Homeworld #8 seems pretty amazing! The -1 point value seems odd, it's not like you're going to keep that world to the end - might have been interesting if it were worth decent points by itself
the Alien world looks the best to me...2 VPs, and you can produce alien goods from turn 1? Makes Alpha Centauri look downright pathetic...
I had the same reaction, but thinking about it, it'll be a sloooow start. If you Produce, Trade, you could well miss out on any Develop/Settles on turns one and two.
Doomed World seems a bit dependent on the draw, in the way that some people (not me) think New Sparta is now. I guess maybe they have an incentive for some early Explore(+5)s.
I had the same reaction, but thinking about it, it'll be a sloooow start. If you Produce, Trade, you could well miss out on any Develop/Settles on turns one and two.
Doomed World seems a bit dependent on the draw, in the way that some people (not me) think New Sparta is now. I guess maybe they have an incentive for some early Explore(+5)s.
True about Alien Factory. It depends a lot on whether Earth's Lost Colony is in the game. Then you might not have to produce, and could Explore +1/+1 on turn one giving you enough cards to leech a Develop or Settle and Produce. However, since I usually play 2p, I was thinking in terms of an Explore/Produce on the first turn then Trade/Produce on the second turn which could be very powerful.
In terms of Doomed World, it is very dependent on the initial draw. I would definitely Explore early on if I didn't get a nice 4 or 5 cost world to play in my opening hand though. Lost Species Ark World is an absolute killer with Doomed World. Not to mention, when it is not a start world, it is a cheaper Colony Ship with an Explore power. This doesn't make sense to me, why isn't it cost 2 like Colony Ship? (And don't say it's due to the negative VPs, you would never play this world without the intent to replace it).
Not to mention, when it is not a start world, it is a cheaper Colony Ship with an Explore power. This doesn't make sense to me, why isn't it cost 2 like Colony Ship? (And don't say it's due to the negative VPs, you would never play this world without the intent to replace it).
I guess it is because there are two Colony Ship cards in the deck, which makes odds of drawing them a little bit higher.
Moreover you can always develop with -1 cost by choosing the appropriate action.
I guess it is because there are two Colony Ship cards in the deck, which makes odds of drawing them a little bit higher.
Moreover you can always develop with -1 cost by choosing the appropriate action.
Even if it is less likely you will draw Doomed World than Colony Ship, I don't like the idea of two cards in the deck with different costs that do the same thing.
It's true you can play both at the cost of 1 card if you play Develop. But if you play Settle you get to draw a card after placing, so the net effect is the same as -1 cost.
What I can say is that, except in 2p Advanced, it is impossible to Settle the Doomed World and use its power on the same turn. With Colony Ship you can use it the same turn you play it, which could explain the increased cost. (Although in 2p Advanced I would say it is clearly better than Colony Ship, since Settle/Settle is usually a superior choice to Develop/Settle).
This doesn't make sense to me, why isn't it cost 2 like Colony Ship? (And don't say it's due to the negative VPs, you would never play this world without the intent to replace it).
You could play it and not have the opportunity to replace it. Depending on the circumstances it might even be worthwhile - there are 6-cost developments to consider, and also the new VP rewards for accomplishing certain goals. So don't assume the the -1 would never come into play.
Besides...maybe the question should be why Colony Ship isn't cost 1...
Even if it is less likely you will draw Doomed World than Colony Ship, I don't like the idea of two cards in the deck with different costs that do the same thing.
It's true you can play both at the cost of 1 card if you play Develop. But if you play Settle you get to draw a card after placing, so the net effect is the same as -1 cost.
The net-effect is not the same at all if you only have one card in your hand you don't care about keeping.
Quote:
What I can say is that, except in 2p Advanced, it is impossible to Settle the Doomed World and use its power on the same turn.
Then it doesn't sound like they do the same thing, then...
Quote:
(Although in 2p Advanced I would say it is clearly better than Colony Ship, since Settle/Settle is usually a superior choice to Develop/Settle).
This ignores that Dev/Settle can be leached more easily. The Settle-Settle combo is something you'd probably have to call yourself, meaning the cost is in the flexibility of doing other things.
I don't get the alien one... Why would I choose to discard a card in order to produce in that world?
It ONLY produces if you discard.
Why then does it say "may" instead of "must"? This increases the risk of people reading the card as having an optional cost rather than making the phase optional for the card.
First question for someone with a rulebook at hand: Is production normally mandatory?
Even if it is less likely you will draw Doomed World than Colony Ship, I don't like the idea of two cards in the deck with different costs that do the same thing.
Even if both cards were cost 1 or 2, the cost would still be different:
Colony Ship requires a Develop phase and a cost in cards, then a Settle phase. Doomed World requires a Settle phase and a cost in cards, then a Settle phase.
As you can see, the bolded part will never become identical, no matter the costs.
Am I missing something or is the Ancient Race Card completly worthless? The only thing it does for you is reduces the number of cards you start with. Every other homeworld has a bonus (and usually a good one). I don't think being a Windfall world counts as much of a bonus. AC is a windfall starting world and has a great Settle bonus.
It is a windfall gene world. Not only are there lots of strategies and combos already for gene worlds but there will be more in the expansion IIRC. Also you get 4 cards for trading Genes goods from the very first turn. Four cards over three for Alpha Centauri is huge in terms of pacing and opening up even more cards you can pay for by choosing produce then trade while leeching off of settles and develops played by others. I bet when you play it you will notice a difference in cash flow over the same strategy with Alpha Centauri.
I don't get the alien one... Why would I choose to discard a card in order to produce in that world?
It ONLY produces if you discard.
Why then does it say "may" instead of "must"? This increases the risk of people reading the card as having an optional cost rather than making the phase optional for the card.
First question for someone with a rulebook at hand: Is production normally mandatory?
Because if it didn't say "may" people would ask if they could choose not to produce to save the card or if they had to discard a card every produce phase. The word "may" makes it clear that it is optional to both discard the card and produce on the world, the two of which go hand in hand.
The notion that one would voluntarily discard a card (i.e., optional cost) is rather absurd so it seems worth the risk that someone might read it that way.
For the starting world 6, the discarding only applies during the initial hand size of 4 (draw 6, keep 4) correct? I was afraid if it applied during EVERY round.
True about Alien Factory. It depends a lot on whether Earth's Lost Colony is in the game. Then you might not have to produce, and could Explore +1/+1 on turn one giving you enough cards to leech a Develop or Settle and Produce.
In practice, when both ELC and DAF are in the game, I have never seen ELC choose Produce and DAF not on the first turn. The opposite, sometimes.
Which makes sense. If you're ELC, why would you choose an action that gives you a price-2 good but gives an opponent a price-(-1+5) good?
Quote:
This doesn't make sense to me, why isn't it cost 2 like Colony Ship?
There's a theoretical answer and an empirical answer.
The theoretical answer is that (except in the Advanced 2P game) Doomed World requires at least two turns to become a big world, since there's never two Settles in a turn, and there's always some uncertainty over whether the next Settle is going to happen. Whereas Colony Ship can often come out in a single turn (when both Develop and Settle happen, and in a 5-player game this is more probable), and when that does happen, you can often play out the Colony Ship and use it without telegraphing to the other players what you're going to do next turn (if you have Doomed World or Colony Ship in your tableau, all the other players will expect you to choose Settle next turn).
The empirical answer is that Doomed World originally cost 2 when it was first devised, and after lots of playtesting, we noticed that players rarely played it, so we decreased its cost, and then players would play it more frequently. It didn't seem too cheap at 1, so we kept it there.
Revelade wrote:
For the starting world 6, the discarding only applies during the initial hand size of 4 (draw 6, keep 4) correct?
Yes. If this world isn't a starting world, it is pretty much identical to Pre-Sentient Race (from the base set).
Am I missing something or is the Ancient Race Card completly worthless? The only thing it does for you is reduces the number of cards you start with. Every other homeworld has a bonus (and usually a good one). I don't think being a Windfall world counts as much of a bonus. AC is a windfall starting world and has a great Settle bonus.
AC is worth 0 VPs. Ancient Race is worth 1. Also, there are now 2 6-cost devs that give 2VP per gene world, while there's only one for rare worlds, and it only gives 1VP for windfalls.
Tom Lehmann himself provides insight to the 1st expansion. I'll PM you about this since I doubt most people check back on image comments and there's still no way to get notifications from posts made on here.
Posted Fri Jul 11, 2008 11:47 am
