Game: Skat

Thread: Re: What happens when you mis-deal the cards?

David Ells — 2008-08-22T22:53:28+00:00

Amen!

Thread: Re: Mein allerlieblings Kartenspiel, spielte der tausendmal und nie wird der seinen Magie fuer mich verlieren ...

Ponton — 2008-07-31T11:52:15+00:00

I don't remember whether we played Bock or Ramsch after the events you mention, Philipp, but we always did so three games long and not 6. And just one of the types. I guess it was a "Ramschrunde" - of course with the option to announce Grand Hand if you like.

Thread: Re: What happens when you mis-deal the cards?

phlipy — 2008-07-31T09:05:01+00:00

Simple: Chop the hands of the dealer off! He won't misdeal again!

Thread: Re: Mein allerlieblings Kartenspiel, spielte der tausendmal und nie wird der seinen Magie fuer mich verlieren ...

phlipy — 2008-07-31T09:01:07+00:00

Aloha fellow skat-lovers!
Just yesterday we had a nice Skat round with some friends and I was reminded to play it more often. It's a fantastic game!

Do you play with "three Bock, three Ramsch rules" which means the next six games will be of these types? According to our houserules it occurs if
1. 'Kontra' and 'Re' are announced
or
2. 'Kontra'-anouncing party loses
or
3. 'Gespaltener Arsch' (='cleaved ass') occurs, meaning a 60-60-point outcome of a game.

Thread: Re: What happens when you mis-deal the cards?

David Ells — 2008-07-20T15:46:18+00:00

It does - thank you!

Thread: Re: What happens when you mis-deal the cards?

trapeze — 2008-07-19T17:05:08+00:00

If you play 'serious' skat, you could use the Skatordnung (the rules published by the Deutscher Skatverband). In which case:

3.2.9 If anyone receives a wrong number of cards there must be a redeal, provided that attention is drawn to it before the end of the auction, or that both parties have a wrong number of cards. (See 4.5.6)

3.2.10 No complaint about an irregularity in the shuffle, cut or deal may be entertained from a player once he has picked up his cards.

I hope this helps.

Thread: What happens when you mis-deal the cards?

David Ells — 2008-07-17T18:51:22+00:00

What happens when the dealer mis-deals the cards incorrectly, in any way, and otherwise does not follow the 3-3-3-2(Skat)-4-4-4-3-3-3 cards that are dealt to each player?

Does the dealer lose any points, and if so, how many? I've always wondered ...

--

Was passiert wenn der Ausgeber die 32 Karten falsch ausgibt, bzw. irgendwie inkorrekt oder wider / gegen die Regeln uber Ausgeben fuer Skat (3-3-3-2[Skat]-4-4-4-3-3-3) an jeden der Spieler?

Also verliert der Ausgeber doch Punkte wegen dem falschen Ausgeben? Wieviel Punkte? Ich habe mich immer gewundert ...

David

Thread: Re: Mein allerlieblings Kartenspiel, spielte der tausendmal und nie wird der seinen Magie fuer mich verlieren ...

David Ells — 2008-07-11T00:58:20+00:00

Ich auch! I also use Kontra, Re, Bock u. Hirsch. I have never heard of Spitzen, I will try that next game. Fascinating!

But you are in (northern) Germany and have no one to play with?! I'm here in California so it takes some time to find people to play, but surely there must be some Stammtisch somewhere in town. I missed playing Skat so much I went to Skat.com and downloaded a good computer version. But playing with friends is still the best.

It's funny, I take playing with Kontra, usw. for granted that I forgot that it is indeed a 'house rule' and not in the DSV Ordnungen.

David

Thread: Re: Mein allerlieblings Kartenspiel, spielte der tausendmal und nie wird der seinen Magie fuer mich verlieren ...

Ponton — 2008-07-09T10:35:13+00:00

It's also my favourite game, but unfortunately I currently have noone to play with. Our board gamers want to play designer games and not "old stuff" like skat...

We also play with various house rules. First of all, the mentioned 'Ramsch'. Also, we allow to give 'Kontra', 'Re', 'Bock' and 'Hirsch' - each of which doubles the game value. Finally, we play with 'Spitzen' that is: you announce 1 or 2 'Spitzen' before the game starts to increase your multiplier by 1 or 2 if you succeed to get the last 1 or 2 tricks with trump 7 or 7 and 8.

Thread: Mein allerlieblings Kartenspiel, spielte der tausendmal und nie wird der seinen Magie fuer mich verlieren ...

David Ells — 2008-07-09T04:34:21+00:00

I love this game so much, it's my favorite card game. I've been playing since the mid-1990's. The only quirky thing about it is the fact that there is an official Skat Association that governs the rules of play (I have no problem with this), but their rules keep changing over the years. Conversely, there are (so) many "house-rules" among each player / Stammtisch I play with that, while they are fun, it can get very chaotic trying to remember each local variation. For instance, we always play with 'Ramsch rules when no one wants to bid as challenger, but these are not (nor ever will be) accepted as official rules among the DSV (Deutsche Skatverein). But that is what makes Skat so special, so much chaos amidst an otherwise very orderly German game ...

Thread: Re: Questions.

Warbear — 2008-05-24T07:29:39+00:00

pusherman42 wrote:
Wonderful! You have been very helpful, both.

Jack

(Only a few) hints on playing Skat:

- Usually only a few games per session are played "hand".
Mostly the sole player takes the Skat and tries to improve his card hand.

- Always try to count your accumulated points and your opponents' points.

- Always count the trump cards played, and estimate which are the remaining trump cards on your opponents' hands.
There are 11 in a color game and 4 in a grand game.

- Start your game with playing trump cards to force your opponents to play theirs, if possible.
This improves your non-trump-cards.

- Be careful when bidding.
Often it's better for you when one of your opponents loses his game (loss points doubled), than to take a risky game by yourself.

- One of the common kinds to play for the opponents team: play a long color on short way, and a short color on long way.

I wish you a great time with Skat.
And thanks for your GG.

.

Thread: Re: Questions.

Ponton — 2008-05-23T21:14:48+00:00

Warbear wrote:
Ponton wrote:
Note, that playing "hand" you lose the same as you win: -44 in this case. If you do not play "hand" you lose double as much.

AFAIK this is a very old rule and no more in effect.
See: http://www.skatwelt.com/skatordnung.html
You lose double points, even if you play hand.

.

Aah, OK, see I didn't read the official rules for years. Thanks!

Oh, and thanks for the GG, Jack!

Thread: Re: Questions.

pusherman42 — 2008-05-23T20:59:33+00:00

Wonderful! You have been very helpful, both.

Jack

Thread: Re: Questions.

Warbear — 2008-05-23T20:57:26+00:00

Ponton wrote:
Note, that playing "hand" you lose the same as you win: -44 in this case. If you do not play "hand" you lose double as much.

AFAIK this is a very old rule and no more in effect.
See: http://www.skatwelt.com/skatordnung.html
You lose double points, even if you play hand.

.

Thread: Re: Questions.

Warbear — 2008-05-23T20:54:21+00:00

Ponton wrote:
But you score "schwarz" only if you get ALL tricks!

That's correct.

.

Thread: Re: Questions.

Ponton — 2008-05-23T20:46:52+00:00

Warbear wrote:
If you've taken 120 points, you've got all tricks.

That's not correct, also. Scoring 120 points does not automatically mean scoring all tricks. There might be 0 points tricks (8-8-9 and so on). But you score "schwarz" only if you get ALL tricks!

Thread: Re: Questions.

Ponton — 2008-05-23T20:45:15+00:00

Warbear wrote:
pusherman42 wrote:

- Lets say the declarer calls Spades Hand against 2 for 40 (he could assume "against 2, game 3, hand 4, times spades = 44" is that right?). What happens if he doesn't take at least 61 points? Does he lose 88 points?
44 points, if he wins.
88 points, if he loses.
But remember, when playing "Hand", he could not take the two cards (the "Skat").

That's not correct. Note, that playing "hand" you lose the same as you win: -44 in this case. If you do not play "hand" you lose double as much.

Thread: Re: Questions.

Warbear — 2008-05-23T20:44:15+00:00

pusherman42 wrote:
Thanks! Let me pose some situations and see if I'm scoring them correctly:

- I declare spades hand against 2 for 40. I get 73 card points in tricks. I score 44 (against 2, game 3, hand 4, times spades).

- I declare spades hand against 2 for 40. I take 50 card points in tricks. I lose 88 (against 2, game 3, hand 4, times spades, times 2).

- I declare spades hand with 1 for 30. I take 25 card points in tricks. I lose 88 (with 1, game 2, hand 3, schneider 4, times spades, times 2). If I had won this with 61-89 points, I score 33. If I'd won this with 90-120 points, I score 44.

- I declare hearts hand against 2 for 36. The jack of clubs is in my skat. I take 73 card points in tricks. The game is only worth 30 (with 1, game 2, hand 3, times hearts), not the 36 I bid. I lose 80. If I had taken 90-120 card points I would instead have won 40 (with 1, game 2, hand 3, schneider 4, times hearts).

If all of these are correct, I'm ready to play.

Nearly all was correct.

If you've taken 120 points, you've got all tricks.
Then you count one level more ("Schwarz" in German, don't know it in English - maybe "Black").
In your last example:
... 90-119 card points you would instead have won 40 (with 1, game 2, hand 3, schneider 4, times hearts)
... 120 card points you would instead have won 50 (with 1, game 2, hand 3, schneider 4, schwarz 5, times hearts)

.

Thread: Re: Questions.

pusherman42 — 2008-05-23T20:14:32+00:00

Thanks! Let me pose some situations and see if I'm scoring them correctly:

- I declare spades hand against 2 for 40. I get 73 card points in tricks. I score 44 (against 2, game 3, hand 4, times spades).

- I declare spades hand against 2 for 40. I take 50 card points in tricks. I lose 88 (against 2, game 3, hand 4, times spades, times 2).

- I declare spades hand with 1 for 30. I take 25 card points in tricks. I lose 88 (with 1, game 2, hand 3, schneider 4, times spades, times 2). If I had won this with 61-89 points, I score 33. If I'd won this with 90-120 points, I score 44.

- I declare hearts hand against 2 for 36. The jack of clubs is in my skat. I take 73 card points in tricks. The game is only worth 30 (with 1, game 2, hand 3, times hearts), not the 36 I bid. I lose 80. If I had taken 90-120 card points I would instead have won 40 (with 1, game 2, hand 3, schneider 4, times hearts).

If all of these are correct, I'm ready to play.

Thread: Re: Questions.

Warbear — 2008-05-23T19:53:18+00:00

pusherman42 wrote:
Fairly complicated rules, but the game looks great. Haven't tried it yet, but I've read rules in a few places and think I'm ready to try and teach the game. I do have a couple questions though.
I've been playing Skat for nearly 50 years now. I'll try to answer your questions, it's only a bit difficult for me to do it in English.

pusherman42 wrote:

- Does only the declarer score/lose points? Looks like yes, but not sure.
Yes.

pusherman42 wrote:

- Lets say the declarer calls Spades Hand against 2 for 40 (he could assume "against 2, game 3, hand 4, times spades = 44" is that right?). What happens if he doesn't take at least 61 points? Does he lose 88 points?
44 points, if he wins.
88 points, if he loses.
But remember, when playing "Hand", he could not take the two cards (the "Skat").

pusherman42 wrote:

- From these rules (http://www.pagat.com/schafk/skat.html) it says that being Schneider or Schwarz is worth a multiplier. It also says that either the declarer or the opponenets can be in Schneider or Schwarz. But if the declarer takes 30 or less card points, or no tricks, he's lost (unless it's Null), so why does it matter if it's worth a multiplier? Doesn't he just lose double points and then we move on?
Take your example above:
"against 2, game 3, hand 4, Schneider 5, times spades, = 55", and doubled when lost.

pusherman42 wrote:

- Does both Matadors with and against give you multipliers? So holding all 4 Jacks (but not the Ace) gives you "with 4" the same way as holding no Jacks (but you do have the Ace) is "against 4"? Seems like you get the same good multiplier for either a really good hand (making it easy to win) or a really crappy hand (making it much harder to win).

Yes.

pusherman42 wrote:

Guess that's all for now. Some of those questions are not phrased well, so if it doesn't make sense I can try and put up an example to illustrate what I'm asking.
Feel free to ask more ...

.

Thread: Questions.

pusherman42 — 2008-05-23T19:15:24+00:00

Fairly complicated rules, but the game looks great. Haven't tried it yet, but I've read rules in a few places and think I'm ready to try and teach the game. I do have a couple questions though.

- Does only the declarer score/lose points? Looks like yes, but not sure.

- Lets say the declarer calls Spades Hand against 2 for 40 (he could assume "against 2, game 3, hand 4, times spades = 44" is that right?). What happens if he doesn't take at least 61 points? Does he lose 88 points?

- From these rules (http://www.pagat.com/schafk/skat.html) it says that being Schneider or Schwarz is worth a multiplier. It also says that either the declarer or the opponenets can be in Schneider or Schwarz. But if the declarer takes 30 or less card points, or no tricks, he's lost (unless it's Null), so why does it matter if it's worth a multiplier? Doesn't he just lose double points and then we move on?

- Does both Matadors with and against give you multipliers? So holding all 4 Jacks (but not the Ace) gives you "with 4" the same way as holding no Jacks (but you do have the Ace) is "against 4"? Seems like you get the same good multiplier for either a really good hand (making it easy to win) or a really crappy hand (making it much harder to win).

Guess that's all for now. Some of those questions are not phrased well, so if it doesn't make sense I can try and put up an example to illustrate what I'm asking.

Thanks!

Thread: Re: My Grandparents Taught Me To Play…The Wrong Game!

rri1 — 2008-05-23T12:29:43+00:00

A few comments:

Don't be too hard on your Grandparents for not teaching you Skat--assuming they did know the game.

You didn't mention a few features that really ***DO*** confuse new players of Skat:
* You mentioned J's are part of (or solely) the trump suit, but not that they are the highest 4 trumps are always JC, JS, JH JD.
* The ranking cards in side suits is A 10 K Q 9 8 7--Pinochle players will be familiar with this ranking, but others will be confused (I beat your 10 with my King, oh sh....)
* There are null games you can choose to play that require you to take no tricks.
* In null games only, the ranking of cards is A K Q J 10 9 8 7--just to change things up.

Skat has a wide variety of house rules and local variants: Raumsches, different valuation of suits/Grand, tournee bid, etc. Skat as played in the US bears a closer resemblance to 19th Century Skat (when presumably it was brought to America by German immigrants) than to the current game in Germany.

Skat has about the most baroque set of rules I know.

Other 3 player games that work: Auction Pinochle with widow, 500, 99 (David Parlett's precision trick taking game--you are trying to predict exactly how many tricks you'll take by secretly "bidding" by discarding 3 cards.)

Thread: Re: My Grandparents Taught Me To Play…The Wrong Game!

KlausKnechtskern — 2008-05-23T08:37:47+00:00

pusherman42 wrote:
Thank you so much for this review. I've been dying for a three handed game, as three handed Euchre just always falls flat for me, and pinochle really really needs 4, as does Tichu.

After a read-through of the rules from the very nicely provided link, I think I've got the hang of it and am very excited to try it out.

I would never have found this game without your review. Thanks!

I am playing Skat now for 25 years, but still do not know how to play perfect.

Thread: Re: My Grandparents Taught Me To Play…The Wrong Game!

nhojput — 2008-05-23T03:58:53+00:00

i learned it once and thought it was a great cutthroat game but couldn't get 2 people to play it with. thanks for the review.

Thread: Re: My Grandparents Taught Me To Play…The Wrong Game!

clearclaw — 2008-05-23T02:42:16+00:00

pusherman42 wrote:
Thank you so much for this review. I've been dying for a three handed game, as three handed Euchre just always falls flat for me, and pinochle really really needs 4, as does Tichu.

Sticheln is another great 3 player card game.

Thread: Re: My Grandparents Taught Me To Play…The Wrong Game!

pusherman42 — 2008-05-23T01:44:48+00:00

Thank you so much for this review. I've been dying for a three handed game, as three handed Euchre just always falls flat for me, and pinochle really really needs 4, as does Tichu.

After a read-through of the rules from the very nicely provided link, I think I've got the hang of it and am very excited to try it out.

I would never have found this game without your review. Thanks!

Thread: My Grandparents Taught Me To Play…The Wrong Game!

da pyrate — 2008-05-23T00:55:02+00:00

[BGCOLOR=#FF0000]SKAT

]]>
Traditional German Card Game for Three Players
Designer Uncredited
Plays Using Regular Playing Cards
[/BGCOLOR]

I can remember the first games I played – Snakes & Ladders and Checkers (although in my Grandparents’ house it was called Draughts). I can remember when I became old enough to play an adult’s game – Euchre. I played many games of Euchre with my Grandparents.

Now, more than forty years later on I ask myself, “Why didn’t they teach me Skat instead?”

Don’t get me wrong – I still think that Euchre is a great game. I just remember clearly how bad Euchre is with three players – you must have four, or even six. And there were so many times that there were only the three of us there.

Why DIDN’T they teach me Skat? It is a brilliant little card game, with much in common with your Whist-based trick-tacking card games AND has the advantage that it only works with three players. For most of my life I have been under the false impression that 3-player games tend not to work at all well. As an aside, you actually can play Skat with four – the fourth player deals the cards and takes no further part in that hand. At the end of each hand the deal passes clockwise. As each hand is fairly quick to play this is almost certainly not a serious problem.

The game SEEMS very strange – it really is an excellent game and a review cannot really do justice to how nice this game really is to play.

The Game in Brief

Players are each dealt 10 cards. An auction takes place to see who gets the right to call the trump suite. Who ever wins the auction is playing to win 61+ of the available 120 points that are in the 32-card deck. The other two players are working together to try to stop the single player from winning their 61+ points.

Regardless of whether the person who calls trumps wins or not, at the end of the hand the score is calculated. The score is not directly related to the bid – this will seem strange to you and took me a little while to understand and assimilate.

Learning the Game

Things to keep in mind:
1. It is easier to have someone teach you the game rather than learn it by the rules;
2. Having been taught how to play the game I then read the rules and found that it all made sense;
3. The following link from BGG is quite good regarding the rules of the game - http://www.pagat.com/schafk/skat.html;
4. The following resource is quite useful to help with scoring - http://www.boardgamegeek.com/file/info/11982;
5. It really is a very, very easy game to play – do not be put off by the rules and the scoring (trust me, I’m a pyrate!).

Playing the Game

The game is played with a deck of 32 playing cards – 7s, 8s, 9s, 10s, Jacks, Queens, Kings and Aces.

Cards are dealt three to each player, two to the centre of the table to form the Skat, four to each player and three to each player.

The person to the dealer’s left is referred to as Forehand (F), then next player is Middlehand (M) and the last player is Rearhand ®.

After looking at their cards, ‘F’ and ‘M’ participate in an auction for the right to make the bid. The winner then takes the auction to ‘R’ to see who will make get the right to call trumps. Bidding must use only certain numbers – the numbers are related to the value of each suit but disguised in such a way that you even if you are bidding in multiples of say Diamonds, you can still call any suit trumps, not just the one you may have been bidding in.

The person who calls trumps can incorporate the Skat into their hand, but they don’t have to. If they ignore the Skat the hand will be worth more points than if they do take the two cards into their hands.

Cards are then played with players having to follow suit where possible and the largest card of the suit lead taking the trick.

At the end of the hand points are scored as follows:
Aces = 11 points
Tens = 10 points
Kings = 4 points
Queens = 3 points
Jacks = 2 points

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There are 120 points in each hand and to win you normally need 61 or more points to win the hand. If you score 90 or more you will gain bonus points.

The game is a little bit different from many other traditional trick-taking card games as the Jacks are EITHER a suit by themselves OR will be part of the trump suite. That means exactly what it says – if clubs are trumps, clubs will have 11 cards (the eight cards marked clubs PLUS the other three Jacks).

When calling a trump suit you can select any of the four traditional suites, or call Grand (which means the Jacks form a fifth separate suite), Null (you will try to lose all the tricks) or Null Overt (you will try to lose all the tricks with your cards laid out, face up, at the start of play).

Scoring

Scoring is the most complicated part of the game.

Like the rest of the game this will sound hellishly complicated, but, once you start to play (or have it explained to you) is really much simpler than it appears.

Each suite has a base value (e.g. if you called Clubs the base value will be 12). You then work out how many times this base score will be multiplied. You get one multiplier for winning the hand, you get another multiplier if you did not take the Skat, you get another multiplier for winner a Schneider (90 or more points), you get another multiplier for declaring Schneider before play commenced. You also get a number of multipliers for ‘matadors’ (i.e. the number of top-ranking jacks held, or not held, by you at the start of play).

You decide how many hands you will play and the person with the highest score at the end is the winner.

]]>
Impressions

It is a beautiful little card game and I am genuinely excited about having learnt to play it.

If you like trick-taking card games and sometimes have a three-some looking for a card-game, consider giving this one a try – it is a winner.

If the rules are not clear, see if there is a German Social Club in your area. I believe that this is the national game in Germany. Surely there must be someone there who can teach you.

“Dead Men Tell No Tales!”

Thread: Re: Where can you buy German-suited cards in the US?

peapicker — 2008-05-16T17:42:20+00:00

I just found and ordered some German decks (both German and French suited) from germanplaza.com -- looks good, located in US and prices seem ok.

Thread: Re: Skat: the what-is-this-suspicious-sounding-german-game-all-about review

Niko Ruf — 2008-02-17T10:12:48+00:00

Good review. Makes me wish I had a regular "Skatrunde" again.

Grumpf wrote:
Usually, the solo player wins.

That depends heavily on your group. I would agree that it is true for serious players in tournaments. But I have met some very "trigger happy" players as well, who would outbid me frequently when I had a strong hand.

For the non-initiated: the bidding system assigns a maximum value to each hand, which is highest if your hand is really good or really bad. This max value is also the number of points you gain if you win. But if you play a lesser game than your bid, you lose no matter what*. So you cannot bid arbitrarily high, even if you have a safe but non-spectacular hand.

* One problem facing the solo player is that he made his bid without knowing the 2 leftover cards. And they can change the max value of his hand.

Thread: Skat: the what-is-this-suspicious-sounding-german-game-all-about review

Grumpf — 2008-02-13T17:05:27+00:00

Note: I am not going to present and explain all the rules of this game in detail. You won't be able to play this game after reading this review, but you should be able to tell wether you want to give it a try or not.
Note #2: The "a" in Skat is a pronounced as in "car" and not like the a in "care"

Skat in 100 words
Skat is a trick-taking card game for three players. It is played with a standard deck of 32 cards. Before each round, a bidding system is used to determine the player who gets to play alone (facing the two other players who will form a team).
The solo player has two advantages over the team: He is allowed to look at the two remaining cards (called the skat) and can then decide which 10 cards he wants to play, putting two of his 12 cards down again. Also, the solo player gets to announce a trump color for the round.

Gameplay
Skat feels like a mixture of Wizard and Doppelkopf (Double Sheepshead). It requires heavy attention and concentration, as each player should be able to keep track of at least 8 cards - the 4 aces and the 4 jacks - throughout the course of a round. Rounds are typically short (~5 minutes) and more or less exciting - depending on wether there was a "bidding war" for beeing the solo player or not. Usually, the solo player wins.
Here in germany, Skat is a very well-known game. There are Skat clubs, leagues and tournaments, we even have an official "German Skat Association".

The bidding system
The bidding system is an outstanding mechanic that is somewhat complex. If you don't know Skat, hearing players following a typical bidding sequence like "18" - "yes" - "20" - "yes" - "2" - "no"- "null" - "yes" - "4" - "yes" - "7" - "yes" - 30 - "your game" can be really confusing (to make things worse, i included some "Skat Speak" here ). Actually, hearing such a sequence made me want to learn Skat.
In the bidding phase, each player has to decide wether his cards are good enough to play the solo part or not. Every player who thinks he can the round win against the other 2 players (you need some good/high cards to win tricks worth more than 50% of the total card point value) evaluates the value of his game (estimated amount of victory points for a win). This value depends on which jacks he has and the trump colour he would choose.
The player whith the highest game value will win the bidding. Players can increase their game value by deliberately choosing handicaps like "ouvert" (playing with cards revealed), "hand" (not using the skat) or "Schneider" (75% of total card value required to win).

After the bidding war
After determination of the solo player and announcement of the trump colour, the game plays just like other trick-taking games. Play a card, others must follow suit or else trump/discard. Highest card/trump wins, gets the trick and plays the next card.
One has to pay attention throughout the course of the game. Tactical errors can turn a would-be close victory into a devastating loss. Trying to foil the solo players plans is often in vain but fun nevertheless.

There are some variants to the basic "gather as much tricks as you can" procedure which come up over the course of the evening and add some more twists to this game:
- Instead of choosing a trump color, the solo player has the option to announce a "null" round - he wins if he manages to not win any tricks in the round. This gives players with "bad" cards a chance to win.
- If no player wants to be the solo player (maybe because everyone feels like his cards are not good enough), a "Ramsch" round starts. Everyone plays alone and there is no trump colour. After the round, each player loses an amount of victory points equal to the card value among the tricks he got. [Note: this is a common house rule not mentioned in the official rules.]

Personal opinion:
Skat is a very challenging cardgame. I would even say it is the best cardgame available for three players (If you are with four players who like cardgames, go play Tichu). It is a little too dry and mathematical for me to make it one of my favourites, but i still like to play it every once in a while. 7 out of 10

P.S: This is the first review i have ever written here Please let me know if you liked it.

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Werbaer — 2007-08-25T16:14:49+00:00

a Skat deck has card 7 to ace in 4 suits (10 being high), and the 4 jacks are the top trumps

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Werbaer — 2007-08-25T16:13:53+00:00

Loriot Skat - card sample

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Werbaer — 2007-08-25T16:13:21+00:00

Loriot Skat - cover card

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ponchera69 — 2007-07-29T00:22:03+00:00

Nice deck by Piatnik

Thread: Re: Question: how to determine game value after playing a h

Niko Ruf — 2007-06-01T14:11:05+00:00

The score is based on the jacks/matadors the solo player actually had available, regardless of whether he had them during bidding or picked them up with the skat. This is true even if he plays a "hand" game and did not look at or use the skat. And yes, this means you can lose a game although you got more than 60 points, in case you bid more than the hand's value.

Now how do you keep track of this? With practice! I.e., keeping track of matadors (and aces, and if you can, all other cards, too ) is a necessary skill for playing well. If you really can't remember (and it happens, especially if it's late and beer is involved), you need to reconstruct the game by looking at the tricks. But the default assumption is that you do remember.

Thread: Question: how to determine game value after playing a hand?

Lightstorm — 2007-06-01T13:36:29+00:00

How *do* you count the final game contract at the end of a hand? I thought I knew and posted an answer but anohter BGGer thankfully pointed out the error of my thinking. Now I'm back to square one.

At the end of a hand, when tricks are collected, how is the best way to determine the contract value? For example, if I played against the other two players, I can't simply look at the stack of cards I won during play since there may (or may not) be matadors in the stack that weren't part of the original count.

Thanks!

Thread: Re: Where can you buy German-suited cards in the US?

CortexBomb — 2007-05-31T18:18:45+00:00

Query based on the specific deck you want: i.e.: Skat, Schafkopf, Doppelkopf, &c.

Thread: Re: Where can you buy German-suited cards in the US?

MrUnicorn — 2007-05-31T15:56:57+00:00

Sprydle wrote:
now have the various card sets available on their website.

What search terms should one use to get these to come up? I'm having some trouble finding them.

Thread: Re: Where can you buy German-suited cards in the US?

Sprydle — 2007-05-30T21:57:58+00:00

I wrote to Fairplay Games to see if they could order some, since they have monthly orders to Germany already. Good news--they said yes, and now have the various card sets available on their website. My lesson learned was, it never hurts to ask

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moxtaveto — 2007-05-13T00:45:45+00:00

"Hasper" Skat pack with funny figures

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moxtaveto — 2007-05-13T00:43:23+00:00

Skat pack with French suits from Blitz (Leimen, Germany)

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moxtaveto — 2007-05-13T00:37:00+00:00

Skat pack with French suits from Piatnik Austria

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moxtaveto — 2007-05-13T00:35:59+00:00

old Skat pack with French suits from Piatnik Austria

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moxtaveto — 2007-05-13T00:35:26+00:00

old Skat pack with French suits from Altenburg Stralsunder

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moxtaveto — 2007-05-13T00:34:46+00:00

old Skat pack with French suits from Kieler Spielkartenfabrik

Thread: Re: Where can you buy German-suited cards in the US?

Roter_Baron — 2007-04-19T16:13:52+00:00

Skat is mainly played with french-suited cards. It is played in the whole north of Germany. The famous "altenburger spielkarten" are french suited cards produced in Germany. But there also German-suited ones. I have a deck called "Skat Deutsches Bild" by FX Schmid. Perhaps Google can help you.

Schafskopf, a 4-player card game, is played in southern Germany, particulary bavaria. It is always played with German-suited cards, which look a bit different.

There is a sort of peacefull animosity between the players of the two games. Reasonably speaking Skat is the choice of a 3-Player game which reguests carefull calculations while Schafskopf is a 4-Playergame, which requests more intuition (which is not neccesarily the easier thing). Schafskopf is more companionable, as you have mainly 2vs.2 games. Skat is less luck-dependant and more reasonable as a cash game. In Germany both games are considered being "skill games" not luck games, as all cards are played in each games. This means you may play for money in public. This is more a tradition in law, than the truth!

Thread: Re: Where can you buy German-suited cards in the US?

HiveGod — 2007-04-14T00:18:02+00:00

I had to order mine from... SCOTLAND?!

Thread: Where can you buy German-suited cards in the US?

mevitale — 2007-04-13T19:10:30+00:00

Pretty much just what the title says. I've found French-suited Skat cards, but I would like to get some German-suited ones. Anyone know where to get some?

Also, kind of related to this, in which areas of Germany do they play with German-suited decks?

Thanks for any help.

Thread: Re: Question about counting matadors

robartin — 2006-06-12T16:56:50+00:00

rri1 wrote:
I have only played a few times, but I assume that's something all of the players "naturally" keep track of.

Yes, since the deck is only 32 cards and there are only 3 players, it's fairly easy to remember which top trumps the declarer had in his hand.

Thread: Re: Question about counting matadors

Salt-Man Z — 2005-05-26T16:03:17+00:00

Okay, that makes sense I guess.

Thanks!

Thread: Re: Question about counting matadors

rri1 — 2005-05-26T01:41:22+00:00

Salt-Man Z wrote:
I'm trying to learn how to play Skat, and have a question about how matadors get counted when scoring.

Are they counted from the cards you've "captured" during play? Or are they based on what was in your hand when you started the game?

It is the number of top trumps in your hand, including the skat--even if you choose not look at it and play from the hand. This means if you play a game from the hand and are without matadors, you may accidentally over bid.

Example--If you are playing without 2 and the skat contains the J of clubs, your game would have one less multiplier than you expected. If clubs were trump, and simply made game you are with 1, game 2, hand 3 * 12 for 36. If you more than 36 (up to 48) because you were assuming: without 2, game 3, hand 4 * 12, you lose the game.

I've been assuming the former, but none of rules sites I've read have actually come out and stated that's the how it's done. The latter method seems impossible to keep track of, but all the rules sites refer to the matadors as being those "in your hand".

I have only played a few times, but I assume that's something all of the players "naturally" keep track of.

Also, if matadors are tallied up after all the tricks have been taken, doesn't that mean that in order to go Ouvert (or Schwarz) you'd automatically count the matador bonus as +11? (Since taking all the tricks means you'd have taken all 11 trump by hand's end -- in a Suit contract, anyway.)

Since that's not how they are calculated.....

Thread: Question about counting matadors

Salt-Man Z — 2005-05-24T22:11:04+00:00

I'm trying to learn how to play Skat, and have a question about how matadors get counted when scoring.

Are they counted from the cards you've "captured" during play? Or are they based on what was in your hand when you started the game? I've been assuming the former, but none of rules sites I've read have actually come out and stated that's the how it's done. The latter method seems impossible to keep track of, but all the rules sites refer to the matadors as being those "in your hand".

Also, if matadors are tallied up after all the tricks have been taken, doesn't that mean that in order to go Ouvert (or Schwarz) you'd automatically count the matador bonus as +11? (Since taking all the tricks means you'd have taken all 11 trump by hand's end -- in a Suit contract, anyway.)

Thanks in advance to whoever answers this.