Game: El Capitán

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malshadow — 2008-11-23T22:37:51+00:00

A great example of why everyone should go to BGG.CON. Lilwil, Munin, and Escher13 teach me El Capitan.

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malshadow — 2008-11-23T22:36:21+00:00

Escher13 and Munin play El Capitan at BGG.CON 2008.

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malshadow — 2008-11-23T22:35:00+00:00

Evidence that in El Capitan it is the warehouses that rule all.

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malshadow — 2008-11-23T22:33:11+00:00

Lilwil and Escher13 battle over shipping route in El Capitan at BGG.CON 2008.

Thread: Re: Warehouses close on backwards rebuilding?

Soledade — 2008-10-19T14:28:31+00:00

In a 2/3 player game you have an aditional space (dark triangle) that closes warehouses but only when building forward. This is the only diference (one more spot for closing warehouses in each city) in a 2/3 player game.

As far as I remember (and I'm almost 100% sure about this) is that warehouses do not close when you build backwards.

Hope that helps
Paulo

edited for clearness

Thread: Warehouses close on backwards rebuilding?

Karmic_devil — 2008-10-19T06:48:14+00:00

The rules don't seem to address this.

In the 2/3 p game, there are some cities where by the time they are filled the first "close a warehouse" square is empty.

When a player places a warehouse on this square, does it close a warehouse for the second time?

Josh

Thread: Islas Canarias - Expansion Rules

ddregs — 2008-10-11T07:17:23+00:00

Hi all,
we played several times now with the 3 renovation fields, Porto , Lisboa and Canarias Isle. But we all agree that this one , with the pirate ship, just renders the game an unbalanced one.
I explain:
- using the rule that doesn't prevent you to enter in the same harbor, you just play a 2 seals card, then you can exit and enter again the Canarias island if you're there. So, with just an expense of 5 you can play the 3rd round making lots of money.
Now, anyone who played the exp and shares the same opinion?
Cheers

Thread: Re: ∞R-A Review of Mike Doyle's Art

rayito2702 — 2008-09-24T16:25:17+00:00

drunkenKOALA wrote:
My answer would be, to provide a new and interesting game play experience.
How exactly does an unclear, illegible design provide new and interesting game play?
I've discussed this at length in my review.

And a part of me questions whether your tendency is to agree, or to say that you agree when in fact you disagree. And a no lesser part of me also wonders, whether a part of you wants game artists to affirm your preconceived notions on the preconceivedness of other peoples "preconceived" notions of practicality.
I meant exactly what I said. If you want me to clarify my statement you can just ask.

In particular I'm not implying anything about your preconceived notions (or anyone else’s). I don't even know what they are. I'm only describing my point of view. That's what words like "me" and "my" denote.

To clarify what I said: I do not want a game's pieces to get in the way of game play and many useful conventions have arisen in game presentation to aid this notion, hence my tendency to agree with Mr. Ekted's statement.

However, I'm naturally opposed to institutionalized conventions. Now that such conventions exist I want to see graphic artists experiment with them or even cast them aside if only for the sake of innovation. If the result is failure, so be it. But, as I said in my review, I do not think that is the case with El Capitán, though I appreciate your difference of opinion in the matter.

Thread: 5 Players

Stormbull — 2008-09-24T14:35:12+00:00

El Capitan sees a fair amount of table play at the Tuesday Night Northbay Gamers meeting -- almost exclusively with 5 players, and last night was no exception. We had 4 veterans and 1 first-timer, who was an experienced gamer.

I wound up last on the first turn, which would put me in a hole I could never recover from. The choice tickets for coming on the board were all taken by my turn, and luck left me with only the most expensive destations -- I chose Alexandria to make my stand. Now I had to choose -- should I build one warehouse and go off the board next turn, or try and make Alexandria pay by going the distance and building 3 -- I chose the latter, which was probably the wrong strategy.

I wound up taking two big loans round 1, one big loan round 2, and a small loan round 3 (taking any loan in round 3 means you have lost). I think I did okay despite my starting position and poor choice on turn 1 -- I was able to make up most of the points gap by being the second player (of 2) to get to all 9 destinations.

K. won the game using in part a strategy he had developed in earlier games -- always buy all 1-cost tickets -- they fit in later letting him be the first to get all nine cities.

K. was close to being a runaway leader by the end of turn 2 -- I think that is a slight problem with El Capitan.

Final Scores:
~180 (K)
144
139
133
129 (me)

Thread: Re: Video Review of El Capitán

sigtaulefty — 2008-09-23T19:23:42+00:00

Thanks Eric, I had other comments about the music too and I agree it does get annoying after a while.

Thread: Re: ∞R-A Review of Mike Doyle's Art

drunkenKOALA — 2008-09-23T01:18:11+00:00

My answer would be, to provide a new and interesting game play experience.
How exactly does an unclear, illegible design provide new and interesting game play?

In changing the method of presentation, game designers and artists can cause the players to think about things in different ways.
Like, realizing how important a clear and legible design is?

I think there's a lot in common between learning a new game and learning a new language, accepting the relative simplicity of the former.
Except when I am playing a game, I am not looking forward to having to learn a new language. I wouldn't want to play Agricola in German, for example.

While my tendency is to agree, a part of me wants game artists to keep challenging my preconceived notions of practicality.
And a part of me questions whether your tendency is to agree, or to say that you agree when in fact you disagree. And a no lesser part of me also wonders, whether a part of you wants game artists to affirm your preconceived notions on the preconceivedness of other peoples "preconceived" notions of practicality.

Sorry, you are getting too philosophical for me here. Mr Doyle didn't follow his number one: comprehension and clarity. That's all I can say.

Thread: Re: ∞R-A Review of Mike Doyle's Art

rayito2702 — 2008-09-22T18:51:29+00:00

drunkenKOALA wrote:
Sure, I'll get used to it in time. I have also learned how to use BSW in time. If I train myself, I can also learn how to speak another language in time. Why do I have to train myself on how to read a gameboard efficiently?
My answer would be, to provide a new and interesting game play experience. When I am learning a new game I'm already getting re-trained. Learning a game's terminology and methods of visual communication are just part of that training.

In changing the method of presentation, game designers and artists can cause the players to think about things in different ways. I think there's a lot in common between learning a new game and learning a new language, accepting the relative simplicity of the former.

Thread: Re: ∞R-A Review of Mike Doyle's Art

matthew.marquand — 2008-09-22T11:54:31+00:00

rayito2702 wrote:
ekted wrote:
Mike Doyle, as well as Ystari, seem to love fancy, thin, hard-to-read type. Form is fine, but never at the expense of function.
While my tendency is to agree, a part of me wants game artists to keep challenging my preconceived notions of practicality.

I agree. Voicing criticism neither implies a lack of respect for the attempt at pushing the envelope of board game artistic design nor a desire for those like Mike Doyle to reduce the ferocity of their attempts.

Thread: Re: ∞R-A Review of Mike Doyle's Art

drunkenKOALA — 2008-09-22T11:20:26+00:00

rayito2702 wrote:
drunkenKOALA wrote:
Once. Does that matter?
Well, you made a claim that it was to busy for practical play. I was curious to see if you'd played it numerous times yet still had the same opinion of it. I felt the art was busy for the first couple of turns of my first play, but then I started to really enjoy it as part of the game.

The only impractical element, in my opinion, is the font.

I like the art, artistically. It looks great, very classy. But the artwork is just too busy. I don't think it's just the font.

Sure, I'll get used to it in time. I have also learned how to use BSW in time. If I train myself, I can also learn how to speak another language in time. Why do I have to train myself on how to read a gameboard efficiently?

Thread: Re: ∞R-A Review of Mike Doyle's Art

rayito2702 — 2008-09-22T03:46:34+00:00

ekted wrote:
Mike Doyle, as well as Ystari, seem to love fancy, thin, hard-to-read type. Form is fine, but never at the expense of function.
While my tendency is to agree, a part of me wants game artists to keep challenging my preconceived notions of practicality.

Thread: Re: ∞R-A Review of Mike Doyle's Art

rayito2702 — 2008-09-22T03:43:12+00:00

drunkenKOALA wrote:
Once. Does that matter?
Well, you made a claim that it was to busy for practical play. I was curious to see if you'd played it numerous times yet still had the same opinion of it. I felt the art was busy for the first couple of turns of my first play, but then I started to really enjoy it as part of the game.

The only impractical element, in my opinion, is the font.

Thread: Re: ∞R-A Review of Mike Doyle's Art

drunkenKOALA — 2008-09-21T05:50:52+00:00

rayito2702 wrote:
drunkenKOALA wrote:
Well looks like Mike Doyle didn't follow his own number one very closely. The design is artistic, but way too busy for practical game play.
Out of curiosity, how many times have you played it?

Once. Does that matter?

Thread: Re: ∞R-A Review of Mike Doyle's Art

ekted — 2008-09-21T04:54:45+00:00

rayito2702 wrote:
But the names of the cities across the tops of the boards are written in a heavily flourished cursive font. Frankly, it can be annoying trying to figure out which city is which. This is a particular problem with the cities of Valencia and Venicia.
Mike Doyle, as well as Ystari, seem to love fancy, thin, hard-to-read type. Form is fine, but never at the expense of function.

Thread: Re: ∞R-A Review of Mike Doyle's Art

rayito2702 — 2008-09-21T03:24:35+00:00

drunkenKOALA wrote:
Well looks like Mike Doyle didn't follow his own number one very closely. The design is artistic, but way too busy for practical game play.
Out of curiosity, how many times have you played it?

Thread: Re: ∞R-A Review of Mike Doyle's Art

drunkenKOALA — 2008-09-21T00:46:11+00:00

Well looks like Mike Doyle didn't follow his own number one very closely. The design is artistic, but way too busy for practical game play.

Thread: Re: A few rules q's

mvettemagred — 2008-09-16T17:29:11+00:00

duvalmont wrote:
1) If the player does not have enough money to build either a warehouse or a fortress he/she needs to sail to take a loan. He/she can't build after taking a loan while taking a loan finishes his round (except that he/she can buy cards).
The bolded text is not correct (bold added by me). The rules specifically state when you take a loan you may not perform any other actions on your turn.

Thread: Re: Video Review of El Capitán

Grudunza — 2008-09-10T18:28:42+00:00

Max, great job covering the game! One suggestions is to fade out the background music once you get into the main part of describing the gameplay... it gets a little distracting after a while. Maybe that's just to me, but I thought I'd mention it anyway.

Best,
Eric

Thread: Re: Video Review of El Capitán

jurjan — 2008-09-10T12:59:36+00:00

Ok,
both links work (the one in your edit of the original post AND the one in your reply)
mmmhhh, strange..
perhaps something at my end is strange.

anyhow, sorry to have declined your review, now that I can see it
(and am doing so right now) I'd probably approve it (still watching).

thanks,
Jurjan

Thread: Re: Video Review of El Capitán

sigtaulefty — 2008-09-10T12:40:33+00:00

I'm viewing fine in firefox, hmmm.

Try the vimeo link:

http://vimeo.com/1699303

Thread: Re: Video Review of El Capitán

jurjan — 2008-09-10T12:37:15+00:00

sorry,
I can't see your video, possibly because I'm using Firefox (3.0.1)?
That's why I had to vote against you in the geekmod.

However, seeing that is has been approved, I'm the only one with this problem?

Have a nice day,
Jurjan

Thread: Video Review of El Capitán

sigtaulefty — 2008-09-10T11:24:59+00:00

I assembled a short video explaining components, game play and my thoughts on the game.

Vimeo Video

edit: It may be easier to view through This Link

Also, I wanted to note that in my video I did not give proper credit to QWG Games for the production of this game. I'm sorry for the oversight on the video, but I wanted to note that here.

Thread: Re: A few rules q's

locusshifter — 2008-09-02T18:29:17+00:00

Yes. Just building all over, or even in volume just won't cut it.

You've got to pick your spots, and do it well.

Thread: Re: A few rules q's

duvalmont — 2008-09-02T15:39:59+00:00

Websteria wrote:
Ok, so it's not the intention of the rules to make sure everyone builds everything then, it's the intention that everyone gets an equal # of turns. I.E. you may have extra warehouses/fortresses at the end of the game if you didn't plan well.

Exactly!
But it's not that simple. Sometimes finishing a game is not a best choice if the situation on the board is not good for you. So it's not the race to build all your buildings the fastest, but to build them effectively to gain the best returns on your investments.

Thread: Re: A few rules q's

Kalidor — 2008-09-02T15:22:22+00:00

Now, my group has only played once, so we are the furthest thing away from experts, but...

1) I think you are "forced" by the game to take a loan if your turns comes up, but if you went earlier in the round that ends the season, you have "extra" warehouses/strongholds for the next season. I think; at least that's how we played...

2) We have not played a 2 player game, it was a 4 player, and we found it quite tense. We all liked it; alot of decisions, strategy and tactics...good game all around, if a tad too long (this may have been our inexperience, however. Our 4 player game, all first-timers, took about 2 1/2 hours).

3) What we found is that I think it is darn near impossible NOT to take a loan out in the 1st round. How well you do going forward (I did poooorly) will dictate how often/how much you need to take out in the future.

Thread: Re: A few rules q's

Websteria — 2008-09-02T15:21:03+00:00

Ok, so it's not the intention of the rules to make sure everyone builds everything then, it's the intention that everyone gets an equal # of turns. I.E. you may have extra warehouses/fortresses at the end of the game if you didn't plan well.

Thanks!
Jeff

Thread: Re: A few rules q's

duvalmont — 2008-09-02T15:17:09+00:00

1) If the player does not have enough money to build either a warehouse or a fortress he/she needs to sail to take a loan. He/she can't build after taking a loan while taking a loan finishes his round (except that he/she can buy cards). He/she could build the last warehouse or fortress on the next round.

3) The least amount of money spent in the first round would be somewhat around:
4 (for the initial sailing card) + 4 for the fortress + 6*2 for the warehouses - with the assumptions someone sails to our starting city and builds a warehouses there or we would need to sail away after we build the 3 one. With the assumption the least money we would spend in the first turn would amount to 20. So it is possible to make a first round without the loan although it requires help from other players and is not likely to happen. I guess it's not a winning strategy either. So it's true one needs to take at least one loan in the firts round.

Thread: Re: loan question

duvalmont — 2008-09-02T15:09:30+00:00

I will back up the previous answer. I always explained the rules like this that you have to take additional loans to pay back your outstanding loans. However it did not happen in my games so far.

Thread: A few rules q's

Websteria — 2008-09-02T15:08:42+00:00

1) If at the end of the turn one of the players does not have enough $ to finish the round by building then are they allows to go take out a loan and then build their final warehouse?

2) It seems to me the 2p game is still too wide open. Anyone have suggestions on tightening it up a bit? Are there other variants?

3) This seems obvious, but everyone is going to have to take out a loan in the first round right? I just wanted to make sure I wasn't doing something wrong.

Thanks!

Thread: Re: loan question

sigtaulefty — 2008-09-02T15:08:11+00:00

Matt,
thanks for showing me that I'm getting old. I actually looked at that thread.

Thread: Re: loan question

matthew.marquand — 2008-09-02T14:51:43+00:00

It's my understanding that you must take out more loans to pay them off.

http://www.boardgamegeek.com/thread/284826

Thread: loan question

sigtaulefty — 2008-09-02T13:21:14+00:00

It hasn't happened in the 2 games I've played, but I was curious in case it did happen in the future.

For example, I take 2 $16 loans.

I extend them to $60 during payday.

I don't get enough money to cover the $60 I need to pay. What happens?

The rules just say I need to pay the loan by any means necessary. Do I sell back warehouses? Can I rebuild if I sell back warehouses?

Thread: Re: (HUMOR) Completely broken game!! Unless you follow rules.

sigtaulefty — 2008-09-02T13:02:51+00:00

This was the first game I taught myself and played with the family that I really feel confident that I didn't break.

Your mistake was humorous and wow would that change things. My family was complaining about starting with only $20 - imagine if I made them spend 4 or 8 or 12 per warehouse!?

Hopefully you give it another try with the right prices. I really enjoyed this game.

Thread: Re: Sailing Back for the Cheaper Harbor?

mvettemagred — 2008-08-26T16:48:19+00:00

I just checked the online rules, and it doesn't preclude sailing from a city back to the same city. In fact, the rules say you can use a Destination card to sail to the city on the card, "no matter where your ship currently is." By that definition, you could be in Tunis, and play a Tunis destination card to sail to Tunis, arriving at an open harbor.

The rules for City Interconnection cards say you can sail as many routes as you want, as long at the city you intend to build in has an open harbor. So, if you wanted to sail from Tunis to Valencia, then Valencia back to Tunis, just to arrive at the cheaper harbor, you could do that.

As Jonathan said, in most cases this wouldn't be an efficient use of resources, and so would make sense to do. However, if it was the only way to build your last warehouse on a round, and you really wanted to trigger the end of the round instead of taking a loan, then you may want to burn the cards.

Thread: Re: Sailing Back for the Cheaper Harbor?

darthservo — 2008-08-23T16:31:28+00:00

I didn't think much of it at first, either. But I got to thinking, what if you were limited on cash (could only afford a cheap warehouse) and sailing out and back could give you warehouse majority?

I know, it's a little bit of a stretch, but there could possibly be some scenarios that could bring it into question.

Here is the rule text: "If your ship is anchoring on the more costly harbor space you may not move to the cheaper one in case it becomes unoccupied."

My line of thinking leads me to believe that this just implies you can't simply scoot over as I don't see anything that says you can't sail out around and back to the same city.

Thread: Re: Sailing Back for the Cheaper Harbor?

Jonathan Degann — 2008-08-23T06:35:35+00:00

I would take the rule literally - you can't return on the same turn. As you surmise, it would not be worth it. The difference is always a single doubloon. Sailing out and back using seals would cost 5 - you'd need to stay five MORE turns. I suppose it might be done for 2 if you had two identical point-to-point passages. Remember that you can't build more than (3 or 4) adjacent warehouses.

In short, it's a non issue.

Thread: Sailing Back for the Cheaper Harbor?

darthservo — 2008-08-23T05:04:38+00:00

The rules say that if a cheaper harbor space becomes unoccupied you can't simply move your ship over from the more costly space. However, would you be able to sail out and back to the same city by use of a destination card? If using red seals, would it cost one or two red seals?

I'm not sure if it would even be worth it (at least in most cases), but was just wondering.

Thread: Re: Questions about Lisboa

emagius — 2008-08-22T13:46:11+00:00

I don't have any special insight, but I'd go with the following:

1) The shut-down happens first ("If, after building the warehouse, you're holding the majority..." and "Each time a warehouse is erected on a dark-colored building site the first warehouse in the warehouse chain in the city is shut down...").
2) Yes, Lisboa pays out normally on payday.
3) Only the player who just built receives the immediate payment ("If you build a warehouse in Lisboa you are paid for it immediately" and example).

Thread: Re: ∞R-A Review of Mike Doyle's Art

candoo — 2008-08-19T18:36:10+00:00

I agree that the number one problem with the design of this game is the font. The city names are virtually non-legible. I have to use the dots schematic to figure out which city it is.

The second and much smaller criticism is that the overall board is rather dark. I understand that it is in keeping with the medieval theme but a slightly brighter board would have been preferred.

Thread: Re: 2 Payouts instead of 3?

Odinsday — 2008-08-17T00:52:52+00:00

beckeykevin wrote:
I have only played El Capitan once. Too me it seemed a tad too long. Would the game still work if it was cut by 1/3 the playing time? I probably would play it more often if it was shorter.

I've only played once, so pinch of sea salt required, but maybe allowing only 5 warehouse placements (and one fort) per 'epoch' would speed things up? You'd probably save 1 or 2 turns per epoch, though the bonuses would drop.

Thread: Re: Strategies?

Odinsday — 2008-08-15T21:37:59+00:00

It seems to me, with the turn cost, and the cost of sailing out of the bank, one almost always wants to take a big loan.

A small loan gets you 10, but at a minimum will cost 4 to sale from bank.

So effectively you get 6 credits and pay back 12.

With a big loan, you get 16, minus 4 for the sale. So 12 credits for 20 to pay back.

A tad more efficient, and should avoid a second turn of loanage (possibly).

Couse that '4' for the sale you might to have to pay anyways to move to a destination you want to get to anyways, but the small loan still seems less efficient for most cases (even though it appears better).

Thread: Re: ∞R-A Review of Mike Doyle's Art

Odinsday — 2008-08-15T17:32:27+00:00

beckeykevin wrote:
I think that it would have been much easier for English speaking players to grasp where each city was located on the board if Z-Man had used the English names, such as using "Venice" instead of Venezia. I find that it takes new players longer to distinguish Valencia from Venezia.

Anyway, my fix to the problem is to refresh players with the geography of the region. Compare the map locations on the board to the present day. It's much easier to locate Spain's Valencia if you think of Spain being below France, above Moracco and left of Italy. I find that the board is much easier to navigate when you think of it this way.

If you are an English speaker from Europe, it's not a big problem

(Though the rest of my group did get those two confused, and Constantinople is in the wrong place, which confused me )

Thread: Re: ∞R-A Review of Mike Doyle's Art

nsolitander — 2008-08-01T19:32:20+00:00

hats off. excellent idea / execution.

Thread: Re: Sailing the mediterranean like a true Tycoon

mvettemagred — 2008-08-01T02:03:39+00:00

Very nice review and strategy tips. However, I think a couple of rules are incorrect:
- The triangle shaded space is for 2 and 3-player games, I think.
- At the end of payday, the player with the least money chooses the starting player for the next round. She is not automatically made the starting player.

Thread: Variant scoring table overlay for Tycoon uploaded

plysbjorn — 2008-07-30T10:52:12+00:00

Just wanted to cross post here for the benefit to anyone looking to play Tycoon El Capitán style. Under the Tycoon entry I've just uploaded a simple overlay for the Tycoon board updating the scoring table and providing spaces for the proliferation bonuses. Enjoy!

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Thommy8 — 2008-07-22T04:12:45+00:00

End of game - Red wins with 195, to Blue's 147 and Yellow's 122. Building warehouses in all 9 cities was key!

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Thommy8 — 2008-07-22T04:12:05+00:00

Close up of Tunis, Naples, Athens, and Alexandria. Only the winner Red is present in all four.

Thread: Re: Replenishing Sailing Cards

CortexBomb — 2008-07-22T01:26:52+00:00

It's after the player's turn.

However, I suggest playing with the auto refresh as a variant. I play Tycoon (the original version of this game) exclusively using the variant and think it adds an interesting element to the ticket purchase phase.

Thread: Re: Replenishing Sailing Cards

unittype — 2008-07-21T21:48:11+00:00

Yup, they are replenished after the players turn. I can't get the rules right now because I am not at home, but I am pretty sure that it is stated cleary there.

Greetings,
Carsten

Thread: Re: Replenishing Sailing Cards

crobledo — 2008-07-21T20:45:09+00:00

We haven't played in a few weeks, but I am pretty sure it's after that player's turn.

Thread: Replenishing Sailing Cards

chaosbreaker — 2008-07-21T19:23:28+00:00

Do you replenish the the sailing card as soon as you buy them, like ticket to ride or do they get replenished after the player's turn?

Thread: Questions about Lisboa

turales — 2008-07-11T05:37:56+00:00

We played our first El Capitan today. Excellent. But I have three question about Lisboa expansion.

1- You receive income after every single warehouse built. But what happened in the next situation: someone build a warehouse in a darked spot so he has to shut down the first warehouse in the line. What happens first: the shut down or the payment? In our game, my friend built a warehouse which make him the leader, so he would receive the total payment, but with the shut down he would become the second in Lisboa, so he would receive just the half of the payment.

2- Lisboa pays exactly as the rest of the ports in every payday?

3- When some build a warehouse, he is the only one who receive the payment or so do the rest of the people in Lisboa?

Thank you in advance for your help.

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cscottk — 2008-06-14T04:09:51+00:00

El Capitan at BGG 2007

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fabricefab — 2008-04-09T15:23:50+00:00

Back and front of bank cards

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fabricefab — 2008-04-09T15:19:44+00:00

back and front destignation cards

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fabricefab — 2008-04-09T15:18:18+00:00

back and front sailing cards