Game: Humans!!!

Thread: Re: A few questions that came up

sdonohue — 2008-11-22T22:35:35+00:00

Exactly. Once you start combat, none of your zombies will move.

Thread: Re: A few questions that came up

PMMJ — 2008-11-22T21:00:57+00:00

sdonohue wrote:
PMMJ wrote:
1.) My zombie moves one, then captures and infects a human. Bam, new zombie. Can my new zombie use the rest of my movement for the turn? (I think so.)
No he can't. The turn order is specifically Move, then Capture/Combat. Once you start fighting, there's no more moving for the zombies.

OK, so, move all my zombies, dividing the movement however I see fit, then do all my captures?

Thread: Re: A few questions that came up

Jonathan Ward — 2008-11-22T19:36:18+00:00

Oops! Played a our first couple of games recently and we continued with the zombie movement after each new zombie placed. Pretty much won the game for those well placed to infect,place, move, infect, place, move, infe...damn! I thought the games were short. NEED to play again soon to rectify.

Thread: Re: A few questions that came up

sdonohue — 2008-11-22T19:02:05+00:00

PMMJ wrote:
1.) My zombie moves one, then captures and infects a human. Bam, new zombie. Can my new zombie use the rest of my movement for the turn? (I think so.)
No he can't. The turn order is specifically Move, then Capture/Combat. Once you start fighting, there's no more moving for the zombies.

PMMJ wrote:
2.) My zombie captures a human, the human tries to wound me and fails. Do I then get to draw capture cards? Or do I just stand there in the square with the human until next turn, and try again?
He fails, you capture him. Draw the cards and hope he doesn't get an escape.

PMMJ wrote:
3.) Can you use the "Just A Flesh Wound" on a wound card that was just drawn? (Specifically, a head shot.) Or can you only use it on the ones in front of you? (i.e., ones you've already taken.)
This one I'm less certain of, but I believe the answer is that you can only play it on a wound you've already taken so it can't be played to avoid the head wound.

Thread: A few questions that came up

PMMJ — 2008-11-22T17:21:21+00:00

1.) My zombie moves one, then captures and infects a human. Bam, new zombie. Can my new zombie use the rest of my movement for the turn? (I think so.)

2.) My zombie captures a human, the human tries to wound me and fails. Do I then get to draw capture cards? Or do I just stand there in the square with the human until next turn, and try again?

3.) Can you use the "Just A Flesh Wound" on a wound card that was just drawn? (Specifically, a head shot.) Or can you only use it on the ones in front of you? (i.e., ones you've already taken.)

Thanks in advance.

Thread: Re: Goal mishap...

KerryB — 2008-11-19T02:17:00+00:00

You think that's bad...

I was showing the game to a group of 5 at Essen. The game started off tremendously slow and ground to a halt quickly as the rolls and card draws were terrible. I had never seen a session go like this. So, the group left obviously unhappy with the game.

I sat back behind the table and contemplated the game and then realized that there were 5 players and they were suppose to start with a second Zombie in play on their 2nd turn. It would have changed the entire game...

Kerry

Thread: Goal mishap...

Jonathan Ward — 2008-11-17T20:58:54+00:00

Finally got around to play Humans!!! this weekend. Lads night so plenty of time, ale and a merciful lie in the following morning. Played two games and both were great fun. The rock star zombie won both (though different players). One thing, I got the table set up and quickly explained the rules before setting off devouring hapless humans only to realise I had not explained how the game ends. I had read the Eat card and your infected zombies provide points but I could not for the life of me find anything explaining the winning conditions. Bemused, I passed the rules over in frustration departing for the loo to mull things over. On my return and to the obvious amusement of my mates the goal of the game had been found titled not surprisingly 'Winning Conditions' and put obviously at the end of the rule book.

In my defence the rules appear to stop for Humans!!! with the Humans!!! and Zombies!!! combo taking over. I just stopped reading at that point as we were not combining Zombies!!! Felt like a prune though. Friends only cackled for about 40 minutes or so. Anyhow, really good game and enjoyed by the group. It will be on the table again shortly, I suspect.

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The Jakster — 2008-11-06T02:37:12+00:00

Player Card

Thread: Re: A question and some discussion

KerryB — 2008-11-06T01:49:57+00:00

Tegyrius wrote:
Great to see the designer himself on this website. I'm impressed!

Thanks for shedding some light onto those subjects. Can't wait to play another game.

I do have a few more questions.

Does the card "Icy Road" help me even tough someone has played "They're Kind of Slow"?

Yes, it still helps you.

Tegyrius wrote:
If there are only two available spaces on my tile and I use "Breakfast, Lunch and Dinner!", is the one remaining human discarded or placed on an adjacent tile?

Only two humans are placed.

Tegyrius wrote:
The tile Insurance Agent: Does the upper right square with the checkered sign count as street or inside a building?

Yes, consider it part of the building.

Tegyrius wrote:
The tile Apartment Building: Can I walk into the alley in between the buildings without having to break a barricade?

For all buildings in this set, consider them all accessible on the same tile as if they were one building.

Let me know if you have any further questions.

Kerry

Thread: Re: What is your favorite Zombie player character?

Tegyrius — 2008-11-05T23:25:53+00:00

The cheerleader is one tough chick. With overall good stats and 5 movement points, she gets my vote.
Dr. Zombie isn't bad either. Nice special and he has the the cool-boost of being a doc gone mad

Thread: What is your favorite Zombie player character?

The Jakster — 2008-11-05T20:50:00+00:00

[poll=16727]

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The Jakster — 2008-11-05T18:36:54+00:00

Player Card

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The Jakster — 2008-11-05T18:34:37+00:00

Player Card

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The Jakster — 2008-11-05T18:30:34+00:00

Player Card

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The Jakster — 2008-11-05T18:28:28+00:00

Player Card

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The Jakster — 2008-11-05T18:26:10+00:00

Player Card

Thread: Re: A question and some discussion

Tegyrius — 2008-11-05T15:52:39+00:00

Great to see the designer himself on this website. I'm impressed!

Thanks for shedding some light onto those subjects. Can't wait to play another game.

I do have a few more questions.

Does the card "Icy Road" help me even tough someone has played "They're Kind of Slow"?

If there are only two available spaces on my tile and I use "Breakfast, Lunch and Dinner!", is the one remaining human discarded or placed on an adjacent tile?

The tile Insurance Agent: Does the upper right square with the checkered sign count as street or inside a building?

The tile Apartment Building: Can I walk into the alley in between the buildings without having to break a barricade?

Thread: Re: A question and some discussion

KerryB — 2008-11-05T12:48:05+00:00

It's intended to lower the weapon bonuses, not the hammer or switchblade. That would just be mean.

Thread: Re: A question and some discussion

The Jakster — 2008-11-05T12:17:10+00:00

Tegyrius wrote:
Hey guys

Does the shotgun inflict an automatic wound? Since the +3 modifier means you have to roll 1 or higher on the dice.

But if "No time to aim" is played, you would miss on a roll of 1.

Speaking of "No time to aim", the card says it lowers the weapon bonus by one.
Since the switchblade and the hammer have no bonus to them, you just use your die roll, the card would be useless against those 2 weapons.
Is that intended or should we just use the card as a -1 to the overall result (weapons bonus + die roll)?

Thread: Re: A question and some discussion

KerryB — 2008-11-05T10:36:06+00:00

Yes, the shotgun would inflict an automatic wound.

When playing with more people, removing the Escape cards and Eat cards helps tremendously! In a 2-3 player game it won't make much of a difference.

As far as balance, we hadn't notice an obvious unbalance in any of the characters. Keep in mind that the special abilities used early in the game helps a lot. And in all the games run at the cons, I've seen each character triumph. Honestly, the one I've seen win the most is the wrestler, and you wouldn't think that...

In a game like this, if a player starts running away with the game they have a tendency to have a target on their head. Even if the characters were slightly unbalanced, this alone would correct it.

Let me know if you have any further questions.

Take Care,

Kerry

Thread: Re: Humans!!! Questions

KerryB — 2008-11-05T10:29:48+00:00

Bernd is correct. Thanks for answering!

Kerry

Thread: A question and some discussion

Tegyrius — 2008-11-05T04:36:34+00:00

Hey guys

Does the shotgun inflict an automatic wound? Since the +3 modifier means you have to roll 1 or higher on the dice.

You remove an Escape card from the deck at times, and place Eat cards in front of you. This means that the infect deck will consist of more or less just Infect cards in the end. What's up with that? I've played the game once and we accidentaly (didnt notice these rules) played without those Escape/Eat removal functions. Seemed fine to me.

After examining the character cards I was a bit disappointed to see how unbalanced the characters were. Looks like the lawyer or cheerleader are the best while the musician is the worst one.. Any thoughts on this?

Thread: homemade player zombies

JeanPaulValley — 2008-11-03T19:05:21+00:00

I was thinking of creating other charecter cards for the following zombies:

Zombie Dog
Zombie Clown
Woman basic Zombie
Male basic Zombie
and possibly glow in the dark zombie.

Do any of you guys have ideas for what there powers might be?

Thread: Re: Humans!!! Questions

The Jakster — 2008-11-01T12:39:11+00:00

From how I read the rules I would say:

1.You don´t have to take the head shot card if only one comes up, there is nothing in the rules that hints that head shot is treated differently to other wound cards.

2.No, Do over tokens are there to reroll YOUR rolls, they never affect the rolls of other players.

3. From my understanding, with "Just a flesh wound" you can discard a wound card you have acquired. Since you never acquire a head shot, because you have to immidiately remove the last Zombie which has been in combat together with all wound cards, if you get a head shot result from your wound draw, I would say no.
I could be wrong with that.

Thread: Humans!!! Questions

DaveCole — 2008-11-01T05:12:28+00:00

1. When drawing wounds, does "head Shot" work like "escape" in the infection deck? Do you have to take it if only one pops up or does it have to be two head shots in a draw before you are forced to take it?

2. Can Do over tokens be used to force the other player to reroll an attack against you?

3. Can 'Just a Flesh Wound be used to prevent a head shot as it happens?

Thanks
Dave

Thread: Re: Anyone ready to review this one yet?

King_Custard — 2008-10-28T17:30:05+00:00

I've only played a few times, but I believe the game is quite good and I like it better than Zombies!!! The shortened game play is a plus in my book and overall, I'm happy with the purchase. The two biggest problems I have with the game are the same that others have mentioned. I doubt that the character abilities are balanced (the Cheerleader with the exact same stats and abilities as the miner, with the exception of two stats that the cheerleader has that are better than the miner - how does that make it though final review and playtesting without someone noticing/fixing) and the color choices for the zombie miniatures is disappointing (the photo in the gallery of another set shows what appears to be a lime green color, a dark green color, a flesh/neutral color, a dark brown color and a pruple color) - my set has a grey color, a darker grey color, a dark green color and a darker green color - these colors tend to blend in on a crowded board. I don't know if this is a mistake or a design decision, but I much prefer the colors of the zombies as shown in the early photos of the game in the gallery. I would pay to have them replaced. Again, nice game, and one that will most likely remain in my collection for years to come, but I think it may take some house rules/modifications to address the character abilities, and I would like to know if the other colored zombies pictured in the gallery are available.

Thread: Demo Copies to FLGS

KerryB — 2008-10-06T21:21:53+00:00

Since we sold through the first print run so quickly, we were unable to send demo copies out to the FLGS. Our next print run is due in next week, and we will have copies available for the stores. Now you can take a peek at the game at your FLGS.

Thread: Re: Anyone ready to review this one yet?

Haze01 — 2008-10-01T06:16:28+00:00

Curious if anyone shares my opinion on using decks of cards (Capture and wound decks) to resolve things? They first tried this mechanic in Zombietown and I didn't really think it added anything to that game (a die-roll could have done the same thing just as easily).

The capture deck could have been replaced, I suppose, but I think the wound deck does a good job of simulating a zombie's resilience. It makes sense that a zombie would only die when hit in the head, or become mostly useless after having taken successive hits to another area. I don't think you could have gotten that with just dice.

The capture deck does have the feature of removing escape cards and eat cards from the game if two are drawn at once, which should have the effect of speeding up the game over time, and this effect couldn't be replicated well with dice. I'm not sure if it has a big enough effect to matter, though.

Obviously, the wound deck has the same feature, but it's even less important in my mind.

The art on the cards add a bit of value, though seeing the same pictures over and over again make them kind of bland (as with the weapon cards).

Thread: Re: if infected or eaten the shotgun guy losses a life

cosmas — 2008-09-25T14:22:09+00:00

Lol,OK No worries.Thanks for the clarification.I have Another question,Really sorry to trouble you with so many questions.if the shotgun player only manage to wound the zombie player and not kill the zombie player hence they will be on the same square too?Then what will be the next move? Hope to hear from you.Thanks.

Thread: Re: if infected or eaten the shotgun guy losses a life

toddbreitenstein — 2008-09-25T13:41:52+00:00

Yeah, I'm sorry about that. My lovely and talented wife corrected me on this one. I have deleted that answer so as not to cause any further confusion.
Todd
Twilight Creations, Inc.

Thread: Re: if infected or eaten the shotgun guy losses a life

cosmas — 2008-09-24T15:35:46+00:00

Thanks for the reply.Sorry but i am getting bit confused??? cos u just said earlier that

Hi,
The shotgun guys play as normal. So, they only move back to town square when the lose ALL their life tokens.
Hope that helps,
Todd
Twilight Creations, Inc.

Thread: Re: if infected or eaten the shotgun guy losses a life

toddbreitenstein — 2008-09-24T12:26:29+00:00

Actually, once the shotgun guy takes ANY damage they are sent to "Town Square."
Hope that helps,
Todd
Twilight Creations, Inc.

Thread: Re: if infected or eaten the shotgun guy losses a life

cosmas — 2008-09-17T16:36:45+00:00

Hi Thanks for the clarification.Correct me if I am wrong is it right to say the zombie player that (infected or eaten) the shotgun guy will then be still sharing the same space with the zombie player?? Cause as I understand is that the shotgun guy only moves 1d6 away if escape card is drawn or if he is not captured.Then what will be the next move?I have Another question,if the shotgun player only manage to wound the zombie player and not kill the zombie player hence they will be on the same square too?Then what will be the next move?Really sorry to trouble you with so many questions.Gonna try playing with my friends this weekend. Hope to hear from you.Thanks.

Thread: if infected or eaten the shotgun guy losses a life

cosmas — 2008-09-16T19:41:32+00:00

I have a question to clarify.In the rule book It is said that if infected or eaten the shotgun guy losses a life. So after losing a life (whether eaten or infected) do we need to move him to town square? or we only move him to town square when he losses all his lifes?? or if he still has his lifes token he is considered as he has survived and he will be able to escape by moving 1 d6 throw? Pls help to clarify,thanks.

Thread: Re: Anyone ready to review this one yet?

RedShark92 — 2008-09-12T14:56:08+00:00

Haze01 wrote:
You bring up the production cost as justification for what I found to be unsatisfying character cards and difficult rules. I don't know how much of an issue the production cost really is to Twilight Creations, and I don't know how much of an issue a higher MSRP would have been to gamers.

I'm not sure how much one extra page would have cost. Regardless I don't think it's relevant as it should have been possible for the rules to be written more clearly within the same amount of space. I'm with you on this. As I said earlier, this has been an issue with every TCI game I've bought so at this point, I almost take it for granted, but still find it frustrating.

You mentioned that you might have preferred it if the Humans vs Zombies rules were not included in the box. I would not have. The advertisement of the ability to combine Humans with Zombies was a big factor in my decision to buy it, and I think it's important that the rules be included in the box.

I agree with you here. I think that combining the games is a huge selling point. Still, it should have been possible to have the rules written more clearly within the space provided.

Curious if anyone shares my opinion on using decks of cards (Capture and wound decks) to resolve thing? They first tried this mechanic in Zombietown and I didn't really think it added anything to that game (a die-roll could have done the same thing just as easily).

Thread: Re: Anyone ready to review this one yet?

RedShark92 — 2008-09-12T14:45:34+00:00

Haze01 wrote:
I'm thinking of writing a full review, but I'm hesitant as it would be my first and I'd like to get some more plays in before writing. I can give you my impressions so far, though.

Good enough - I've got a few plays of this under my belt, I've started writing a review, but it's not quite ready to post yet.

The text in the rulebook and the wordings on many cards could be improved or clarified.

IME, this is always a problem with TCI games.

The theme is fun to joke about and makes for good, light conversation. The miniatures, artwork, text and city tiles all work great to set the mood for horror and humour.

IME, this is a strength of the entire Zombies!!! series.

Ah, except for the do-over tokens - unlike the tokens from previous Zombies!!! sets, these are bland and don't contribute to the feel of the game. But that's quite minor.

Agreed. I've gotten to the point of using glass beads for tokens in our large Zombies!!! Games, more for ease-of-use than for aesthetics (they're easier to pick up off the board and more visible across the table). Easy enough to do here as well. In Zombies!!! we use red tokens for hearts, black for bullets. I think white or clear would be good for do-overs and maybe green for the no-Barricades (not really thematic, but I'm running out of colors!).

A small thing that irked me was the Cheerleader and the Miner characters; they have the same special ability and identical stats except for where the Cheerleader has two better stats. Regardless of if this minor boost would make a difference in balance, it seems kind of thoughtless. I'm sure they could have come up with another interesting special ability and given us something unique with the stats.

I'm a little uncertain about all of the abilities actually. The minor differences don't seem to make that much difference in in-game strategy during a game. I'm thinking of just coming up with a common set of values and using them for everyone. This will also make things more manageable if we end up combining Z!!! And H!!! Together for our large (and chaotic!) Zombie nights.

The game has a lot of charm and I'm trying to like it, but it already seems like I'm going to have a hard time getting friends and family to sit down to play it some more.

This is a possibility here, too, but maybe for different reasons. The balance actually seems to be pretty good, especially as it's very easy to just save your weapons to use on whoever's in the lead.

My main concern with it is that the whole thing seems a bit.... fiddly and cumbersome.

You make your capture attempt - if you fail the human runs away - if you suceed your opponents have a chance to arm the human. If they arm the human and it wins you take a wound and draw from the wound deck. If they don't arm the human, or if you win the fight you draw from the capture deck.

For me, this is all a little clunky. You have this whole series of if-then points and when you finally get around to resolving something it comes down to drawing two or three cards from a deck and then figuring out how to resolve it based on what you draw. It's not really difficult, but it just doesn't feel all that smooth or well designed to me.

Compare this with the simplicity of Zombies: Roll a die. 4+ you win. 1-3 either add bullets to make it a 4+ or take a wound and re-roll. I'm not suggesting that H! should have been set up exactly like this, and I don't mind a little extra complexity when it offers something real in return (even in a Beer and Pretzels game!), but here it seems like it should be possible to come up with something just as simple and fast as what's used in Z!, but with a different feel that's appropriate for playing a Zombie. I may try to work up some house rules to this effect.

Thread: Re: Humans!!! Doctor Question

Burchamj — 2008-09-11T13:20:23+00:00

Thanks for the reply

Thread: Re: Humans!!! Doctor Question

ZomCom — 2008-09-10T17:59:14+00:00

Humans can pass through humans. But, two humnas cannot end up on the same space. If the movement roll of a humna is not sufficient to get to an unoccupied space, the human is captured.

Thread: Re: Humans!!! Doctor Question

Burchamj — 2008-09-10T17:25:28+00:00

another question we came up with last night. Can humans pass through spaces with humans? Example, if we have 3 humans in 3 spaces by each other and we miss our capture, does the rule that they cant move and get captured come into play?

Thread: Re: Humans!!! Doctor Question

sdonohue — 2008-09-10T11:29:41+00:00

It starts when activated.

Thread: Humans!!! Doctor Question

Burchamj — 2008-09-10T02:05:20+00:00

Does the scalpel start at the very beginning of the game, or does it start when you "activate" it? We played it as it starts out with the ability on.

Thanks

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Zombi — 2008-09-09T06:01:39+00:00

Humans!!! Cheerleader and Miner zombies.

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Zombi — 2008-09-09T06:00:29+00:00

Humans!!! Musician and Wrestler zombies.

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Zombi — 2008-09-09T05:59:41+00:00

Humans!!! Doctor and Lawyer zombies.

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Zombi — 2008-09-09T05:56:58+00:00

Humans!!! zombie minis

Thread: Re: How many weapon cards does this expansion have in the card deck?

ZomCom — 2008-09-08T17:06:44+00:00

Yugblad wrote:
So am I right in assuming that the deck has the same backing art as all the other expansions? [Knocks on wood]

Yes, they stuck with a winning forumula. Humans!!! artwork and components are comparable and compatible to Zombies!!! It is similar in theme and shares game elements like movement and card play and a tile based board. But it is a stand alone game, not an expansion. It plays very differently than Zombies!!! Zombies!!! is checkers to Humans!!! chess. The two can be combined.

Thread: Re: How many weapon cards does this expansion have in the card deck?

Yugblad — 2008-09-07T17:04:40+00:00

So am I right in assuming that the deck has the same backing art as all the other expansions? [Knocks on wood]

Thread: Re: How many weapon cards does this expansion have in the card deck?

The Jakster — 2008-09-07T14:07:31+00:00

Yugblad wrote:
You, my friend, are a star!

Looks like I need a copy of this. I keep trying to entice my friends into another disastrous session of Tigris & Euphrates, all the while they keep mewling for more sessions of Zombies!!!

Can´t blame them...

Thread: Re: How many weapon cards does this expansion have in the card deck?

toddbreitenstein — 2008-09-07T12:49:23+00:00

Hi Mark,
Thanks for writing. I wanted to chime in as I think the new weapon mechanic in Humans!!! is very cool.

You are correct, the weapons are no longer found in specific locations. In fact, the weapon cards are played by the other players when a zombie tries to capture a human. Basically, the other players are given the opportunity to play cards for the human being captured. This really ups the player interaction level for Humans!!! It also gives it a somewhat different feel than normal Zombies!!!

Hope that helps,
Todd
Twilight Creations, Inc.

Thread: Re: How many weapon cards does this expansion have in the card deck?

Yugblad — 2008-09-06T22:12:33+00:00

You, my friend, are a star!

Looks like I need a copy of this. I keep trying to entice my friends into another disastrous session of Tigris & Euphrates, all the while they keep mewling for more sessions of Zombies!!!

Thread: Re: How many weapon cards does this expansion have in the card deck?

Michel — 2008-09-06T21:52:25+00:00

Okay - I just ceremoniously opened my deck ...

Axe: 3
Hammer: 3
Meat Cleaver: 3
Switchblade: 3
Pistol: 2
Shotgun: 2

Thread: How many weapon cards does this expansion have in the card deck?

Yugblad — 2008-09-06T21:11:49+00:00

Looking at the pictures, it seems that this set does away with the location-tied weaponry of past sets. That interests me.

So, as the title indicates, can anyone tell me how many shotguns, pistols, etc, are in the box?

Thread: Re: Tile placement, human placement, movement, and card questions.

ZomCom — 2008-09-06T08:04:38+00:00

Haze01 wrote:
The official Humans!!! FAQ was posted a few days ago. What follows are the few FAQ answers that differ from the rulings we came up with in this thread.

Kerry wrote:
How does the card "Not Fast Enough" work?
Play the card to discard a number of cards from your hand to discard that number of cards from your infection draw (from the capture deck) and redraw that number of capture cards. So, if you have a draw 3 for Infect and you draw 2 Human Escapes and 1 Eat, you can discard two cards from your event card hand to discard the 2 Human Escapes and draw two new cards from the infection deck. We thought you just toss away the capture cards you don't want and redraw them, with Not Fast Enough being the only event card to leave your hand. We also thought that, if two Escape cards were drawn, one would be taken out of the game before the effect of Not Fast Enough.

Kerry wrote:
Does "No Time To Aim" affect Switchblade or the Hammer weapons?
Since there is no bonus, then it would not affect either weapon.
We thought that No Time To Aim would affect the die rolls. We also thought the wording of the Hammer weapon did indeed imply a bonus - a "+0" bonus.

While working on my questions to send to them, I've realised we may have misinterpreted what "your current tile" means, as used in the text of "Breakfast, Lunch and Dinner!". We thought it meant any tile on which you have a zombie, but I'm starting to think it means the tile you just drew and played this turn. Will ask.

I thought "Not Fast Enough" worked like you did. In fact, I convinced my group it did NOT work like this official explanation. "Not Fast Enough" is already a potent card. It’s only going to be played after the player has replenished his hand so the player will always have two choices of cards in his hand to discard to get rid of one (or two) Escape cards. That’s not a difficult choice; Infectin fo Eating humans is much more valuable than holding on to any given card, IMHO. I’d often want to discard one or two cards anyway. Zombies!!! has a few cards that force opponents to discard, but I did not see any functional relationship between discarding event and weapon cards and discarding Infect cards. That would be the only way to discard multiple cards in the Player’s hand. I think this is a very Zombies!!!-ish ruling. Playing cards like crazy is a key feature in Zombies!!! In Humans!!! card play is much more strategic. Discarding a good card in the hopes of getting a better one is a real consideration. A few of the cards can be decisive towards the end of the game. So, anything that allows for multiple discards is a big deal.

I think I will stick to our original idea and hope no one in my group sees the FAQ.

I think your initial interpretation of “No time to aim” is correct. I usually discard “No time to aim.” It’s OK, but there are better cards. This ruling makes it slightly less functional, which is OK-ish, I guess.

I have found over the years that FAQ’s sometimes come back with odd answers. Be careful what you wish for. Fortunately, TCI’s big rule is play the game like you want to play it.

Thread: Re: Anyone ready to review this one yet?

ZomCom — 2008-09-06T07:36:36+00:00

You are right; I really am not bothered by the character cards or the rules. The cards are functional. I agree, those 6 cards could be better, but the game itself has lot’s of artistic goodness, so I’m satisfied. The rules booklet is 8 pages, double-sided. Surely a cost saver. And, mercifully brief. I’m sure there are chances to get things wrong; I know we did at first. But, I will say that while we interpreted a few rules incorrectly, the wording of the rules was essentially accurate. I can’t emphasize enough that one should follow the rules as written. I’m not a rules lawyer, but we have one in my group (he is a playtester for Sony, and a very good gamer). I’m much more likely to get “creative” with game tactics, especially in the heat of battle. I tell newcomers to resist those urges until you have some games behind you. These rules tell you what you can do, not what you cannot do.

You are probably right that the rules for mixing the game with Zombies!!! need to come with Humans!!! game. I bought it as a stand alone, I wasn’t thinking of folks who bought it because they want to combine the two. No doubt TCI knows their customer base better than I do.

Thread: Re: Anyone ready to review this one yet?

Haze01 — 2008-09-05T06:56:46+00:00

Hi Mark, thanks for your reply. It seems we agree on quite a few things, but I'd like to continue to discuss some of those issues that we seem to disagree on.

You bring up the production cost as justification for what I found to be unsatisfying character cards and difficult rules. I don't know how much of an issue the production cost really is to Twilight Creations, and I don't know how much of an issue a higher MSRP would have been to gamers. Would I have been satisfied with these things if the game was cheaper? As someone who has only started buying games again, I am no judge of value. Even so, I would not have been satisfied with these things as I had certain expectations going into this purchase.

I went into Humans!!! thinking, "I've played Zombies!!! once and it had great art, with big illustrations on the cards", and was disappointed to see the character cards as they are. I thought "they've had six or seven expansions to Zombies!!! already, they've gotta be pretty good at this by now", and was dissapointed by the frustrating rules and card texts.

You mentioned that you might have preferred it if the Humans vs Zombies rules were not included in the box. I would not have. The advertisement of the ability to combine Humans with Zombies was a big factor in my decision to buy it, and I think it's important that the rules be included in the box.

Your post suggests to me that you do not consider the character cards and rulebook to be as big a detriment to the game as I do. The rules-lawyer side of me values concrete rules where confusing situations rarely happen and, when they do, examples or rulings are provided. The part of me that grew up playing CCGs values rules and card text that sticks to naming conventions and key words to avoid confusion. The artistic side of me, along with the CCG player in me, knows that the character cards are the only cards that stay in play the whole game and, therefore, should be among the very best-looking cards in the game!

... phew. I've got some more to say, about cost and price, about what could have been done to make the cards or rules nicer, about how the game's played, and my thoughts on the Wrestler, but I've stayed up way too late and will have to put that off for another day.

Thread: Re: Tile placement, human placement, movement, and card questions.

Haze01 — 2008-09-05T05:26:39+00:00

Finished the email while I was writing that post. Here's the questions I sent along, just for the sake of recording them somewhere:

1) Consider the abilities of the Cheerleader, Miner, and Doctor. Can I activate these abilities after failing a capture roll?

2) "Breakfast, Lunch and Dinner!" says to "add three humans to your current tile". Is "your current tile" the single tile you've drawn and laid on your turn, or is it any tile on which you have a zombie?

3) Considering the effect of "Breakfast, Lunch and Dinner!", what happens if my current tile does not have enough room for three additional humans? Am I simply not allowed to play the card?

4) With "Breakfast, Lunch and Dinner!", can I choose to place only one or two humans on a tile that could have supported all three?

5) Can I play "Breakfast, Lunch and Dinner!" after moving one or more zombies onto the tile? Added to this thread only: Can I play it after resolving combat?

6) Can the card "No Time to aim!" be played after seeing the result of a combat die-roll, before taking wounds?

7) How does the card "Close but no cigar!" work? More specifically, at what point (from when to when) is a human considered 'captured' as far as "Close but no cigar!" is concerned? I wouldn't like to have someone play this card after I've used my movement to land my zombies on the humans. It would be even nastier if they could play it after I've picked up the dice to roll for capture. I am curious about if it could be played after I've failed capture, but before the human moves.

8) Lets say that my opponent has managed to get a zombie on the same square as a human, and has four humans surrounding this square on each side. My opponent fails his capture roll. For human movement, a 1 is rolled. The human would have nowhere to go, and would be auto-infected, right? Could I, at this point, use "Close but no cigar!" to move the human in question or one of the surrounding humans in order to prevent this auto-infection?

9) I want to take a good look at the Stadium and Hospital tiles here. Am I right in thinking that the Stadium has one place for a barricade (top of the road) and the Hospital has three (each side of the road)?

10) Do the event cards (weapons, etc.) get reshuffled after all have been drawn?

11) If a human successfully destroys a zombie in combat, do they still have to perform the 'human movement' phase?

12) Furthermore, if they have to move after destroying a zombie, but are otherwise surrounded, would they be automatically infected? Edit for this thread: or can they stay put on the safe square as though it was a movement of zero?

13) Can we get some more clarification on how the automatic infection rule works? Discussion on BGG has turned up three different situations where automatic infection would take place, and our rulings are as follows:
1)The human has nowhere to run. Do not roll to capture, the human is auto-captured. Opponents can play weapon cards. If the zombie is not de-animated (removed), the human is auto-infected.
2)The zombie fails the capture die roll, but the human does not run far enough to find an empty square. The human is now auto-captured. Opponents can play weapon cards. If the zombie is not de-animated (removed), the human is auto-infected.
3) The zombie captures the human, and the normal combat and infect procedures apply. If the human escapes but the human’s movement roll is not far enough to find an empty square, the escape fails and the human is auto-infected.
These could use some tweaking and further explanation, but they make sense to us. Do you agree with them?

Thread: Re: Tile placement, human placement, movement, and card questions.

Haze01 — 2008-09-05T05:22:14+00:00

The official Humans!!! FAQ was posted a few days ago. What follows are the few FAQ answers that differ from the rulings we came up with in this thread.

Kerry wrote:
How does the card "Not Fast Enough" work?
Play the card to discard a number of cards from your hand to discard that number of cards from your infection draw (from the capture deck) and redraw that number of capture cards. So, if you have a draw 3 for Infect and you draw 2 Human Escapes and 1 Eat, you can discard two cards from your event card hand to discard the 2 Human Escapes and draw two new cards from the infection deck. We thought you just toss away the capture cards you don't want and redraw them, with Not Fast Enough being the only event card to leave your hand. We also thought that, if two Escape cards were drawn, one would be taken out of the game before the effect of Not Fast Enough.

Kerry wrote:
Does "No Time To Aim" affect Switchblade or the Hammer weapons?
Since there is no bonus, then it would not affect either weapon.
We thought that No Time To Aim would affect the die rolls. We also thought the wording of the Hammer weapon did indeed imply a bonus - a "+0" bonus.

While working on my questions to send to them, I've realised we may have misinterpreted what "your current tile" means, as used in the text of "Breakfast, Lunch and Dinner!". We thought it meant any tile on which you have a zombie, but I'm starting to think it means the tile you just drew and played this turn. Will ask.

Thread: Re: Humans!!! Question

Burchamj — 2008-09-04T04:25:28+00:00

I was also wondering about that. Thanks for the info. I havnt heard of the book but i just checked it out on amazon.com and it looks good. It looks like its becoming a movie soon too.

Thread: Re: Anyone ready to review this one yet?

ZomCom — 2008-09-02T08:57:31+00:00

Haze01 wrote:
I'm thinking of writing a full review, but I'm hesitant as it would be my first and I'd like to get some more plays in before writing. I can give you my impressions so far, though.
My impressions of your impressions.

Haze01 wrote:
I'm disappointed with the look of the character cards. I like the artwork I've seen from the Zombies!!! series, with most cards having large pictures, but the character cards in Humans!!! only show a tiny mugshot of the character, with the rest of the card looking rather bland. That said, all the other cards are quite nice.
There is a lot of info on the character cards that takes up most of the card. A larger, thicker card would have been nice, but probably cost prohibative.

Haze01 wrote:
The text in the rulebook and the wordings on many cards could be improved or clarified. Confusion can result from instances where they refer to one thing by two different names or from some vague wordings that seem open to interpretation. Some important rules, ones that may be familiar to Zombies!!! players, have been left out of the rulebook. Oh, I do like their approach to the rulebook, though - it's nice to know I can go online and print out an identical copy, should I need it (I happened to do just this when I borrowed a friend's copy of Zombies!!!).
The rules could be clearer, but they would be longer. Another cost measure. Also, 1 1/2 pages out of 4 are dedicated to combining Humans!!! and Zombies!!! I think I would have preferred those rules come from the website, and more pages be dedicated to Humans!!! Still, the rules aren't bad, especially if you don't read too much into them as we did at first. The Zombie!!! rules help close some holes, and they are available for download on the website.

Haze01 wrote:
The theme is fun to joke about and makes for good, light conversation. The miniatures, artwork, text and city tiles all work great to set the mood for horror and humour. Ah, except for the do-over tokens - unlike the tokens from previous Zombies!!! sets, these are bland and don't contribute to the feel of the game. But that's quite minor.
The do overs are odd looking. They convey no cheesy zombie movie feel, like everything else. The rest is really nice. The zombie figs come in 6 colors, but two are grey and darker grey. A little more variety there would have been nice. Love the humans, love the way they are posed to run.

Haze01 wrote:
A small thing that irked me was the Cheerleader and the Miner characters; they have the same special ability and identical stats except for where the Cheerleader has two better stats. Regardless of if this minor boost would make a difference in balance, it seems kind of thoughtless. I'm sure they could have come up with another interesting special ability and given us something unique with the stats.
Something we noticed off the bat, too. Probably makes no real difference as many things influence the game. The stats and abilities do roughly follow the archetypes, but should be more varied and balanced. No biggie, though.

Haze01 wrote:
I'd like to comment on things like speed of play, balance, luck, strategy, early- mid- and end-game, but I've only been able to play five or six times so far and those with 3-4 people. I'd like more plays and would like to try some with 5-6 players. From the few games I've played, most have come down to a close race for the last point, the ending's rather anticlimactic, the choice of "eat or infect" isn't really a choice, the endgame has everyone cycling cards to try to get the best weapons, and the wrestler is difficult to play well. These things might prove to be misconceptions, or might change with different player-counts or more-experienced players.
The game does start slow, as the infection spreads. It picks up the pace mid-game, and can be a nail biter in the end game. I haven’t noticed a big difference in 5-6 player games as opposed to even 2 player games. Honestly, since the zombies have to share a movement allotment of 4 or 5, depending on type, once a player's zombies multiply, they don’t move all over the map, like in Zombies!!! In fact, a 6 player game fits nicely on the city tiles that come with the game. Because the zombies share movement, they tend to stake out a target rich (hopefully) section of the city and concentrate there. It’s not hard to get focused on your little slice of hell-in-the-city and not have a lot of interaction with others, except to screw or be screwed.

It's true, there is no real choice between Eat or Infect cards. Infect every time, as far as I can see. Infect has advantages in adding more zombies, and the only advantage I can see with Eat is you can’t loose those point if your zombie gets De-animated. That brings up another observation. Once a player gets going, it’s hard to stop him, unless you can steal his next human victims. Zombies don’t get De-animated often, maybe one a game per player. If they died more often, the game would slow down. So, kids, when it comes to Infecting so that you can add more zombies, go early, go often. Better to use those cards and abilities and do overs now to get some Infections, than to wish you had later on.

Card play in this game is an art form. In Zombies!!! playing the right card at the right time can be fun and rewarding. In Humans!!! not playing a card till you need it, and discarding good cards in the hopes of getting a better card is the trick. Towards the end, players really have to be smart about when and how they try to stop the frontrunners. Players tossing down a bunch of weapon cards is fun, but it does no good to over hammer one player while another sneaks in a grabs a victory.

I like the Wrestler, he is more of a challenge than the Doctor, whom I despise (I hate needles).

Haze01 wrote:
The game has a lot of charm and I'm trying to like it, but it already seems like I'm going to have a hard time getting friends and family to sit down to play it some more.
The game is not as varied as Zombies!!! because the tactics you use to win is the same each game. On the other hand, it is more challenging and less random than Zombies!!! I think combining the two is going to b a hoot, I have got to give it a go.

Thread: Re: Humans!!! Question

ZomCom — 2008-09-01T16:30:29+00:00

Answered by Kerry on ZombiesBG@yahoogroups.com

"The lawyer's ability is: Use when a capture is successful, the human is
automatically infected. We were trying to be cute and give homage to Stephen King's Cell. We just missed the clarification in the rules."

This would be after Capture/Combat, including weapons cards, etc. Do not draw from the Infect deck, Infection is automatic.