Game: Agricola

Thread: Re: Video review of Agricola

Chris Dorrell — 2008-05-09T10:46:45+00:00

Thanks for putting the time and effort in to create this video. It's well structured, informative, concise and gives an excellent feel for the game

Well done
Chris

Thread: Re: Sculpey == Fimo?

UnknownParkerBrother — 2008-05-09T10:29:15+00:00

byronczimmer wrote:
So... Does Michael's Craft stores carry this, or do I need to look somewhere special?

Michaels usually carries both, at least around here.

Thread: Re: Thoughthammer Preorders Filled

byronczimmer — 2008-05-09T10:15:15+00:00

I predict a run of 'pre orders' with the other online retailers.

Or put another way... The ani-cow is out of the barn.

Thread: Re: Thoughthammer Preorders Filled

Ambrose — 2008-05-09T09:04:33+00:00

CovertDad wrote:
Ambrose wrote:
If I order Agricola from Thoughthammer NOW, would I still get the animeeples and promo cards, even if the first edition is sold out?

Nobody ordering through Thoughthammer will ever get Animeeples... In [-]America[/-] The US, Animeeples are only for those who pre-ordered directly from Zev...

Since they have sold out their pre-orders, if you place an order now, it will not contain the Z-Deck...

:ninja:

I quote from www.thoughthammer.com:

Please Note: The publisher has informed us that all pre-orders placed on our site will receive the bonus pack of 24 new cards as well. As stated this applies only to pre-orders. Also, the animeeples promo is exclusive to orders placed directly with Z-Man Games. Retailers will not receive the animeeple promos. Please direct any questions concerning the availability of the cards after the release of Agricola to Z-Man Games.

So I see I can't get animeeples, but what about the extra cards?

Thread: Re: Thoughthammer Preorders Filled

CovertDad — 2008-05-09T08:52:21+00:00

Bosco312 wrote:
Wait...does 'filled' mean 'shipped', or does it just mean that all the copies they will ultimately get from the first printing have been allocated?

I ask because, well, I ordered mine very early on, directly from Z-Man, and it would kinda suck to pay the MSRP (vs. online price) AND have to wait to get the game in my hands AFTER those that ordered from Thoughthammer.

Can someone clarify?

I'm sure it does not mean 'shipped'.

Thoughthammer told their distributor, "we will buy X copies of Agricola" during the pre-order window. Those are now sold out, and anyone who places an order for one now will be part of the "on-the-shelf" supply, as it were...

:ninja:

Thread: Re: Thoughthammer Preorders Filled

Bosco312 — 2008-05-09T08:41:12+00:00

Wait...does 'filled' mean 'shipped', or does it just mean that all the copies they will ultimately get from the first printing have been allocated?

I ask because, well, I ordered mine very early on, directly from Z-Man, and it would kinda suck to pay the MSRP (vs. online price) AND have to wait to get the game in my hands AFTER those that ordered from Thoughthammer.

Can someone clarify?

Thread: Re: Sculpey == Fimo?

sunshiny — 2008-05-09T08:39:49+00:00

Fimo is the better product in my view, I've been a polymer clay artist for about 15 years now & always use fimo or kato. If you have to get sculpey get sculpey III as it's firmer & is better for detail than regular sculpey.

Thread: Re: Thoughthammer Preorders Filled

CovertDad — 2008-05-09T08:17:58+00:00

Ambrose wrote:
If I order Agricola from Thoughthammer NOW, would I still get the animeeples and promo cards, even if the first edition is sold out?

Nobody ordering through Thoughthammer will ever get Animeeples... In [-]America[/-] The US, Animeeples are only for those who pre-ordered directly from Zev...

Since they have sold out their pre-orders, if you place an order now, it will not contain the Z-Deck...

:ninja:

Thread: Re: Thoughthammer Preorders Filled

Ambrose — 2008-05-09T08:14:48+00:00

If I order Agricola from Thoughthammer NOW, would I still get the animeeples and promo cards, even if the first edition is sold out?

Thread: Re: Sculpey == Fimo?

byronczimmer — 2008-05-09T08:08:49+00:00

So... Does Michael's Craft stores carry this, or do I need to look somewhere special?

Thread: Re: Thoughthammer Preorders Filled

CovertDad — 2008-05-09T07:58:34+00:00

RockLobster wrote:
Son... of... a... BITCH.

And here I was, stupidly waiting until I actually had some money before pre-ordering the *&^$*ing thing.

Any idea how those of us screwed by trying to be fiscally responsible can get ahold of the Z deck in future?

[To say nothing of getting ahold of the animeeples...]

My best suggestion would be to go to a con where Z-Man is... Zev specifically said that the Z-Deck was NOT exclusive to pre-orders, and that it might show up at cons he attended... Pre-ordering was just a way to ensure getting it for free...

:ninja:

Thread: Re: Thoughthammer Preorders Filled

CovertDad — 2008-05-09T07:56:14+00:00

At this point, I'm very glad I pre-ordered direct from Zev...

The immortal words of Nelson Muntz come to mind...

"HA-ha..."

:ninja:

Thread: Re: Thoughthammer Preorders Filled

Roliander — 2008-05-09T07:51:50+00:00

RockLobster wrote:
Son... of... a... BITCH.

Any idea how those of us screwed by trying to be fiscally responsible can get ahold of the Z deck in future?

I don't know. Luckily for me the tax return came at an opportune moment or I would have been in the same boat. Hopefully there will be plenty to be had through other distributers.

Thread: Re: Thoughthammer Preorders Filled

Rokkr — 2008-05-09T07:47:53+00:00

Rappak wrote:
It's batch allocation. Printers run for multiple games. When a game first goes to print, they select a print amount and print it. Then when that print is done, they move on to another game and print that. From my knowledge of the game industry, some of these print queues are 10-20 long. So when one print run is finished and they need more, the game goes to the end of the line to await reprinting.

To be complete sold out before the print run is finished means that the distributor has already allocated what stock they were promised to get from the publisher. In this case, Thoughthammer has already enough orders to claim the stock that they were promised and the rest of the pre-orders will get the next shipment of the game when the game comes back into the front of the line to be printed.

I hope this helps and someone correct me if I'm wrong.

Also note that publishers can move games around in the printing queue but they often do not as that would mean deadline shifts and other crap that comes with it.
I worked for a big commercial book printer and what he describes is the same way they work.
You schedule jobs based on a set print run, which has a planned amount of time. It's next to impossible to change a print run once it's set because optimally there are always jobs scheduled. They can't decide to double your print run and delay another customer's job to do so.

Thread: Re: Thoughthammer Preorders Filled

Rappak — 2008-05-09T07:47:29+00:00

RockLobster wrote:
Son... of... a... BITCH.

And here I was, stupidly waiting until I actually had some money before pre-ordering the *&^$*ing thing.

Any idea how those of us screwed by trying to be fiscally responsible can get ahold of the Z deck in future?

[To say nothing of getting ahold of the animeeples...]

I would suggest ordering from somehwere else. I would try Boards and Bits When they had Galaxy trucker, that supply lasted for about a month longer than anyone else. How the hell they had that much stock more than anyone else is beyond me. You might have better luck there.

Thread: Re: Thoughthammer Preorders Filled

Rappak — 2008-05-09T07:43:05+00:00

It's batch allocation. Printers run for multiple games. When a game first goes to print, they select a print amount and print it. Then when that print is done, they move on to another game and print that. From my knowledge of the game industry, some of these print queues are 10-20 long. So when one print run is finished and they need more, the game goes to the end of the line to await reprinting.

To be complete sold out before the print run is finished means that the distributor has already allocated what stock they were promised to get from the publisher. In this case, Thoughthammer has already enough orders to claim the stock that they were promised and the rest of the pre-orders will get the next shipment of the game when the game comes back into the front of the line to be printed.

I hope this helps and someone correct me if I'm wrong.

Also note that publishers can move games around in the printing queue but they often do not as that would mean deadline shifts and other crap that comes with it.

Thread: Re: Thoughthammer Preorders Filled

RockLobster — 2008-05-09T07:41:31+00:00

Son... of... a... BITCH.

And here I was, stupidly waiting until I actually had some money before pre-ordering the *&^$*ing thing.

Any idea how those of us screwed by trying to be fiscally responsible can get ahold of the Z deck in future?

[To say nothing of getting ahold of the animeeples...]

Thread: Re: Sculpey == Fimo?

keep220 — 2008-05-09T07:41:09+00:00

It's been a couple of years since I messed around with polymer clay, but my experience was always that FIMO was superior to Sculpey. Especially in the colder months, the Sculpey was difficult to work with and wound up fairly brittle after baking. The FIMO worked much better, and to me the colors are more realistic. I would say it depends on the detail you are putting into your models--the more detail, the more I recommend FIMO over Sculpey.

Thread: Re: Thoughthammer Preorders Filled

the_spy — 2008-05-09T07:40:45+00:00

Oh yes.... so you just have to keep delaying...

Thread: Re: Sculpey == Fimo?

ScottMcChesney — 2008-05-09T07:37:06+00:00

I prefer Fimo over Sculpey. I feel the colors are richer with Fimo and it has better constancy. However a lot of people use Sculpey to good effect so I'm think it is just a personal preference.

Thread: Re: Sculpey == Fimo?

foppwin — 2008-05-09T07:24:23+00:00

just bought the fimo for the farmers today, so cant really help you there.

my experiense with fimo or cernet is that they stick very well togeter. I am a novice to moddeling, so take my advice as someone who have made 2 cows, 5 sheeps and 2 pigs.

Thread: Re: Thoughthammer Preorders Filled

tmarozas — 2008-05-09T07:21:53+00:00

How can a game that is still in the production process be completely sold out ?

You would think there would be a way to request the printer to create more copies.

:what:

Thread: Re: Sculpey == Fimo?

byronczimmer — 2008-05-09T07:21:13+00:00

So - query...

I can never find FIMO at my local craft store, only SCULPEY.

Are they the same thing (short of brand name differences) ?

What are the differences in grades of SCULPEY? I see 'Original Sculpey' and 'Sculpey III' and so on.

Thread: Thoughthammer Preorders Filled

Roliander — 2008-05-09T07:12:09+00:00

On their site they announced that all pre-orders as of May 7th have been filled. This was a relief to me because I pre-ordered mid-April and was afraid that I might have to wait until the next shipment. Hopefully this makes others feel good as well amid the disappointment of delays until June/July.

BTW...they also said that the entire first printing is sold out.
So if you ordered after May 7th.....erm....Good luck! :devil:

Thread: Re: Sculpey == Fimo?

byronczimmer — 2008-05-09T07:02:55+00:00

so step one is: go get new clay

That's probably going to solve much of the other issues.

May even do what the original intent for the bendy clay was - which was making a set of shaped & textured playing pieces for a blind friend of mine.

(esp since the miniature cookie cutters ALSO turned up a day or two ago)

Thread: Re: Sculpey == Fimo?

sunshiny — 2008-05-09T06:14:50+00:00

First off don't use the the bendy stuff get new fimo or sculpy. The bendy stuff is BENDY, not good for legs :D I'm in the process of making an Agricola set & find the pieces are so small as to not need armatures. But if you really can't get the legs to stay on after baking try this. After making the body use broken pieces if toothpicks inserted into body at each leg & have about 1/3 inch sticking out (you could also do this for arms & legs if needed)then slip the legs down the toothpick till touching the body. Use a small blunt tool like a small knitting needle to kind of smooth the legs to the body to make the join more solid.

Another technique is called multiple baking. Thats when you would make the body, add tooth picks & bake. After cooling take some white glue & spread a tiny bit around the body at the legs & let dry. Then add the legs then bake again. I don't think you'll need to use the method as I only use it when I'm crafting complicated sculptures.

One thing is to make the eyeballs first and bake them before making the rest of the head if your going so far as to make a face.

As for tools I use knitting needles, sewing needles, wooden sticks with flattened ends, pens without the ink, ect. for details. Petroleum jelly like Vaseline or mineral oil works great as a clay softner, you only need a little bit. Another trick for softening/preparing clay is to put it in a ziplock bag & immerse in hot water for about 15 to 30 minutes. Polymer glue (white glue) is great for rebaking. Also if your using a bead for say the inside of the head spread with glue 1st, let dry, then cover with clay.

One other tip about working in small bits is to construct your sculpture on a small square of cardboard say 2 or 3 inches across. This makes it very easy to work on as you can just pick it up by the cardboard which means less finger prints or less accidents with putting too much pressure on a spot.

Have fun,
Melody

Thread: Re: Agricola will ship late June/early July

agent easy — 2008-05-09T05:16:54+00:00

Thanks for the update. It's appreciated.

Thread: Sculpey == Fimo?

byronczimmer — 2008-05-09T05:12:20+00:00

So, I was digging around my pile of 'projects I never did' and found some 'Bake and Bend Sculpey', from many MANY years ago.

Seeing all the Agricola farmers, I got into it a bit, and have a small family of blue clothed farmers.

Now - they look a little squished and man handled and my only tools were a miniature rolling pin that came in the set and a paperclip.

Obviously, there are better ways than 'make balls, form them into tubes, squish it all together in a vaguely humanoid shape and hope for the best.

So - We've seen some recommendations for making the animals (which is less of an urgency with the forthcoming animeeples sets) - but I've not seen many recommendations for making the people.

What tools to use (household preferred)
What techniques to prevent having to glue legs to bodies?
Is 5+ year old clay too old to use reliably?

Luckily I managed to buy a set long ago with eight colors, including an approximation of flesh-tone.

So is this material recommended, or would a more traditional 'not bendy' clay work better?

Thread: Re: Guess the date Thoughthammer will report that Agricola is in stock (15 GG prize)

foppwin — 2008-05-09T04:49:11+00:00

3 of august

Thread: Re: Getting started with Agricola - a query

Purple — 2008-05-09T03:06:05+00:00

1a) K-deck
1b) 8
1c) Weak

2a) 7
2b) 8.5
2c) Middling

Thread: Re: Getting started with Agricola - a query

Werbaer — 2008-05-09T01:29:34+00:00

1a. E Deck
1b. 8
1c. middling

2a. 13 (2 x family game, 11 x E deck)
2b. 9
2c. weak

I've seen 2 extreme cards hands in about 25 games (my games played, and about the same number i supervised).
One IMO very weak hand in the very first game i played (not my hand).
One very strong hand in a game i wasn't in; the only game i've seen where the players used the K deck (only).

Thread: Re: Getting started with Agricola - a query

brauerle — 2008-05-09T12:49:47+00:00

1a) Don't really know - imo only E.
1b) high - 8
1c) middling

2a) Well, this was my only play (this Monday, btw).

Thread: Re: Getting started with Agricola - a query

Zimeon — 2008-05-09T12:44:07+00:00

Maybe I shouldn't reply to this. Why? Look at the replies:

1a) None. only family game
1b) 10.
1c) Hypothetically, we figured "marginal".

2a) 13
2b) 10
2c) No idea… still playing the family game as I'm mostly playing with new people all the time.

Thread: Card Dealing Variations

BeyondMonopoly — 2008-05-09T12:24:11+00:00

A master thread for Card Dealing/Drafting Variants...

1. [url=http://www.boardgamegeek.com/thread/244284]The Turn-the-Tide Variant[/url]
2. [url=http://www.boardgamegeek.com/thread/240187]The Standard Card Draft[/url]
3. [url=http://www.boardgamegeek.com/thread/290354]The Rochester Draft[/url]
4. [url=http://www.boardgamegeek.com/thread/302781]The Shared Draft[/url]
5. The Discard 3 - Get 1 Variant (in the rules, under variants)

Others I have Heard Discussed/Seen Used

6. The X Game - Deal each player 3x cards of each type, x each from the three different decks. At the start of the game, they discard down to 7 of each.

7. The Decision Game - Deal each player N cards of each type, from all the decks in amounts that they choose for each deck (For example, if N is 10, I could take 3 from the E, 3 from the I, and 4 from the K). At the start of the game, they discard down to 7 of each.

I am sure others have tried or thought of other ideas. Please add them here...

Thread: Re: Getting started with Agricola - a query

Gelete — 2008-05-09T11:05:01+00:00

1a: E, I and K
1b. 9
1c. Middling

2a: 20 or so
2b: 9.8
2c: Weak

the players, can actually hurt themselves greatly trying to make situations where their cards are more useful.

I completly agree with this opinion. Is a normal situation that one player wastes several actions (and food) in order to use cards that seemed to be good (or that can actually be good). And doing this he/she forgets to use his/her familiars to collect goods, mayor improvements or whatever, and once the card is on the table is really too late to generate enough points for a win.

Thread: Re: Getting started with Agricola - a query

BeyondMonopoly — 2008-05-09T10:33:43+00:00

1a. E deck
1b. 9
1c. weak

2a. 80 or so
2b. 10
2c. weak

a player, can actually hurt themselves greatly trying to make situations where their cards are more useful.

Thread: Re: Guess the date Thoughthammer will report that Agricola is in stock (15 GG prize)

godfeather — 2008-05-09T10:13:27+00:00

howdyhamster wrote:
July 25 / Christmas in July / My birthday
Actually, you are not that far off. In Sweden, Yule (or Jul as we spell it) was an old pagan feast that took place during the winter solstice. Later it became christianized.

Thread: Re: Agricola will ship late June/early July

poifpoif — 2008-05-09T10:12:53+00:00

Acutally I might be a little bit upset... :what:

Thread: Re: Getting started with Agricola - a query

Blind Reality — 2008-05-09T10:06:39+00:00

1a E & I
1b 9
1c Middling

2a 10
2b 9.4
2c Weak

Thread: Re: Getting started with Agricola - a query

melissa — 2008-05-09T10:05:29+00:00

1a) E deck first 1 game, then family game x2
1b) high - 9
1c) we decided that they actually made our scores go backwards! So weak, I guess.

2a) 23 or so
2b) 10
2c) weak

I do recognise that there is a very small possibility of a killer combo of cards, but my experience is that in most if not all cases the other players should be able to play against that combo. (eg by denying grain to that user)

Thread: Re: Agricola will ship late June/early July

poifpoif — 2008-05-09T10:03:46+00:00

Yeah... Thanks for the update... :what:

But the game wasn't initialy planed to go out in April or so ? If I had known at that time (in december) it would take so long, I certainly would have waited for the French version to come, avoiding an expansive shipping cost by the way.

Yet I'm not upset. But a bit frustrated though...

:shake:

Thread: Re: Getting started with Agricola - a query

Maik — 2008-05-09T09:48:42+00:00

1a) E deck
1b) 9
1c) weak

2a) 59
2b) 10
2c) weak

Thread: Getting started with Agricola - a query

Maik — 2008-05-09T09:45:43+00:00

There have been several discussions, often centered on individual cards, on whether the influence of your initial hand of cards is strong to practically determine the winner. As I've stated in most of those discussions, my stance is No, it ain't, but I'd prefer to spare you (and myself) another rehash of my arguments.

Rather I'd like to ask for your help in getting to the root of this misconception, since I have a hunch that it can be avoided by not using all cards right from the start. There is some anecdotal corraboration for that hunch, but I'm definitely running the risk of only reading what I want to read, and so I'd like some more data. Cold, hard data, preferrably.

So if you'd like to sate my curiosity, please answer the following set of short questions. Again, the hypothesis your answers will prove or crush is: if you restrict yourself to the E deck for your first few games of Agricola, you'll have more fun than if you don't.

1a) In your first three (or less) games of Agricola, which card decks did you play with? If you've only played once or twice, please state that along with your answer.
1b) How would/did you rate the game after these first games?
1c) How would you gauge the influence of the cards on winning after these first games:
none - pure game of skill
weak - only significant between players of very even skill
middling - about as significant as skill
strong - can only be evened out by great differences in skill

Optionally, you can also answer this second set:
2a) What's your current total number of plays?
2b) What's your current rating for Agricola?
2c) How do you gauge the card influence now?

I'll be the first to answer myself to make this thread look a little livelier ;) and will have a first look at the results (if any) next Tuesday or Wednesday.

Thanks for participating!

Maik

Thread: Re: Agricola will ship late June/early July

Dator220 — 2008-05-08T11:37:57+00:00

[-]Additon first and then 'Expand without room'. I shouldn't be talking smack though, I suck at this game.:D[/-]

Damn it! I'm slow. HA! Funny...

byronczimmer wrote:
melissa wrote:
jpkapps wrote:
Dator220 wrote:
BREAKING NEWS!

AGRICOLA DELAYED...until Christmas.

*Sigh*

Adrian Larson

Don't be so bloody pessimistic! I predict an early September delivery.

Delivery is the right word. June 15th will be 9 months since the initial effort on an English translation.

So, did you build an addition for your house first or did you use the 'Expand family without room' action?

Thread: Re: Agricola will ship late June/early July

Dator220 — 2008-05-08T11:29:50+00:00

Optimistic be thy name. Prasie the farming gods with good fortune.

Faithless would be my name.

Later,
Adrian Larson

jpkapps wrote:
Dator220 wrote:
BREAKING NEWS!

AGRICOLA DELAYED...until Christmas.

*Sigh*

Adrian Larson

Don't be so bloody pessimistic! I predict an early September delivery.

Thread: Re: Agricola will ship late June/early July

BettyEgan — 2008-05-08T08:01:48+00:00

where are you moving to?

I myself will be moving within Canada, and thought it was going to be complicated for me.

I'm moving to Kingston, Ontario. Yes, moving is a pain. My husband is in the military so we move every few years. I've gotten used to it. I just hope my game collection survives the overseas trip.

Thread: Re: Agricola will ship late June/early July

Faithful — 2008-05-08T05:17:45+00:00

Thank you for the update, and no worries when it gets here, I rather have it right than too soon.

Thread: Re: Agricola will ship late June/early July

the1jugg — 2008-05-08T05:14:06+00:00

BettyEgan wrote:
All I can say is, I hope I have my copy before the end of July, because after that it will get complicated for me. I preordered from the UK to be shipped to Germany, but I will be moving to Canada at the end of July.

where are you moving to?

I myself will be moving within Canada, and thought it was going to be complicated for me.

Thread: Re: Agricola will ship late June/early July

bazik123 — 2008-05-08T02:53:45+00:00

byronczimmer wrote:

So, did you build an addition for your house first or did you use the 'Expand family without room' action?

they mean to use the 'expand family without room', but it isnt't available until the 'june' round. or 'july', if the 'field and plow' comes up for june...

Thread: Re: Agricola will ship late June/early July

byronczimmer — 2008-05-08T02:47:01+00:00

melissa wrote:
jpkapps wrote:
Dator220 wrote:
BREAKING NEWS!

AGRICOLA DELAYED...until Christmas.

*Sigh*

Adrian Larson

Don't be so bloody pessimistic! I predict an early September delivery.

Delivery is the right word. June 15th will be 9 months since the initial effort on an English translation.

So, did you build an addition for your house first or did you use the 'Expand family without room' action?