Game: Tally Ho!

Thread: Re: That middle square...

MABBY — 2008-08-21T15:18:11+00:00

You've invented a rule.

Maybe I should move this thread to the variants forum for you?

That sounds like a valid proposal, based on what's been posted.

Eliminating all movement through the middle square definitely changes the dynamic of the game and it tends to keep the scores lower, as well.

My main comment to the designers would be this, however: If the middle square is meant to allow movement through it, why did you draw a tower on it? Why not leave it empty (grass) and put one line in the rules (which apparently is there, already) that says "leave the middle square uncovered"?
For that matter, if movement was supposed to have been discouraged, you could have drawn a fence around it, or better yet, a pond instead of a tower.

Next time out we'll give it a spin with movement & shooting allowed through the middle. It makes it fresh for us, at least.

Thread: Re: That middle square...

heli — 2008-08-20T18:22:37+00:00

Earlier versions had one more piece and it was placed in the center, which is just another space like the rest.

Thread: Re: That middle square...

Drewcooter — 2008-08-20T17:00:52+00:00

Adam is correct.

Thread: Re: That middle square...

asmiles — 2008-08-20T16:38:15+00:00

MABBY wrote:
I've owned this game for years, and have played many times to great satisfaction, but one particular rule that we use is not covered by the rulebook so I'm wondering if anyone else has the same ideas on this:

That middle square- the kind of Forest Ranger station- does not get a tile placed on it at the start, and we've found no rule to say that anyone (neither human nor beast) is allowed to pass through it or rest upon it. BUT, can a hunter shoot through it, assuming he's facing the right direction and there's an animal on the opposite side?

If the space really does represent a little hut on top of four pole-like legs then, in actual fact, you would be able to shoot a bullet through the space in the legs rather easily and hit whatever was on the other side. In fact, you'd be able to walk or stand under it, as well.

We play it so that the middle square is a solid barrier (think cabin instead of tower), though, with no movement and no shooting through it. We justify this decision by observing the rule that the hunter shoots and then moves to the same square of the animal that he has just shot (and removed). Since this would require travel trough the middle square (which we've disallowed) then it follows that you can't shoot through the middle either.

Any agreement or disagreement on this? Did I miss a rule somewhere?

The rules tell you that the middle space is left empty.
The rules tell you that you may only move through empty spaces.

You've invented a rule.

Maybe I should move this thread to the variants forum for you?

Thread: That middle square...

MABBY — 2008-08-20T16:20:29+00:00

I've owned this game for years, and have played many times to great satisfaction, but one particular rule that we use is not covered by the rulebook so I'm wondering if anyone else has the same ideas on this:

That middle square- the kind of Forest Ranger station- does not get a tile placed on it at the start, and we've found no rule to say that anyone (neither human nor beast) is allowed to pass through it or rest upon it. BUT, can a hunter shoot through it, assuming he's facing the right direction and there's an animal on the opposite side?

If the space really does represent a little hut on top of four pole-like legs then, in actual fact, you would be able to shoot a bullet through the space in the legs rather easily and hit whatever was on the other side. In fact, you'd be able to walk or stand under it, as well.

We play it so that the middle square is a solid barrier (think cabin instead of tower), though, with no movement and no shooting through it. We justify this decision by observing the rule that the hunter shoots and then moves to the same square of the animal that he has just shot (and removed). Since this would require travel trough the middle square (which we've disallowed) then it follows that you can't shoot through the middle either.

Any agreement or disagreement on this? Did I miss a rule somewhere?

Thread: Re: mOVE LIKE A rOOK?

Prestonisnormal — 2008-05-21T19:45:19+00:00

Got it. Thanks all. Sorry for the strange subject line. i didn't realize cap locks was on.

Thread: Re: mOVE LIKE A rOOK?

chaddyboy_2000 — 2008-05-21T19:08:16+00:00

Yup, the foxes and hunters (as well as ducks and pheasants) can move in a straight line as far as you'd like (provided there are no obstructions) per move. No turning is allowed during a move.

So, if you wanted to move up 3 spaces, over 2 spaces, and up another 3 spaces, it would take you 3 turns to do so.

Thread: Re: mOVE LIKE A rOOK?

qzhdad — 2008-05-21T18:53:25+00:00

They can move like a rook. A rook moves orthogonally.
Orthogonal means not diagonal.

It does mean that over several turns a fox can move as you describe, but during each turn, it can only move in a straight line, no turns allowed.

Thread: Re: mOVE LIKE A rOOK?

Verkisto — 2008-05-21T18:52:46+00:00

The game doesn't make any sense unless the pieces move like rooks. When my wife and I played it, YEARS ago, we played as you suggested, moving the pieces as far as we could, in any combination of twists and turns, so long as they weren't diagonal, and the game was over in about one minute. It only took opening a spot off the board, and then it was over.

The rules are ambiguous, but I think the intention is for the pieces to move in straight lines.

Thread: Re: mOVE LIKE A rOOK?

Drez — 2008-05-21T18:51:44+00:00

I also found the english rules to this game rather unclear. I needed to watch a few games played online before I totally understood this "orthogonal move" business. Seems that movement like a rook is correct. For example, foxes can only move in straight lines, but not turn corners on the same move.

Thread: mOVE LIKE A rOOK?

Prestonisnormal — 2008-05-21T18:44:04+00:00

I keep hearing about Foxes and Hunters being able to move like rooks. However, no where does ITay that or give an example in the English rules.

It says they can move orthagonaly as far as they want. What does that mean? Can I move a fox say, up three, to the right two and up another two and get a duck, as long as there is nothing in the way?

In other words, can a fox move anywhere on the board as long as there is a clear path of only orthogonal and right angle turns?

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Emil 109 — 2008-05-14T11:48:48+00:00

Greek Edition

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Ceryon — 2008-01-31T22:44:55+00:00

Flat german box

Thread: Re: 1st time playing with my 6 year old son

kimapesan — 2008-01-30T02:47:21+00:00

Excellent - my review spawns an actual gameplay!

Thread: 1st time playing with my 6 year old son

Larry Welborn — 2008-01-30T01:18:43+00:00

Tally Ho!is a game that I bought several years ago. I played it a lot when I first got it, but eventually it got replaced by newer games and I hadn't played it in several years. Today, I read a review of the game and it mentioned that the simple rules made it a good game to play with children. Hmmm, I thought, good point. Plus, there is enough luck in the game to help a child play competitively. So tonight, before bedtime, I asked my son if he wanted to play a new game. He, of course, wanted to play. After a few minutes of explaining the rules we were ready to start. My son chose to play the animal side.

My son picked up the game very quickly, and only had a few questions during play. He quickly learned how to move to avoid hunters and use the trees to block shots. A couple of times, he realized that he was going to get shot, but was able to eat a bird before he was shot.

Unfortunately, both bears were revealed in the sights of a hunter and were quickly killed; this proved to be the difference in the game. In the final 5 turns, my son was able to get two foxes off the board. I "accidentally" made a couple of sub-optimal moves and only got 2 hunters off the board.

In the end, the two hunters were two to many, and I won the game 55-45.

My son said he really enjoyed the game and wants to play it again.

Based on the simple rules and the luck of the initial tile placement, Tally Ho! is a game that I can recommend to play with children.

Thread: Re: One of those "diamonds in the rough" you hear about...

Pozman — 2008-01-29T20:29:41+00:00

For me this game has brought to many frustrations: hunters killing your foxes while you are looking for one of your bears in dispare, a bear closed in by trees, a bear killing all your hunters because their f***ing gun is pointing out in the wrong direction,...

It's true that when the tiles are mixed 'correctly' you can have a really tense game, with scores close together, and then you change sides and the tiles are screwed up for you

Thread: Re: One of those "diamonds in the rough" you hear about...

batdog — 2008-01-29T16:25:47+00:00

I bought this a while back but after a few games dismissed it as too luck driven. Then last year I discovered an online version with a reasonable AI at http://www.yourturnmyturn.com/java/tallyho/index.php. Soon I began to realise that there is a surprising amount of strategy to the game, particularly when forcing the endgame. So my copy has begun to hit the table more often.

Thread: Re: One of those "diamonds in the rough" you hear about...

Larry Welborn — 2008-01-29T16:07:42+00:00

Thanks for the review. This is a game that I own but haven't played in several years. I need to pull it out and try it with my children.

Thread: One of those "diamonds in the rough" you hear about...

kimapesan — 2008-01-29T13:52:08+00:00

Tally Ho! came to me by way of a trade chain on the Geek a few years ago. It's a shame I haven't reviewed it yet because it has proven to be an excellent two-player game, at once quick to play but with enough depth to make it a genuine strategy game.

I traded away my copy of the "Settlers of Catan: Card Game" to get this. At the time, I don't think anyone on the trade chain thought I was getting the better deal out of it. Repeated plays of Tally Ho! have proven this assessment wrong - this is by far one of the best "little games" I have, alongside Hive and Lord of the Rings: The Confrontation.

Gameplay

One player takes the role of the hunters & lumberjacks, the other takes the bears & foxes. Along with these are trees (which can't move but the lumberjacks can cut down) and ducks and pheasants (which either player can move, and hunters and foxes can take). All pieces are represented by tiles, which are placed face-down on the 7x7 board. Each turn, a player can either turn a tile over, which makes that piece active and moveable, or moves a piece. Bears and lumberjacks are slow (one space movement), while foxes, hunters, and the birds are fast (any number of spaces in a line).

The goal is to take as many "points" as possible. Each tile you take counts as points, although some tiles are worth few points (trees and ducks) while others provide major scores (bears, hunters, jacks, and foxes). On the human side, hunters can shoot bears and foxes as well as ducks and pheasants for points, while lumberjacks can cut down trees for points (and also make it possible for the hunters to get better positioned for taking animals). For the animals, foxes can grab the birds while the bears can eat hunters and lumberjacks. The only piece with major limitations are hunters - while they can move in any direction, they can only capture in the direction their gun is aimed, and they cannot change this direction at any time in the game.

Once all the tiles are turned over, the game ticks down to the end, with five turns left to each player. During those five turns, players may either continue capturing pieces, OR may move their own pieces off the board (through one of the four paths on the sides) - those pieces that escape will count as points for that player. Once the five turns are up, each player counts points, and the higher score wins.

Component Quality

It's hard to find any fault at all with the Kosmos version of the game components. The tiles are thick cardboard and have proven to be durable through repeated plays by young children, and the board is similarly hard to destroy. About the only thing that isn't sturdy is the plastic tray insert (for storing the tiles), which, in the grand scheme of things, is insignificant. And that's all the components there are - it's a very "unfiddly" game.

Simplicity

I really could have almost written this review without going into the gameplay; what I wrote above is just about half the length of the actual rules sheet. It's that simple a game to learn and play. This makes it an ideal game for a) game partners who aren't up for learning more than two minutes of rules, and b) young children who literally cannot yet handle complex rules sets.

Depth of Play

Yet, as simple as the game is, there is a good deal of depth to the game, and it is not merely a race to turn over random tiles.

At first, yes, you're mostly limited to turning a few tiles over and hoping to find your pieces, and not just another tree or two. But which tiles? After the first few are turned over, simply turning over any tile won't do - there are better tiles to turn than others, based on which other pieces are already in play and nearby. If you're the hunters, for example, you don't want to touch any tile next to an exposed bear - you could find a hunter, which will immediately become bear food.

Choosing to move is not a simple matter either. What players frequently forget is that they are not limited to moving their own pieces - they can also move the ducks and pheasants. Sometimes it's better to make the bird come to you, than for you to go to the bird - for example, if moving a fox into position to take a duck next turn would put you in a hunter's line of fire. Moving birds can also help pieces escape capture - putting a duck between your hunter and a bear means the bear can't get next to you (for whatever reason, bears don't bother with small meals).

As well, the game ends only when one player consciously chooses to make it end - by turning over the last tile. Up to that point, the players continue moving and capturing indefinitely. So the question is, when do you want to turn that last tile over? If you have a better move to make or a capture set up, leave the tile be. If you're ahead in points and can quickly get one or two of your pieces off the board, it's to your advantage to get the tiles turned over quickly to end the game.

Because the setup is throughly randomized, there's no danger of running out of "playability" - you can use the same strategies and tactics but they will apply to a different situation every game.

(The one and only drawback is that, on occasion, the tiles will get set up with the trees thoroughly blocking up the movement of other pieces. Easy to remedy - just agree to a restart.)

Overall

I long ago rated this an 8 and that rating still stands. This is a solid game that offers tactical depth, high replayability, and simplicity both in components and rules. No question that this will never leave my shelf in trade.

Thread: Re: Tally Ho! Where the hunters are the hunted, sometimes.

jammasterjake — 2008-01-22T00:18:53+00:00

Good review -- this is a good game to break out over a drink or TV show or something... A good game to play when you don't feel like concentrating completely on the game.

Thread: Tally Ho! Where the hunters are the hunted, sometimes.

electricvomit — 2008-01-21T15:35:04+00:00

The game in less words than this sentence.
If trees allow, hunters become the hunted.

Why I bought it:
It's a Kosmos two player. I'm now officially going after the whole Kosmos two player series. At this time I have 21 of them. As of yet, I have not played a bad one, The Reef isn't that good, but I wouldn't call it bad either. It is important to note, that I have not played the infamous Crocodile Pool Party yet.

Gameplay:
Two players square off in a Kosmos-approved hunting romp within the forest. Turns go by fast with one player either flipping over a face down tile on a grid of 49 tiles that are initially all face down, or moving one of their own type of tiles, blue for animals or red for hunters. Either player may also move a green bird tile instead of the other two options. Players may earn points through capturing the opponent's pieces. Capturing involves moving your piece onto the captured piece in a rook-like movement scheme. The types of tiles are captured in a food-chain style tree, where bears hunt hunters and lumberjacks, hunters hunt everything including bears, foxes hunt birds, and birds are only hunted. In addition, lumberjacks hunt the elusive and wild tree.

After every tile has been flipped over, a five round endgame starts, where players can score extra points by getting their pieces out the exits on the sides of the board.

What I liked:
Tally Ho provides an at times luck-heavy, but fun playing experience. One round takes about 15 minutes with set up. Within the game there is some room for strategy, but the best move is often painfully obvious. The face down tile set up provides for a very different set-up for every play, that may make the game very unbalanced. I have played rounds where I have lost by 2 to 50 points. Also for all the tiles in the game it's not too fiddly, which my hands that function more like lobster claws when small pieces are involved appreciated.

What I disliked:
The setup of Tally Ho! is both its strength and weakness. If you don't like luck, you will hate this game. Even though I understand and accept this significant luck factor, I found myself pretty frustrated with it in a couple rounds where I was just buried by poor tile flips. I would say that the animals are more effected by this luck, if your two bears appear in a long, narrow corridor with a hunter's rifle pointed at it, you're boned. Make sure you follow the directions and play two rounds for a complete game, this will mitigate some of the luck.

Moving on from the luck, I felt that the rulebook for this game is bad. The four-page book (including cover) could use two more pages with a couple examples to make it read a little easier. Overall, I suppose the rules aren't that bad, but for such a simple game, they really bring up a lot of ambiguity.

Overall:
Tally Ho! has a welcome place in the Kosmos line. It is a unique game within the line, and will support a crowd that is younger than your average Kosmos player.

Pick this up if:
You're not allergic to luck and are looking for a light tile game that can be played by kids, but doesn't have to be.

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margaretha — 2008-01-08T19:20:10+00:00

Game play, Dutch version

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jwedel — 2007-10-26T06:37:27+00:00

Tally Ho can be deadlocked, here only one player can move

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batdog — 2007-10-07T05:36:42+00:00

Tally Ho! at YourturnMyturn.com

Thread: A Fun distraction with my Dad

Blott — 2007-07-16T17:32:57+00:00

Now that my gaming habit has escalated to an addiction I carry games with me for any situation, on the off chance that I might get a chance to play. This brought a welcome treat on Saturday.

My parents were having a garage sale to which Rikki and I had added some of our stuff. So while Rikki went to have her nails done, I stayed at my parents and helped with the sale. It was a bit rainy so the sale was very slow and we spent a lot of time indoors waiting for the next group of customers.

At one point I pulled out Tally-Ho (believe it or not, this is the only Kosmos 2-player that I own) and I asked my father if he would give it a try. He was willing to give it a shot while we had a little bit of time. He grasped the rules within just a couple minutes and we set up to start playing. Dad played the animals and I was the humans.

*Helpful tip: This game has a very useful summary page on the back of the instruction booklet. I just left this sitting next to the game board so that my Dad wouldn't need to ask when he had questions.*

Quickly I could see my Dad understanding the strategies and outsmarting me for some of the ducks and pheasants. Whenever we had to go outside and help customers, we'd talk about what our next move was going to be. Then we'd hurry back inside as soon as the customers left and get right back into the game. By the end he beat me by 7 points. Unfortunately, we didn't have time to switch roles and play again, but it still was worth taking the time for one round.

Looking back on Saturday, I have to say this time with my Dad was really special. It reminded me of days around the chess board, when my Dad taught me how to play (and would even let me win from time to time.) It made me think of the evenings when Dad would come home from a big game of Risk with his buddies, and he would still take the time to try and teach his youngest son the same game he just played with the big boys. My attention span might not have been long enough back then but if it wasn't for him helping to build my passion for games, then this Tally-Ho game might never have happened.

Here's hoping I can get some more opportunities to play one-on-one with a man who has always been one of my best friends...my Dad!

Thread: Re: Tally Ho! ...variants post

Schlupp — 2007-07-13T13:40:37+00:00

I remember the original game (Jag und Schlag), which was sold in the 1980's. I got it from the library and it was always fun.

Now, unfortunately I don't remember the rules very well, but I am pretty sure, that:

1. Both players had a bear, a woodcutter and a hunter -> at the same time. So you always had the chance to hack down trees, eat the blue/red woodcutter or shoot the blue/red bear. I don't know why they changed that?

2. You could rotate the hunter with his rifle. Using one turn, you were able to rotate him 90°.

Those were two things I noticed, which I deeply miss in this game. Unfortunately I'm not quite sure how to "fix" the games to bring it back to its old glory.

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snoozefest — 2007-05-17T19:35:52+00:00

BSW's implementation. An early effort, with grainy graphics.

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ZiggyZambo — 2007-04-05T21:00:24+00:00

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ccmonter — 2007-02-23T02:17:26+00:00

One of The Hunters

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littlekeylime — 2007-02-21T16:16:02+00:00

The greens...close up.

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littlekeylime — 2007-02-21T16:14:55+00:00

The blues and browns

Thread: Re: Bird Movement

scattered — 2006-11-20T03:04:47+00:00

The "Green Freeze" described above as a house rule is also the way Halali! is programmed on BSW.

vs vg
scattered

Thread: Re: Halali - Error in English and Italian Rules

mitnachtKAUBO-I — 2006-09-30T01:34:22+00:00

chaddyboy_2000 wrote:
Hmm, I have the English version and I think it does state the rule about not moving one of your own tiles back to the square it occupied before your previous move. I've always played that way, so I must have read it somewhere in the rules.
The RGG English rules are correct (just read them). I think the issue is with the unofficial English translation posted on BGG.

Thread: Re: Halali - Error in English and Italian Rules

chaddyboy_2000 — 2006-08-31T13:32:03+00:00

Hmm, I have the English version and I think it does state the rule about not moving one of your own tiles back to the square it occupied before your previous move. I've always played that way, so I must have read it somewhere in the rules.

Thread: Re: Bird Movement

ludopath — 2006-08-31T13:31:13+00:00

David Gardner wrote:

We play what I call the GREEN FREEZE rule -- it's our own house rule that works this way. IF your opponent has moved a certain green piece on his turn, it is "frozen" to you for your very next turn; you may not move a green piece your opponent just moved.

GREEN FREEZE.

That works for us. Let me know if this seems to work or not to work for you. I'm not claiming any expert rules knowledge of Tally Ho.
David G.

Hi David,

your "house rule" makes a lot of sense, because - surprise surprise! - it is in fact the official, correct rule of "Halali"!
(Note: I have not seen the rules of "Tally Ho".)

Even the English translation of the "Halali" rules (here on this site) gets it right this time (see my other post for its erroneous representation of another important movement rule):

"A neutral, green tile, which one player has either just moved or just turned over cannot then be immediately moved by the other player on the next turn."

Actually, getting this rule right is quite important for fluid and satisfying gameplay.

Ulrich

Thread: Halali - Error in English and Italian Rules

ludopath — 2006-08-31T13:13:56+00:00

It seems to me that there is a critical error in the English and Italian translations (here on this site) of an essential movement rule of "Halali".
(Note: I do not know what the rules of "Tally Ho" are like.)

The German original states:

"Hin- und Herziehen ist verboten. D.h., dass ein Spieler ein bewegtes Kärtchen seiner Farbe im unmittelbar folgenden eigenen Zug nicht wieder auf dasselbe Feld zurücksetzen darf, woher das Kärtchen gekommen ist."

A literal (hence clumsy) translation of this would be:
"To-ing and fro-ing is forbidden, i.e. a player may not, in his immediately following move, return a moved tile of his colour to the square where it came from."

Essentially, what it means is:
"A player may not move one of his own tiles back to the square it occupied before his previous move."

The French translation (also here on this site) represents this idea accurately:

"Les mouvements aller-retour sont interdits. C’est à dire qu’un joueur ne peut pas ramener à nouveau une même carte sur la case qu’elle occupait lors de son dernier tour. Ceci n’est valable que pour le tour juste suivant; il est ensuite libre de revenir sur cette case."

The English version (and the Italian in a similar fashion), however, reads:

"Moving in a zig-zag is not allowed, and it is not allowed to make a ‘null’ move, putting the tile back on the same space as it started."

Apart from being rather obscurely worded, this sentence is utterly redundant, since it is already previously stated in the same rules that "Tiles may only be moved in a straight line".
And of course, it is obviously something very different from the original text, the meaning of which has quite simply been lost.

This mistake does matter, as situations where the correct rule enhances gameplay are not infrequent.

So, if you
a) have hitherto played without the correct rule, and
b) have for some reason stopped playing (or enjoying) this *great* little game,
give it another whirl!

Ulrich

Thread: Re: Tally Ho! ...variants post

habermanm — 2006-06-13T15:45:25+00:00

I haven't tried this yet, but I don't see why it would break anything.

If you flip over a tree, and it causes an area to be completely enclosed by trees, it is dicarded.

Thread: Re: General Comment

Dirty Harry — 2006-05-13T06:37:57+00:00

Foxes can move as many spaces as possible. Hunters can move as many spaces as possible in straight lines-as can the fox.

Hunters can shoot as many spaces as long as their line of sight is not blocked by trees or other tiles. All straight lines.

Thread: Re: rules question: orthogonal movement

Rulemonger — 2005-12-16T01:46:34+00:00

And remember, it's "orthogonal", not "orthagonal".

English dictionaries should all include "orthogonal", but will likely only give the math-related definitions of the term, not the game-related one.

It is relatively "common" game jargon, but certainly not something to throw into a set of game rules without some additional definition, I agree.

And see also:
http://www.chessvariants.org/piececlopedia.dir/rook.html#voc...

Thread: Re: rules question: orthogonal movement

simonjauk — 2005-12-15T21:07:44+00:00

It's a mathematical term (mostly used with arrays) and in the case of this game means you can only move at right angles. The easiest way to explain this is that the pieces move as a rook/castle would move on a chess board.

Quite why they chose such an obscure word for a supposedly young game is beyond me.

Thread: Tally Ho with Halali rules

None-So-Pretty — 2005-11-22T22:04:09+00:00

It had been a hard start to the week so our middle school son tried to cheer me up with A GERMAN BOARDGAME. We keep the 2 player games in a special cabinet and he pulled out TH. Tally Ho was the first one we ever bought, just before Christmas 2001, I think and we hadn't played it in a year or so.

I remember when we had first read the rules we were scared we were too dim to play a German eight year old's game: orthogonal was not in the dictionary AND we took ages to realize many of the creatures could move more than one space at a time! We made up a story that night is falling at the end of the game to explain why everyone has to leave the forest and that there are two rounds, one for each day of the weekend.

Monday's game was great as I had copied the rules off the geek called English Translation of Halali (Made without reference to Tally Ho!). It clears up some of the confusion. For example, it seems that in the German, under the list that shows who can kill whom (Woodsmen cuts down trees, bears kill woodsmen and hunters, etc.), there's a note which translates to, "When killing a tile, place the attacking tile where the now-dead tile was and place the dead tile openly in front of the attacking player." We like to think the predator has to collect its kill and we make sound effects.

I beat him in the first round, then he beat me, and in the end his "bag" was a higher total than mine.

Great game, still fun.

Thread: Re: Bird Movement

David Gardner — 2005-10-23T17:09:01+00:00

I don't believe there IS a rule that adequately protects against the eternal loop created by moving a single green piece.

You are not allowed to move a green piece your opponent just moved back to the space it was on. That is true. However, if your opponent moved the green piece three squares, let us say, you could technically move it back two squares -- essentially the same move for the same purpose, but you are just moving it one square short of where it had been. By alternating the square the piece lands on, you can create an endless loop that the rules do not address.

We play what I call the GREEN FREEZE rule -- it's our own house rule that works this way. IF your opponent has moved a certain green piece on his turn, it is "frozen" to you for your very next turn; you may not move a green piece your opponent just moved.

GREEN FREEZE.

That works for us. Let me know if this seems to work or not to work for you. I'm not claiming any expert rules knowledge of Tally Ho.

David G.

Thread: Re: Tally Ho! ...variants post

GeoMan — 2005-09-02T17:00:10+00:00

bookgnome wrote:
I would tend to agree, except that in the variants A and C, you place either the player's pieces or the trees randomly, so you still never know where the lumberjacks are.

But you still know were all the trees are if you place them face-up, while in the basic game you don't. That's still an advantage (although a small one and if you play the best of 2 games it evens out...)

Thread: Re: Bird Movement

crazyjack — 2005-09-02T13:33:27+00:00

If I remember correctly, the rules state that you can not reverse a move by moving a tile back to the space it occupied the turn before. If that is the only space available to move the bird, you would need to wait a turn to move it back out of your way. Hope this helps...

Thread: Re: Tally Ho! ...variants post

gironha — 2005-09-02T01:00:40+00:00

GeoMan wrote:
Placing the trees face-up gives an advantage to the player with the woodcutters...

Haven't tried the variant and I don't know if I will, but... Since a complete game is each player playing each side one time, the advantage should even out.

Thread: Bird Movement

theredwagoneer — 2005-09-02T00:31:11+00:00

I really like this game, but I'm confused about the movement of the ducks and pheasants.

People talk about moving ducks and pheasants to block opponent, but if your opponent moves a duck in front of you, can't you just move it back?

The rules say that you can't move a bird your oppenent flipped, but it doesn't seem to prohibit moving birds he moved.

Can someone help me?
Thanks

Thread: Re: Tally Ho! ...variants post

bookgnome — 2005-09-01T22:29:14+00:00

I would tend to agree, except that in the variants A and C, you place either the player's pieces or the trees randomly, so you still never know where the lumberjacks are, and there are only 2 of them. Otherwise, B would be a good variant to play with a kid that has a hard time losing, until he gets better at the game.

I kind of view Tally Ho as a great 'gateway' game for kids, getting them used to mechanics of flipping tiles and moving pieces. The age range on the box says 8-up, but I would tend to place it at 7-12, except for parents.

Thread: Re: Tally Ho! ...variants post

GeoMan — 2005-09-01T22:16:38+00:00

Placing the trees face-up gives an advantage to the player with the woodcutters...

Thread: Tally Ho! ...variants post

bookgnome — 2005-09-01T19:56:47+00:00

I just got "Tally Ho!" by Rudi Hoffman and love it, fun light filler, but after reading all the posts about how brutal an unlucky tile setup can be, I thought of a few easy ways to cut down on the luck.

Variant (A)
Take all the trees, turn em face up, then take turns placing them wherever you want on the board, with the brown player starting. Then, mix up the rest and place them in the remaining spaces randomly as normal.

Variant (B)
For even less luck, after you place the trees, take turns placing your own pieces face down on the board without looking at the orientation, then fill in the gaps with the birds.

Variant (C)
Or, with brown starting, alternate placing all your own pieces face down first without looking at the orientation of hunters, then mix up the trees and birds and place all those face-down randomly in the remaining spaces.

Here's a link to the game page:
[c]http://boardgamegeek.com/game/908[/c]

Enjoy!
--John Green

Thread: Starting placement variants to mitigate luck

bookgnome — 2005-09-01T19:52:33+00:00

I just got this and love it, fun light filler, but after reading all the posts about how brutal an unlucky tile setup can be, I thought of a few easy ways to cut down on the luck.

Variant (A)
Take all the trees, turn em face up, then take turns placing them wherever you want on the board, with the brown player starting. Then, mix up the rest and place them in the remaining spaces randomly as normal.

Variant (B)
For even less luck, after you place the trees, take turns placing your own pieces face down on the board without looking at the orientation, then fill in the gaps with the birds.

Variant (C)
Or, with brown starting, alternate placing all your own pieces face down first without looking at the orientation of hunters, then mix up the trees and birds and place all those face-down randomly in the remaining spaces.

Enjoy!
--John Green
(bookgnome)

Thread: not your average German game

Gnomekin — 2005-08-29T23:34:46+00:00

Halali! (or Tally Ho!, if you prefer the English name) was the first of the Kosmos Two Player line that I ever played, before ever trying Lost Cities or Odin’s Ravens or Zeus and Hera. Looking back, I realize that Halali! is actually one of the more unusual games in the line in many ways.

Most European games, particularly German ones, tend to have a strong balanced feeling, where the two sides are equally paired off against each other. They also have a reputation for having very thin themes. Halali!, on the other hand, is a blatantly unfair game where one side can easily be totally crushed. That’s okay, though, since it fits the theme perfectly.

In Halali!, each player takes two sides of a tug of war with the food chain. One player takes control of the blue pieces, which are the predatory animals. The other player takes control of brown pieces, which are the humans. There are also neutral pieces, which both players can use.

The game comes with a board that unfolds to show a nice, peaceful, wooded landscape, just the perfect place for a little ultra-violent, no holds bar hunting spree. There is a seven by seven grid over the top of the board. There are also several cardboard tiles, 48 of them to be exact..

The pieces are:

Foxes, controlled by the animal player. Foxes move like rooks and can capture ducks and pheasants.

Bears, also controlled by the animal player. They can only move one space up down, left and right but never diagonal. They can capture either of the human pieces but not the pheasants or the ducks.

Hunters, controlled by the human player. They also move like rooks. They can capture any kind of animal but only in the direction that their gun is pointing.

Lumberjacks, controlled by the human player. These guys also can only move one space but never diagonally. They can capture trees.

Ducks, controlled by either player. Ducks move like rooks and they can’t capture anything.

Pheasants, controlled by either player. They’re the same as ducks, only prettier and worth more points.

Trees, controlled by neither player. Um, they’re trees. They don’t move at all. And claiming to move one doesn’t count.

All of the tiles are on nice, square cardboard with pleasantly cartoony artwork. The hunters, as the earlier description hinted are carrying an Elmer Fudd style gun. The direction the gun is pointing can be difference between victory and being eaten by a bear.

You set the game up by randomly shuffling them and placing them face down on the board, one tile per square. Only the center square is going to be empty.

Yup, that’s right. Completely random and unknown setup. I don’t want to hear anyone complain about the tile layout of Settlers of Catan ever again.

On your turn, you can do one of two things. You can flip over an unflipped tile. Or, you can move a face up tile that’s legal for you to move. Hunters, by the way, will face the direction that they are flipped over in. You don’t get to orient them. There is no moving a piece back to where you just moved it from. You also cannot move a pheasant or duck that your opponent just revealed.

The game ends five rounds after the last unflipped tile is flipped over. So, after the end game kicks in, each player gets five turns.

Each piece is worth a certain number of points, with bears being worth the most and trees being worth the least. Every piece you capture, up unto the end game, are points towards you.

However, there are exit points at each of the cardinal compass points on the board. After the end game begins, you can use them. As long as there isn’t a tree on them, you can move one of your own pieces off the board through those exit points and you get the points for those pieces.

Whoever gets the most points wins.

As will come as no surprise, this can be a wildly unfair and uneven game. I have seen seventy point differences between scores. It’s usually suggested that a match consist of two games, with the players switching sides for the second game.

I have seen hunters flipped right in front of bears, to die horribly on the next turn, and I have seen both bears penned in by trees and helpless for the entire game. This is a game that plays favorites. You just don’t know who it will be until the tiles start flipping over.

If you go into it knowing that, Halali! can be a lot of fun. It’s a game where you have to play as tactically as possible because you have to assume the tile play will go against you. There is nothing like managing to pull off a win when the layout is against you. Because of the limitations in the way that both bears and hunters capture, pheasants and ducks often are more useful as a way to pen your opponent in than as points. The game also lends itself to a lot of chess-like fork and pincer moves. An experienced player will almost always have a chance. There is plenty of room for thought and good play, although there will be times when the tile layout will simply kill you.

Halali! is definitely a different kind of game than most German games. It is asymmetrical, with every piece doing its own thing. It isn’t a game for everyone. If you like a lot of luck mixed with a lot of strategy, though, Halali! will be worth your time.

Thread: Re: rules question: orthogonal movement

duckweed — 2005-08-09T02:31:52+00:00

I assume diagonal movement is out? And what's the definition of "orthagonal," anyway? It's not in either of the 2 dictionaries I looked in! They could really be a bit more clear, for such a simple game.

Thread: Game 2 - Tally Ho

CharlieWonka — 2005-08-04T00:08:19+00:00

Using Nick from Shire Games method of loser chooses the next game - Jamie chose this one that hasn't seen much play recently and Jamie has never played it at all.

We go over the rules as a refresher for me and I remember that this game is either a lot like chess or one person gets very lucky.

I start with the Blue Foxes and Bears - A Bear is revealed early on and standing with his back to him was a Hunter - Munch Munch went the bear. It seems the Lumberjack standing next to his Hunter had dropped off to sleep as he got mangled in the bear hug straight afterwards. Jamie managed to chop down a few trees and shoot the odd Pheasant and duck but he was getting his Hunters in really unlucky places and couldn't stop my bear from eating them or dragging them to caves. By game end it was clear I had loads more tiles than Jamie. I scored 61 pts to Jamies 11.

It didn't get any easier for Jamie as I took the role of the Hunters. He managed to overturn a bear in the sights of my hunter which was nice to start with and when his foxes came out they were trappedwhere a little repositioning of a hunter or two in some cases dwindled the foxes number down to one by the end. My Lumberjack managed to contribute with a nice bundle of trees while Jamie had found his second bear that tore a trapped Lumberjack and Hunter apart before getting trapped in the corner by a lone Hunter. I manage to get a lot of pieces off the board in the final phase of the game and win this round as well by 81 - 40

Final Scores - 150 vs 51

Mark 2 vs 0 Jamie

Thread: Re:User Review

kimapesan — 2005-02-25T15:04:08+00:00

rochs77 (#7431),

Thanks for this review - I'm in a trade list to trade SoC card game for this game. I like the SoC card game but it never gets played - this game, I think, will, based on your description!

Thread: Session Report

mbourgeois — 2005-01-11T14:52:19+00:00

Tally Ho... finally a game that I won... at least 1 out of the 2 and with the final score coming out on my side... witness the happy dance of a mature male gamer.

In our first game with both of us being bewbies at the game Kim choose the Bears and Foxes and as a result chewed my butt something fierce. We played incorrectly for this game and the next under the improper assumption that movement meant in all eight directions when after looking 'orthagonal movement' up I found that it meant horizontal and vertical movement. She proceeded to chew my hunters up and even maul both my lumberjacks into gristly little pulp. Final score Kim 39 and Mike 32.

The second game we traded places and bless the goddess of fickle placements because she had both lumberjacks sitting right beside a hungry bear. No more lumberjacks. (burp) I also managed to take innumerable ducks and pheasants so my foxes where eating well as well. our final score was Kim 22 and Mike 49. The final tally became Kim 61 and Mike 81. The crowds went wild and the cat meowed because he was hungry and unimpressed with our gameplay.

Kim really liked this game and was more than happy to try it again. I'm that much closer to getting her to try another game down the road.

Thread: Re:Rules Questions

nello — 2004-12-17T00:15:51+00:00

unflipped tiles are not empty space
if there is an unflipped tile between an hunter and a fox..you can't shoot
the hunter can shoot from any distance(0 to the MAXIMUM OF THE BOARD)
best regards
nello

Thread: Re:rules question: orthogonal movement

GeoMan — 2004-12-16T23:32:45+00:00

astroglide (#71416),

You move only in one direction.

Thread: rules question: orthogonal movement

astroglide — 2004-12-16T23:18:52+00:00

i can't infer from the definition of the word whether or not the pieces can only be moved in ONE DIRECTION per turn. am i allowed to move 2 up, 1 right, 3 up, 1 left in 1 turn or would that have to be done in 4 separate turns?

Thread: Session Report

faqtotum — 2004-03-29T22:54:30+00:00

What other game lets you quack like a duck and growl like a bear without reason? This neat little game blends luck and skill. As the game progresses, the challenge increases as empty spaces will actually permit maneuvers and slaughter.

Both my daughters really like this game. Both insist on playing the fox/bear team; that leaves me in the ungrateful position of having to shoot at them; often at very close range. Being a bit of greenie, I reluctantly use the lumberjack when I have to. How a whole spruce can be cut in the same time as it takes to shoot a duck I don't know...

The random element of the initial part of the game can deceive one into discarding this game as frivolous. But I promise you, it gets tougher as lanes are cleared. The hunters never change their facing, so moving them in a proper shooting position can be challenging. However, it is prefectly legal to move a duck or feasant exactly in the shooting alley of a trigger-happy hunter. My girls sometimes get offended if I make too explicit slaughter sounds (my last quack of a foxed duck is macabre but oddly entertaining).

Thread: Re:Rules Questions

Henry Rhombus — 2003-12-30T05:25:10+00:00

Chad,

> A few more rule questions.
>
> 1) Are unflipped tiles considered empty spaces, or do
> unflipped tiles inhibit movement as well?

The German ("Außerdem gilt, dass die Bewegung nur in gerader Richtung und über beliebig viele, leere Felder erfolgen darf.") translates to something like, "Movement may take place only in a straight direction and over as many spaces as desired, but only if the fields are empty." (Bears and woodsmen move only one space, though, no matter how many spaces you "desire" to move them.")

> 2) Does the hunter make a capture when he just points
> at a target, or does he actually have to move on top of
> the target to make the capture? The rules say "the
> hunter's rifle is pointing at the animal and only empty
> spaces separate the two." It says nothing about the
> hunter actually moving to capture the piece, just
> pointing at it, but I'm wondering if this is correct.

In the German, under the list that shows who can kill whom (Woodsmen cuts down trees, bears kill woodsmen and hunters, etc.), there's a note which translates to, "When killing a tile, place the attacking tile where the now-dead tile was and place the dead tile openly in front of the attacking player."

I really enjoy Tally Ho/Halali. It's not deep, but the play is fast and the asymmetry is a neat aspect that few games employ. Hope this helps!