Commands & Colors: Ancients | BoardGameGeek

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: General:: Re: Storage Solutions (Europe)

mvaldeslora — Thu, 09 Jul 2009 18:21:27 +0000

Thx Brent. Have you had any issues with the unit stickers sticking to the sides of the baggies?

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: General:: Re: Storage Solutions (Europe)

Thunder — Thu, 09 Jul 2009 13:12:32 +0000

Baggies.

I use baggies and bag most of the units seperately. There are some I bag together like this:

1 Bag: Leaders, War Machines, Elephants, Chariots(Easy to sort)
1 Bag: Cavalry (Easy to sort)
1 Bag: Heavy & Medium Infantry (Easy to sort)

Then all the other units I bag seperately.

Everything fits in the original boxes but I re-sorted a couple of them. Both Roman armies are in the same box, Carthage & Barbarians are in the Barbarians box. The rules, maps, etc are in the Base Game Box.

Works pretty well, maybe not as compact as some systems, but looks good on my game shelf and those sturdy boxes have not gone to waste.

Peace

Thread: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: General:: Storage Solutions (Europe)

mvaldeslora — Thu, 09 Jul 2009 12:02:12 +0000

by mvaldeslora

I have seen the various threads (and pictures) related to the use of Plano bins for storing the units. I am familiar with Plano from when I lived in the States but I have not run across them where I now live (Athens, Greece). What do other CCA gamers in Europe use that may be similar to Plano? (or other storage solutions entirely)

Many thanks.

Mario

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: General:: Re: Scenario Editor

Caesar — Thu, 09 Jul 2009 07:34:31 +0000

by Caesar

I personally use VASSAL to create scenario maps for a couple main reasons:
- it's like a WYSIWYG editor.
- it will be immediately playable online. (to playtest it)
:D

Alessandro

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: News:: Re: Napoleonics 2010 release?

tarheel — Thu, 09 Jul 2009 00:59:36 +0000

by tarheel

My order will take only moments when I see it. Heck, I'll order two.

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: News:: Re: Napoleonics 2010 release?

ColtsFan76 — Wed, 08 Jul 2009 19:16:16 +0000

by ColtsFan76

There was a post copied over from consimworld that GMT said it should be getting on the P500 list this fall I thought. Given that it should be the fastest 0-P500 acceleration ever, that would probably translate to it coming out next year.

Thread: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: News:: Napoleonics 2010 release?

impulse — Wed, 08 Jul 2009 19:11:31 +0000

by impulse

I thought I heard or read a rumor that there will be a Command & Colors: Napoleonics...and that it will be released in the fall of next year. Is this true?

Thread: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: General:: Scenario Editor

mrtof — Wed, 08 Jul 2009 14:52:59 +0000

by mrtof

Is there a scenario editor available? Ideally WYSIWYG? Or do people use VASSAL or a similar engine?

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: General:: Re: Expansion Packs - New Units/Capabilities?

broadsword — Mon, 06 Jul 2009 18:18:06 +0000

by broadsword

The lack of a distinction between heavy formations was my only nag, given that there were so many different categories of light troops. I guess Mr Borg thought the distinctions between light troops were far more significant than those between Phalanx and Legion, say.

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: General:: Re: Expansion Packs - New Units/Capabilities?

kduke — Mon, 06 Jul 2009 12:01:58 +0000

by kduke

There is no "special" phalanx unit or formation-- the Greeks/Macedonians have "heavy infantry" or "medium infantry" which is basically like any other.

There are some scenario special rules for Romans v phalanx that highlight some disadvantages of the system.

You will find several approaches for making something "special" out of this on CCA ancients net.

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: Sessions:: Re: Crimissos River - Quick and Dirty with the Missus

Snowman — Mon, 06 Jul 2009 11:07:22 +0000

by Snowman

Awesome battle report with great pics, keep it up.

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: General:: Re: Expansion Packs - New Units/Capabilities?

mvaldeslora — Mon, 06 Jul 2009 11:00:35 +0000

by mvaldeslora

I assume that some kind of phalanx unit is introduced in Expansion Pack 1. How are the strengths and weaknesses of this unique unit modeled using the CC:A system?

Mario

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: General:: Re: questions from a m44 player

Snowman — Mon, 06 Jul 2009 10:54:57 +0000

by Snowman

I've sold M44 since I purchased CCA. It just doesn't cut the mustard compared to this classic.

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: Sessions:: Re: Crimissos River: Timoleon sent home crying

Snowman — Mon, 06 Jul 2009 10:46:44 +0000

by Snowman

Wow, a Carthaginian win. I've played four Crimissos River scenarios so far, two against an opponent and two solo. Haven't managed to get anything other than a badly mangled unit across the Crimissos River, let alone see the Carthaginians win! In every match so far, the three Syracusan light units on the right flank have managed to easily stave off any Carthaginian attempts to cross the river, leaving the four Syracusan units of heavy infantry with MC support, plenty of time to demolish Hasdrubal and his scattered lot of units.

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: General:: Re: Command card decks available

Robin — Mon, 06 Jul 2009 10:10:22 +0000

by Robin

StevenE wrote:
My only real complaint about the ArtsCow cards is that they are basically photo paper and somewhat flimsy... But they do shuffle nicely.

Put them in card protectors, and you will see that they are much more rigid - and they won't wear out.

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: General:: Re: Expansion Packs - New Units/Capabilities?

Jacovis — Sun, 05 Jul 2009 22:36:51 +0000

by Jacovis

Just a side note, Love the new Avatar KD :D Cheers!

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: Rules:: Re: Elephants vs. Elephants - Number of Dice?

kduke — Sun, 05 Jul 2009 21:31:24 +0000

by kduke

Elephants can suffer from "Rampage" and the dangers of blocking another elephant's retreat like anyone else.

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: General:: Re: Expansion Packs - New Units/Capabilities?

kduke — Sun, 05 Jul 2009 18:18:05 +0000

by kduke

The "Eastern"armies play a lot differently too. One has to realign the mind a little bit to play them successfully.

After the base game, the new units added have been horse archers, barbarian chariots... upgrades to Roman legions...camel "cavalry"... and some new special rules that are interesting (like medium infantry units with bow capability)... The upcoming expansions have cataphracts-- both horse and camel.

Wulf nailed it- the different MIX is what is really different, and it's significant.

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: General:: Re: Expansion Packs - New Units/Capabilities?

Burnham — Sun, 05 Jul 2009 15:47:59 +0000

by Burnham

Even though it's got basically the same units, the barbarian armies from Expansion #2 are quite unique and play a lot differently.

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: General:: Re: Expansion Packs - New Units/Capabilities?

Wulf Corbett — Sun, 05 Jul 2009 15:45:13 +0000

by Wulf Corbett

mvaldeslora wrote:
I am a total newbie to this game but I am enjoying it immensely. Played my first two games against myself today

Did you win? :D

Haven't bought the expansion packs yet (although I'm sure I will) and I have a question. Do these have new units with new capabilities, abilities, limitations, rules, etc?

Some, but not many. Mostly the new armies use the same units with different coloured blocks and different stickers. There are some new rules for later period Romans, chariots, etc.

But the most important thing is the different mix of units - armies with more or less stress on certain types of forces. This game takes the attitude that you should have unique blocks for each army, even though most of them have the same abilities as those of other armies. Other similar games such as Ancients I have two generic armies, and the scenarios tell you what units make up that nationality's forces.

Thread: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: General:: Expansion Packs - New Units/Capabilities?

mvaldeslora — Sun, 05 Jul 2009 15:31:08 +0000

by mvaldeslora

I am a total newbie to this game but I am enjoying it immensely. Played my first two games against myself today (Akragas) and had a lot of fun. (One Carthaginian victory; one Syracusan blowout). Haven't bought the expansion packs yet (although I'm sure I will) and I have a question. Do these have new units with new capabilities, abilities, limitations, rules, etc? Or do they consist essentially of different armies (i.e. colored blocks) of units with essentially the same designations (LI, War, HI, MI, etc.) and capabilities as those in the base game?

Many thanks.

Mario

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: Rules:: Re: Designer's Notes?

davisa — Sun, 05 Jul 2009 12:03:45 +0000

by davisa

Howdy,

On June 25th on the GMT forum at Consimworld, the following was posted by Gene Billingsley:

C&C Napoleonic????

When can we expect to see Command and Colors: Napoleonic Ed. in the P500 queue?

Dave Smith

Sorry, Dave, I missed this earlier.

Nothing concrete as yet on timing for P500 as much is still in flux, but if I had to guess right now I'd say probably a 2-4 month timeframe to see it on the P500 list would be about right.

Gene

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: Rules:: Re: Designer's Notes?

ColtsFan76 — Sun, 05 Jul 2009 10:52:04 +0000

by ColtsFan76

mvaldeslora wrote:
Thank you much. Not much mention of Ancients but it gives a flavor of his philosophy and goals (granted they are fairly obvious from the game itself...). I guess no further word on the Napoleonics since, huh?

BAttle Cry is to be reissued next year in preparation for the anniversay for the year after.

But for Napoleonics, I was assured it is under contract but won't be announced until "that company" decides to do so. Apparently the title has been under contract many times before but those companies have allowed ti to lapse without exercising their right to publish it. (I am not lawyer, so my terms might be off - but basically, many companies have had the rights and chosen not to publich - so we may have more of the same. Regardless, Richard Borg can't give any more details.)

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: Rules:: Re: Designer's Notes?

mvaldeslora — Sun, 05 Jul 2009 08:41:03 +0000

by mvaldeslora

Thank you much. Not much mention of Ancients but it gives a flavor of his philosophy and goals (granted they are fairly obvious from the game itself...). I guess no further word on the Napoleonics since, huh?

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: Rules:: Re: Designer's Notes?

ColtsFan76 — Sun, 05 Jul 2009 04:00:38 +0000

by ColtsFan76

dcorban wrote:
There is actually an article from back before the game was released. My memory is fuzzy, but they are available online... somewhere. It had the infamous mention of the Napoleonic flavor of the C&C system, which still hasn't seen the light.

I believe this is what you are looking for. (I bookmarked it, ya know)

http://www.bouldergames.com/gamenotes/gamenotes_803.htm

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: Rules:: Re: Designer's Notes?

dcorban — Sun, 05 Jul 2009 03:03:22 +0000

by dcorban

There is actually an article from back before the game was released. My memory is fuzzy, but they are available online... somewhere. It had the infamous mention of the Napoleonic flavor of the C&C system, which still hasn't seen the light.

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: Rules:: Re: Designer's Notes?

broadsword — Sat, 04 Jul 2009 23:46:31 +0000

by broadsword

Unfortunately not to my knowledge, Mario.

However, I suspect he just wanted to keep the GAME aspect of CC:A, and bring in a whole bunch of newbies into the "sport". Perhaps he thought a designer's notes would detract from the universality of his game?

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: Rules:: Re: Elephants vs. Elephants - Number of Dice?

Wulf Corbett — Sat, 04 Jul 2009 22:52:49 +0000

by Wulf Corbett

You mean after unit elimination? Yep, nothing panics an elephant quite like panicing elephants...

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: Rules:: Re: Elephants vs. Elephants - Number of Dice?

Minedog3 — Sat, 04 Jul 2009 22:51:21 +0000

by Minedog3

can elephants trample other elephants?

Thread: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: Rules:: Designer's Notes?

mvaldeslora — Sat, 04 Jul 2009 18:43:08 +0000

by mvaldeslora

Has Mr Borg published any articles or other notes discussing the design of the game?

Mario

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: Rules:: Re: Sequence of Warrior CC when charging

broadsword — Sat, 04 Jul 2009 17:11:20 +0000

by broadsword

Miguel, could you fire me an email about what you are working on? I'm very curious to see the approach you are taking in CC:A's probability analysis. I'd like to know if there is a common decision-making process that leads to more wins than not.

Kevin, by random decisions, I mean am I wasting my time trying to squeak a bit better position, a bit better sequencing, etc? Or do you learn the game to a certain level, and thereafter, it is the dice that decide who wins?

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: Rules:: Re: Sequence of Warrior CC when charging

broadsword — Sat, 04 Jul 2009 17:09:45 +0000

by broadsword

Hi, Kevin.

What I'm dying to know (if we frame it in terms of probability) is what your chances are if you make arbitrary, random moves, as opposed to deliberately losing ones. For instance, how much better at the game do I have be than, say, Miguel is, in order to be winning 80% of the games we play against each other? Can those kind of win/loss records even exist in this game? Etc, Etc, ....

By the way, if you could "crack" CC:A as a stats thesis, I'd wager the results would be very publishable, as CC:A is a laboratory in action for operations research, and economics, where you have a closed, two-market system.

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: General:: Re: Command card decks available

toddrew — Sat, 04 Jul 2009 13:00:18 +0000

by toddrew

kentreuber wrote:

Now if I only had another BattleLore deck....

Any luck contacting FFG about getting some decks for your goodwill endeavor?

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: Rules:: Re: Elephants vs. Elephants - Number of Dice?

Caesar — Fri, 03 Jul 2009 08:12:59 +0000

by Caesar

Hi Mario,
Greg and Knut did a great job answering!

I'll post here also this link to UNIT REFERENCE for further reference.
http://www.ccancients.net/Rules/Units/elephants-el.html

Alessandro

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: Rules:: Re: Elephants vs. Elephants - Number of Dice?

mvaldeslora — Fri, 03 Jul 2009 08:07:08 +0000

by mvaldeslora

Thank you very much. Great game. Really looking forward to playing. I'm thinking even my wife may become interested...

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: Rules:: Re: Sequence of Warrior CC when charging

franchi — Fri, 03 Jul 2009 07:57:04 +0000

by franchi

As Kevin said, I am currently toying around with probabilities and CCA, and believe me, over a series of games long enough the best play will lead to victory. Not over a few battles, but well, that is what probability is about! BTW, some examples, when the probabilities are analyzed, are counter-intuitive...

I had played mostly solo, and this way it is not easy to draw conclusions. But this year I have been playing with my brother over VASSAL twice a week, and in most of the games (during the post-game analysis) we identify the mistake(s) that lead to the other army's victory. At the beginning they were mostly his mistakes, but he is learning quickly!

In a few, close battles, we both played well and the dice decided the outcome. And that's why we keep playing CCA, he plays Chess at a very high-level and therefore we NEVER play Chess...
:)

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: Rules:: Re: Elephants vs. Elephants - Number of Dice?

gb1469 — Fri, 03 Jul 2009 07:35:32 +0000

by gb1469

From the rules:

When an elephant unit Battles Back after being attacked in
Close Combat it will roll the same number of dice as the unit
which made the attack on the elephant unit.

Exceptions:
Elephant against elephant - roll 3 dice.
Elephant against a leader - roll 1 die.
Elephant against a warrior unit - roll 3 dice.
Elephant against a heavy chariot unit - roll 3 dice.
Elephant against a camel unit - roll 3 dice.

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: Rules:: Re: Elephants vs. Elephants - Number of Dice?

knurt — Fri, 03 Jul 2009 07:16:17 +0000

by knurt

Living rules, page 11, elephant combat:

Elephant against elephant: roll 3 dice.

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: General:: Re: Command card decks available

StevenE — Fri, 03 Jul 2009 07:09:49 +0000

by StevenE

I went the ArtsCow rout using the custom graphics... The cards turned out ok, nice new graphics and a thicker deck... I did two custom decks (54 cards each) and then combined them so I have 108 cards instead of a 60+ card C&C deck.

My only real complaint about the ArtsCow cards is that they are basically photo paper and somewhat flimsy... But they do shuffle nicely.

I paid about $14 for both decks and shipping... It took about 8 business days for them to arrive.

Thread: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: Rules:: Elephants vs. Elephants - Number of Dice?

mvaldeslora — Fri, 03 Jul 2009 06:34:59 +0000

by mvaldeslora

Sorry if this has been discussed but I searched the forum and did not find an answer.

How many dice are rolled in an elephant vs. elephant close combat?

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: General:: Re: Subject: Blocks Upright, Blocks Flat, or Miniatures?

A_Denis — Fri, 03 Jul 2009 03:43:50 +0000

by A_Denis

Upright.

Tried flat yesterday for five minutes to see if my life would be more fulfilled, then went back to upright.
(and won the game) :D

I live a very exciting life. :shake:

For the miniature enthusiasts I found this link:
http://mikes-lead.blogspot.com/2009/06/fistful-of-ancients.h...,
I would go also for 6mm scale to get that mass effect.
thing is I'd rather be playing this game then painting its armies!
and sincerely, having painted the M44 miniatures, I am not convinced that the game is enhanced. the set-up is longer because the minis are not "thrown around", the color difference is harder to see, etc.

As someone suggested elsewhere, I am even tempted to "blockify" M44, get a bigger scale effect maybe. but that would take time away from playing C&CA...;)

Thread: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: General:: Command card decks available

kentreuber — Fri, 03 Jul 2009 03:31:02 +0000

by kentreuber

I'm going to be running C&CA (as well as all the C&C games which I'm calling "Commands & Colors Fest") at Conquest (San Francisco area) over Labor Day. I have all the expansions, so I have multiple armies and maps, but I don't have multiple command decks. It turns out that GMT will sell you extra decks. Price is $10 + $2.50 shipping. So, I bought 2 decks. Now I'm all set.

Now if I only had another BattleLore deck....

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: Rules:: Re: Sequence of Warrior CC when charging

BillJ1967 — Thu, 02 Jul 2009 22:44:25 +0000

by BillJ1967

broadsword wrote:
We'd all like to think so, but I'd love to see a real analysis about whether that's the case. Maybe when I start my PH.D. in Stats....:gulp:

It sounds like a fun dissertation project :)
On the other hand, it might not find a home in an academic journal :(
But, you could always publish your findings on BGG. I do! :D See link below [edit: for my findings on the Shogun Battle Tower behavior]:

http://www.boardgamegeek.com/filepage/40090

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: Rules:: Re: Sequence of Warrior CC when charging

kduke — Thu, 02 Jul 2009 22:42:33 +0000

by kduke

Well, I don't know about stats (Miquel is writing an article about that), but I'll wager any amount of money you care to that careful, thoughtful play will win out most of the time over bad decisions and almost all the time against "random, idiotic plays." The latter would include things like having light troops attack heavies in close combat, not using evade rules thoughtfully, playing cards at random and yadda yadda.

Yes, certainly, there is "luck" involved. Thank goodness (I don't much care for "I have strength 3, you have strength 2, so you are dead, always" games). But, while we may mutter about our card draws and curse or laugh at the die rolls, it's the THINKING that makes the game so good to play again and again.

Depending how fast they catch on, I think regular players quickly get over the "rush forward and attack with anything I can" style of play, because it's mostly a bad idea. If both players do it, anything can happen, but if one does it and the other one plays "smart," I put my money on "smart."

P.S. I don't think there's just one 'gimmick' to playing CCA, or we wouldn't keep playing it over and over. Combat sequencing is just one of the tools to use to play more effectively, but it's certainly not the only one, nor the ultimate one.

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: Rules:: Re: Sequence of Warrior CC when charging

broadsword — Thu, 02 Jul 2009 21:35:40 +0000

by broadsword

To clarify , what I mean about "decision-sensitve" is this: "Do good decisions lead you to win statistically more often than bad ones?"

We'd all like to think so, but I'd love to see a real analysis about whether that's the case. Maybe when I start my PH.D. in Stats....:gulp:

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: Rules:: Re: Sequence of Warrior CC when charging

BillJ1967 — Thu, 02 Jul 2009 15:58:22 +0000

by BillJ1967

broadsword wrote:
I remain a bit puzzled over whether the game is decision-sensitive or not. Could you win just as often as before by making random, idiotic plays?

I doubt it. As I play it, there are plenty of decisions to be made about card management, leader placement, retreat lanes, and combat order to keep my brain engaged.

On the other hand, I do recognize that if you just want to fight and roll dice, you can do that as well. In that instance, the outcome will be shaped by the balance of the scenario, the cards and the rolls of the dice.

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: Rules:: Re: Sequence of Warrior CC when charging

broadsword — Thu, 02 Jul 2009 15:37:32 +0000

by broadsword

I'm finding over time that all games boil down to some gimmick, or "schtick" that you need to master in order to play well.

In CC:A it is almost always combat sequencing (although I'm finding myself playing more and more positionally also, as I mature with the system). In DBA, it is almost all geometry, and a tiny bit of sequencing. Other games will have other schtick. It's all down to what you like. Ultimately, schtick is what we're "schtuck" with because we ain't got real armies. After all is said and done, do you like the results?

CC:A for me = good. Seems to generate incredibly variable but historically plausible results over replays. I remain a bit puzzled over whether the game is decision-sensitive or not. Could you win just as often as before by making random, idiotic plays? If so, then that's not a good sign, and the players are then deluding themselves into thinking they're actually contributing in some vital way to the outcome.

I haven't tested that theory, but I suspect it is incorrect, as the combat sequencing seems to make a huge difference in damage dished out...

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: News:: Re: 2nd Annual CC:Ancients Tournament at the UK Games Expo, Birmingham on Sunday 7th June...

TommieSL — Thu, 02 Jul 2009 13:00:37 +0000

by TommieSL

Many players expressed interest in a possible 'follow-up' tournament day later this year.

With this in mind you may want to pencil in Sunday 27th September as a possible date for a full day's gaming at the gaming club in Wigston, Leicester.

I'm not organising the day but have been asked to GM a tournament of some sorts.

If we get enough interest we may consider running concurrent C&C: Ancients / Memoir 44 competitions. There won't be enough time in the day to be able to play in both so players would have to commit to one or the other. Both will be run along the same sort of format as the Expo events.

Any interest?

I'll ask the organiser (Patrick) to post more details of venue, directions, travel details, parking etc as well as opening/closing and the cost. I believe there will be a (small) entrance fee to cover the cost of the venue and the food & drinks that will be provided.

More to follow.
Please post here or contact me direct if you would like to register an interest in attending for general gaming (details to follow) or to play in either of my planned events.

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients Expansion Pack #2: Rome and the Barbarians:: Sessions:: Re: Julius Caesar wins the day for the Romans!

Minedog3 — Thu, 02 Jul 2009 03:57:52 +0000

by Minedog3

but the Britons gave us Monty Python.. so you are convicted on your own testimony..:whistle:

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: Rules:: Re: Sequence of Warrior CC when charging

kduke — Wed, 01 Jul 2009 05:35:18 +0000

by kduke

You know you love it!

New Image for Commands & Colors: Ancients Expansion Pack #1: Greece & Eastern Kingdoms

Luftwaffe Flak — Wed, 01 Jul 2009 00:58:45 +0000

by Luftwaffe Flak

My Spartan, Commands and Colors, Grooms Cake from my wedding, one of m...

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Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients Expansion Pack #2: Rome and the Barbarians:: Sessions:: Re: Julius Caesar wins the day for the Romans!

da pyrate — Tue, 30 Jun 2009 05:21:15 +0000

by da pyrate

GeneSteeler wrote:
All right. But apart from the sanitation, the medicine, education, wine,
public order, irrigation, roads, the fresh water system, and public
health... What have the Romans ever done for us?

They gave us law and order - before the Romans came it was really dangerous walking the streets at night.

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients Expansion Pack #2: Rome and the Barbarians:: Sessions:: Re: Julius Caesar wins the day for the Romans!

GeneSteeler — Tue, 30 Jun 2009 04:33:33 +0000

by GeneSteeler

All right. But apart from the sanitation, the medicine, education, wine,
public order, irrigation, roads, the fresh water system, and public
health... What have the Romans ever done for us?

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients Expansion Pack #2: Rome and the Barbarians:: Sessions:: Re: Julius Caesar wins the day for the Romans!

da pyrate — Tue, 30 Jun 2009 02:23:45 +0000

by da pyrate

I am surprised and disappointed by your session report.

I have met you and you seemed like quite a reasonable, well balanced and likable person and yet in this report you seem to rejoice in the victory of Barbarian over Roman. You seem to writing in such a way as to indicate that you actually wanted the Romans to lose.

It is a sad day when one such as yourself writes in such a way as to show no respect for the Romans, their way of life or for their military invincibility.

"What have the Romans ever done for us?" I have heard asked. Well we all know the answer to that and you should be ashamed to think otherwise.

Thank goodness that Julius Caesar was there to save the situation.

And you should also know that the Victors are always the ones to write the history afterwards.

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: Rules:: Re: Sequence of Warrior CC when charging

sduke — Tue, 30 Jun 2009 02:18:00 +0000

by sduke

And this is the stuff that makes this game awesome!!!

this is the stuff that makes me CURSE this game.... unless I'm the one who can pull it off. :)

Session: Commands & Colors: Ancients Expansion Pack #2: Rome and the Barbarians:: Julius Caesar wins the day for the Romans!

GeneSteeler — Tue, 30 Jun 2009 01:12:18 +0000

by GeneSteeler

Julius Caesar wins the day for the Romans!

Mike (mdr003) and I had another evening of Commands & Colors: Ancients Expansion Pack #2: Rome and the Barbarians last night. Unsure how far through the scenario book we’ve gotten, we started at the rear and made our way backwards. This had us start in Britannia with the Britons trying to repulse the Romans.

This scenario was a blast with the Romans pushing hard on their right flank, crossing the river and challenging the ramparts. We traded formations back and forth, and every time the rampart was lost, the Britons repelled the Romans back.

Crossing the river and the very steep hills slowed the Romans and were major considerations in this scenario.

The Romans began to move their left flank forces into the middle as reserves and the Britons followed suit. But eventually, the battle on the Roman right flank was tied at 5 formations routed a piece, when the Britons made one last big strike eliminating two more Roman units (one trapped in the river) and the Roman army was routed!

]]>

The Romans lost two of the next three scenarios and the Barbarians were up 3-1 on the night.

Then came the scenario where the Romans were facing a massive line of Barbarian Chariots. Now, charging chariots into the Roman medium infantry seemed suicidal, so I sent my chariots in to hit the archers in front. Unable to break either unit, the Roman Medium troops came forward as the archers melted into the background.

I was a bit stuck with how to break through the Roman line, especially with being dealt the best hand ever:

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This was actually my opening dealt hand. I moved my units with a center-2 then picked my cards up again for the picture, as I thought this hand was just too funny

Well, lacking any surprises, the Romans eventually whittled down my chariots and won 6-5.

Continuing our trek backwards through time, Julius Caesar himself joined the Roman side. JC was invincible as my horse and chariots would evade, only to be set on again the following impulse. I drew JC forward then surrounded him with 4 units. The first strike whittled him down, but was destroyed by the battle-back. The next Chariot attack did minor damage but held its ground and allowed the third attack (medium horse) to finish off JC’s troops. But the wily commander evaded death, and retreated through my damaged chariots back to another unit.

With my left flank mostly depleted, JC continued to chase my horse around and with my only leader dead, led the Romans to a comfortable 6-3 victory.

The final battle again saw JC and the 10th legion fighting the Germanic Tribes. This was fine Roman planning as they out-weighed and began with terrific formation spearheaded by the 10th with JC right behind. I surged against the 10th and failed to deliver a single hit with my two units, and I was soon behind.

I sent in a few bands to attack JC, at which Mike scoffed “So, you just want to give the battle away”. Well, the first auxilla delivered a few hits and was repulsed (but not broken) and JC’s infantry were overrun. A moment of moral victory was found when JC himself died to a German sword as his legion was routed. But the victory was short lived, as the 10th continued to prove unstoppable. Twice in the battle they eliminated a full-strength Warrior unit with a single blow (and avoided the battle-back). Attacks on the 10th were futile and at the battle’s end the 10th only had received a single casualty after being attacked not less than four times.

A rally saw my right flank retake shape, but the 10th did not care how strong their opponents were, and instantly eliminated any enemy they faced.

The battle finally ended at a respectable 7-5.

So, Mike “won” the night 4-3 as the Romans. It was a great evening and I did get to stick his nose in it when I trounced him 6-0 once.

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: Rules:: Re: Sequence of Warrior CC when charging

scrub — Tue, 30 Jun 2009 00:41:47 +0000

by scrub

Umbratus wrote:
Thx :) I just realized that this awesome combat sequence reference here has a note covering this issue as well: http://boardgamegeek.com/filepage/40962

Note: Targets of Warrior combat may be eliminated or no longer adjacent when their sequence if resolved and this is legal. They do NOT have to resolve first.

There are alot of other helpful notes as well. It seems to cover the whole combat process pretty thorougly while maintaining a good overview and a clear structure.

I hope this will help us getting into the game tonight to a great deal.
Thanks to the author :)

You're welcome! :laugh:

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: Rules:: Re: Sequence of Warrior CC when charging

Goshawk — Tue, 30 Jun 2009 00:36:08 +0000

by Goshawk

kduke wrote:
Yes, picking the order of your attacks is an important part of the game, and creates some of the balance and tension, especially when mixed with the "MAY choose to ignore a flag" rule and evasion rules.

While you frequently may wish to 'soften up' a target with ranged fire fire-- trying to pick off a block and hope that it means your CC can eliminate the unit (and, thus, avoid the battle back roll against you), sometimes that back-fires. If a player realizes he is going to get hit badly by CC and your range-fire plink rolls a flag on him-- a flag he could choose to ignore-- he may just choose to NOT ignore it, retreat, and leave the CC's you set up blowing in the wind.

And this is the stuff that makes this game awesome!!!

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: Rules:: Re: Sequence of Warrior CC when charging

kduke — Mon, 29 Jun 2009 16:43:39 +0000

by kduke

Yes, picking the order of your attacks is an important part of the game, and creates some of the balance and tension, especially when mixed with the "MAY choose to ignore a flag" rule and evasion rules.

While you frequently may wish to 'soften up' a target with ranged fire fire-- trying to pick off a block and hope that it means your CC can eliminate the unit (and, thus, avoid the battle back roll against you), sometimes that back-fires. If a player realizes he is going to get hit badly by CC and your range-fire plink rolls a flag on him-- a flag he could choose to ignore-- he may just choose to NOT ignore it, retreat, and leave the CC's you set up blowing in the wind.

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: Rules:: Re: Sequence of Warrior CC when charging

Umbratus — Mon, 29 Jun 2009 16:21:02 +0000

by Umbratus

Thx :) I just realized that this awesome combat sequence reference here has a note covering this issue as well: http://boardgamegeek.com/filepage/40962

Note: Targets of Warrior combat may be eliminated or no longer adjacent when their sequence if resolved and this is legal. They do NOT have to resolve first.

There are alot of other helpful notes as well. It seems to cover the whole combat process pretty thorougly while maintaining a good overview and a clear structure.

I hope this will help us getting into the game tonight to a great deal.
Thanks to the author :)

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: Rules:: Re: Sequence of Warrior CC when charging

Typhon — Mon, 29 Jun 2009 16:03:29 +0000

by Typhon

Great question, Joel.

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: Rules:: Re: Sequence of Warrior CC when charging

ColtsFan76 — Mon, 29 Jun 2009 14:51:41 +0000

by ColtsFan76

Umbratus wrote:
Without having played this game I figured you want your ranged attack to go through first sometimes, since ranged cannot be battled back and not be evaded. So basically you could harm or even kill a unit without having to fear reprisal at all. Of course there are other tactics as well, which you point out as an example.

And most often, you will probably want to do that. However, it is your option. Just pointing out there is no order, not giving strategy tips. ;)

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: Rules:: Re: Sequence of Warrior CC when charging

Umbratus — Mon, 29 Jun 2009 14:35:55 +0000

by Umbratus

Aha, thx alot for your help brian.

Without having played this game I figured you want your ranged attack to go through first sometimes, since ranged cannot be battled back and not be evaded. So basically you could harm or even kill a unit without having to fear reprisal at all. Of course there are other tactics as well, which you point out as an example.

I guess actually playing the game will change my impressions on tactics alot :)

Nevertheless it certainly helps to know that I can use warriors charge and still not battle necessarily, as a tactic.

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: Rules:: Re: Sequence of Warrior CC when charging

ColtsFan76 — Mon, 29 Jun 2009 14:28:51 +0000

by ColtsFan76

You only have to check conditions at the time you order and move. If conditions change by the time the actual battle starts, you just leave them where they are. Nothing within the game dictates to you the order you must resolve battles. But for your own sake, you may wish to use the warriors first so the target units don't retreat from ranged attacks first.

Thread: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: Rules:: Sequence of Warrior CC when charging

Umbratus — Mon, 29 Jun 2009 13:52:44 +0000

by Umbratus

I'll be playing the first time tonight, going through the rules another time to make sure I got everything straight. I hope that I am grabbing most of the rules but now there is one thing that crossed my mind and I cannot seem to solve.

I read that movement happens first in whatever order I pick and then combat happens in whatever order I pick, also a mix of ranged combat and CC.

Now if I ordered some Warrior Infantry for a charge, move 2 hexes, then I must CC. Now I target the same and only adjacent unit to my warriors with another unit capable of ranged combat and I decide to roll them first. Now I roll a flag and that enemy unit acutally retreats. So now my warriors are without a target to do their forced CC but doing CC was a preliminary of the movement phase to be allowed to move 2 hexes at all.

So is this a valid move ? Even a common tactic ? Or is this not allowed at all, do I have to initiate CC with my warriors first ?

The same thing is thinkable with some other unit CCing the same enemy unit, so is there a special rule that forces warriors to resolve first during combat phase before they run out of targets ?

Sry if I overlooked that rule somewhere, thx for enlightening me

New Image for Commands & Colors: Ancients

jstalica — Fri, 26 Jun 2009 04:36:07 +0000

by jstalica

My glorious breakthrough shall happen HERE!

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Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: Rules:: Re: Combat sequence

Snowman — Wed, 24 Jun 2009 07:13:16 +0000

by Snowman

Thanks for the clarifications. Only had this game for a while and it has gone straight to #1 for me. As a fan of DBA this is a great alternative.

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients Expansion Pack #2: Rome and the Barbarians:: Rules:: Re: Marius Legion ranged fire

kduke — Wed, 24 Jun 2009 02:51:29 +0000

by kduke

And in cases that reduce the combat die roll-- like being inside a camp hex-- they get zero for ranged fire, standing still or not.

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: General:: Re: How many dice sets do I need?

Sylvicolus — Wed, 24 Jun 2009 00:17:07 +0000

by Sylvicolus

Heliconia wrote:

Yes I just got mine about 2 weeks ago.
As for the number of sets I would say that 1 set is fine, but each player having their own set I guess is good too.

I also got mine recently. I got 3 sets and the shipping was actually less than if I got one set!

Thanks Kevin, for that tip on indicating ordered units. I was using the dice or some beads for the more complicated ordering like lines and I am Spartacus.

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients Expansion Pack #2: Rome and the Barbarians:: Rules:: Re: Marius Legion ranged fire

angeral — Tue, 23 Jun 2009 18:21:16 +0000

by angeral

nicktaruffi wrote:
Do they always roll a SINGLE die with ranged fire?
Moving AND standing still?

yes, only one dice roll for range fire.

Thread: Commands & Colors: Ancients Expansion Pack #2: Rome and the Barbarians:: Rules:: Marius Legion ranged fire

nicktaruffi — Tue, 23 Jun 2009 18:05:48 +0000

by nicktaruffi

Do they always roll a SINGLE die with ranged fire?
Moving AND standing still?

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: General:: Re: bestbandis

russ — Tue, 23 Jun 2009 16:45:02 +0000

by russ

I've never understood why people do the "scorched earth" policy of deleting all their posts when they grow tired of BGG. It's just pointless destruction that messes up forum threads and links, and removes valuable content.

Quit visiting and posting if you don't want to be active here any more, sure... but why delete all the content that is useful and enjoyable for others? Just update your profile with a note that you're no longer active here, for pete's sake.

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: General:: Re: Equus

andreww — Tue, 23 Jun 2009 15:57:34 +0000

by andreww

Um. I think that's a ferret.

Andrew

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: Rules:: Re: Combat sequence

kduke — Tue, 23 Jun 2009 04:55:45 +0000

by kduke

Most especially when you factor in the situations (like "supported" or full strength warriors or units with an attached leader or some terrain) where the owner MAY ignore a flag result for each one of these that applies- possibly ALL of them!

"May" does not mean "must." There are times when the owner may choose to accept a flag result, especially when it means getting away from an attack that has not happened yet.

Note also that range fire and close combat are conducted in any order you choose. If an ordered, range-fire capable unit is adjacent an enemy unit, it cannot range fire. But if it has not conducted combat yet and the enemy unit is no longer adjacent (retreat or removal), then the option to shoot is now available.

File: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: CC Acients Reference cards per unit type in GERMAN

Biswut — Mon, 22 Jun 2009 15:26:39 +0000

by Biswut

CC Acients Reference cards per unit type in GERMAN for Board Game: Commands & Colors: Ancients ]]>

File: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: CC Acients Reference cards per unit type in GERMAN

Biswut — Fri, 19 Jun 2009 17:51:03 +0000

by Biswut

CC Acients Reference cards per unit type in GERMAN for Board Game: Commands & Colors: Ancients ]]>

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: Rules:: Re: Combat sequence

Dweeb — Fri, 19 Jun 2009 12:00:14 +0000

by Dweeb

Yep. Choosing the order in which you resolve the battles can be an important decision in this game.

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: Rules:: Re: Combat sequence

ColtsFan76 — Fri, 19 Jun 2009 10:31:36 +0000

by ColtsFan76

Yes, each battle is fully resolved before going on to the next one. That means completing any applicable follow-on actions like pursuit or battle back from the opponent.

If the intended target is eliminated or forced to retreat before the 2nd battle and no longer adjacent/in range, then the 2nd attacker needs to find a new target that is in range or forfeit their turn.

Thread: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: Rules:: Combat sequence

Snowman — Fri, 19 Jun 2009 10:28:16 +0000

by Snowman

Ok, I think I have a mind block with this one. It also came up for me in Memoir 44 and for the life of me couldn't find the clarification in the rules. I'm guessing it's staring me in the face. If two or more units have been ordered and are in close combat with one other unit, each combat is resolved entirely first? I'm guessing that's correct. My question is, if the defending unit retreats out of that hex after the first combat and is not subsequently adjacent with my second unit ordered to close combat with it, does that mean I cannot close combat with it as well. Same for example applies to ranged combat where two units are ordered to fire at the same target, and it retreats out of range after the first combat. Thanks for the help.

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: Rules:: Re: Reference sheets with 1st edition still good?

BradyLS — Thu, 18 Jun 2009 21:52:11 +0000

by BradyLS

franchi wrote:
I think there was only one error in them, concerning Elephants:

Note 5 - Any sword hit scored by an Elephant unit is re-rolled ~~one time only~~ for a possible additional hit.

You keep re-rolling until no swords are obtained. So just delete "one time only" and you're done. I think that was all...

And that often hung me up, because I would see that and forget this: Remember, if a unit that is in combat with an Elephant can ignore a sword hit from the Elephant (say they are on a Rampart or in a Camp, for example), the ignored Sword is taken out of the roll and is not re-rolled by the Elephant.

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: Rules:: Re: Battle Back clarification

chiba13 — Wed, 17 Jun 2009 03:21:24 +0000

by chiba13

Thanks for the info folks. I suspected we were doing it wrong, but as we started the day that way, we continued that way out of fairness... or at least consistency.

The First Strike has only come up in our games twice, and both times it was decisive, ending the game before the attacking unit could, well, attack.

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: Rules:: Re: Reference sheets with 1st edition still good?

kduke — Wed, 17 Jun 2009 03:06:35 +0000

by kduke

I recall the same thing. "2nd edition" was really "surprise we sold out so quickly" and there were not many actual changes in the rules. The cards had some different language but the only thing I recall that made a diff was that the mounted charge originally said heavy CAVALRY could move 3 hexes and fight and changed to allow heavy MOUNTED to do so (meaning elephants and chariots were included).

2nd edition included the 3 'bonus' scenarios that pre-orders rec'd, plus 2 more that were new. And better dice. I don't recall anything else? Anyone else?

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: Rules:: Re: Reference sheets with 1st edition still good?

franchi — Tue, 16 Jun 2009 18:58:41 +0000

by franchi

I think there was only one error in them, concerning Elephants:

Note 5 - Any sword hit scored by an Elephant unit is re-rolled ~~one time only~~ for a possible additional hit.

You keep re-rolling until no swords are obtained. So just delete "one time only" and you're done. I think that was all...

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: Rules:: Re: Reference sheets with 1st edition still good?

scribidinus — Tue, 16 Jun 2009 18:19:11 +0000

by scribidinus

Yes. The later reference sheets revised to reflect the attributes of the newer units which do not appear in the basic game.

Thread: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: Rules:: Reference sheets with 1st edition still good?

Blustar — Tue, 16 Jun 2009 17:06:55 +0000

by Blustar

What do I need to do to make my 1st edition reference sheets compatible with 2nd edition rules?

Or can I use them as is?

I can't seem to find an errata for the reference sheets to know what I need to change...

thanks

ps-I just have the base set and printed out the 2nd edition living rules

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: Rules:: Re: Battle Back clarification

Noonespecial — Tue, 16 Jun 2009 05:09:13 +0000

by Noonespecial

JohnRayJr wrote:
Which is why yesterday I felt a sense of dread when I surrounded full-strength heavies (with a leader) with one medium infantry, one auxillia, and one medium cavalry. The mediums got blown off the map after inflicting one casualty. The auxillia got knocked back to the edge of the board after inflicting one casualty. I had little confidence that my Cavalry could finish the job, but they rode down the heavies with an extra hit to spare. (And then they killed the leader, mwhwahaha) Sometimes, you just have to counterattack. Just try not to do it against heavies with a leader.

:arrrh:

Especially if that leader is "Julius Caesar" and he's with the "10th Legion". :soblue:

My personal experience with that cost/benefit analysis is:

Me: -4 medium blue warriors, -2 green auxilia infantry (plus a retreat)
Him: -1 heavy infantry

EDIT: I am speaking of one of the scenarios in expansion #3, by the way.

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: Rules:: Re: Battle Back clarification

kduke — Mon, 15 Jun 2009 21:13:46 +0000

by kduke

Actually, hitting the "basics" of Battle Back is sufficient.

8. Battle Back: In Close Combat, the defending enemy unit
may Battle Back against the attacking unit if one or more of the
defending unit’s blocks survived the Close Combat attack and
the defending unit did not retreat from its hex.

That's it.

Every time a unit gets attacked, if it meets the criteria described, it is allowed to Battle Back, meaning the potential of 6 or more battle backs in a given round. (Unit is surrounded but not getting wiped out-- and "more than 6" could happen if the battle backs blew attackers out of their hex and momentum advance/bonus attacks from other units allowed additional attacks on this same, remarkable defending unit. Unlikely, but the point is, there is no limit on Battle Backs, as long as the defender does not retreat and has a block surviving.

Given your point in the learning curve, maybe we should point out that a "First Strike" card counts as the normal "battle back," but it's just happening out of sequence. So if the original attacker survives the first strike and doesn't retreat, thus executing the attack it intended (before the First Strike card surprised it), even if the defender would still meet the criteria above for a battle back, he NOW does not get to-- because he already had his battle back against this one attack (he just got it early). Hope that makes sense-- it was hard to follow the first time it happened to us. Point is, "First Strike" is not an "extra" battle back, it's just an "early" one.

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: Rules:: Re: Battle Back clarification

JohnRayJr — Mon, 15 Jun 2009 19:08:27 +0000

by JohnRayJr

Which is why yesterday I felt a sense of dread when I surrounded full-strength heavies (with a leader) with one medium infantry, one auxillia, and one medium cavalry. The mediums got blown off the map after inflicting one casualty. The auxillia got knocked back to the edge of the board after inflicting one casualty. I had little confidence that my Cavalry could finish the job, but they rode down the heavies with an extra hit to spare. (And then they killed the leader, mwhwahaha) Sometimes, you just have to counterattack. Just try not to do it against heavies with a leader.

:arrrh:

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: Rules:: Re: Battle Back clarification

ColtsFan76 — Mon, 15 Jun 2009 14:59:23 +0000

by ColtsFan76

You can battle back once per attack.

The rule you quote is for attacking units only.

But if a target is attacked multiple times, and conditions of support and battle back are met, then the unit can battle back multiple times.

EDIT: answered before reading the rest.

A Battle back is tied to the particular battle. So you would toss your dice right after your opponent tossed his.

Attack - Battle Back
Attack - Battle Back
Attack - Battle Back

Thread: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: Rules:: Battle Back clarification

chiba13 — Mon, 15 Jun 2009 14:46:22 +0000

by chiba13

Can a defending unit engage in more than one Battle Back in a given turn?

My instinct says "no" because the rules say that a given unit may only (normally) battle once per turn (of course, there is momentum advance + bonus combat, but that doesn't apply to defenders).

So here's the dilemma we talked about yesterday:

One unit is being attacked by 3 enemy units (let's say, for sake of argument, it's a Medium Infantry defending against an Elephant, Medium Cavalry, and Auxilia).

When does the Med Inf battle back? How many times? If a unit can only battle back once, does the defender dare risk elimination or retreat and therefore losing battle back capability by not battling back against the first unit that attacks?

Also - do ALL attacks get resolved before the defender battles back, or can the defender interrupt the overall attack to throw down his battle back?

The rules hit the basics of battling back, but don't get very in-depth. Any help is appreciated.

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: Rules:: Re: Leader adjacent (alone or not?)

Ivappanther — Mon, 15 Jun 2009 10:35:59 +0000

by Ivappanther

so without the note one could think that a lone Leader does not provide support

Ok, that's what I thought of it originally (and as I played), but I wanted to make sure about. Your clarification about the leader not being himself a unit and therefore needing his own note on the rule's text is very valuable (now, I know the reason behind).

Thank You.

Iva.

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: Rules:: Re: Leader adjacent (alone or not?)

franchi — Sun, 14 Jun 2009 22:12:04 +0000

by franchi

Ivappanther wrote:
It's the meaning of adjacent to implicitly stating that the leader must be alone, or attached to another unit, or both.

Iván, on the attack any unit attached or adjacent to a Leader (alone or attached to another unit) hits on helmets too. So the leader extends his effect over the 7 hexes around him.

On the defense, only the unit to which he is attached may ignore 1 flag. His effect applies to just 1 hex.

The note on retreats and support is there because a Leader is not a unit, so without the note one could think that a lone Leader does not provide support. But it does, that is, a unit adjacent to 2 units and/or Leaders is supported and can ignore 1 flag.

Thread: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: Rules:: Leader adjacent (alone or not?)

Ivappanther — Sun, 14 Jun 2009 21:47:13 +0000

by Ivappanther

In chapter 12 RETREAT the rules state this:

Bolster morale section.

· A leader when alone in the hex, may act as an adjacent support unit and can provide support just as a unit does.

And on chapter 14 LEADERS

Summary of leader benefits section

says

1. converts leader symbol results into hits in Close Combat, when attached or adjacent to a friendly non-elephant unit in Close Combat.

It's the meaning of adjacent to implicitly stating that the leader must be alone, or attached to another unit, or both.

I think it's not easily understandable from the text on the rules (as in the RETREAT chapter is specified and, I think, not in the other[LEADERS]).

Thank YOU.

Iva.

New Image for Commands & Colors: Ancients Expansion Pack #3: The Roman Civil Wars

Luftwaffe Flak — Sun, 14 Jun 2009 20:47:51 +0000

by Luftwaffe Flak

Myself enjoying the Civil Wars

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New Image for Commands & Colors: Ancients Expansion Pack #3: The Roman Civil Wars

Luftwaffe Flak — Sun, 14 Jun 2009 20:40:54 +0000

by Luftwaffe Flak

Mom enjoying the Civil Wars

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Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: News:: Re: 2nd Annual CC:Ancients Tournament at the UK Games Expo, Birmingham on Sunday 7th June...

JMcL63 — Sat, 13 Jun 2009 22:10:43 +0000

by JMcL63

Bugger! ;)

EDIT
Fixed now. :blush:

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: News:: Re: 2nd Annual CC:Ancients Tournament at the UK Games Expo, Birmingham on Sunday 7th June...

RegBob — Sat, 13 Jun 2009 22:01:46 +0000

by RegBob

JMcL63 wrote:

BTW, I'm still sure some impostor was smuggled in. The person who was calling himself Barry Ingram that weekend looked nothing like his picture here... ;)

John, is that why you changed his name to 'Steve' at teh end of the blog??
Yet, when it's your Combat Commander tournament......

You dippy %£!#er :p

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: General:: Re: Equus

elgin_j — Sat, 13 Jun 2009 18:14:59 +0000

by elgin_j

Weasels are cool.

Thread: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: General:: Equus

danweasel — Sat, 13 Jun 2009 17:36:06 +0000

by danweasel

I have the Equus scenarios for CC:A from GMT's C3i magazine, along with several other scenarios from C3i (#19-22); if anyone is interested in them, let me know and maybe we can work out a trade of some sort.

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: News:: Re: 2nd Annual CC:Ancients Tournament at the UK Games Expo, Birmingham on Sunday 7th June...

JMcL63 — Sat, 13 Jun 2009 00:39:52 +0000

by JMcL63

My report on the tournament is now up @RD/KA!. :)

BTW, I'm still sure some impostor was smuggled in. The person who was calling himself Barry Ingram that weekend looked nothing like his picture here... ;)

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: General:: Re: Double noob, Vassal and CC:A anybody want to teach me?

Edbryan — Wed, 10 Jun 2009 21:18:11 +0000

by Edbryan

Thanks for all the offers. I've sent out a geekmail, so hopefully i'll be vassaling very soon. Maybe I'll even get to play Vietnam again!

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: News:: Re: 2nd Annual CC:Ancients Tournament at the UK Games Expo, Birmingham on Sunday 7th June...

TommieSL — Tue, 09 Jun 2009 15:20:22 +0000

by TommieSL

Thanks to all for the very kind words. It makes all the efforts that much more rewarding and my 'job' was made all the easier by the excellent spirit and camaraderie on display throughout the day.

As for posting piccies, unfortunately this was one area in which I failed miserably. One player did snap a pic of the CC:Ancients award presentation so I'll post a link just as soon as his pops that onto his blog. Apart from that I am relying on the Expo's own official photographer who I know was floating around both days taking snaps of memoir and Ancients games in action. I'll see if I can get copies of any relevant shots to post here as soon as they are available.

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: News:: Re: 2nd Annual CC:Ancients Tournament at the UK Games Expo, Birmingham on Sunday 7th June...

JMcL63 — Mon, 08 Jun 2009 22:55:07 +0000

by JMcL63

Hello all. I've not been around on these boards much at all lately, but I too had a great time at the C&C:A tournament. It was nice to meet up with so many people I know from the BGG and elsewhere, and I was pleased to get a chance to play one of my favourite games all afternoon, especially in such friendly and good-humoured company. I look forward to meeting you all again in the future. Many thanks to Barry for his efforts. ;)

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: News:: Re: 2nd Annual CC:Ancients Tournament at the UK Games Expo, Birmingham on Sunday 7th June...

Tulfa — Mon, 08 Jun 2009 22:37:55 +0000

by Tulfa

I'll just add my thanks too.

Despite losing all my games :shake: I had a very enjoyable time, and it was great to meet everyone. With a bit of luck I'll be back next year, but in the meantime, I'm generally up for a game with anyone via Vassal (though often time pressures mean it may have to be PBEM rather than live online).

Thanks again,
Tony

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: News:: Re: 2nd Annual CC:Ancients Tournament at the UK Games Expo, Birmingham on Sunday 7th June...

Mantuanwar — Mon, 08 Jun 2009 19:30:07 +0000

by Mantuanwar

Thanks indeed Barry for an excellent day from myself and said son Lawrence.

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: News:: Re: 2nd Annual CC:Ancients Tournament at the UK Games Expo, Birmingham on Sunday 7th June...

earthquake — Mon, 08 Jun 2009 15:11:45 +0000

by earthquake

Thanks for reminding me of that Barry - though it's not something I'm likely to forget any time soon :cry:

My son found it highly entertaining!

Any chance that you can post your picks of this and the Memoir tourney soon - I forgot to take a picture of the prize giving and it would be nice for the club website (especially since John Bennett - runner-up in the Memoir Tourney is also a member of Scimitar)

Cheers

Neil

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: News:: Re: 2nd Annual CC:Ancients Tournament at the UK Games Expo, Birmingham on Sunday 7th June...

TommieSL — Mon, 08 Jun 2009 14:03:05 +0000

by TommieSL

Neil.

You are very welcome. I thoroughly enjoyed the whole day myself - heck , I even got to play a game myself (thanks to Paul for letting me sneak a win).
We witnessed some cracking games and the tournament was all the better for your trio of players. Andrew played consistently well through the preliminary stages on the Carthage side and did well to beat Bill in the top rank game for the Carthaginian camp. Martin also deserves mention since he won 2 of his 3 games beating Andrew in games won but unfortunately losing on the banners won tie-break, due to his unlucky 3rd game wash-out.
[Note: I may change this next year to reward players on their won/lost record before counting back on banners won.]

The final between Andrew and David was as close as a game can be and like many before was in the balance till the very end.

Congrats to David Andrew (Leicester Wargames society) for his championship win.

I'd just like to thank all the players for their exemplary behaviour and fair minded spirit. All games were conducted in an extremely friendly atmosphere with a good deal of skill and fortitude amidst the usual backdrop of unlucky dice and bad cards.

If only I'd had a camera to capture the look on your face when you lost your game to Lawrence (13 years of age) when he hit his 1 in 36 chance of a 2 dice shot at your leader...hehe. Priceless in itself but even more so considering it was you who reminded him that he had the leader check roll in the first place. That action alone symbolises the spirit in which the whole event took place.

Well done Neil and please pass on my thanks to the Coventry lads.

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: News:: Re: 2nd Annual CC:Ancients Tournament at the UK Games Expo, Birmingham on Sunday 7th June...

earthquake — Sun, 07 Jun 2009 22:34:47 +0000

by earthquake

Barry

Can I just say a huge thank you to you for the effort you put into organising today's tournament.

An excellent day, full of tales of glorious endevour, heroic failure and the odd spot of luck...

...and, of course, the highs and lows of elephants!

Fantastic stuff...we'll be back next year...

Neil

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: General:: Re: Double noob, Vassal and CC:A anybody want to teach me?

toddrew — Sat, 06 Jun 2009 16:52:41 +0000

by toddrew

Count me among those who are happy to help out :)

Geekmail or email, or if you see me on Vassal, feel free to ask me for a game there as well.

I would suggest playing a game, or at least a few turns, "live" on Vassal before going strictly pbem.

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: General:: Re: Double noob, Vassal and CC:A anybody want to teach me?

Gamer DC — Sat, 06 Jun 2009 12:31:32 +0000

by Gamer DC

Brent,

I've run into a few snags with my Mac but been able to work them all out. Just a few different steps here and there and it usually works fine. Let me know if you need any help!

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: General:: Re: Double noob, Vassal and CC:A anybody want to teach me?

goshublue — Sat, 06 Jun 2009 09:36:44 +0000

by goshublue

hoostus wrote:
My Mac hosted a game of Twilight Struggle from wargameroom this morning with no apparent problems. Granted all I did was the setup and the first action round....

That's good news. Maybe they've introduced Apple scripts (for Twilight Struggle at least). There was a discussion of how one user previously managed to get it to run for TS here....the relevant entry is about half way down (post 9).

Brent

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: General:: Re: Double noob, Vassal and CC:A anybody want to teach me?

hoostus — Sat, 06 Jun 2009 07:47:19 +0000

by hoostus

My Mac hosted a game of Twilight Struggle from wargameroom this morning with no apparent problems. Granted all I did was the setup and the first action round....

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: General:: Re: Double noob, Vassal and CC:A anybody want to teach me?

goshublue — Sat, 06 Jun 2009 07:27:35 +0000

by goshublue

I realise this isn't relevant to most users but I should point out that while Wargameroom looks great, it isn't at all friendly to Mac users. There are some Java gymnastics that can be used to get it running in a limited way but even then Macs apparently can't host.

I've found Vassal excellent online and it's also a great engine for quick and easy solo play.

Brent.

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: General:: Re: Double noob, Vassal and CC:A anybody want to teach me?

highpriestrsw2 — Sat, 06 Jun 2009 03:02:28 +0000

by highpriestrsw2

I'm also a CC:A and vasal noob. I just purchased my copy of both the core and 1st expansion earlier this week and they are in route to my house as I type this. (Go CLS Games! WOOT!) I'm also looking for someone to teach me the ways of Vasal. I'm not a Commands and Colrs noob though. I have quite a few games of Memoir '44, Battlelore and Battlecry under my belt. I'm willing to play via wargames room too if anyone is interested.

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: General:: Re: Double noob, Vassal and CC:A anybody want to teach me?

Gamer DC — Sat, 06 Jun 2009 01:22:19 +0000

by Gamer DC

Ed,
If you haven't had much success hooking up with anyone by Monday, pm me and I'll arrange a time to help you out. I'll have a wide variety of times at that point to meet up with you.

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: General:: Re: Double noob, Vassal and CC:A anybody want to teach me?

Edbryan — Sat, 06 Jun 2009 00:45:52 +0000

by Edbryan

I really want to learn Vassal, CC:A is just a way to get my feet wet so to speak. I also need to play by PBeM.

kentreuber wrote:
Rather than Vassal which doesn't enforce rules, you might want to try playing C&CA at http://wargameroom.com

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: General:: Re: Double noob, Vassal and CC:A anybody want to teach me?

Thunder — Sat, 06 Jun 2009 00:15:20 +0000

by Thunder

Does the War Room have the same support and community for the game that Vassal has?

Peace

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: General:: Re: Double noob, Vassal and CC:A anybody want to teach me?

kentreuber — Fri, 05 Jun 2009 23:22:22 +0000

by kentreuber

Rather than Vassal which doesn't enforce rules, you might want to try playing C&CA at http://wargameroom.com

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: General:: Re: Double noob, Vassal and CC:A anybody want to teach me?

ColtsFan76 — Fri, 05 Jun 2009 21:47:57 +0000

by ColtsFan76

If no one else steps up, I'll help you out. My only hesitation is that we are moving soon so I am not sure how much time I can consistently devote to this.

But I have trained quite a few in Memoir on Vassal PBEM and a couple on Ancients.

Thread: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: General:: Double noob, Vassal and CC:A anybody want to teach me?

Edbryan — Fri, 05 Jun 2009 21:23:38 +0000

by Edbryan

I've played a game or two of CC:A, but Vassal is completely new to me, though I think I figured out where to get the module. I'd like to play be email, so I've got something to do on my lunch break at work. Anybody up for teaching me? I promise to lose the first game.

New Image for Commands & Colors: Ancients

Arteusz — Fri, 05 Jun 2009 14:42:57 +0000

by Arteusz

Example of cards

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New Image for Commands & Colors: Ancients

Arteusz — Fri, 05 Jun 2009 14:42:51 +0000

by Arteusz

Content of the box

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Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients Expansion Pack #3: The Roman Civil Wars:: General:: Re: EPIC Scenario X

Commando719 — Wed, 03 Jun 2009 19:54:49 +0000

by Commando719

All right then -- I'll propose a match to Carole (after we finish our current tournament) and we'll report back with the results. Thank you in advance!

New Image for Commands & Colors: Ancients Expansion Pack #1: Greece & Eastern Kingdoms

Arteusz — Wed, 03 Jun 2009 14:23:14 +0000

by Arteusz

Back of the box

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New Image for Commands & Colors: Ancients Expansion Pack #1: Greece & Eastern Kingdoms

Arteusz — Wed, 03 Jun 2009 14:23:07 +0000

by Arteusz

Blocks, victory and special markers

]]>

New Image for Commands & Colors: Ancients Expansion Pack #1: Greece & Eastern Kingdoms

Arteusz — Wed, 03 Jun 2009 14:18:30 +0000

by Arteusz

Content of the box

]]>

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: Reviews:: Re: the best of Command and Colors series? I dont think so...

franchi — Wed, 03 Jun 2009 07:38:39 +0000

by franchi

kduke wrote:
I do enjoy Manoeuvre (except trying to spell it)

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: Reviews:: Re: the best of Command and Colors series? I dont think so...

kduke — Tue, 02 Jun 2009 14:11:50 +0000

by kduke

This late in the forum, I'll try to avoid repeating what others have said.

But mark me as a "yes, CCA is the best of the C&C series" (at least so far).

I do enjoy Manoeuvre (except trying to spell it) but don't find it to be very much like CCA at all, and those who think so must not have spent much time with either game. That's not attacking Man.-- it is its own game and fun for its own reasons.

This is all about personal tastes and I think some of that includes whether you want to be pushing tanks or need to be seeing plastic soldiers, but I've played all 4 C&C games and CCA is the one I'm always ready to play, again and again, for as long as I can stay at the game session. Even before Epic, we played it with from one to 4 people and enjoyed it with every combination. We've played the same scenario 3 or 4 times in a row and enjoyed it each time (and found enough differences with each play to make it rewarding), and were ready to set it up again. I can't think of any other game I can say that about.

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: General:: Re: How many dice sets do I need?

kduke — Tue, 02 Jun 2009 13:53:59 +0000

by kduke

I tend to mark all ordered units with dice, and then would keep the dice on those who will close combat or shoot

You actually can make this happen without any additional item-- just "alter" one of the unit's blocks when it receives an order-- if they're standing, lay one block down or vice-versa. If they are a ranged-fire unit that isn't moving (getting 2 die for shooting) alter 2 blocks. When the unit moves and you know it won't have combat, replace the altered block. If combat will be involved, wait til you are finished with that unit before fixing it.

Quick, simple, doesn't require anything extra. It's a little harder with "only one block left" units, but "alter" can be anything you want it to be-- if the blocks are standing, turn one sideways so it faces the flank and the same thing gets accomplished.

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: News:: Re: 2nd Annual CC:Ancients Tournament at the UK Games Expo, Birmingham on Sunday 7th June...

TommieSL — Mon, 01 Jun 2009 11:20:50 +0000

by TommieSL

Andy.

Sorry to hear that. Please do pop in and say hello (same applies to anyone else with a passing interest).
I could use a reserve player just in case we get a no show so you might be able to pick up a game or two.

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: News:: Re: 2nd Annual CC:Ancients Tournament at the UK Games Expo, Birmingham on Sunday 7th June...

Asroc2000 — Mon, 01 Jun 2009 11:03:29 +0000

by Asroc2000

Sorry about that, life got in the way of fun yet again, oh well, maybe next year.
Thanks for getting extra places though, I'll pop in and see how its going on Sunday anyway.

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: General:: Re: Truceless War: Leptis

Minedog3 — Mon, 01 Jun 2009 02:23:39 +0000

by Minedog3

I can't think how many times I've fled 1 block units behind the line to save the banner. Even sweeter when they form a support unit to the flank.. part of the game.

Thread: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: General:: Truceless War: Leptis

scribidinus — Sun, 31 May 2009 16:15:03 +0000

by scribidinus

My friend Richard and I are playing through all the official scenarios in chronological order twice and switching sides. Yesterday we played seven games to finish off the Truceless War Bonus Pack Scenarios. Richard and I are evenly matched but yesterday I won 5 of the 7 games played. Most of the games were close but one that was not prompted me to make a side note.

On our second play of Leptis I was the Rebels and Richard was the Carthagenians. I won the game 6 to 3 but while we were sorting the pieces we noticed that I had scored 6 Banners by killing only 17 blocks. Richard killed 23 blocks but only scored 3 Banners.

Yep, I killed 3 elephant units, 2 Medium Cavalry and one Medium Infantry unit for 16 hits plus one other block.

I know I had at least 4 single block units and two deuces left on the map at game end.

It seems Richard usually came up one hit short on his high odds attacks against my bent units allowing me a Battle Back. One of my surviving one block Medium Infantry units caused 8 hits including killing a full strength Medium Infantry, a full strength Elephant in one turn on Battle Backs. It also caused two hits in an attack on an evading but reduced Medium Cavalry unit. This Medium Infantry broke the back of Richard's left flank.

Yeah it was a good day

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: Variants:: Re: Phalanx Unit Sticker?

franchi — Sat, 30 May 2009 20:32:12 +0000

by franchi

Here they are:

This link:

http://talk.consimworld.com/WebX?50@136.Be7Eb5aYYDP.2@.1dcfb...

takes you to the latest posts on CCA at CSW, then you have to scroll up to post number 6339, like Dan said above.

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: News:: Re: 2nd Annual CC:Ancients Tournament at the UK Games Expo, Birmingham on Sunday 7th June...

TommieSL — Sat, 30 May 2009 20:14:10 +0000

by TommieSL

Mike.

I can confirm that you are registered for three places only.

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: Variants:: Re: Phalanx Unit Sticker?

Thunder — Sat, 30 May 2009 20:05:42 +0000

by Thunder

Desi wrote:
Excellent Phalanx sticker posted over at ConSimWorld in the CCA folder, post number 6339.

http://talk.consimworld.comWebX?13@371.1mKWe3Q190T.4@.1dcfbb...

That link is dead already. Can someone post the picture here on BGG or over on CCAncients?

Thanks!

Peace

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: General:: Re: How many dice sets do I need?

broadsword — Sat, 30 May 2009 15:58:59 +0000

by broadsword

Maximum possible dice needed is 8 I guess: HI with Alexander attached, playing "Clash of Shields": 5+1+2=8

The advantage of having everyone with their own dice is how it speeds up Leader loss checks.

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: Rules:: Re: Rules clarification

rri1 — Sat, 30 May 2009 13:55:48 +0000

by rri1

Also note, often the is an advantage to not moving when using ranged fire.

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: General:: Re: How many dice sets do I need?

rri1 — Fri, 29 May 2009 12:41:32 +0000

by rri1

Five per side is probably enough (Only a few cards allow using more than that--and those can be borrowed from you opponent.)

And in Epic it is nice to have multiple sets.

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: General:: Re: What's wrong with the original dice?

Robin — Fri, 29 May 2009 07:14:52 +0000

by Robin

Valley Game dice symbols are slightly "incrusted", so they wear less than if they only were painted on the wood.

Other suggestion : Summer is approaching, and heat is growing. Buy Valley Game dice, they are the dice cream which will refresh your gaming experience.:p

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: Rules:: Re: Rules questions

Stosser44 — Fri, 29 May 2009 00:56:18 +0000

by Stosser44

To the original poster I would say:

"Your post indicates you are intelligent and genuinely intersted in learning the game. Continue asking similar questions."

I was fortunate enough to learn the game from someone who really knows it. If I hadn't such an opportunity, my questions would have even been more basic.

To several responders (squeek if the shoe fits):

"Just answer his questions. We need more people interested in the game. Don't add your need to demonstrate your superior knowledge into putting down a new player."

Again, "squeek if the shoe fits..." :snore:

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: General:: Re: What's wrong with the original dice?

highpriestrsw2 — Fri, 29 May 2009 00:26:54 +0000

by highpriestrsw2

I'm thinking of ordering some Valley Games C&C Ancients dice. Do you REALLY need to clear nail polish them? Are they as prone to rubbing off as the original Battlelore Dice were?
I have both glosscoat and dullcoat Testors sprays in my arsenal. Would a spray of the gloss hardcoat followed by a spray of the dullcaot keep them in good condition (like it does my miniatures)?

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: News:: Re: 2nd Annual CC:Ancients Tournament at the UK Games Expo, Birmingham on Sunday 7th June...

TommieSL — Thu, 28 May 2009 19:06:09 +0000

by TommieSL

Welcome Tony,

Look forward to meeting you on the day.
By the way there's still some room in the Memoir tourney if you fancy some WWII action on the Saturday (assuming you're attending both days).

Andy,

Only one spot left so you need to get your skates on.

Mike,

Still waiting to hear back re your question on number of tickets.
I will chase for an answer again and let you know here.

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: News:: Re: 2nd Annual CC:Ancients Tournament at the UK Games Expo, Birmingham on Sunday 7th June...

Tulfa — Thu, 28 May 2009 18:07:49 +0000

by Tulfa

Just slipped in under the wire to snaffle one of the last couple of tickets for this.

My first time attending the UK Games Expo and very much looking forward to the experience and meeting you all there!

Tony

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients Expansion Pack #4: Imperial Rome:: News:: Re: Brief Scenario Descriptions

BillJ1967 — Thu, 28 May 2009 03:43:28 +0000

by BillJ1967

Thank you for listing the details of these scenarios! I'm particularly looking forward to the idea of a 'campaign game' scenario. When ASL tried it in the Red Barricades game, it really breathed new life into the system. I'm hoping that the multi-day battle concept will introduce some new types of planning decisions for CC:A. This expansion looks better every day.

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: Strategy:: Re: C&C:Ancient vs Piquet: Archon II

aringarosa — Wed, 27 May 2009 18:51:20 +0000

by aringarosa

Alexei thanks for the information.

I would like to understand what is the greater difficulty of Piquet system;

unfortunately are interested in the ancient period, Cartouche plays a different period; Archon maybe it would be different.

thanks anyway and good game. Aringarosa.

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: General:: Re: How many dice sets do I need?

Heliconia — Wed, 27 May 2009 17:22:56 +0000

by Heliconia

gbaker59 wrote:
Are these dice still available?

Yes I just got mine about 2 weeks ago.
As for the number of sets I would say that 1 set is fine, but each player having their own set I guess is good too.

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: General:: Re: How many dice sets do I need?

gbaker59 — Wed, 27 May 2009 17:07:16 +0000

by gbaker59

Are these dice still available?

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: Reviews:: Re: the best of Command and Colors series? I dont think so...

Minedog3 — Wed, 27 May 2009 00:34:26 +0000

by Minedog3

b5mith wrote:
Command & Colors: Ancients: C&C for grogs.

when they want to play something light.. a 40 minute game with 12 unit types (and rarely more than 5-6 types in play) is too complex! Really?:surprise:

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: Reviews:: Re: the best of Command and Colors series? I dont think so...

gbaker59 — Tue, 26 May 2009 21:06:26 +0000

by gbaker59

drunkenKOALA wrote:
Why is it on preorder? Didn't they print it once already? Can't they just use the money they got from the last print run to start the new one, which should be easier because it's the same print? Sorry but I think preorder systems are a bunch of bull.

Anyways, I haven't played Ancients, but I found Manoeuvre to be a better version of Memoir 44.

In war, head hunting is a means, not an end. In Memoir, head hunting is the end. In Manoov, head hunting is more of a means. It is still one of the two victory conditions, but if you just run around avoid being killed, you will easily surrender the other victory condition of holding territories. As such, Manoov just feels more natural and strategical.

Manoov has leader cards that can be used to exploit positional advantages.

Manoov lets you discard extra cards to draw extra cards, instead of strictly play one draw one.

In Manoov, I almost always want to move forward, or sideways, or make a movement of some sort. And movement don't cost a card. It's one movement per turn, any unit. In Memoir, it's play a card to move and fire one unit. It's been awhile, and it might be the scenario, but I don't enjoying the movement much, just playing a card to fire from range. Movement is still important, but it's a bit more stale.

And this probably has to do with the afore mentioned victory condition. In Memoir, you don't want to move a weaker unit up close to a stronger unit, because it's just a pure headhunting contest. In Manoov, that's prefectly fine because when you lose a dice roll by less than double, the defender gets to choose whether to take a hit or retreat one step. So forcing the opponent to burn a good card to initiate a fight, just to advance a step (which he could've done for free if you hadn't moved up), is a viable tactic.

In Memoir, it's about rolling dice to kill units. In Manoov, it's a combination of killing units, and making advancements into enemy territory. Sometimes, the defender may even voluntarily choose to take a hit instead of retreating. I think a good wargame rewards you for holding a strong position, and not just killing units. (Yes I know better position will help you kill units in Memoir, but it is flipped that way, positioning becomes the means, and killing the end. I prefer the other way around.)

Manoov has 8 different nations, each with a very unique feel and characteristic to it. They are not all balanced, but they are all different and require different style of play to use effectively.

But that doesn't explain everything. For some reason Manoov just feels so much more interesting. Memoir has much better production quality though.

The wargames don’t sell as much so the seller/publisher wants to be assured they will get a return on their investment hence the preorder system. Yeah they can be annoying for the consumer.

Well I certainly don’t want to get in a position of defending Memoir 44 over X, but one advantage that Memoir has over CCA is objectives. Memoir isn’t just about head hunting since it has objectives in some of the scenarios. I don’t know about Manoeuvre since I don’t have it nor have I played it. I was under the impression from my reviewing the game that it, like CCA, are mainly meeting engagements which typically are slugfests without objective locations. In the end Memoir is just a fun easy game but to abstract to be considered a wargame. If Memoir is a wargame so is Risk, etc. I do have CCA but I’m still in the process of applying stickers so I have little playing experience. I don’t think you’d care for it given your comments.

I’d like to try Manoeuvre but the one guy in our group who has the game rarely brings it out. I think its to abstract for his wargaming taste. Bummer. He doesn’t play Memoir either but I think he finds it to luck driven with the dice and cards. I recently thought of picking up Manoeuvre but noticed its out of stock status in many of the online site I use. Good luck you should be able to find a copy somewhere.

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: Reviews:: Re: the best of Command and Colors series? I dont think so...

broadsword — Tue, 26 May 2009 20:37:10 +0000

by broadsword

Well, ultimately I'd argue headhunting the other guy is actually the goal of most warfare (admittedly not all) , and "other means to victory" are really just "new and exciting ways to hunt heads, or to make headhunting easier"!

CC:Ancients isn't only headhunting, although again, most battles are (and were incidentally, since destroying the other guy's army meant he couldn't beat you). More "subtle" ways to victory, as discussed in Sun Tzu for instance, are merely relatively less harmful ways of showing the other guy he's about to get head-chopped unless he ceases and desists. Xerxes tried that at Thermopylae, but those darned Spartans just wouldn't see they were already beaten. Xerxes: "Dude, you're like screwed, man. Give it up already"..... Leonidas: "Oh yeah? PROVE IT or lose!"

In CC:A the headhunting could actually be many things - Army Morale is the way I think of it, and when an Army reaches breaking point, it's gone in game terms (and the real slaughter can begin!). So if after X number of units in Army B break, rout, slink away, or simply become more interested in rescuing the hookers from the camp, Army B has ceased to pose an existential threat to Army A. In game terms, that's a bunch of banners in CC:A.

I will grant there are scenarios in CC:A where you really do feel like you're playing a game of random suicide bombings. That's a flaw in the scenario design usually. There are very deep scenarios, involving holding camps, ramparts, hills, and even getting units offmap. The default setting is "Kill off X of your opponent's units" but many other things can also come into play.

However especially in the fields of CC:A battle, things are not always as they appear at first.

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: Reviews:: Re: the best of Command and Colors series? I dont think so...

drunkenKOALA — Tue, 26 May 2009 18:39:36 +0000

by drunkenKOALA

gbaker59 wrote:
slate43 wrote:
drunkenKOALA wrote:
Who cares about either? There's Manoeuvre.

Hey Koala,

I noticed you do not own Manoeuvre. Could you explain your reply further? I have been considering both Manoeuvre and CC:A.

Thanks.

You may have to get manoeuve via Ebay as its OOP. It is on GMT's P500 but has a ways to go.

Why is it on preorder? Didn't they print it once already? Can't they just use the money they got from the last print run to start the new one, which should be easier because it's the same print? Sorry but I think preorder systems are a bunch of bull.

Anyways, I haven't played Ancients, but I found Manoeuvre to be a better version of Memoir 44.

In war, head hunting is a means, not an end. In Memoir, head hunting is the end. In Manoov, head hunting is more of a means. It is still one of the two victory conditions, but if you just run around avoid being killed, you will easily surrender the other victory condition of holding territories. As such, Manoov just feels more natural and strategical.

Manoov has leader cards that can be used to exploit positional advantages.

Manoov lets you discard extra cards to draw extra cards, instead of strictly play one draw one.

In Manoov, I almost always want to move forward, or sideways, or make a movement of some sort. And movement don't cost a card. It's one movement per turn, any unit. In Memoir, it's play a card to move and fire one unit. It's been awhile, and it might be the scenario, but I don't enjoying the movement much, just playing a card to fire from range. Movement is still important, but it's a bit more stale.

And this probably has to do with the afore mentioned victory condition. In Memoir, you don't want to move a weaker unit up close to a stronger unit, because it's just a pure headhunting contest. In Manoov, that's prefectly fine because when you lose a dice roll by less than double, the defender gets to choose whether to take a hit or retreat one step. So forcing the opponent to burn a good card to initiate a fight, just to advance a step (which he could've done for free if you hadn't moved up), is a viable tactic.

In Memoir, it's about rolling dice to kill units. In Manoov, it's a combination of killing units, and making advancements into enemy territory. Sometimes, the defender may even voluntarily choose to take a hit instead of retreating. I think a good wargame rewards you for holding a strong position, and not just killing units. (Yes I know better position will help you kill units in Memoir, but it is flipped that way, positioning becomes the means, and killing the end. I prefer the other way around.)

Manoov has 8 different nations, each with a very unique feel and characteristic to it. They are not all balanced, but they are all different and require different style of play to use effectively.

But that doesn't explain everything. For some reason Manoov just feels so much more interesting. Memoir has much better production quality though.

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: General:: Re: Looking for blank (or used) C&C dice

alexeigartinski — Tue, 26 May 2009 17:15:48 +0000

by alexeigartinski

Are you still interested? If yes, send me an e-mail, and I will happily send you all the original C&C:A plastic dice to you. I bought excellent wooden VG dice, and don't need these plastic "monsters" anymore. Also, I live in Switzerland (Geneva), so no excessive postage costs either... ;)

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: Strategy:: Re: C&C:Ancient vs Piquet: Archon II

alexeigartinski — Tue, 26 May 2009 17:00:17 +0000

by alexeigartinski

Correct. You draw the card and activate that unit. Also, Piquet is a pure miniatures game: you have no hexes to regulate movement, so you need rulers etc. Also, Piquet in my view is a much more complicated system... If you are still interested, I have its XVIII century module PIQUET:CARTOUCHE for sale at €25 (shipment in Europe included) ;)

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: General:: Re: How many dice sets do I need?

alexeigartinski — Tue, 26 May 2009 16:53:11 +0000

by alexeigartinski

I tend to mark all ordered units with dice, and then would keep the dice on those who will close combat or shoot. If you do that, you would need two sets of dice (I actually bought 3, but I just love them). And, by all means, do get the VG dice: the difference it makes is incredible! ;);)

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: Reviews:: Re: the best of Command and Colors series? I dont think so...

gbaker59 — Tue, 26 May 2009 16:52:53 +0000

by gbaker59

slate43 wrote:
drunkenKOALA wrote:
Who cares about either? There's Manoeuvre.

Hey Koala,

I noticed you do not own Manoeuvre. Could you explain your reply further? I have been considering both Manoeuvre and CC:A.

Thanks.

You may have to get manoeuve via Ebay as its OOP. It is on GMT's P500 but has a ways to go.

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: Reviews:: Re: the best of Command and Colors series? I dont think so...

b5mith — Tue, 26 May 2009 12:28:46 +0000

by b5mith

Memoir '44: C&C for newbs.
Command & Colors: Ancients: C&C for grogs.
Battlelore: C&C for pre-pubescent 30 yea^H^H^H^H^H^H err Ameritrashers. :p

Smart marketing strategy!

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: General:: Re: Which should I buy...C&C:A or Conflict of Heroes?

philmcd — Tue, 26 May 2009 07:31:26 +0000

by philmcd

I own CoH and have traded C&C:A (not because I didn't like it).

IMHO they are both excellent games, and I would say that you should go with the one who's theme appeals to you most. Ancients or WW2 east front.

Simples !

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: General:: Re: Which should I buy...C&C:A or Conflict of Heroes?

stalingrd — Tue, 26 May 2009 07:12:41 +0000

by stalingrd

I own both, for two separate gaming experiences.

I'd consider C&C a fun light game you can play with non-gamers and gamers alike. Anyone who can handle chess can handle C&C

COH to me is alot more involved and I like to play it because I can't (or won't) get my mind around ASL. So it comes out when my ASL buddies come around.

So it depends on what you want, a light or heavy game. Personally I like C&C a whole heck of alot. I don't have to spend oodles of time thinking about the rules, but instead can just have fun playing the game.

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: General:: Re: How many dice sets do I need?

kentreuber — Tue, 26 May 2009 03:58:30 +0000

by kentreuber

The most that any one player will need is about 7 dice. If you're playing Epic games, it's possible that you might need 21 dice per side if people aren't willing to share.

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: General:: Re: How many dice sets do I need?

toddrew — Tue, 26 May 2009 02:29:12 +0000

by toddrew

No real need for more than one set. Two are nice for those who have sharing issues ;) , but unless one plays a lot of epic multiplayer and has the same desire for each player to have their own dice, I can't think of a reason to have more than one set.

Thread: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: General:: How many dice sets do I need?

MonkeyMagic — Tue, 26 May 2009 02:03:03 +0000

by MonkeyMagic

Just got my copy of C&C:A and am already coveting a set of the wooden VG dice.

Looking through the posts most people seem to have bought more than one set. Is this helpful for the game? Would you use more than one set at once? Or are people just buying "spares"?

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: News:: Re: 2nd Annual CC:Ancients Tournament at the UK Games Expo, Birmingham on Sunday 7th June...

TommieSL — Mon, 25 May 2009 23:49:26 +0000

by TommieSL

Andy.

Should be room for you now if you try the tickets page.
Let me know here if you don't manage to snag one of the last available tickets.

Mike.

I'll check with the organisers and confirm.
Thanks for the support (again).

New Image for Commands & Colors: Ancients

30ought6 — Mon, 25 May 2009 23:34:54 +0000

by 30ought6

Raaco storage-solution inside the C&C:A box. Keeps everything neat!

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New Image for Commands & Colors: Ancients

30ought6 — Mon, 25 May 2009 23:24:38 +0000

by 30ought6

Plastic inserts for Raaco storage systems fits perfectly inside the C&...

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Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: Reviews:: Re: the best of Command and Colors series? I dont think so...

tech7 — Mon, 25 May 2009 21:32:58 +0000

by tech7

toddrew wrote:
tech7 wrote:

Battlelore Epic is imo quite different to C&C:A Epic. I think that Battlelore epic is the way to play the game, since it corrects some flaws of the normal games while C&C:A Epic (or Memoir Overlord) shines only with the suggested number of players, but the basegame is also fine.

Adding another opinion to this thread :) I would not say that the Epic/Overlord versions shine only if played with multiple players. I very much enjoy playing C&C:Ancients Epic with two players, much the same as I enjoy playing BattleLore Epic with just myself and an opponent. And I'll leave the "corrects some flaws of the normal games" comment alone...for now :)

In order to refine what I say, I think that epic may be great with two players, but it is more fun with 8. Unlike Battlelore where I have the opinion that the game has some flaws which are eliminated or weakened by playing epic. However, I find that the square BL-epic field is not as suited for multiple players as the wide C&C:A field (With the exception of reluctant allies variant for BL. I had no chance to play it yet)

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: General:: Re: Punic Wars scenarios?

Mondior — Mon, 25 May 2009 21:30:59 +0000

by Mondior

Thanks everyone.

I like the idea of starting with the Bagradas scenario!

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: Reviews:: Re: the best of Command and Colors series? I dont think so...

jwb3 — Mon, 25 May 2009 20:38:35 +0000

by jwb3

kalevi1999 wrote:
Better to lay them flat but if I have to do that I prefer to have counters instead!

I lay them flat too. I wouldn't say I'd "prefer" to have counters, but I do think the blocks have prevented me from buying the game.

The real obstacle to my purchasing it is the bang-for-buck ratio. If C&C:A had been produced with counters, I'm not sure the first game would have been less expensive -- but I'm pretty sure it either would have been less expensive, or it would have included more armies. And it's the fact that I have to buy a whole new set of blocks to make the expansions "look" right that turns me off.

Putting the stickers on all those blocks is a secondary problem. :)

Maybe I'm getting to affected by the Memoir point of view but the sweetspot of gaming time in order to enjoy the Command and Colors system should be 40 minutes at best!

I'd say the sweet spot for any C&C system should be less than an hour... and C&C:A meets that sweet spot for me.

I'm a pretty casual player of all these games; maybe two dozen games of C&C:A since it came out, less than that of Memoir '44, and half a dozen of Battle Cry. So every time I play one I'm refreshing myself on the rules a little bit, and playing the game relatively slowly. The amount of time it takes me to play a C&C:A game is not significantly longer than the amount of time it takes me to play Memoir '44. The rules are slightly more complex, but only a couple of them require going back to the rulebook after that initial "refreshment" phase. There are certain situations that require me to check the reference chart, but only a few... and the same can be said of the terrain rules for Memoir '44.

The reason I personally feel that C&C:A is the best of the series is because, although it is slightly more "fiddly" than the others, the resulting game is a lot more like the subject it is portraying. C&C:A feels to me like a simple ancients wargame. Memoir '44 feels to me like a complex kids' game. That doesn't make it a bad game, but as a wargamer, I want more "simulation" than it offers.

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: News:: Re: 2nd Annual CC:Ancients Tournament at the UK Games Expo, Birmingham on Sunday 7th June...

Mantuanwar — Mon, 25 May 2009 20:21:06 +0000

by Mantuanwar

Barry I just need to check that you have me down for 3 C&C slots and not 4. I booked about 4 weeks ago and accidently bought 4 places instead of 3. I sent an email to the organisers and they refunded me and said they were going to add the place back in. Of course they probably did that, but I thought I better check in case there is a place apparently taken that actually is not. I booked in my name (Mike Smith).

Cheers. Looking forward greatly to this. It was most enjoyable last year, and thanks for organising it again.

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: Rules:: Re: Rules clarification

hank__hill — Mon, 25 May 2009 20:04:38 +0000

by hank__hill

thanks

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: General:: Re: Pyrrus Epic Scenarios

Desi — Mon, 25 May 2009 19:10:29 +0000

by Desi

Another approach for the campaign would be to tally the number of banners accumulated through the campaign. Obviously, Pyrrus would have to survive, but bonus points could be awarded for units that survived the entire campaign. Units that survive Asculum would be notated and marked battle to battle (possibly using a different army for replacement units). Historically it makes some sense as Pyrrus was concerned with the casualties his veteran Epiriot troops were suffering, and this contributed to decision to head for Sicily.

Again, this adds a bit of tension to every battle; when do you commit veteran troops and how risky can you be with them?

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: Reviews:: Re: the best of Command and Colors series? I dont think so...

toddrew — Mon, 25 May 2009 19:05:21 +0000

by toddrew

tech7 wrote:

Battlelore Epic is imo quite different to C&C:A Epic. I think that Battlelore epic is the way to play the game, since it corrects some flaws of the normal games while C&C:A Epic (or Memoir Overlord) shines only with the suggested number of players, but the basegame is also fine.

Adding another opinion to this thread :) I would not say that the Epic/Overlord versions shine only if played with multiple players. I very much enjoy playing C&C:Ancients Epic with two players, much the same as I enjoy playing BattleLore Epic with just myself and an opponent. And I'll leave the "corrects some flaws of the normal games" comment alone...for now :)

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: Reviews:: Re: the best of Command and Colors series? I dont think so...

BartowWing — Mon, 25 May 2009 19:02:44 +0000

by BartowWing

Umbratus wrote:
Interesting. I was looking around and considering whether to buy this or Memoir'44 recently, getting closer to actually buying C&C: Ancients just today :)

While I have never played any of those and I am not really a wargamer, I am looking for something that plays within an hour or at least not much more, offers some tactical and strategic depthness while rules need to be somewhat simplified and generalized so you can teach how to play in about 10 minutes. Replayability seems to be offered by many scenarios included.
I was pretty positive that C&C: Ancients matches these demands, doesnt it ?

Also, at days, you simply grow tired of another WWII setting and I figured Ancients might help me there with abit more variety and fresh air by some rather different settings all in one box. Thats certainly not saying anything about how good the game is, I do mind that.

I wasnt really thinking this is a game for a casual gamer at all, probably our definition of 'casual gamer' is somewhat differing. For me thats folks who dont regularily play or ask to play games on their own, but who might sometimes join a game when asked to. Now I think neither Memoir'44 or C&C: Ancients is a game I'd play with casual gamers that I know. I am rather thinking about playing this game with one or another buddy who shares some certain geekness but does not want to sit down half a day for one single game, which I do not want either.

So, is it really THAT slow, is there really that much to remember and can you enjoy this game from scratch at all, or do you need 5-10 games before you can really start enjoying it ?

I am talking about an investment of 50€ here, which is rather alot compared with other games I usually buy, so I better make sure. This review gave me quite some doubts.

Play Ticinus River first. Each side has exactly two types of units (plus leaders) and anyone can remember that!!! Just don't judge the game by that scenario because it is the variation in the unit types that goes a long way making this game more interesting and a game you can savor over time instead of boring and lacking any real theme for what you are fightin with like Memoir 44.

It is true that the early turns are spent manoeuvering for position but that is part of the strategy and tactics.

CC:A is the best in this system of Borg's. Both for beginners and long-time gamers. If I have any complaint it is the rules but that is quibbling.

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: Rules:: Re: Rules clarification

Brigz — Mon, 25 May 2009 18:41:22 +0000

by Brigz

When a unit is ordered it can move and then do combat. The game sequence is: first move all ordered units and then after all units have been moved they may perform combat. Combat is of two kinds - close combat or ranged fire. Since a unit cannot do ranged fire if adjacent to an ememy unit, units can only perform one type of combat per turn. If a unit doesn't move it can still perform combat, ranged fire or close combat whichever is applicable. Obviously, since all movement must be performed before any combat, a unit cannot range fire and then move (unless of course the "Move-fire-move" command card is played.

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: Reviews:: Re: the best of Command and Colors series? I dont think so...

slate43 — Mon, 25 May 2009 18:36:26 +0000

by slate43

drunkenKOALA wrote:
Who cares about either? There's Manoeuvre.

Hey Koala,

I noticed you do not own Manoeuvre. Could you explain your reply further? I have been considering both Manoeuvre and CC:A.

Thanks.

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: Reviews:: Re: the best of Command and Colors series? I dont think so...

tech7 — Mon, 25 May 2009 18:35:06 +0000

by tech7

aerial7 wrote:

Having played BattleLore Epic, I'm definitely looking forward to playing Ancients that way....I just need to figure out what bits I need to buy....

Battlelore Epic is imo quite different to C&C:A Epic. I think that Battlelore epic is the way to play the game, since it corrects some flaws of the normal games while C&C:A Epic (or Memoir Overlord) shines only with the suggested number of players, but the basegame is also fine.

But in order to help.

You need at least C&C:A base game, + expansion 2+3. However, 3 of the 4 epic scenarios say that you need blocks from the first expansion. I think that it is possible to sbstitute the missing units by using spares, but I'm not sure,

Furthermore, there is a new epic expansion on the horizon. With adds a lot of new scenarios. (Which will most likely need expasnison 1,2,3)

Therefore, I would buy exp 2+3. This will be enough to try the epic game, and gives you nearly 40 new scenarios for the standard game and two mounted maps.

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: Reviews:: Re: the best of Command and Colors series? I dont think so...

Rob Doupe — Mon, 25 May 2009 18:03:52 +0000

by Rob Doupe

Strope wrote:
Too heavy for it's depth? It has more tons more depth than M' 44 at a marginal increase in complexity. This is one of the easiest wargames out there. I think you might stepped out of your comfort zone, and realized wargames just aren't for you. There's nothing wrong with that. Play the games you enjoy.

That's quite an assumption. I'm not the OP, but I am a wargamer who thinks C&C:A is too much work for such a light game. I'll happily play heavy wargames, such as the OCS series, Here I Stand, Berg's Ancient World series, etc., so long as the rules overhead generates a corresponding depth of gameplay or immersion. And I do enjoy the C&C system. Battle Cry is one of my favourite games.

However, compared to Battle Cry, Ancients has about 30 per cent more depth, at the cost of 200 per cent more overhead. I'm not willing to make that trade-off for what, at the end of the day, is still a very light, luck-driven game.

To me, the extra rules and unit variations of C&C:A are like putting together a bunch of house rules to make checkers more detailed and complex. If I want to play checkers, I'll play checkers (read Battle Cry). If I want to play a deeper game, I won't pull out checkers - no matter how much chrome is stuck to it.

Thread: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: Rules:: Rules clarification

hank__hill — Mon, 25 May 2009 17:59:15 +0000

by hank__hill

I just read through the rules and needed some clarification on what can be done after an order is given to a unit. In reading the rules it appears that the unit can only move, cc, or ranged fire. When reading the examples that does not appear to be true. A unit can move then CC, or ranged fire then move. Can a unit Ranged fire, move, and then CC?

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: Reviews:: Re: the best of Command and Colors series? I dont think so...

aerial7 — Mon, 25 May 2009 17:55:59 +0000

by aerial7

Completely disagree with the review. If you're still playing with little green army men, I suppose M'44 has it's place, but even my 9 yo stopped playing it because it wasn't realistic enough for him. (And the kid's not exactly been steeped in military stuff either.) We still drag M'44 out occasionally, but it's more just to remind ourselves of how bad it is. Maybe it gets better by the time you're done collecting everything for it -- we only have the base game -- but I have too many other things ranked higher on my wishlist...

I do remember the first attempt at playing Ancients -- I had a headache by the time I gave up on it. But these days there are enough great reference cards that we can now enjoy the game. The problem with the game isn't the graphic design -- it looks good enough -- but rather the visual design. With such a variety of units, the blocks should convey a lot more information about the units abilities.

Having played BattleLore Epic, I'm definitely looking forward to playing Ancients that way....I just need to figure out what bits I need to buy....

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: Reviews:: Re: the best of Command and Colors series? I dont think so...

Strope — Mon, 25 May 2009 17:24:16 +0000

by Strope

Too heavy for it's depth? It has more tons more depth than M' 44 at a marginal increase in complexity. This is one of the easiest wargames out there. I think you might stepped out of your comfort zone, and realized wargames just aren't for you. There's nothing wrong with that. Play the games you enjoy.

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: Reviews:: Re: the best of Command and Colors series? I dont think so...

John Rogers — Mon, 25 May 2009 16:28:45 +0000

by John Rogers

Good Review.

Yes CCA is slower (50mins) than M44 ('bout 30mins) but it is also the deeper, and in my opinion the better of the two.

My friend owns M44 (+3 of the expansions) and I would heartily recommend it to newbies (especially guys) who enjoy the WW2 period. The troop movements are easy to memorize but it does take time to figure out the terrain (after 30+ games we still use the reference cards on occasion).

Ancients is a different animal. The troop diversity is much deeper and more complex (leaders, elephants, foot, mounted, specialty units etc) but the diversity in strategy is worth it. I own all the expansions and I'm so glad I do. Yes after 20+ plays we still use the reference sheets but not for EVERY move, that's why there called REFERence sheets.

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: Reviews:: Re: the best of Command and Colors series? I dont think so...

Dweeb — Mon, 25 May 2009 16:26:20 +0000

by Dweeb

I play this game on a near-weekly basis, and from sit-down to pack-up it's never more than 1 hr. That even includes deciding which scenario to play.

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: Reviews:: Re: the best of Command and Colors series? I dont think so...

Jambo — Mon, 25 May 2009 15:09:04 +0000

by Jambo

In total contrast to the OP, I found CC:A easy to learn, easy and quick to play and absolutely fantastic fun. I found the reference sheet moderately useful in my first couple of games, but thereafter I haven't touched one since. All the units really play as you'd imagine them to, with the lighter units sacrificing raw power for greater manoeuvrability and vice versa. Just goes to show how interesting and diverse people can be.

CC:A is also quite unique in that it plays really well solo.

:)

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: General:: Re: Punic Wars scenarios?

HeinzGuderian — Mon, 25 May 2009 14:45:17 +0000

by HeinzGuderian

Bagradas is an excellent scenario to start with. Not only does it represent a battle from the First Punic War, it has a very representative army for each side (multilingual, predominantly light army for Carthage, perfectly arrayed manipular legionary army for Rome), has no terrain and a pretty straightforward tactical situation.

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: General:: Re: Punic Wars scenarios?

peapicker — Mon, 25 May 2009 14:22:05 +0000

by peapicker

2nd edition of C&C:A includes these scenarios from the 2nd Punic war in the box:
Ticinus River, Trebbia, Lake Trasimenus, Cannae, Dertosa (Ebro), 2nd Beneventum, Castulo, Baecula, Metaurus, Ilipia, Great Plains, and Zama. These are scenarios 004 through 015.

Bagradas (003) is from the 1st Punic War.

In other words, most of the 15 included scenarios qualify. :D

I'm fascinated with the whole Rome/Carthage conflict of the Punic wars, particularly the 2nd. Anyway, I had recorded this info on another geeklist, which may give you a list of games your friend will also have an interest in... http://www.boardgamegeek.com/geeklist/24783/

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: Reviews:: Re: the best of Command and Colors series? I dont think so...

Rob Doupe — Mon, 25 May 2009 13:58:44 +0000

by Rob Doupe

I agree that C&C:A is a fiddly implimentation of what is, at heart, a very light system. For ease of play and fun value, my favourite game using the C&C system is Battle Cry. It is somewhat less tactically sound, simulation-wise, than C&C:A. But on the other hand, it's far easier and quicker to play.

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: Reviews:: Re: the best of Command and Colors series? I dont think so...

tech7 — Mon, 25 May 2009 13:48:01 +0000

by tech7

Battleback slows down the game for one simple reason. In Memoir there is nearly no reason for a full strength infantry not to attack a tank, but in C$C:A you have more to think about the possible consequences.

Imo, this and several other rules makes C&C:A a better game, but it looses some of the light-hearted appeal of Memoir.

Therefore I'm glad that I own both.

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: General:: Re: Pyrrus Epic Scenarios

Desi — Mon, 25 May 2009 13:37:07 +0000

by Desi

I liked the Pyrric Campaign for several reasons:

- The series of battles is historically contained, with none of the battles being decisive
- Excellent unit diversity with the bonus of phalanx vs legion
- Excellent terrain diversity
- Allows for the use of the phalanx variant
- Romans, Epiriots, Carthaginians (could even add Macadonians if you added a battle in Epirus after Pyrrus returned home)

Epic battles would be best for a Campaign series:

- Provides more units to increase the survivability percentage for the selected unit
- Reduces the impact of any "special" effects the campaign rules may grant to the selected unit as it progresses from battle to battle

Campaign Effects:

- Unit could earn "special" effects based upon # enemy unit steps removed, # enemy units eliminated

Possible Earned Effects (in no particular order)

- extra step
- re-roll of a single die
- earn a leader
- earn hits on sword or leader
- ability to be activated by "other cards"

The idea of following a unit through the campaign is popular among the Squad Leader types. As the unit gets stronger one has to decide when to risk it, and in CCA a unit can be destroyed very quickly. The possibility of winning the battle but losing a Campaign because your Heavy Calvary unit was left exposed adds a lot of extra tension to an already tense gaming experience.

Just some thoughts.

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: Reviews:: Re: the best of Command and Colors series? I dont think so...

goshublue — Mon, 25 May 2009 13:33:06 +0000

by goshublue

I don't have any experience with any other games in the C&C series so I can't speak to the comparison with Memoir 44 but there are some points in the review I think should be addressed because I think they sell it short.

Compared to other wargames, CCA's rules are neat and simple and the learning curve shallow. The variety of units are a strength of the game (particularly the rules for Light units) and minimal play time is required to memorise their attributes. After 3 plays you will rarely need to refer to the reference cards. Gamers are generally intelligent people and remembering simple rules for 12 units is really not that hard when you look across the spectrum of wargaming. CCA is about as light as I would personally want to go yet it still manages to deliver great tactical bang for buck.

I have to say that over 40 minutes play time is excessive. Once familiar with the game it flows extremely smoothly and quickly. It's one of the reasons I chose the game and the advertised play time of less than an hour per battle is accurate. In fact I would rarely find a battle taking longer than 30 to 40 minutes with experienced players.

I'm not sure why battle back would slow the game. The increased attrition it generates could surely only speed it up. I actually think it's one of the strongest features of CCA, adding realism to what is a reasonably abstract game. It's a great balancing rule, mitigating the card based unit ordering system where the possibility of an absence of cards for the defender to counter an attack in one section of the battlefield could otherwise lead to bizarre results. This isn't criticism of a game I haven't played but I find it hard to imagine playing a C&C game where units would sit still and take repeated pounding without fighting back because the cards required to order them are not available.

Many find the blocks much easier to move for game play than figures and I do think they look great, just like ranked formations.

Your points are all valid if the game doesn't appeal to you but when it comes down to it they are indications of your preferences, not faults with the game. It rewards repeated play and if you only plan to play it a couple of times then perhaps it would be too complex but this would surely only apply to extremely casual play. Personally I've found CCA to be everything it's advertised to be.......light on rules, deep on strategy, high on variety and replayability, quick to play, challenging and, most importantly, heaps of fun.

Brent.

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: Reviews:: Re: the best of Command and Colors series? I dont think so...

Umbratus — Mon, 25 May 2009 13:23:25 +0000

by Umbratus

Thanks for all the other opinions, especially your elaborated one, Mary.

I wasnt aware of Manoeuvre before, so I checked it out. Its a somewhat more abstract game as I found out. At 40€ its not really that much cheaper, but it does look cheaper for sure with that thin maps and tiny cards. Its sold out at my sources anyways.

Reading other reviews and considering what I am looking for, I am strongly leaning towards C&C:Ancients, never mind the price, but I'll ponder that for another while :)

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: Reviews:: Re: the best of Command and Colors series? I dont think so...

jpat — Mon, 25 May 2009 13:18:53 +0000

by jpat

My complaint about Ancients, relative to the other C&C games, is that for each of the three games I've played, I've felt like I had to go back and relearn the rules because, at least for me, the logic of the symbols and exceptions isn't all that clear. Granted, I played those three games with substantial intervals between them, and the UniversalHead player aid cars help immensely, but I just have never crossed that threshold where I wasn't fiddling around with what each unit did.

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: Reviews:: Re: the best of Command and Colors series? I dont think so...

elcomadreja2 — Mon, 25 May 2009 13:17:13 +0000

by elcomadreja2

I had pretty much the same thoughts with my first plays, with the added frustration of not having anyone around that knew the in game tactics. Consider laying the blocks flat so you can look from the top and see everything. (or use 1 block with a die next to it)
Also, yes this tends to be slow until you play the same scenario, say, 4 or 5 times fairly close together, after which things start clicking, and you recognize quickly the things that you really want to do.

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: Reviews:: Re: the best of Command and Colors series? I dont think so...

sodaklady — Mon, 25 May 2009 13:12:38 +0000

by sodaklady

Sounds like C&C:A is just what you're looking for, Joel. The several types of units add a degree of difficulty but they also add strategy and interest. And even though there are more types to remember, you don't start by playing with ALL of them. After a couple of games of the first scenario, you're ready to move on and learn another type or two.

As for slowing it down, I don't see how Battle Back applies. Your unit attacks me on your turn, I attack you back. How is that slower than waiting for my turn (and hoping I have a corresponding card) to attack you? I can't see how Evade slows it down, either; it makes your unit harder to hit, then you move any remaining pieces back 2 hexes.

I never thought of the beginning of the game as slow, maybe it is. But it's the point where you decide a strategy and begin the maneuvering to implement it. You don't have to piddle around with the light units while you wait for the slower units to catch up. It's nice if they're all in a line, but not necessary. It all depends on the scenario, your cards, and your plan.

I bought it because I enjoyed Memoir but felt it was too light; I wanted something with a bit more. C&C:A suits me just fine as a light, fun war game.

I'm sorry that Leonardo didn't enjoy it, but as you said, maybe he was looking for a more casual game and Memoir hits his sweet spot in that way.

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: Reviews:: Re: the best of Command and Colors series? I dont think so...

Shatner — Mon, 25 May 2009 13:03:06 +0000

by Shatner

My first play was slow, but then proceeding play took about 30 minutes

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: Reviews:: Re: the best of Command and Colors series? I dont think so...

kalevi1999 — Mon, 25 May 2009 12:49:47 +0000

by kalevi1999

For casual gamers I meant a person who can play a game and enjoy it the first time he plays it having played only Risk... maybe the definition "newbie" better fits the situation. Memoir is a game that newbies can play without much help and win. CCA is not. Most of my friends instead cant now be called newbies since we boardgamed a lot in the 2 years I discovered board games (but still we prefer medium weight games since the hype for board games isnt the same among my friends).

As for CCA... yeah it feels very slow, anybody who played it (with me) reported that. U can master it in a 5 games? Yes. Can u play it and hope to win the first time? Yep. Is there a lot to remember? Yes. Without reference sheet u pratically cant unless u play it very often. If u like to play game with a reference sheet u'll be just fine. I dont :D There always will be a unit u dont remember :p

As long as I got ur point of view u can buy it and like it (with ur buddy).

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: Reviews:: Re: the best of Command and Colors series? I dont think so...

drunkenKOALA — Mon, 25 May 2009 12:47:27 +0000

by drunkenKOALA

Who cares about either? There's Manoeuvre.

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: Reviews:: Re: the best of Command and Colors series? I dont think so...

Umbratus — Mon, 25 May 2009 12:30:51 +0000

by Umbratus

Interesting. I was looking around and considering whether to buy this or Memoir'44 recently, getting closer to actually buying C&C: Ancients just today :)

While I have never played any of those and I am not really a wargamer, I am looking for something that plays within an hour or at least not much more, offers some tactical and strategic depthness while rules need to be somewhat simplified and generalized so you can teach how to play in about 10 minutes. Replayability seems to be offered by many scenarios included.
I was pretty positive that C&C: Ancients matches these demands, doesnt it ?

Also, at days, you simply grow tired of another WWII setting and I figured Ancients might help me there with abit more variety and fresh air by some rather different settings all in one box. Thats certainly not saying anything about how good the game is, I do mind that.

I wasnt really thinking this is a game for a casual gamer at all, probably our definition of 'casual gamer' is somewhat differing. For me thats folks who dont regularily play or ask to play games on their own, but who might sometimes join a game when asked to. Now I think neither Memoir'44 or C&C: Ancients is a game I'd play with casual gamers that I know. I am rather thinking about playing this game with one or another buddy who shares some certain geekness but does not want to sit down half a day for one single game, which I do not want either.

So, is it really THAT slow, is there really that much to remember and can you enjoy this game from scratch at all, or do you need 5-10 games before you can really start enjoying it ?

I am talking about an investment of 50€ here, which is rather alot compared with other games I usually buy, so I better make sure. This review gave me quite some doubts.

Review: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: Reviews:: the best of Command and Colors series? I dont think so...

kalevi1999 — Mon, 25 May 2009 11:52:19 +0000

by kalevi1999

I played something like 50 or more games of Memoir '44 and I bought Command and Colors Ancients since I saved my money for a board game (which had to be Bombay, and it will...).

As for the components the game comes in the best box I have ever had! Thick and solid, only Winds of Plunder box comes closer in terms of quality and thicness.

The blocs are a problem: I like them but how they are supposed to be used isnt that good at all. If I put them as I should I never cant see them and I have to low my head close to the game area. Light never hit the images on them... they are bad in the end! Better to lay them flat but if I have to do that I prefer to have counters instead!

As for CCA I was introduced to the game by luigi54, with whom Im running a Memoir '44 Campaign).He introduced me to the "improvements" on the Command and Colors system in compare to Memoir '44:

which essentially are:
-battleback (attacked unit in close combat if doesnt retreat can battle back)
-leaders (allow to ignore retreat flags, allow to score further hits and are specifically mentioned in some cards)
-evade (Attacked unit goes back to hexes, attacker score hit only when the exact symbol matching attacked unit is rolled, dramatically lessening chances to hit).

When I asked Luigi to show CCA he mentioned me that it had to be played with the unit reference sheet since there are a lot units to remember (almost 12 in the base game, while Memoir base game units are 6, at best!). Now its not so hard to memorize all the units since there is a structure in their balance but I consider it a bad thing which slows the game down if u dont play it often.

In order to play the game effectively u must have at least an idea of how an ancient battle and in this regard the game itself does a magnificent job:

For every flag rolled units must retreat for the maximum movement possible and flags can be ignored putting units side by side altogheter. This usually leads to slow beginning of the game in which u deploy ur army and wait (or go) for the big melee while the light units make some preliminar fights.

This is all very cool and historically accurate... but its slow!! Most units are very slow and the evade rule and the battleback rules, while giving a better feel of the battlefield in compare with Memoir they slow down a lot the game.

Maybe I'm getting to affected by the Memoir point of view but the sweetspot of gaming time in order to enjoy the Command and Colors system should be 40 minutes at best!

In the end this is not a game for casual gamers. Its too slow for it offers and there are too many things to memorize for a casual gamers (reference sheet may help but casual gamers dont like to read them). I have a feeling I have better control over the battlefield in compare with Memoir (Days of Wonder should remade the battle deck having CCA deck in mind) since the command cards are better designed.

CONCLUSION:

My friends didnt like it (graphic didnt help), my gf liked it at first but later she thought it was too slow either. I am glad to play it with Luigi but its not enough to own it (4 games of CCA are daunting and arent as fun as 4 games of Memoir!)! I hope my son will like it. I liked it but its too heavy for its depth I sold it and I'll find a copy of Bombay instead!

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: General:: Re: Pyrrus Epic Scenarios

Caesar — Mon, 25 May 2009 05:35:12 +0000

by Caesar

Hi Dan,
I've found your "Pyrrhic campaign" idea very interesting.
Would you like to disccuss it deeply here?
Maybe we could get-out of our "hat" something good...
:p
Please, let me know.
Alessandro - www.CCAncients.net ADMIN

Reply: Commands & Colors: Ancients:: General:: Re: Punic Wars scenarios?

GeneSteeler — Mon, 25 May 2009 01:20:13 +0000

by GeneSteeler

Check out:

http://www.ccancients.net/Maps/index.html

They have:

First Punic War (264-241 BC) ( 9 Articles )
Second Punic War (218-202 BC) ( 51 Articles )
Third Punic War (149-146 BC) ( 1 Article )

So, those 61 scenarios should keep you busy!

As above, you could start with the ones with low density and/or small number of different unit types, and ramp up from there.