_K wrote:

When I do take an emperor's loge, I certainly will not use all of my emperor medals to boost the attendance in my last turn. Changes are much higher that I will at least use two to get an extra build action in the early turns to stay on target for the bigger programs.

Thanks for pointing out that there is a suggested auction variant to be found on DoW forums. I will definitely check that one out.
Really? I do sometimes use the emperor medal for more money if I really need to win an auction, but I had always figured that using it for an extra build was a losing proposition. What would you use that extra build action for?

My usual builds are (possibly with slightly varying order): Loge, Expand, Program, Program, Expand. Relative to this, the possibilities for the extra build would be:

Season tickets--if you build them on turn 1 then they would earn you an extra $20 ($10 profit) plus 5 points on the last round; that's not bad, but by not building the Loge on turn 1 you're likely giving up a medal.

Program--this would be worth some marginal increase in base value plus 5 points on later rounds because you would not be reusing an early program; however, for about the same benefit, it's more expensive than season tickets and might require different tiles, so I don't know why you wouldn't just buy the season tickets.

I'm not convinced, but I'll have to try the extra build a few times. The main way I could see it being worth it is if it make the difference to snag you a few podiums; those would make up for the points you'd miss out on from the medals.

I sometimes buy two season tickets in the first two turns if everyone starts of with an emperor's loge. This will give me a big edge in the first auctions because of the added income. This will probably allow me to get some star performers/podiums early on.

If by turn three, there are no bonus tokens for an extra build action available, I'll use my emperor medals for an extra build action to expand and get a new program in one turn.

If everyone has an emperor's loge, it's much more difficult to use yours for increasing attendence. That's why I'd rather take the steady income first and let them fight for the extra attendance. The risky part is that I have to have a 'extra build action' token or two emperor medals by turn 3.

Thread: Re: Why I Almost Love Colosseum

HandEyeProtege — 2008-09-16T06:06:02+00:00

Matthias_K wrote:

When I do take an emperor's loge, I certainly will not use all of my emperor medals to boost the attendance in my last turn. Changes are much higher that I will at least use two to get an extra build action in the early turns to stay on target for the bigger programs.

Thanks for pointing out that there is a suggested auction variant to be found on DoW forums. I will definitely check that one out.
Really? I do sometimes use the emperor medal for more money if I really need to win an auction, but I had always figured that using it for an extra build was a losing proposition. What would you use that extra build action for?

My usual builds are (possibly with slightly varying order): Loge, Expand, Program, Program, Expand. Relative to this, the possibilities for the extra build would be:

Season tickets--if you build them on turn 1 then they would earn you an extra $20 ($10 profit) plus 5 points on the last round; that's not bad, but by not building the Loge on turn 1 you're likely giving up a medal.

Program--this would be worth some marginal increase in base value plus 5 points on later rounds because you would not be reusing an early program; however, for about the same benefit, it's more expensive than season tickets and might require different tiles, so I don't know why you wouldn't just buy the season tickets.

I'm not convinced, but I'll have to try the extra build a few times. The main way I could see it being worth it is if it make the difference to snag you a few podiums; those would make up for the points you'd miss out on from the medals.

Thread: Re: Extra performers.

aramis — 2008-09-14T07:31:37+00:00

20+ (unlogged) games, and never found it needed to account for it.

Yes, you're more likely to fully complete, but still, people are often unable to complete larger programs completely due to excellent bidding strategies.

Thread: Extra preformers.

timex — 2008-09-13T04:18:02+00:00

I don't know how other groups handle the extra preformers/tokens that they get thru the intense action. I have proposed but have yet to try this. You may add extra preformers to your play. You may not exceed the listed amount on the play in extras per each group. Example if your play has 3 horses and 2 pillers then you could use up to 6 horses and 4 pillers. You get 2 extra on your score for each extra preformer, in the case of this example your score would increase by 10 You must discard 1/2 (rounded up) of ALL the extra preformers that you used this turn. so in our example you would have to discard 3 of the extras and 1 as normal. You may not use any tokens as extras unless they are listed on the play.

I would also like to see what people think of by allowing a player to buy more than 1 loge. A loge would allow the roll of 1 addition die. so IF you bought 4 loge's you could roll 5 die(you would just have to write down your results before using them).

Thread: Re: Why I Almost Love Colosseum

Mateui — 2008-09-10T00:21:02+00:00

I just can't seem to get into this game despite owning it and feeling that it's the best looking game in my collection.

What really disappoints me about it is despite there being lots of different event programs available, once you run your first one, your direction is then set in stone and your next option dwindles down to choosing between 2 events. There's just too much specialization in this, and the game seems to just play itself after the beginning. I just find that kind of boring.

Thread: Re: Why I Almost Love Colosseum

Matthias_K — 2008-09-09T07:50:25+00:00

First of all, I would like to say that I like your review, but... (isn't there always one?)

HandEyeProtege wrote:

Which brings up another point: despite the wide variety of choices available, there are some that are just too obvious. Buying an emperor's loge allows you to roll two dice instead of one, and move two different nobles or one for the sum of the rolls. This kind of flexibility is so valuable that there is little choice but to buy it first turn. Chances are your other four investment actions--you only get one per turn--will be to buy two event programs and expand your arena twice. (I'd much prefer to get rid of the dice rolling and instead have some other interesting, balanced investments that you could make in your arena.) Finally, the emperor medals that you acquire over the course of the game have several possible uses, but it is almost always the right choice to spend them to increase the attendance of your last event--nothing else will boost your score by as much.

I must admit, I have not played this more than 12 times or so, but I have not always bought the emperor's loge on the first turn. Sometimes not at all. When I'm the last one in the starting turn and everyone buys one, I sometimes go for a season ticket instead. This because I fear that all of the pawns will be out of range once I get around to moving them. This does have the disadvantage that you'll probably get less emperor medals in the game, though.

When I do take an emperor's loge, I certainly will not use all of my emperor medals to boost the attendance in my last turn. Changes are much higher that I will at least use two to get an extra build action in the early turns to stay on target for the bigger programs.

Thanks for pointing out that there is a suggested auction variant to be found on DoW forums. I will definitely check that one out.

Thread: Re: Why I Almost Love Colosseum

HandEyeProtege — 2008-09-09T06:47:38+00:00

out4blood wrote:
For me this game broke when we played in our group when the players openly colluded during the auctions. In an environment where you only get one auction, the remaining players can divy up the useful cards amongst themselves, particularly since you can see what's out there. (Prohibiting open collusion does not prevent the inevitable secret-collusion-because-it's-so-obvious-what-he/she-wants.)
Interesting. I haven't really experienced this in my games, and I wonder just how it would work? In the end, each player should be looking out for his own best interests, and it's pretty rare that the available tiles will divide up so neatly that they can be equitably distributed.

ackmondual wrote:
If you've played Power Grid before, then does this also apply to that game? Similar mechanism. I've noticed power plants can go for at cost or a bidding war frenzy can really drive things up. Every now and then, something does sell for somewhat higher
I think this manifests a little differently in Power Grid. For one thing, a power plant that is good for one player is probably good for all the other players too--unlike in Colosseum where each player is looking for a different set of tiles--so it's unlikely that that a decent plant will go uncontested. (If you're buying at cost, then it problem means you're desperate for a new plant and are willing to take one that isn't that great.) It is frustrating when the last player to bid gets a great plant for face value, but that is an advantage that, for better or worse, is intentionally built into the turn order mechanism.

Thread: Re: Why I Almost Love Colosseum

jasonbrice — 2008-09-09T06:43:12+00:00

ackmondual wrote:
If you've played Power Grid before, then does this also apply to that game? Similar mechanism. I've noticed power plants can go for at cost or a bidding war frenzy can really drive things up. Every now and then, something does sell for somewhat higher

The difference is that in Power Grid there are many more opportunities to buy power plants than there are opportunities to buy tiles in Colosseum. Colo only has five rounds, where as PG may run 10+ rounds.

Thread: Re: Why I Almost Love Colosseum

ackmondual — 2008-09-09T04:34:11+00:00

HandEyeProtege wrote:

The Bad

Unfortunately there are a few things that blemish the experience for me. Auctions, according to the standard rules, don't work very well. What tends to happen is that some lots will go uncontested, selling for the minimum bid, while others will have the price driven up far more than they're really worth. This is a result of only being able to win one bid; it's too dangerous to bid against someone for something you don't really want, and when you know you're only going to be paying for one auction this turn, when it's something you need you might as well bid as high as you can afford. Days of Wonder has more or less fixed that with their "Intense Auctions" variant (available in the online version of the rules, though not my in-game copy; see http://www.daysofwonder.com). I highly recommend playing with this variant. It allows you to win multiple auctions per turn, but, interestingly enough I haven't found that people frequently do so. It causes tile batches to go for more consistent, reasonable prices, and once the cheap lots are being bid up some there isn't usually so much money floating around to spend on a second auction.

If you've played Power Grid before, then does this also apply to that game? Similar mechanism. I've noticed power plants can go for at cost or a bidding war frenzy can really drive things up. Every now and then, something does sell for somewhat higher

Thread: Re: Why I Almost Love Colosseum

out4blood — 2008-09-09T04:10:51+00:00

Good review.

For me this game broke when we played in our group when the players openly colluded during the auctions. In an environment where you only get one auction, the remaining players can divy up the useful cards amongst themselves, particularly since you can see what's out there. (Prohibiting open collusion does not prevent the inevitable secret-collusion-because-it's-so-obvious-what-he/she-wants.)

The multiple auction variant (which we tried) doesn't eliminate this possibility, either.

I would probably prefer a Medici-type, one-lot-at-a-time, once-around auction where people had to bid for a lot they wanted, not knowing what would be available in the next lots. I say probably because no one has shown any interest in playing this again after our disastrous games.

Thread: Re: Princes of Florence type scoring

killjoy00 — 2008-09-08T23:21:12+00:00

Yea - I don't think this type of scoring works at all for how the game is balanced. In my experience, this scoring would turn interesting, close games into blowouts.

Thread: Why I Almost Love Colosseum

HandEyeProtege — 2008-09-08T22:50:00+00:00

In Colosseum you and your opponents each run one of these titular arenas, putting on events to entertain the Roman populace. Your goal is to draw in the biggest crowds, from the gladiator-loving plebeians and aristocrats to the emperor himself.

Colosseum is published by Days of Wonder, better known for its Ticket to Ride franchise. Like Ticket to Ride, it tries to be a Euro-style game while still being accessible and appealing to the casual gamer. This is a tough balance to strike--I found Ticket to Ride lost its glamour quickly--but the gameplay in Colosseum has some real meat to it. Couple that with beautiful pieces and a handsome board, and it's a game I can easily recommend to my gamer and non-gamer friends. It has just a few weaknesses that keep me from really loving it.

Gameplay

The sequence of gameplay does take some digesting the first time through, but rules are clear and have plenty of visual examples. The game is played over five turns, during each of which you will produce an event in your colosseum. The attendance to your event determines your income--which you will spend to produce bigger and better events in the future--and whoever has the highest attendance in any single event is the winner. (Technically this can be in any of the turns, but in practice everyone's last event will be the biggest.)

Event attendance is determined by some simple arithmetic. The base value depends on what program you're producing; for instance, "Circus Maximus" can be worth up to 32 attendees. This assumes you have all of the performers and props (represented by asset tiles) necessary to produce that event--for each asset that you are missing the value of the event goes down by a marginal amount. Each turn there are sets of action tiles available for auction, and you can trade with or buy from other players. Then there are a bunch of ways to increase your attendance: previous events you have produced cause more people to come, apparently because of your growing reputation; star performers will draw more people; senators, consuls, and the emperor (figurines that move around the board based on dice rolls) will boost your attendance if they end up in your colosseum during a show; and there are various other improvements that pack the stands and therefore increase your earnings and your end-game score.

The Good

So where does the fun come from? Like its big brother, Princes of Florence, Colosseum is largely an auction game, which means you have to weigh what particular tiles are worth to you against what you think others are willing to play for them. Following the auction you have an opportunity to trade with your opponents. This works out well since tiles come in batches of three; likely you got at least one you didn't really need. It doesn't really reduce the tension of the auction that much, since the competition there tends to be over the rarer, more valuable tiles, but it does add a negotiation aspect to the game.

For the strategic thinker, there are a wide variety of choices as you try to optimize your score. Should I give up this tile that I need in order to get the star performer of that other type? Do I buy a new event program now, even though I might not be able to afford the tiles I want this turn? It's not the brain burner that some games are, but there are always more things you want to do than time or money allow, so you will have to make tough choices.

Most satisfying to me is simply the sense of growing and accomplishing something. You start out with a small colosseum, nearly empty, but every turn you'll have a chance to grow it, maybe add a section for season ticketholders or an emperor's loge, and you'll acquire more performers and assets. The result is that each performance is greater than the last, so that by the end of the game (hopefully!) you'll be able to put on the most spectacular show of all.

The Bad

Unfortunately there are a few things that blemish the experience for me. Auctions, according to the standard rules, don't work very well. What tends to happen is that some lots will go uncontested, selling for the minimum bid, while others will have the price driven up far more than they're really worth. This is a result of only being able to win one bid; it's too dangerous to bid against someone for something you don't really want, and when you know you're only going to be paying for one auction this turn, when it's something you need you might as well bid as high as you can afford. Days of Wonder has more or less fixed that with their "Intense Auctions" variant (available in the online version of the rules, though not my in-game copy; see http://www.daysofwonder.com). I highly recommend playing with this variant. It allows you to win multiple auctions per turn, but, interestingly enough I haven't found that people frequently do so. It causes tile batches to go for more consistent, reasonable prices, and once the cheap lots are being bid up some there isn't usually so much money floating around to spend on a second auction.

This may be a petty nitpick, but I feel like the mechanism for rolling dice and moving the nobles around the board feels sort of juvenile. You can do all sorts of shrewd bidding and clever trades, but if a poor dice roll means you can't get the emperor into your arena when you're counting on it, then you'll still end up in the hole. If I wanted to rely on that sort of luck I'd play Monopoly, thanks.

Which brings up another point: despite the wide variety of choices available, there are some that are just too obvious. Buying an emperor's loge allows you to roll two dice instead of one, and move two different nobles or one for the sum of the rolls. This kind of flexibility is so valuable that there is little choice but to buy it first turn. Chances are your other four investment actions--you only get one per turn--will be to buy two event programs and expand your arena twice. (I'd much prefer to get rid of the dice rolling and instead have some other interesting, balanced investments that you could make in your arena.) Finally, the emperor medals that you acquire over the course of the game have several possible uses, but it is almost always the right choice to spend them to increase the attendance of your last event--nothing else will boost your score by as much.

There's a catch up mechanism build into the game that is a bit contrived: during each turn, the player that put on the smallest show gets to steal a tile from the player with the largest. I usually dislike rules like this, which directly harm the leader just because they are the leader, but in this case it isn't too harsh; also, the leader gets to add a podium to their colosseum which grants extra attendance to all future events. So, even if the rule feels contrived, it doesn't really hurt gameplay that much. (In fact, it does add another tactical choice: if I know I can't take the lead, should I sandbag myself for the chance to grab a tile I need?)

Conclusion

Colosseum has a lot of things going for it. The game itself is gorgeous, the theme is interesting, and the gameplay is suitably deep while still being accessible. I think most of the flaws I've pointed out are really concessions to the more casual gamer, and I'm sure they'd be considered features by some. They're certainly not enough to make me shy away from the game; just enough to make me say I only almost love it.

Thread: Re: Auction - initiate bid

F6_Garfield — 2008-08-18T09:29:17+00:00

Thank you ... this makes more sense as base rules.

Thread: Re: Auction - initiate bid

Capoeirista — 2008-08-18T09:07:58+00:00

You are playing it wrong.

Player A continues to initiate auctions until he wins one or chooses to pass. Then the markets are refilled and the next suitable player kicks off an auction. So to use your example:

Player A starts initiating an auction .. 8 gold
Player B bids 11 gold .. wins

Player A starts a new auction with one of the remaining four markets .. 8 gold
No one else bids so Player A wins

Markets are refilled.

Player B cannot initiate an auction so it moves on to Player C.

Player C initiates auction: bid 10 gold
player D bids 11 gold -> wins

Player C can now essentially buy one of the remaining four markets for 8 gold as no one else is able to bid.

Every player is guaranteed to get exactly one set of asset tokens as long as he doesn't pass when it is his turn to initiate an auction.

Edit: expanded example and corrected spelling.

Thread: Auction - initiate bid

F6_Garfield — 2008-08-18T08:23:10+00:00

I know it's been asked and answered before but I don't get it.

basic rules
If you have won an auction, you are not allowed to bid again in this round. As initiating an auction is actually a bid of eight you can also not initiate an auction this round.
The spirit of the rule is that each player has a chance to walk away with a set of extra asset tokens. But in my experience this is completly the opposite and the basic rules are far more damaging then the intense auction variant.

4 players at start of autcion phase
player A: 8 gold
player B: 12 gold
player C: 10 gold
player D: 11 gold

player A starts initiating an auction .. 8 gold
player B bids 11 gold .. wins (no one can over bid him)

player B can not initiate an acution (has just won one)

player C initiates auction: bid 10 gold
player D bids 11 gold -> wins

player D can not initiate an auction .. has just won.

result: player A and player C can not buy asset tokens.

In my last session I had this happen twice in a row to me with results in a game that when you're down you're even pushed further down ... you lose an asset token at the end of your event and you can not buy new ones .. twice in row .. practically game over ..

So either we play it wrong or something is wrong in the rules.

Thread: Re: A Dissenter's Opinion

Skadar — 2008-08-13T04:08:04+00:00

Agree with everything Muz said.

Thread: Re: Party Like It's Nineteen

lmnop — 2008-07-31T19:28:50+00:00

waferthinninja wrote:
Thumbed just for the title

My sentiments exactly. Oh, and the review was good too!

Thread: Re: Party Like It's Nineteen

waferthinninja — 2008-07-31T11:45:10+00:00

Thumbed just for the title

Thread: Re: Question on Rules

decumanusmaximus — 2008-07-30T15:30:39+00:00

Here's a specific 2 player variant that is based on the best of previous suggested variants IMHO If you have any suggested changes or additions, please let me know.

Game Summary:
Using a 4 player setup, each player receives 2 Colosseums and a single 'pool' of coins to be allocated, at any time, to each of the player's Colosseums at his/her discretion. However, all purchased Investments (ex. Event Programs, Arena Expansions, Season Tickets & Emperor's Loge) are 'assigned' to the player's currently 'active' Colosseum and all acquired Event Asset Tokens are immediately 'assigned' to any one of the player's Colosseums. Both Investments and Event Asset Tokens 'assigned' to a Colosseum must be kept separate from the player's other Colosseum. A player can only trade his/her Event Asset Tokens with the Event Asset Tokens of his/her opponent and, therefore, can not trade Asset Tokens from between his/her own Colosseums. A player's score on the scoring track is based on the player's Colosseum with the lowest number of Spectators. Therefore, after the fifth and final turn, the player with the highest score, based on that player's Colosseum with the lowest number of Spectators, is the winner!

Setting up the Game:
Each player receives a single Scoring Marker, 2 Colosseums (2 x 2 Arena pieces of matching colour), 4 Event Programs (2 Event Programs per Colosseum) and coins worth a total of 60. The coins are kept together in a single 'pool' and allocated to the player's Colosseums at his/her discretion. After the 5 markets are filled with 3 'green-backed' Event Asset Tokens in each market, distribute and assign 6 'green-backed' Event Asset Tokens to each of the Colosseums. The Event Asset Tokens assigned to each of the player's Colosseums must be kept separately and a player can only trade Event Asset Tokens with his/her opponent and not between his/her own Colosseums.

Object of the Game:
After the fifth and final turn, the player with the highest score on the scoring track, based on that player's Colosseum with the lowest number of Spectators, is the winner!

The Game Turn:
The player's Colosseum that is to the immediate left (clockwise) of the Emperor receives the First Player Token and begins the first phase (i.e. 'Phase 1 - Investing') using that Colosseum. The First Player Token is given to the 'other' player at the end of a turn once both players have finished all the phases, for all the Colosseums, during that game turn. On the second and subsequent turns, the player with the First Player Token can choose which of his/her Colosseums will begin the first phase for that turn.

Phase 1 - Investing:
The order of play is determined by the Colosseum that is to the immediate left (clockwise) of the Colosseum that has finished that phase's action. Otherwise, normal rules are followed.

Phase 2 - Acquiring Event Asset Tokens:
All acquired Event Asset Tokens are immediately 'assigned' to any one of the player's Colosseums. The auction process is as follows:
* The player with the First Player Token (bidder) selects a market and makes an opening bid that must be 8 coins or more.
* The opponent (non-bidder) can either pay this bid amount and take the 3 Event Asset Tokens from the market or pass.
- If the non-bidder pays the bid amount, the bidder may pay 8 coins and take the 3 Event Asset Tokens from any remaining market.
- If the non-bidder passes, the bidder must pay the amount of the bid and take the 3 Event Asset Tokens from the market.
* The market(s) are refilled and the other player (the new bidder) selects a market and makes an opening bid that must be 8 coins or more.
* Each player gets to initiate bidding twice (once for each of the player's Colosseums).

Phase 3 - Trading Event Asset Tokens:
Normal rules are followed except that a player can not trade Asset Tokens from between his/her own Colosseums.

Phase 4 - Producing an Event:
The order of play is determined by the Colosseum that is to the immediate left (clockwise) of the Colosseum that has finished that phase's action. Otherwise, normal rules are followed.

Phase 5 - Closing Ceremonies:
Podium: The COLOSSEUM with the highest number of Spectators receives the Podium.
Event Cleanup: Each COLOSSEUM must discard a single Event Asset Token from the game.
Asset Donation: The PLAYER that did not receive the Podium selects an Event Asset Token from the opponent's COLOSSEUM that received the Podium. As usual, the Event Asset Token must be immediately assigned to any one of the player's Colosseums.

Emperor Medals:
Emperor Medals are not assigned to Colosseums and, therefore, can be used, when appropriate, for any player's Colosseums.

Thread: Re: Question on Rules

l-hansen — 2008-07-30T15:03:20+00:00

rbrund wrote:
You gain an additional +5 fans for each previous event. Does this mean for each different previous event. So if I perform event 1, 4 times then produce 30 once, I would get only +5 fans from the previous for 4 performances.

Thanks in advance.

Yes you only get +5 fans for each show that you have closed.

But on the other hand, if you don't buy new shows (at 11+ coins) each round, it means that you can buy season tickes instead (at 10 coins) which also gives +5 fans.

Lars

Thread: Re: Question on Rules

tonksey — 2008-07-30T09:02:31+00:00

rbrund wrote:
Thanks for the quick reply. Now i just need a good 2 player rule set so i can play this with my dad.

This is my fiancee's favourite game & we play it 2-player quite often, though this is something of our own devising. We play it as a 4-player game, taking control of two opposite colosseums (so that your turns for both arenas alternative between both players):-

1) randomise the emperor, senators & consuls on the board.
2) auctions as per the Intense variant seem to work fine as you only get outbid by your opponent - why would you want to outbid yourself...?!
3) trading this takes place, but you cannot trade between your two colosseums; both of yours can only trade with either of your opponent's colosseums.

Winner is the one who has the highest score from either of their colosseums. But we usually end up saying 'yeah, but I had the best overall score... etc' in good humour !

It certainly isn't the best game for 2, but if you wanted to play this one in particular, I find what I've described above seems to work well.

Cheers,

Matt...

Thread: Party Like It's Nineteen

VixenTorGames — 2008-07-30T07:38:35+00:00

Maybe you were in a fraternity or sorority in college and think you know how to have a party. Maybe you were a merchant marine, and know that you know how to party. And maybe you're John Hughes, and not only do you know how to party, but everyone who saw Sixteen Candles knows that you know how to party.

But there's no way you were an ancient Roman, so no matter how much you think you know how to party, you can't hold a candle to a real Roman shindig. Romans knew how to party, and they had the corpses to prove it (even though they probably knew better than to use the word 'party' as a verb). When you play Colosseum, you get to be one of those ancient Roman madmen in the biggest party the Empire has known - and you get to plan the entertainment.

Each player in Colosseum gets an arena, and they'll try to get the emperor and his cronies to stop by when they put on a show. The nobility is on a long bar crawl around the board, stopping in at the different events (and at any orgies they might pass, though the game just calls them 'rest areas', like they were a few picnic tables in a grassy spot alongside I-20, and not a whole lot of naked people getting crazy with cheap wine and porn painted on the ceiling).

You'll start every turn by investing in your arena. The problem is, you can only make one investment, and you'll want to make more. You might want to add on to the arena so you can fill it up with water and have sea battles, but if you do, you won't have time to install the emperor's box seats, or upgrade an area for season tickets, or read over the latest scripts from the hack writers who keep churning out event plans like Greenwich Village hipsters writing off-Broadway musicals. It's like when you're already fixing the sink and your wife tells you the air conditioner is making that weird thumping sound again, but you can't fix both because you've got the water turned off to the house and you're going to have to go to the hardware store and buy a sackful of plastic washers before anyone can take a shower. Then again, that might only happen to me.

Once you sink a little money into your nightclub-slash-arena of death, you get to hire talent. After all, you can't have a gladiator show if you don't have some gladiators. You might want some lions, but then, chariots might be nice for a different kind of event. A priest might add some pomp to your show, or a comedian might help you sell drinks (as long as you tip your waitress). But the other players might want to hire the guys you need, so there will be messy bidding wars to make sure you get the performers that can draw a crowd. And since lots of these actors are package deals, you'll have to recruit entire entourages, and then swap them with the other players to get rid of the torches you don't need and get cages so that your lions don't wander around eating all the Christians before you can fill the seats.

And then, after all this planning and swapping and trading and shopping, it's time to put on the main event. The Roman Writers Guild will supply you with scripts, but you'll have to supply your own people. One script might call for three gladiators and a chariot, while another might have you recruiting Robin Williams and The Eurythmics for a musically bizarre comedy (which may or may not be hopped up on cocaine and absinthe). The really big shows are expensive to buy and require enormous casts, but they sure can draw a crowd. If you can get the emperor to drop by, you might have the hottest show in town. You'll be invited to all the right dinners and get your pick of all the best orgies.

Of course, there's always a reckoning for putting on a big show - this isn't Vegas, this is Rome, baby, and they party for keeps. Every time you put on a show, somebody dies. It would be a pretty lame gladiator show if you didn't have some blood, you know? And just because this is that kind of party, even if all you do is hire a couple musicians and float them around on pleasure barges, somebody still ends up six feet under. You know you've got a wild party when you can't even recite poetry without a body count.

So back to the grind you go - put in some new season tickets, buy an event program, hire talent, and do the whole thing again. You've only got so many chances to show off before the emperor remembers that he still wants to enslave Gaul and gets back to work, so you have to really crank it up. You better put on the best show in town, because when the party ends, the only one who gets remembered is the one who drew the biggest crowd. Everybody remembers Studio 54, but nobody even knows what happened to the first 53 studios.

Just like Romans knew how to raise the roof, Days of Wonder knows how to make a game. Colosseum has instantly hopped into my top twenty, and I can't wait for another chance to play it again. The pieces are absolutely exquisite - it's like a box full of toys, and there's even a magnificent storage tray so that everything goes back in the box (Fantasy Flight could use some pointers in that department). It takes planning and luck to win this one, and an early mistake can kick you in the jewels for the whole game, but even if you don't win, you'll have a blast playing Colosseum.

Summary

Pros:
Tons of great pieces
Excellent theme
Parties that would make Charlie Sheen look like Bill Gates
Brilliant storage tray
Body count makes every show an adventure
Incredibly fun

Cons:
Can't think of one. No game makes my top 20 if I can think of serious cons.

Thread: Re: A Dissenter's Opinion

muzfish4 — 2008-07-29T23:35:44+00:00

Played this last night for the second time and I must say that I quite enjoyed it.

It wasn't too heavy or too much for social gamers, but there was enough in it to keep me interested.

I agree with the OP's point that the develop actions in phase one of a turn are pretty much a given, though in the last game I bought a season ticket before I bought an Emperor's loge which was unusual, but I ended up winning so couldn't have been doing too much wrong.

yes, there's luck, but as Alan Reeve noted, luck mamagement is a chellenge for players. That and the auction element makes it a good bit of fun, I think.

That said, I should also say that I do like the theme and that, for what it's worth, makes a difference to me.

Thread: Re: Question on Rules

Heliconia — 2008-07-29T22:43:25+00:00

Yes, you flip the event over to show the +5 thingy as far as I remember. So you only get the +5 if you can see it when counting scores. You know what I mean

Thread: Re: Question on Rules

MidKentGamerUK — 2008-07-29T22:25:32+00:00

Zeromus wrote:
And you would not get the +5 on any of the repeated performances.

"Hey, do you fancy going out for an amphora and catching a show at the Colosseum tonight?"

"Sure, what's on?"

"Well according to this poster it's 'a flower pot, a gladiator and 2 horses'!"

"Really? Still? Me and 4 of the guys went and saw that last week! The plot was a bit thin, and the bouquet really wasn't all that..."

Thread: Re: Question on Rules

rbrund — 2008-07-29T22:05:14+00:00

Thanks for the quick reply. Now i just need a good 2 player rule set so i can play this with my dad.

Thread: Re: Question on Rules

Zeromus — 2008-07-29T21:40:36+00:00

Yup!

And you would not get the +5 on any of the repeated performances.

Thread: Question on Rules

rbrund — 2008-07-29T21:30:21+00:00

You gain an additional +5 fans for each previous event. Does this mean for each different previous event. So if I perform event 1, 4 times then produce 30 once, I would get only +5 fans from the previous for 4 performances.

Thanks in advance.