Power Grid | BoardGameGeek

New Image for Power Grid

bacoon23 — Tue, 10 Nov 2009 01:58:17 +0000

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With poker chips, US map.

Reply: Power Grid:: Rules:: Re: Rule ? on firing plants

BoardGameBondy — Mon, 09 Nov 2009 23:06:30 +0000

Haha wow, that seems pretty obvious in hindsight. My hindsight is 20/20. Thanks for clearing that up, I guess I forgot about the third plant in the context of the original question.

Reply: Power Grid:: Reviews:: Re: Andrew Reviews: "Power Grid"

Karlsen — Mon, 09 Nov 2009 23:05:08 +0000

by Karlsen

You need to find that extra player or two :meeple:

Reply: Power Grid:: Rules:: Re: Rule ? on firing plants

UnknownParkerBrother — Mon, 09 Nov 2009 22:59:01 +0000

by UnknownParkerBrother

Your plant limit is 3, and you usually fire them all, that's why he said 3.

Two works the same way, declare "I fire X and Y, earn this many bucks". Both fire simultaneously.

Reply: Power Grid:: Rules:: Re: Rule ? on firing plants

BoardGameBondy — Mon, 09 Nov 2009 22:56:32 +0000

by BoardGameBondy

Barticus88 wrote:
I say the operation is as follows: Move your fuel wherever you want, but then burn fuel at all three plants simultaneously.

Sorry, what do you mean by all three plants? I thought we were just talking about two plants? Are you referring to the third plant that would be required if you wanetd to shift resources? If the original question is about two plants, I'm just curious about where this third plant you're talking about came from.

Reply: Power Grid:: Rules:: Re: Rule ? on firing plants

UnknownParkerBrother — Mon, 09 Nov 2009 21:42:30 +0000

by UnknownParkerBrother

Yup, simultaneous was the result of the previous thread, at some point you have to declare "I burn X, Y, and Z for this many bucks".

Shuffle around all you want before and after that.

Reply: Power Grid:: Rules:: Re: Rule ? on firing plants

peapicker — Mon, 09 Nov 2009 19:52:55 +0000

by peapicker

Barticus88 wrote:
I say the operation is as follows: Move your fuel wherever you want, but then burn fuel at all three plants simultaneously.

That's how I've always understood it.

Reply: Power Grid:: Rules:: Re: Rule ? on firing plants

Barticus88 — Mon, 09 Nov 2009 19:41:12 +0000

by Barticus88

BeyondMonopoly wrote:
I actually had a very similar situation come up in a game with Freidemann hisself last April, and his ruling was that the fuel for a plant must come from the plant's own storage.

That's the ruling I got when I asked this question years ago. But what if there are only three oil on the hybrid. Can you move a coal, burn it, move a second coal, burn that? I say no, you have to burn a coal and an oil. It's the basic problem with "anytime" rules. There are some atomic operations which may not be interrupted by anytime rules. I say the operation is as follows: Move your fuel wherever you want, but then burn fuel at all three plants simultaneously.

BeyondMonopoly wrote:
You could do it if you wanted to throw away 2 of the oil... I can't contrive why you would want to do that, but there it is.

No you can't. Fuel may only be discarded when you discard a plant.

Reply: Power Grid:: Rules:: Re: Rule ? on firing plants

CrankyPants — Mon, 09 Nov 2009 19:15:01 +0000

by CrankyPants

Great answers, Thanks. Sounds like we played it right.

We allow players to reshuffle resources at any time as long as they all have a legal home. But in the this case there was nowhere to shuffle too. The crux of the argument came down to: Does a PP actually house the resource? or do you own a pool of resources that cannot exceed double the firing cost of your plants? The rules came close enough to answering that query that we reached consensus on how to play it.

DaviddesJ wrote:
BeyondMonopoly wrote:
You could do it if you wanted to throw away 2 of the oil... I can't contrive why you would want to do that, but there it is.

There are reasons you might want to throw resources away. I'm pretty sure that is not allowed. Where did you get the idea that you can throw the oil away?

I'm quite certain that intentionally discarding resources is not allowed. Otherwise it would be too easy to buy up all of a resource by simply trashing the excess.

Reply: Power Grid:: Rules:: Re: Rule ? on firing plants

DaviddesJ — Mon, 09 Nov 2009 18:57:09 +0000

by DaviddesJ

BeyondMonopoly wrote:
You could do it if you wanted to throw away 2 of the oil... I can't contrive why you would want to do that, but there it is.

There are reasons you might want to throw resources away. I'm pretty sure that is not allowed. Where did you get the idea that you can throw the oil away?

Reply: Power Grid:: Rules:: Re: Rule ? on firing plants

Throknor — Mon, 09 Nov 2009 18:45:54 +0000

by Throknor

ryudoowaru wrote:
I *believe* (and I don't have the rulebook with me to confirm) that the only two times you can shift the resources on your power plants are:
a) when you purchase a new power plant;
b) when you purchase resources.

If you were able to shift stuff during production, I would think that would kind of invalidate the entire point of keeping resources on each individual power plant. So no, as I have always played the game, you would have to use two of the four oils to run the hybrid plant. (You are still not required to run the coal plant, of course.)

I was about to tell you you were off your rocker as I'm positive you can move your resources around at any time, but then I figured out what you meant. So I'm going to take the liberty of explaining the restriction differently:

The resources can be moved at any time as long as the resources displaced have somewhere to go, and they cannot 'burned' unless they were legally stored on the plant.

In the example given, it could not be done because before firing there would have been six total fuel on the hybrid plant which isn't allowed. If there had been an empty hybrid or oil plant then two of the oils could have been moved there first, then the two coal could have been moved to the desired plant and used.

Or, like above, if you toss the oil; but I'm not actually sure you're allowed to just randomly throw resources away.

Reply: Power Grid:: Rules:: Re: Rule ? on firing plants

BeyondMonopoly — Mon, 09 Nov 2009 18:25:51 +0000

by BeyondMonopoly

I actually had a very similar situation come up in a game with Freidemann hisself last April, and his ruling was that the fuel for a plant must come from the plant's own storage.

You could do it if you wanted to throw away 2 of the oil... I can't contrive why you would want to do that, but there it is.

Reply: Power Grid:: Rules:: Re: Rule ? on firing plants

ryudoowaru — Mon, 09 Nov 2009 18:24:13 +0000

by ryudoowaru

I *believe* (and I don't have the rulebook with me to confirm) that the only two times you can shift the resources on your power plants are:
a) when you purchase a new power plant;
b) when you purchase resources.

If you were able to shift stuff during production, I would think that would kind of invalidate the entire point of keeping resources on each individual power plant. So no, as I have always played the game, you would have to use two of the four oils to run the hybrid plant. (You are still not required to run the coal plant, of course.)

Thread: Power Grid:: Rules:: Rule ? on firing plants

CrankyPants — Mon, 09 Nov 2009 18:13:43 +0000

by CrankyPants

I've played this long enough I'm surprised I haven't come across this situation before:

I've got 1 hybrid plant that uses 2 fuel. I have 4 oils on it.
I've got 1 coal plant that uses 2 fuel. I have 2 coals on it.

Can I fire the hybrid but burn the coal to fuel it? (and not fire the coal plant)

We played that you could not but the rules weren't entirely clear on the matter (and I ended up firing both).

Reply: Power Grid:: General:: Re: Expansion + DIY, has anyone tried it?

maura — Mon, 09 Nov 2009 15:37:16 +0000

by maura

i`m always wondering, why there are high resolution scans of boxsides here at boardgamegeek.

know i know, why!

FYI: the puplisher, but also the graphic-designer could forbid this.
you can`t copyright a gameidea, but the graphics, name and the rules are.

but i don`t see a real problem in this in the moment.
the quality of the components of a puplished boardgame is lot better than DIY-games.

and it won`t be much cheaper.
i think, that most people, who make the games by thereself, would buy the game, if they have the possibilty.

so i don`t think, that pirate boardgames will be the same problem like downloading music or software (expect, if people printed the stuff professional and sell the game!).

but it`s still illegal, you shouldn`t forget this.

just want to mention this.

aloha,
maura

Reply: Power Grid:: Variants:: Re: Handicapping for new players?

CrankyPants — Mon, 09 Nov 2009 14:13:37 +0000

by CrankyPants

Update: New player won with no handicap. Though we did give him a lot of advice.

Power Plants also came out very uneven. Got lots of 20s and low 30s early. A few people got game ending plants and then the teens came out and pushed the 5s and 6s back up to the futures market. We never made it to Step 3.

Game ended with 15 builds and 2 players powering 13. I could power 11 (5,4,2). Another player ended at 7! He hoarded his money and was holding out for a 5 or 6 to drop -- never did. In the last 3 auctions, nothing higher than a 3 made it into the current market and no one wanted to bid a 3 (to upgrade a 1 or 2) in fear that one would drop.

We still had a great time.

Reply: Power Grid:: General:: Re: Expansion + DIY, has anyone tried it?

Wraith — Mon, 09 Nov 2009 11:46:41 +0000

by Wraith

minordemon wrote:
Travis: As long as we're being technical here. I didn't see any mention of you being allowed to print the downloaded manual, did you?

I believe you will find that in most countries, copyright law doesn't generally care about the form of the copies. If the copyright holder says you can make a copy, but doesn't otherwise limit the form of that copy, you aren't automatically limited. Rio Grande Games says we can copy the rules (by making it freely available on their web site) so we can print it too.

Anyway, even without printing it, you can always just learn to play off your laptop screen.

None of this is particularly technical. You say copyright law makes creating your own version of a game illegal. It doesn't. It's as simple as that.

Don't worry you won't go to court for any copyright violation, as long as you're not selling it.

Sounds like you need to read up on copyright law. Selling the copies is neither here nor there as far as copyright law is concerned. The copyright holder is probably more likely to find it worthwhile to sue if you are selling copies, but the legality of copy-making isn't generally affected by whether the copies are being sold.

Look, jumping up and down about copyright legalities isn't going to stop anyone making their own games. The law just isn't there to stop it, and would be ridiculously hard to enforce even if it was. Why not focus on the argument that won't just get people to scoff at you? Say, the argument that the game is really pretty good value for the great majority, so much more worth buying than trying to copy.

Reply: Power Grid:: General:: Re: Expansion + DIY, has anyone tried it?

minordemon — Mon, 09 Nov 2009 08:21:42 +0000

by minordemon

Travis: As long as we're being technical here. I didn't see any mention of you being allowed to print the downloaded manual, did you?
Don't worry you won't go to court for any copyright violation, as long as you're not selling it.

Randall: I'll join you! :snore::snore::snore:

New Image for Power Grid

cdbass — Mon, 09 Nov 2009 05:05:38 +0000

by cdbass

]]>

Replacement Elektro chip set for Power Grid.

Session: Power Grid:: Isleworth Boardgamers go easy on the newbie.......

Emsdad — Sun, 08 Nov 2009 20:00:03 +0000

by Emsdad

Wednesday November 4th, 2009
Venue: London Apprentice, Isleworth

(USA map)

Despite being new to the game, Ian and David joined Steph and Scott in finding unique strategies for the game. Scott started with powering 2 coal for one city in the northeast, Ian with 2 for one in the mid-southeast (he had picked powerplant #5, the 'alterative' fuel), David with 3 coal for two cities in the very southeast, and Stephanie with 1 oil for one city in the north.

Steph had built just one city, so dropped from being 'first' to the much beloved last place. The next few rounds progressed smoothly with Scott choosing multi-fuels, Steph sticking with oil, Ian branching into economical wind power, and David into Oil as well, each player shooting up and down in the playing order, until David dropped a bombshell in round three, purchasing #31 (3 coal for six cities).

Things started to get a bit confusing at this point. Scott was powering well, but was starting to look a bit trapped with pressure from Steph in the west and Ian in the south. David had a great plant, but was struggling to build his cities up to make the expenditure worth it. Ian was powering incredibly cheaply, but the lack of higher capacity plants was preventing growth. Stephanie, on the other hand, seized her opportunity to trigger Stage 2.

Soon after, Scott and Ian entered a tussle for powerplants. Ian won, purchasing #25 (2 coal for 5). It came at a pricey 39, but allowed some much needed growth - finally putting some serious pressure on Steph's expansion potential. The next round a similar battle occurred between Scott and Ian over the #30 (3 garbage for 6), Scott won but paying a hefty 61 and with Ian last to bid on plants that round he ended up with the #32 (3 oil for 6) for cost.

That round, things were again shifting, the coal market was beginning to look very scarce and Scott took the lead with 14 cities, exceeding his capacity but triggering Step 3 with the removal of the #11 and #14 stuck in the market. Ian was right behind with 13, David was at 10 and had no need to boost it further with his plants, Steph stayed at 10 also to ensure being in last position the #36 (3 coal for 7) was in the market and she would be the only one guaranteed to fuel it.

The next round could easily signal the end of the game with Scott and Ian only 3/4 cities away from the end trigger of 17. Scott was first to bid in the auction and put up the #46 (3 coal/oil for 7), lots of interest from all put this up high but despite Steph being the only one able to get the #36 she pushed this up higher and took it for 75. David won the #40 (2 oil for 6) for 65, Ian the #44 (wind power for 5) for 50 and Scott the #35 (1 oil for 5) for cost; The #36 remained in the market.

At this point everyone had 16 capacity except Scott on 13 (desperately hoping for another round to happen so he could get to 18 capacity next round with the #38 (3 garbage for 7) now in the market. However, since Steph had bid far too high on the #46 and David decided not to power his #31 at the end of last round for fear of a coal shortage, neither of them were in a position to get to 16 to stop Ian who had just enough to get to 17 cities and trigger the end of the game.

I'm not too sure how David felt by the end of the game but a fun game and congratulations to Ian for winning his first game, we'll make sure not to let him get away with anything next time.

The final scores were as follows (plants in order of purchase):

Ian 17 cities (16 powered), 150 electro, plants #5, #13, #18, #25, #32, #44
Steph 14 cities (14 powered), 142 electros, plants #9, #12, #16, #19, #20, #29, #46
Scott 14 cities (13 powered), 189 electros, plants #4, #15, #23, #22, #30, #35
David 12 cities (12 powered), 136 electros, plants #8, #7, #31, #28, #40

For more reports, and to check out the general vibe of the IBG, check out our blog - http://isleworthboardgamers.blogspot.com/

Reply: Power Grid:: General:: Re: Expansion + DIY, has anyone tried it?

Barticus88 — Sun, 08 Nov 2009 04:07:29 +0000

by Barticus88

:snore::snore::snore:

Reply: Power Grid:: General:: Re: Expansion + DIY, has anyone tried it?

Wraith — Sun, 08 Nov 2009 03:16:52 +0000

by Wraith

minordemon wrote:
Have you ever noticed the little c in a circle? Maybe you should look it up on the Wikipedia, it's there for a reason.

In many countries, at least, copyright law doesn't apply to game mechanics and systems, only to the text of a particular expression of them (ie. the rulebook itself, which the publisher allows to be downloaded and printed freely). Patent law is what covers game mechanics, and patents have much stricter requirements than copyright. I seriously doubt that the designer has a patent on the Power Grid mechanics.

The art and similar creative intellectual property associated with a game is covered by copyright, but the suggestion was to buy the cards and boards, not make illegal copies of them. There's no law that requires purchased cards and boards to be used only with purchased game tokens (or game tokens purchased only from the same source).

If you did care to make your own power plant deck, you could do so legally, as long as you came up with your own icons for the various resources, used different pictures of power plants (or none at all) and perhaps used a different typeface and/or positioning of the elements of the card.

There's nothing actually illegal about what was proposed.

I wouldn't do it, but that's because I don't think it would be worthwhile. I'm quite happy to pay what is being asked for a set of high-quality components (better than what I could readily assemble on my own) that I don't have to put great effort into gathering.

Reply: Power Grid:: General:: Re: Expansion + DIY, has anyone tried it?

minordemon — Sun, 08 Nov 2009 02:17:16 +0000

by minordemon

Anjohl wrote:
How exactly would it be stealing? You can get the rules online for FREE, and there is no prohibition agaisnt printing them. You can buy the expansion board in a shop. What you do with those things are up to you...when did "illegal downloading" because confused with DIY gaming?

Have you ever noticed the little c in a circle? Maybe you should look it up on the Wikipedia, it's there for a reason.

Reply: Power Grid:: General:: Re: Expansion + DIY, has anyone tried it?

Anjohl — Sat, 07 Nov 2009 22:12:50 +0000

by Anjohl

Sounds neat! I hope it works out for you. I have been wanting to try out the Atolla Modulis myself.

People need to de-materialize/de-commercialize themselves...it's odd to see how easily people translate "Friese is a nice guy" to mean "using a legally available method to play the game is a crime". Sad.

Reply: Power Grid:: General:: Re: Expansion + DIY, has anyone tried it?

Anjohl — Sat, 07 Nov 2009 22:10:48 +0000

by Anjohl

You arn't stealing anything by using the expansion and printable rules + deck 2 to make your own copy.

Reply: Power Grid:: General:: Re: Expansion + DIY, has anyone tried it?

Anjohl — Sat, 07 Nov 2009 22:10:04 +0000

by Anjohl

How exactly would it be stealing? You can get the rules online for FREE, and there is no prohibition agaisnt printing them. You can buy the expansion board in a shop. What you do with those things are up to you...when did "illegal downloading" because confused with DIY gaming?

Reply: Power Grid:: General:: Re: Collector's Edition

endou_kenji — Sat, 07 Nov 2009 16:02:58 +0000

by endou_kenji

fnord23 wrote:
What collector's edition?

The Brazil/Iberia box? That'll be in normal distribution soon, if it isn't already.

I did see one copy of the EnBV Funkenschlag in the used section, and managed to scam the "sample/display" Chinese edition of Power Grid for myself...those were probably the most "collectible" PG items at Essen.

Ah, i meant the collector's box... Didn't knew it came with the Brazil/Iberia expansion. Many thanks!

Reply: Power Grid:: Rules:: Re: Gah, these are terribly confusing rules. Help answer my questions please.

DancerInDC — Sat, 07 Nov 2009 15:28:14 +0000

by DancerInDC

wmshub wrote:
Blott - one piece of advice. Give one job to each person. Power Grid is fiddly, if one person does all the fiddling they'll go crazy. The jobs break down as:

Power plant manager - Draw plants when needed (keeping market properly sorted and, during phases 1 and 2, split into two groups). Throw plants when needed (changing steps or when made obsolete because somebody built enough substations). Place plants under deck when needed (during beaucracy each turn). This is the trickiest job, it should go to whoever knows the rules the best.

Fuel market manager - Restock fuel at end of each turn.

Banker - Duh.

Turn order manager - Updates the turn order markers at the end of each turn.

If you break it down that way, only the power plant manager really has a tricky job. The rest become straightforward, and if everybody knows what they're doing, you can all take care of the fiddliness together and it goes very quickly and with minimum confusion.

Enjoy the game! It's one of my favorites.

Seconded on all this - it definitely helps to dole out the responsibilities. That's part of why I enjoy playing this online - the BSW computer takes care of all those little details!

It's a game that takes awhile to play, but the more I play it, the more I appreciate its complexities.

Reply: Power Grid:: Rules:: Re: Gah, these are terribly confusing rules. Help answer my questions please.

rmartinc — Sat, 07 Nov 2009 11:22:11 +0000

by rmartinc

The player aid (especially if only using the base game) I like is
http://www.boardgamegeek.com/filepage/15138

Only thing wrong is it says "6 Players: On USA map play only 5 areas", but you reduce it to 5 for all maps. That came from an early edition of the rules

Reply: Power Grid:: General:: Re: Collector's Edition

Karlsen — Sat, 07 Nov 2009 10:30:52 +0000

by Karlsen

As part of our post Essen travelling we went to, amongst many other places, Karlsruhe which is in the EnBW Power Company region. We visited the local specialist games shop and they had two copies of EnBW Funkenshlag just sitting on the shelves (at a 10E premium to the normal one of course). If I didn't already have it I would have swooned.

Also of note in Karlsruhe, Werbear gave me his copy of Funkenshlag (the original). Thanks very much Webear!

Reply: Power Grid:: General:: Re: Expansion + DIY, has anyone tried it?

Gogolski — Sat, 07 Nov 2009 08:56:13 +0000

by Gogolski

Right now, 3/4 of my games sit in storage in my sister's attic. I've got a [thing=29416][/thing] on a shelve at home and I've printed out the [thing=22355][/thing] from the files section, but I've yet to glue them on chipboard to be usable. Use tokens of your choice and I think that this method gives you the cheapest powergrid possible.

Reply: Power Grid:: General:: Re: Expansion + DIY, has anyone tried it?

TermiGator — Sat, 07 Nov 2009 08:20:07 +0000

by TermiGator

Always depends: If you consider it part of your hobby to build your own games it could be worthwile.
If i paint my miniatures I also don't weigh material cost and working time vs. prepainted miniatures, because it's my hobby and I like spending the time.

In any other case if you add all the components you'd have to buy, the gas you'll need to drive to different places and the price of your own workingpower (which you probably should consider somewhere between $5 and $20 per hour) you'll probably reach the conclusion that it's better to:
- get a holiday job
- make an extra hour
- mow the neighbours lawn or babysit his kids
- or something else that earns you the 10-20 extra bucks you'll need to buy the original.

Plus:
- The base plan still gets quite a few plays with us
- Friese is a nice guy

Reply: Power Grid:: General:: Re: Expansion + DIY, has anyone tried it?

crambaza — Sat, 07 Nov 2009 06:24:59 +0000

by crambaza

Isn't the game only $30-$35 online anyway?

Seems like a lot to go through, and NOT save any money...

Reply: Power Grid:: General:: Re: Oooopa ! Compulsive Buyer Could Not Resist Power Grid....but

Sidewynnder — Sat, 07 Nov 2009 05:47:34 +0000

by Sidewynnder

Eric Brosius wrote:
Why do they say it's not their kind of game?

Yea, it isn't like they have played it yet. So how do they know? I will at least try anything once.

Reply: Power Grid:: General:: Re: Expansion + DIY, has anyone tried it?

Dr Lucky — Sat, 07 Nov 2009 05:44:49 +0000

by Dr Lucky

Wraith wrote:
If you only ever want to use the new plant deck and never want to play USA or Germany maps, sure, you could do it. You can buy the little houses separately too (not necessarily from the distributors of Power Grid, but those same houses are sold as generic gaming tokens), and half the players of Power Grid seem to prefer using poker chips to the paper money that comes with the game.

You'd be better off finding some appropriate tokens than tracking resources with pen and paper, I'd say. If tracked via pen and paper, you'd have to keep adding it up over and over to make sure you haven't exhausted the supply. It's more hassle than it is worth to avoid buying some little glass gaming stones or something like that.

But by the time you've got all those pieces, I doubt you would have saved all that much money, and that saving is offset somewhat by the time spent putting it together. Then you wind up with a set that misses many of the options you would have with a standard Power Grid set. You can't play with the original plant deck, you can't play the official variant that combines the plant decks, you can't play China without having to make up your own rules for it.

And I don't see why you would never play USA or Germany again. The benefit of the expansion maps is that they provide variation, but the basic game is what they vary from. If you play a lot of the other maps, USA and Germany become the less-familiar variations. There's no need for special rules to make the game interesting; rather, special rules just add to the variety, and so give their best benefit when not used all the time.

I mean, I can see a group getting burned out on USA and Germany, but this won't happen unless you already own them, in which case, why scavenge to construct an El Cheapo version of a game you already own?

And if you really want to avoid USA and Germany in your base game, you could just order in a foreign version with different maps in the base set, since some foreign versions have maps other than USA and Germany.

I just want to second everything he said, plus add that by euro game standards, Power Grid is really reasonably priced. $45 MSRP (or less than $28 at Boards and Bits) is a steal compared to a lot of other games. You probably can't steal it for that cheap and I don't really support doing it even if you could. Plus, I like the basic power plant deck better than the expansion deck, and while I appreciate the options of the expansion maps, I always go back to the basic maps (usually USA) when teaching new players the game.

Reply: Power Grid:: General:: Re: Expansion + DIY, has anyone tried it?

chrisjwmartin — Sat, 07 Nov 2009 05:25:48 +0000

by chrisjwmartin

Stealing can be cheap: who knew?

New Image for Power Grid

BoardGameBondy — Sat, 07 Nov 2009 04:58:43 +0000

by BoardGameBondy

]]>

I found plastic containers that fit the box perfectly!

Reply: Power Grid:: General:: Re: Expansion + DIY, has anyone tried it?

Wraith — Sat, 07 Nov 2009 04:43:43 +0000

by Wraith

If you only ever want to use the new plant deck and never want to play USA or Germany maps, sure, you could do it. You can buy the little houses separately too (not necessarily from the distributors of Power Grid, but those same houses are sold as generic gaming tokens), and half the players of Power Grid seem to prefer using poker chips to the paper money that comes with the game.

You'd be better off finding some appropriate tokens than tracking resources with pen and paper, I'd say. If tracked via pen and paper, you'd have to keep adding it up over and over to make sure you haven't exhausted the supply. It's more hassle than it is worth to avoid buying some little glass gaming stones or something like that.

But by the time you've got all those pieces, I doubt you would have saved all that much money, and that saving is offset somewhat by the time spent putting it together. Then you wind up with a set that misses many of the options you would have with a standard Power Grid set. You can't play with the original plant deck, you can't play the official variant that combines the plant decks, you can't play China without having to make up your own rules for it.

And I don't see why you would never play USA or Germany again. The benefit of the expansion maps is that they provide variation, but the basic game is what they vary from. If you play a lot of the other maps, USA and Germany become the less-familiar variations. There's no need for special rules to make the game interesting; rather, special rules just add to the variety, and so give their best benefit when not used all the time.

I mean, I can see a group getting burned out on USA and Germany, but this won't happen unless you already own them, in which case, why scavenge to construct an El Cheapo version of a game you already own?

And if you really want to avoid USA and Germany in your base game, you could just order in a foreign version with different maps in the base set, since some foreign versions have maps other than USA and Germany.

Reply: Power Grid:: Sessions:: Re: Ok, Power Grid RULES! (half review/session report)

BoardGameBondy — Sat, 07 Nov 2009 04:40:34 +0000

by BoardGameBondy

Great share on your first experience with PG, sounds similar to the one I had. Just have to throw in there,

Anjohl wrote:
The quality was top notch for $50! All that wood.....so beautiful.

That's what she said.

Reply: Power Grid:: General:: Re: Expansion + DIY, has anyone tried it?

BoardGameBondy — Sat, 07 Nov 2009 04:26:57 +0000

by BoardGameBondy

That's like donwloading music. No support for the artist. But I get what you're saying about not using the base map again.

Thread: Power Grid:: General:: Expansion + DIY, has anyone tried it?

Anjohl — Sat, 07 Nov 2009 04:21:43 +0000

by Anjohl

My friend and I got to talking about how you could do Power Grid "on the cheap", and we came to the conclusion that it would be completeley feasable to buy an expansion, print the rules from online, buy whatever tokens you wanted for $5-$10 in a dollar/craft store, (You can get colored wooden tokens even) and have a $30 copy of PG!

I mean, I doubt we will *ever* use the base map again, so in hindsight, this method might have been a good idea for our group.

Has anyone done this? What challenges did you face? I figured the resource market might be a problem, but it would be feasable to track the resource market via pen and paper.

Reply: Power Grid:: General:: Re: Collector's Edition

fnord23 — Sat, 07 Nov 2009 02:46:06 +0000

by fnord23

What collector's edition?

The Brazil/Iberia box? That'll be in normal distribution soon, if it isn't already.

I did see one copy of the EnBV Funkenschlag in the used section, and managed to scam the "sample/display" Chinese edition of Power Grid for myself...those were probably the most "collectible" PG items at Essen.

Thread: Power Grid:: General:: Collector's Edition

endou_kenji — Sat, 07 Nov 2009 02:26:54 +0000

by endou_kenji

Was the collector's edition sold at Essen a promo-only edition or will it be released to the rest of us mortals who couldn't go?

Reply: Power Grid:: Rules:: Re: Gah, these are terribly confusing rules. Help answer my questions please.

Barticus88 — Sat, 07 Nov 2009 02:10:34 +0000

by Barticus88

Banker is the simplest task conceptually (there are no funny rules to know), but it is actually the most demanding, because it happens in every phase.

Reply: Power Grid:: Rules:: Re: Gah, these are terribly confusing rules. Help answer my questions please.

wmshub — Fri, 06 Nov 2009 22:38:04 +0000

by wmshub

Blott - one piece of advice. Give one job to each person. Power Grid is fiddly, if one person does all the fiddling they'll go crazy. The jobs break down as:

Power plant manager - Draw plants when needed (keeping market properly sorted and, during phases 1 and 2, split into two groups). Throw plants when needed (changing steps or when made obsolete because somebody built enough substations). Place plants under deck when needed (during beaucracy each turn). This is the trickiest job, it should go to whoever knows the rules the best.

Fuel market manager - Restock fuel at end of each turn.

Banker - Duh.

Turn order manager - Updates the turn order markers at the end of each turn.

If you break it down that way, only the power plant manager really has a tricky job. The rest become straightforward, and if everybody knows what they're doing, you can all take care of the fiddliness together and it goes very quickly and with minimum confusion.

Enjoy the game! It's one of my favorites.

Reply: Power Grid:: Rules:: Re: Gah, these are terribly confusing rules. Help answer my questions please.

Blott — Fri, 06 Nov 2009 22:37:58 +0000

by Blott

You guys rock! What is that 4 people answering my questions in less than 10 minutes? Awesome.

Reply: Power Grid:: Rules:: Re: Gah, these are terribly confusing rules. Help answer my questions please.

jsciv — Fri, 06 Nov 2009 22:31:14 +0000

by jsciv

I guess I was too slow!

:p

Reply: Power Grid:: Rules:: Re: Gah, these are terribly confusing rules. Help answer my questions please.

jsciv — Fri, 06 Nov 2009 22:30:29 +0000

by jsciv

1: The smallest power plant currently in the market.

2: Shuffle the draw pile (and only the draw pile). The "with the remaining..." part is redundant verbiage. In theory someone could know the order of the plants left since you've seen them all. This randomizes them.

3: One player buys as much as they want, then the next player buys as much as they want, and so on.

4: One player builds as much as they want, then the next player buys as much as they want, and so on until the last player in turn order has gotten the shaft. :)

Reply: Power Grid:: Rules:: Re: Gah, these are terribly confusing rules. Help answer my questions please.

oeolycus — Fri, 06 Nov 2009 22:29:42 +0000

by oeolycus

By the way I read your 1st question, I just want to check to make sure you're reordering the power plants so that they order numerically each time you draw a new power plant.

Reply: Power Grid:: Rules:: Re: Gah, these are terribly confusing rules. Help answer my questions please.

proclaimed — Fri, 06 Nov 2009 22:29:15 +0000

by proclaimed

1) In the rules for Step 2 & Step 3 it talks about discarding the lowest/smallest power plant "in the game". Am I to assume this means the lowest one in the market? In other words a player who owns the lowest power plant doesn't lose their plant do they?

Yes, from the market. A player will only discard a plant when they exceed their maximum of 3 (or 4 in a 2p game).

2) What does Step 3 mean when it says "Shuffle the draw stack, with the remaining power plants (the power plants that were placed under the draw stack during steps 1 and 2 of the game.)"? What are the "remaining power plants"? Aren't the only ones left in the draw pile the ones that were put under there in steps 1 and 2? Or are you supposed to shuffle in all the ones in the market too?

Shuffle the plants that are left in the deck that you've been removing at the end of each round. This removes the chance that someone remembered the ordered as the plants were removed and makes a decision about an auction because they know what plant is next.

3) How does Buying Resources work in turn order? Is it one player buys as much as they want, and then the next player buys as much as they want, etc.? Or is it the first player buys something, then the next player, etc. until everyone is done buying?

In turn order each person will buy as many resources as they want/can buy before the people behind them purchase any. This allows the players in lower positions to drive up the market price on resources the "winning" players need to purchase.

4) Same question about turn order in Building. Is it one player building as much as they want, and then the next player building as much as they want, etc.? Or is it the first player builds one house, then the next player builds one house, etc. until everyone is done building?

Same idea. Build all that you can/want and when you're done the next guy goes until everyone had a chance to build.

Hope that helps and enjoy. PG is a great game but it will make you feel a bit like an accountant.

Reply: Power Grid:: Rules:: Re: Gah, these are terribly confusing rules. Help answer my questions please.

Daddys_Home — Fri, 06 Nov 2009 22:29:10 +0000

by Daddys_Home

Blott wrote:
1) In the rules for Step 2 & Step 3 it talks about discarding the lowest/smallest power plant "in the game". Am I to assume this means the lowest one in the market?

Exactly.

Blott wrote:
In other words a player who owns the lowest power plant doesn't lose their plant do they?

True

Blott wrote:
2) What does Step 3 mean when it says "Shuffle the draw stack, with the remaining power plants (the power plants that were placed under the draw stack during steps 1 and 2 of the game.)"? What are the "remaining power plants"? Aren't the only ones left in the draw pile the ones that were put under there in steps 1 and 2?

Yes, shuffle the ones you placed under the stack.

Blott wrote:
Or are you supposed to shuffle in all the ones in the market too?

Blott wrote:
3) How does Buying Resources work in turn order? Is it one player buys as much as they want, and then the next player buys as much as they want, etc.?

Yes

Blott wrote:
Or is it the first player buys something, then the next player, etc. until everyone is done buying?

Blott wrote:
4) Same question about turn order in Building. Is it one player building as much as they want, and then the next player building as much as they want, etc.?

Yes

Blott wrote:
Or is it the first player builds one house, then the next player builds one house, etc. until everyone is done building?

Blott wrote:
I'm sure I'll have more later, but these were the biggest questions I had right now.

Sounds like you pretty much get it just needed a little clarification. Have fun.

Reply: Power Grid:: Rules:: Re: Gah, these are terribly confusing rules. Help answer my questions please.

ColtsFan76 — Fri, 06 Nov 2009 22:27:46 +0000

by ColtsFan76

1) Lowest one in the market, yes. The lowest ones owned by players stay until they meet their quota of Power Plants but they get to choose what they discard.

2) The one that were placed under there in steps 1 and 2. The point of the shuffle is so that you don't know what order they are coming (for those crafty players that kept track of the plants as they were getting buried).

3) One player buys as much as he wants before it passes to the next player.

4) Same thing. You have one chance to build as much as you want before it goes to the next player.

Thread: Power Grid:: Rules:: Gah, these are terribly confusing rules. Help answer my questions please.

Blott — Fri, 06 Nov 2009 22:19:52 +0000

by Blott

There are just too many rules questions on this game and I don't have time to dig through them all if I'm going to play this game tonight...So here's my questions:

1) In the rules for Step 2 & Step 3 it talks about discarding the lowest/smallest power plant "in the game". Am I to assume this means the lowest one in the market? In other words a player who owns the lowest power plant doesn't lose their plant do they?

2) What does Step 3 mean when it says "Shuffle the draw stack, with the remaining power plants (the power plants that were placed under the draw stack during steps 1 and 2 of the game.)"? What are the "remaining power plants"? Aren't the only ones left in the draw pile the ones that were put under there in steps 1 and 2? Or are you supposed to shuffle in all the ones in the market too?

3) How does Buying Resources work in turn order? Is it one player buys as much as they want, and then the next player buys as much as they want, etc.? Or is it the first player buys something, then the next player, etc. until everyone is done buying?

4) Same question about turn order in Building. Is it one player building as much as they want, and then the next player building as much as they want, etc.? Or is it the first player builds one house, then the next player builds one house, etc. until everyone is done building?

I'm sure I'll have more later, but these were the biggest questions I had right now.

New Image for Power Grid

Guantanamo — Fri, 06 Nov 2009 17:50:56 +0000

by Guantanamo

]]>

Mike's Mini Meet V

Reply: Power Grid:: General:: Re: Which Power Grid map is best for only 2-players?

piko — Fri, 06 Nov 2009 07:56:19 +0000

by piko

Hi,

then I'll try Italy and the south of US map.

Thanks for sharing your experience.

piko

Reply: Power Grid:: General:: Re: Which Power Grid map is best for only 2-players?

gregrich — Thu, 05 Nov 2009 19:34:20 +0000

by gregrich

I recommend this map, which works really well for 2 players.

Reply: Power Grid:: General:: Re: Which Power Grid map is best for only 2-players?

Barticus88 — Thu, 05 Nov 2009 19:15:54 +0000

by Barticus88

Karlsen wrote:
As a huge Power Grid fan, I would say play something else if you only have two players.

What he said. I have never played Power Grid two player, and I have tired of it three players (after 150 or so 3P games).

But if you want to play 2P or 3P, use long stringy boards. Southern Italy is good. Many combinations on the France board work. Anything that includes the South West US is good.

Reply: Power Grid:: General:: Re: Which Power Grid map is best for only 2-players?

Karlsen — Thu, 05 Nov 2009 18:29:30 +0000

by Karlsen

As a huge Power Grid fan, I would say play something else if you only have two players.

Reply: Power Grid:: General:: Re: Which Power Grid map is best for only 2-players?

dshortdesign — Thu, 05 Nov 2009 17:41:05 +0000

by dshortdesign

Italy. Pretty challenging for two.

Reply: Power Grid:: General:: Re: Which Power Grid map is best for only 2-players?

cayluster — Thu, 05 Nov 2009 17:33:11 +0000

by cayluster

Maps that are long and thin - basically, any map with choke-points, to allow for blocking. When we played PG with 2, we thought the north or south of the US map worked pretty well.

Thread: Power Grid:: General:: Which Power Grid map is best for only 2-players?

piko — Thu, 05 Nov 2009 17:22:46 +0000

by piko

Hi,

is there a Power Grid map that is best or optimized for just 2-players?

Thanks,
piko

Reply: Power Grid:: Reviews:: Re: Andrew Reviews: "Power Grid"

cyclone85 — Wed, 04 Nov 2009 18:22:38 +0000

by cyclone85

Nicely done, Andrew.

This is pointed out quite often, but if you don't like paper money, poker chips work great. A good set of chips can be used for money in a great many games. If you want to keep money secret, just secure each player's chips behind some screen. I personally just hold the chips in my hand as I play. We use chips in most of our games that use paper money.

BTW, good teachers are a valuable, under-appreciated resource. Kudos to you and those like you. Have a :gg: on me.

Reply: Power Grid:: Strategy:: Re: 2-player standard rules

cyclone85 — Wed, 04 Nov 2009 16:16:08 +0000

by cyclone85

Thanks for your input Anjohl and JeVo! :)

I agree. I think I could have paid nearly all my money to take that plant and still "cruised" to a victory. With only two players, it is hard to deny the other person resources -- you can only hope to make them more costly. In practice, I was paying as much for resources (even if they were cheaper) because he could buy 2 resources to power 5 cities and I needed to buy usually double the resources to power 5 cities. Money really wasn't an issue.

The problem was that I needed a turn in which I could buy a plant that allowed me close the "total cities powered" gap. This never occurred during the game due to the way the plants came up. The first time I could purchase a 5-city plant was when step 3 occurred, which meant all plants were available at that time and my opponent could buy a similar plant thus maintaining his lead.

To summarize (IMHO), buying that first 5-city plant turned out to be a game-winning move. I think I would have won if I had bought it and he did win with it. The long-term advantage of owning it far exceeded the intial cost to the extreme point of me spending all my money to obtain it. (I had enough resources to power plants and make money that turn.)
BUT, if I had spent all my money on the 5-city plant and the luck of the draw had pushed the OTHER 5-city plant down into the current market that bidding round, then my opponent would have had a nice advantage in money (being able to buy the second at cost). But at least I think the game would still have been competitive.

I'm done rambling. Thanks for your input everybody!

Reply: Power Grid:: Strategy:: Re: 2-player standard rules

cyclone85 — Wed, 04 Nov 2009 15:28:16 +0000

by cyclone85

UnknownParkerBrother wrote:
cyclone85 wrote:
I let my opponent outbid me for the 5-city plant

I don't see this as "luck".

Your opponent wanted the plant, made the bid needed to win it, and thus won the game. His *play* forced you into a weaker position that turned out to be decisive.

Outbidding me was not "luck". That was a purposeful choice. The "luck" was the lack of availability of another four- or five-city plant for many turns after his purchase. In the after-game discussion, I think I could have won the game even if I had paid most of my cash at that point to buy the plant.

This may be (is) worded poorly, but it seems as if either player can get plants able to power two or three extra cities more than the opponent, it is nearly impossible to overtake them by the endgame. This seems way too easy with only one 5-city plant coming out early, thus making this a less desirable two-player game.

Of course, I could be wrong.

Regardless, thanks for your perspective and response.

Reply: Power Grid:: Strategy:: Re: 2-player standard rules

cayluster — Wed, 04 Nov 2009 12:53:43 +0000

by cayluster

Personally, I don't like Power Grid with any number, but 2 is definitely the least fun. We gave up on it after a half-dozen or so games, but we did find that playing the 3 player rules with 2 improved the game both in terms of tension and game length. Also, use a map with many choke points - that is, one that is long and thin, like the north or south US. Coupled with the right map, playing with the 3 player rules made for some competition and blocking - otherwise, you're just waiting for both players to hit every city, and the whole game becomes about timing (and even that quite limited) and doing math over and over. I know I'm in the minority here, but that's my two cents.

Reply: Power Grid:: Strategy:: Re: 2-player standard rules

JeVo — Wed, 04 Nov 2009 12:26:41 +0000

by JeVo

cyclone85 wrote:
I don't think I made any glaring mistakes and if I had bought the 5-city plant, I think I probably would have had the same easy time of winning this last game.

IMHO the mistake you made was a miscalculation of the value of the first 5 plant. You let it go too cheap to your opponent. If he want the plant, make him pay for it. He should be left alone with almost no cash left. He will have the plant, but no money to buy extra cities.

And with him buying that plant, you should have had the trailing position for quite some time, with all the rewards it brings.

I guess you let him have the 20 or the 25 plant for less then 45. Then you give him the advantage, and you let him keep his money ...

JeVo

Reply: Power Grid:: Rules:: Re: placing high cards after steps 1 & 2 under the deck

Anjohl — Wed, 04 Nov 2009 12:06:09 +0000

by Anjohl

boltongeordie wrote:
An easily overlooked rule. Page 6. Last full paragraph of "Phase 5: Beaurocracy".

Place the highest numbered power plant from the future market face down under the draw stack and draw a new one to replace it. Rearrange the market appropriately (see phase 2: this will change in Step 3, see the steps of the game). Because of this, the highest numbered power plants are collected under the »Step 3« card and become available during step 3 in the game

I think the rulebook could use a reprint personally, with seperate sections for setup, play, and victory, with ALL rules pertaining to each distinct section contained in it. As it is, the rulebook is just a mess. Several very important rules are listed as "important reminders", but arn't actually listed in the main rules *anywhere*!

Reply: Power Grid:: Variants:: Re: Handicapping for new players?

Anjohl — Wed, 04 Nov 2009 12:00:43 +0000

by Anjohl

Benelux. That, or give him a 2 electro discount on connection costs, something like that.

Reply: Power Grid:: Strategy:: Re: 2-player standard rules

Anjohl — Wed, 04 Nov 2009 11:59:35 +0000

by Anjohl

Risk/reward exemplified. Unless that plant you are letting go is expendable, you must bid on it. At the very least, you should force the price high enough that you can pay for enough turns of resources to make your less efficient plants produce as well, if you follow me. IE, you force the bid for plant 29 up to 64 dollars, and your opponent wins for 65; while you buy plant 35 at cost. You now have a 30 dollar allowance with which to buy resources and such for free, as it pertains to the status quo of the game.

Reply: Power Grid:: Reviews:: Re: Andrew Reviews: "Power Grid"

Anjohl — Wed, 04 Nov 2009 11:56:34 +0000

by Anjohl

Wow, you must be everyone's favorite teacher! What you are instilling in your students now will likely pay dividends. I had a grade 6 teacher that noticed I had started reading well above my level into the Tolkien books, and other adult fantasy books. She nurtured that interest, and it has enriched my life ever since.

You are raising the new crop of board game geeks! Kudos.

Reply: Power Grid:: Reviews:: Re: Andrew Reviews: "Power Grid"

baba44713 — Wed, 04 Nov 2009 09:02:41 +0000

by baba44713

Good review. Kudos for not weighing it down with unnecessary rules rehashing or component reviewing, it's nice to see someone simply talking about the game instead of describing it in painful detail (which many other reviews boil down to).

Review: Power Grid:: Andrew Reviews: "Power Grid"

Andrew_C_E — Wed, 04 Nov 2009 06:07:16 +0000

by Andrew_C_E

I will begin this review by laying its overarching bias out in the open: "Power Grid" is my favourite game right now (and thus, the subject of my very first review). I have played it somewhere between 10 and 14 times as of this writing, with between 2 and 4 players (though I am very interested in trying it with 5 and 6 players. Someday... someday....).

Backstory
I initially purchased "Power Grid" for use in my classroom, or more specifically, so that my students during the study period who were done with their homework would have something to do. "Settlers of Catan" went over quite well (in fact, I rearranged my classroom just so that my one big table would be freed up for the explicit purpose of board-games), but I found myself wanting a better gaming experience.

Except, y'know, with 15-year-olds.

We never actually got around to playing "Power Grid" in my classroom; it was a small enough school that extracurriculars absolutely ravaged attendance after about 10 in the morning, but after I left Kansas and moved back to Nebraska, it quickly fell into favour with my local social group (we socialized by playing games, and also by drinking, though I only partook in one of those activities more than once).

There are 3 aspects of "Power Grid" that make this my favourite game:

1) The thing that I like the most about "Power Grid" is also a thing that is perhaps deceptive at first: the primary mechanic of this game is not the auctions, nor the house-building, nor the power-plant buying; instead, it is the turn-order jockeying. Everything else in the game is subservient to turn-order, as near as I can tell.

As such, when I teach this game (I've played it with probably 10 different people, ranging from my high-school age step-brother (who LOVES it) to friends a few years older than me), the thing that I stress more than anything is turn-order, and how it's manipulated. I find that this forces me to be conscious of my current goals, and to play my moves accordingly.

2) Secondly, I appreciate the nature of player interaction within this game. It never really feels like "multi-player solitaire" (as so many Euros are accused of being) because players are constantly feeling the ramifications of the decisions of others (I would contend that the only time the game becomes truly adversarial is during the auction phase), be it during the resource-buying phase or the placement of power plants (as, particularly in Step 1, cities are exclusive: if I take them, no one else gets to until later. Throughout the game, power plants and resources at a given price also fall under the same type of exclusivity, to various degrees).

This forces players to play around each other, and introduces the possibility of screwage or blockage, but even then, I feel as though players are rewarded for making the best decisions for themselves more than making the worst decisions for their opponents.

Moreover, the turn-order mechanic can be jockeyed all over the place depending on what a given player needs to do. With this in mind, recovering from screwage is much easier than it is in many other games with this much player interaction. Also: no screwage is permanent. If a player plays well, then there is always a chance to win (up until the game is over, at which point if you haven't won yet, you're probably not going to until at least next time).

3) Finally, I like the rhythm and flow of the game, both within turns and throughout the game. There's just enough downtime to plan for the next phase, and while decision-making is complex, the complexity comes from the interactions of several very simple systems, rather than one large mass of rules.

All that said, there are a few things that I dislike about "Power Grid":

1) Firstly, I dislike how fiddly it all is, particularly in the resource track and also with money/Electros. This is not a knock against the game, as I find it to be much less bothersome here than in, say, "Agricola" or "Pandemic", but the resource track is tough for those of us who are somewhat clumsy, and paper money has always annoyed me in games (though never worse than in "Monopoly" - grah!). This isn't a major concern, but I'm anal enough that it occasionally bothers me.

2) Secondly, I think I'd have a hard time using this in the classroom (I'm an English teacher, though not teaching this semester). This is more commentary on the profession than it is anything else, but between the time it takes to play (at least 1 hour) and the lack of immediate relevance to "The Language Arts", this one probably won't fly anytime soon.

(That said, for the Reading Skills seminar that I taught last year, I'd bring in board games from time to time and the kids who mostly just needed to learn how to read carefully and check for comprehension (rather than those who struggled with the basic mechanics) would sit down and, over the course of a few days, figure out how to play the game. The next time I teach a Reading Skills course, I'll be able to take advantage of my much larger collection of board-games)

3) Finally, this isn't the best game to play with people of disparate skill level (though it is much friendlier to learn than, say, "Race for the Galaxy"); there's not anywhere near enough luck to compensate for a lack of meta-strategic knowledge about the game, and while the theme goes a long way toward making the game make sense (the rules themselves are pretty simple, by my standards), the "real" mechanic of turn-jockeying takes a few plays to really get, as do the values of the various power-plants.

Final Summary

To summarize, though, "Power Grid" is still my favourite game. I'm a harsh grader, and I hold the games I play to similarly high standards (higher, even, because they are professionally done), but there aren't too many scenarios in which I wouldn't be willing to play it, and quite a few scenarios in which I wish I could be playing.

I trust that this is the hallmark of, at the very least, a pretty darn good boardgame.

Reply: Power Grid:: Strategy:: Re: 2-player standard rules

UnknownParkerBrother — Wed, 04 Nov 2009 05:44:53 +0000

by UnknownParkerBrother

cyclone85 wrote:
I let my opponent outbid me for the 5-city plant

I don't see this as "luck".

Your opponent wanted the plant, made the bid needed to win it, and thus won the game. His *play* forced you into a weaker position that turned out to be decisive.

Reply: Power Grid:: Sessions:: Re: I "mavericked" my way to victory...

Danath — Wed, 04 Nov 2009 02:17:50 +0000

by Danath

I did the same thing with my brother in a two player game. He was always buying the better plant and supply 2-4 cities more then me but I was buying all his resources and making him pay for it. As the last bit I caught up in cities and I have 156 electos or whatever the money is called to his 60 something.

Reply: Power Grid:: Strategy:: Re: 2-player standard rules

esok — Tue, 03 Nov 2009 16:16:35 +0000

by esok

If more "churn" is needed in the power plant deck, then use the rule for the Benelux map where you trash the lowest power plant each Bureaucracy.

I've played a 2-player game and didn't like it much, either.

Reply: Power Grid:: Rules:: Re: buracracy phase

JeVo — Tue, 03 Nov 2009 09:03:14 +0000

by JeVo

;)our good old Russ,

never too tired to point people to the FAQ :)

Keep pushing them to the right path. :p

Reply: Power Grid:: Variants:: Re: Handicapping for new players?

mrorwell — Tue, 03 Nov 2009 02:56:35 +0000

by mrorwell

cpf86 wrote:
actually this was stated as in the rules for new players. anyway,

Shows how long it's been since I read the rules from start to finish!

when u give an handicap, he'll understand the dynamics of the game wrongly and when u remove the handicap, he'll suffer.

That's a very good point.

Reply: Power Grid:: Variants:: Re: Handicapping for new players?

cpf86 — Tue, 03 Nov 2009 02:22:19 +0000

by cpf86

mrorwell wrote:
StevenE wrote:
*Play only 3 or 4 rounds then start over again.

This gets my vote.... And while playing, explain your reasons for buying/not buying, placing/not placing, powering/not powering.

actually this was stated as in the rules for new players. anyway, i think a combination of playing shorter game, explaining and advice is better than giving a handicap. when u give an handicap, he'll understand the dynamics of the game wrongly and when u remove the handicap, he'll suffer.

"holy crap, i thought i always have enough money to buy 3 cities in the 1st turn? what happened now? i'm screwed"

Reply: Power Grid:: Variants:: Re: Handicapping for new players?

Eric Brosius — Mon, 02 Nov 2009 23:18:52 +0000

by Eric Brosius

The first suggestion, since there's no secret info, is to offer "if at any time you want advice, just ask and we'll give you the best advice we can." That allows the new player to decide when he or she wants to get advice.

Reply: Power Grid:: Rules:: Re: high power plant cards

hammertime7777 — Mon, 02 Nov 2009 22:41:48 +0000

by hammertime7777

Thanks alot

Reply: Power Grid:: Rules:: Re: high power plant cards

cyclone85 — Mon, 02 Nov 2009 21:52:17 +0000

by cyclone85

The player aid cards (same size as the plant cards) are good at illustrating this point. Phase 5 lists this rule for steps 1 & 2 and the "remove the lowest numbered power plant" rule for step 3.

Reply: Power Grid:: Rules:: Re: high power plant cards

boltongeordie — Mon, 02 Nov 2009 21:27:54 +0000

by boltongeordie

Just at the end of phase 5.

Thread: Power Grid:: Rules:: high power plant cards

hammertime7777 — Mon, 02 Nov 2009 21:23:30 +0000

by hammertime7777

Do you place the highest plant card on the bottom of the deck at the end of each phase of step 1 and each phase of step 2,or just at phase 5 of each round?

Reply: Power Grid:: General:: Re: What Charity does Friedemann Friese support?

Barticus88 — Mon, 02 Nov 2009 19:56:30 +0000

by Barticus88

Johan wrote:
According to the text on the tin where I put my donation for the Umspannwerk, the money went to clowns for the children's ward at the Bremen hospital.

But they never told you that the clowns have green hair.

Reply: Power Grid:: General:: Re: What Charity does Friedemann Friese support?

Eldard — Mon, 02 Nov 2009 18:44:55 +0000

by Eldard

Charity is a lap-dancer in Baltimore, USA.

Reply: Power Grid:: Strategy:: Re: 2-player standard rules

dkeisen — Mon, 02 Nov 2009 18:30:31 +0000

by dkeisen

I have the same problem with Power Grid regardless of player count. This was less of a problem with the original Funkenschlag because longer game length required more turnover of plants and because the steeper decline in payout for more productive cities made a good plant less valuable. But it seems a serious issue with an otherwise very strong design in Power Grid.

Reply: Power Grid:: General:: Re: What Charity does Friedemann Friese support?

Johan — Mon, 02 Nov 2009 17:56:49 +0000

by Johan

According to the text on the tin where I put my donation for the Umspannwerk, the money went to clowns for the children's ward at the Bremen hospital.

Reply: Power Grid:: Variants:: Re: Handicapping for new players?

peapicker — Mon, 02 Nov 2009 17:54:23 +0000

by peapicker

CrankyPants wrote:

We try to tell people who are about to play a game like this for the first time: "You are most likely going to lose." and give them the chance to lose at some other game.

Fixed that for you! :p

Thread: Power Grid:: Strategy:: 2-player standard rules

cyclone85 — Mon, 02 Nov 2009 17:14:39 +0000

by cyclone85

[thing=2651][/thing] I have played 2-player Power Grid a few times. After my last game, I was pretty disillusioned at this being worth the time as a two-player game. It seems that the relative randomness of how power plants can come out in the early game can really skew how the game plays out.

For example, early on two "five city" power plants hit the board. One was the last available power plant in the current market and the other was the first available power plant in the future market. I let my opponent outbid me for the 5-city plant, but the luck of the draw put a lowered number plant in the current market. And then turn after turn went by without another 5-city or higher plant becoming available. (Actually, it took quite a while for even a 4-city plant to become available.) The result was that my opponent was able to potentially (and actually) power more cities than I could each turn and I could not find a method to catch up due to the distribution of the cards. He was always able to stay ahead and eventually won by ending the game before I could get big enough plants bought. I don't think I made any glaring mistakes and if I had bought the 5-city plant, I think I probably would have had the same easy time of winning this last game.

In general, I think this plays alright as a two-player game only as long as the power plants come out in a relatively balanced order. I think an early 5- or 6-city plant for one player is a distinct advantage when it comes to the end game. Any thoughts on this?

Reply: Power Grid:: Variants:: Re: Handicapping for new players?

mrorwell — Mon, 02 Nov 2009 16:06:18 +0000

by mrorwell

StevenE wrote:
*Play only 3 or 4 rounds then start over again.

This gets my vote.... And while playing, explain your reasons for buying/not buying, placing/not placing, powering/not powering.

Reply: Power Grid:: Variants:: Re: Handicapping for new players?

StevenE — Mon, 02 Nov 2009 15:58:37 +0000

by StevenE

Several options:
*Have the new player watch the first game or pair him up with someone.
*Play only 3 or 4 rounds then start over again.
*Have him show up early so you can explain the rules and strategy over a few turns.

Reply: Power Grid:: General:: Re: What Charity does Friedemann Friese support?

trippercook — Mon, 02 Nov 2009 15:49:45 +0000

by trippercook

I'll guess Greenpeace.

Reply: Power Grid:: Variants:: Re: Handicapping for new players?

CrankyPants — Mon, 02 Nov 2009 15:49:31 +0000

by CrankyPants

trippercook wrote:
What's wrong with playing normal and letting the new guy lose? It's expected.

A fair question which I meant to answer in the original post.

I want our new player to have fun and I've seen several people get their enthusiasm crushed by playing a game with the knowledge that they are losing and have no chance of even catching up.

We try to tell people who are about to play a game like this for the first time: "You are most likely going to lose." and give them the chance to choose some other game. Some people are fine with that idea and enjoy playing anyway. Others think they are fine with it but really aren't. Of course, one time, we got trounced by the new player in Power Grid. Absolutely, embarrassingly, slaughtered. Probably because we underestimated him and played against each other.

Thread: Power Grid:: General:: What Charity does Friedemann Friese support?

Uncle G — Mon, 02 Nov 2009 15:31:28 +0000

by Uncle G

For the past couple of Essen's FF has given away (for a small charitable donation) expansion power plants for Power Grid.

Does anyone know what charity this supports?

Reply: Power Grid:: Variants:: Re: Handicapping for new players?

trippercook — Mon, 02 Nov 2009 15:03:05 +0000

by trippercook

What's wrong with playing normal and letting the new guy lose? It's expected.

Thread: Power Grid:: Variants:: Handicapping for new players?

CrankyPants — Mon, 02 Nov 2009 14:50:48 +0000

by CrankyPants

We're going to be playing PG this weekend with a brand new player.

We've done this before and the results are predictable: the new player gets beaten. Badly.

We give advice during play; try to point out obvious errors and explain our reasoning. But we also try not to play their game for them and let them make their own decisions/mistakes and learn from them. But this only gets them so far and once you're out of synch with the pace of the game, you're a goner.

Any advice on leveling the playing field?

I think starting them with more cash would take some steps toward giving them a fighting chance and help cover some early errors. How much do you think would be appropriate? 20? 30?

Reply: Power Grid:: Rules:: Re: placing high cards after steps 1 & 2 under the deck

boltongeordie — Sun, 01 Nov 2009 20:38:59 +0000

by boltongeordie

Jinx

Reply: Power Grid:: Rules:: Re: placing high cards after steps 1 & 2 under the deck

boltongeordie — Sun, 01 Nov 2009 20:24:59 +0000

by boltongeordie

An easily overlooked rule. Page 6. Last full paragraph of "Phase 5: Beaurocracy".

Place the highest numbered power plant from the future market face down under the draw stack and draw a new one to replace it. Rearrange the market appropriately (see phase 2: this will change in Step 3, see the steps of the game). Because of this, the highest numbered power plants are collected under the »Step 3« card and become available during step 3 in the game

Reply: Power Grid:: Rules:: Re: placing high cards after steps 1 & 2 under the deck

DaveD — Sun, 01 Nov 2009 20:23:11 +0000

by DaveD

In the current online copy at the RGG site it is on page 6

Place the highest numbered power plant from the future market face down under the draw stack and draw a new one to replace it.
Rearrange the market appropriately (see phase 2: this will change in Step 3, see the steps of the game). Because of this, the highestnumbered
power plants are collected under the »Step 3« card and become available during step 3 in the game.

Thread: Power Grid:: Rules:: placing high cards after steps 1 & 2 under the deck

hammertime7777 — Sun, 01 Nov 2009 20:16:13 +0000

by hammertime7777

What page in the rules does it say to place high cards under the deck in steps 1 & 2?

Reply: Power Grid:: Rules:: Re: buracracy phase

russ — Sat, 31 Oct 2009 20:38:56 +0000

by russ

This and many other Frequently Asked Questions are answered in Power Grid FAQ.

Reply: Power Grid:: Rules:: Re: buracracy phase

wmshub — Sat, 31 Oct 2009 20:34:05 +0000

by wmshub

No. Each plant fires at most once per round.

Thread: Power Grid:: Rules:: buracracy phase

hammertime7777 — Sat, 31 Oct 2009 20:31:14 +0000

by hammertime7777

If I have a power plant with 2 coals to power 1 city & I have 4 coals on it can I use 2 coals to power 1 city & then use ti again to power another city in the same round?

Reply: Power Grid:: Rules:: Re: resource example

hammertime7777 — Sat, 31 Oct 2009 19:15:55 +0000

by hammertime7777

Thanks much.

Reply: Power Grid:: Rules:: Re: resource example

Eric Brosius — Sat, 31 Oct 2009 19:09:06 +0000

by Eric Brosius

These are the resources that were used to power plants. For example, the owners of the #04 and #05 plants may each have burned two coal units.

Thread: Power Grid:: Rules:: resource example

hammertime7777 — Sat, 31 Oct 2009 18:47:39 +0000

by hammertime7777

On page 6 of the rules it states resources are to be resupplied for 5 players in step 1: 5 coal 4 oil 3 garbage & 2 uranium, now it says as there are only 4 coal tokens left in the supply (the rest are stored on power plants) as I see it there is none left in the supply,Where did the 4 come from?

New Image for Power Grid

middleclassjoe — Sat, 31 Oct 2009 04:45:52 +0000

by middleclassjoe

]]>

This started out ok but didn't end so well. :D

Reply: Power Grid:: Reviews:: Re: The best designed game I ever didn't like

RiffRaff14 — Thu, 29 Oct 2009 19:22:45 +0000

by RiffRaff14

I mostly agree with the OP. It is a lot of calculations. There are definitely fun parts of the game, the bidding/bluffing for example.

I disagree on the smooth game play. It's quite the opposite in my opinion. It's a few moments of nothing and silence followed by a few moments of exchanging money. Rinse repeat. I'll give it a few more chances, but there are many other games I'd play before this.

Reply: Power Grid:: General:: Re: One copy of "umspannwerk" up for grabs at geekgold lottery!

red_gobbo — Wed, 28 Oct 2009 16:49:45 +0000

by red_gobbo

If you are ready to test your luck, I have another two for the lottery!

http://boardgamegeek.com/geeklist/47353/item/1085246#item108...

Reply: Power Grid:: Rules:: Re: CITIES

Barticus88 — Wed, 28 Oct 2009 15:59:55 +0000

by Barticus88

Smoo wrote:
There are lots of things to consider when building cities. The most important thing to remember, though, is to build it on rock and roll.

High yield bonds.

Reply: Power Grid:: Rules:: Re: CITIES

ohbalto — Wed, 28 Oct 2009 15:41:25 +0000

by ohbalto

Holy crap, I think Donald took up boardgaming . . .

More

Reply: Power Grid:: Rules:: Re: CITIES

unixrevolution — Wed, 28 Oct 2009 15:34:06 +0000

by unixrevolution

We will happily answer any question you have about cities, but you do need to ask it.

Reply: Power Grid:: Sessions:: Re: 3-game Session/Observations

RaduB — Wed, 28 Oct 2009 12:22:07 +0000

by RaduB

Anjohl wrote:
Ok, so we had "Power Grid Bonanza" tonight, playing THREE games in a row, all two-player.

Game one was full map US, games and 2 and 3 were full map Germany, We used my NEW power plant deck (yay!) for all games, using variant 3, the full new deck.

I am confused, are you playing full map (as in all 6 regions) for 2 players? Is this a variant from the regular rules?

Reply: Power Grid:: Rules:: Re: CITIES

Smoo — Wed, 28 Oct 2009 07:03:49 +0000

by Smoo

There are lots of things to consider when building cities. The most important thing to remember, though, is to build it on rock and roll.

Reply: Power Grid:: General:: Re: Electro

Aeopile — Tue, 27 Oct 2009 17:50:03 +0000

by Aeopile

Poker Chips will cut the length of the game down by at least 20%. Think about how much time you spend each turn handling money - it goes so much faster with poker chips. Give a shot once. I appreciate OCD too, but I would never play Power Grid without poker chips, so my OCD swang the other way.

Reply: Power Grid:: Rules:: Re: cities

TaxpayersMoney — Tue, 27 Oct 2009 16:02:09 +0000

by TaxpayersMoney

hammertime7777 wrote:
thanks, but I don't get the hint about the up arrow.

Lol, I think he's poking fun at your lack of capital letters in the original post. He's referring to the shift key.

Reply: Power Grid:: Rules:: Re: CITIES

Spielfreak — Tue, 27 Oct 2009 15:08:39 +0000

by Spielfreak

I'm checking them out
I'm checking them out
I got it figured out
I got it figured out
There's good points and bad points
But it all works out
I'm a little freaked out
Find a city
Find myself a city to live in.

Talking Heads: Cities, from Fear of Music

Reply: Power Grid:: Rules:: Re: CITIES

stargate — Tue, 27 Oct 2009 14:57:29 +0000

by stargate

spearjr wrote:
Is there a question in the above post?

I think the question is: can I post spam here ? :soblue:

Reply: Power Grid:: Rules:: Re: CITIES

spearjr — Tue, 27 Oct 2009 14:42:48 +0000

by spearjr

Is there a question in the above post?

Thread: Power Grid:: Rules:: CITIES

hammertime7777 — Tue, 27 Oct 2009 14:34:20 +0000

by hammertime7777

Thanks guy's I'm probably going to bother you a little more, but I LOVE PLAYING BOARD GAMES & THIS ONE'S A LITTLE CONFUSING.

Reply: Power Grid:: Rules:: Re: cities

hammertime7777 — Tue, 27 Oct 2009 14:29:47 +0000

by hammertime7777

thanks, but I don't get the hint about the up arrow.

Reply: Power Grid:: Rules:: Re: cities

TermiGator — Tue, 27 Oct 2009 13:37:46 +0000

by TermiGator

Take a look at the rules page 4: Phase 4 the two paragrahs after "Important": (highlighting by me)

At the beginning of the game, each player has no cities and, thus, no network. Each player starts his network by choosing any city (not
already chosen by another player) in the playing areas (chosen at the beginning of the game) on the map. To show that this city is part of his network, the player places one of his houses on the space numbered 10 in this city. The player pays the building cost of 10 for the starting city. [...].

Once a player has started his network, all subsequent cities he adds to his network must connect to at least one city already in his
network (marked with one of his houses). A player may add any city (if there is room in the city for the player) to his network, regardless
of its distance from his other cities. The player need only pay the connecting cost shown on the map between the new city and one of
the cities already in his network. [...]

Unless you got in a really hefty bidding over the starting powerplants (which would be very unusual) you should have 20-40 Electro left after buying a powerplant and resources which is enough for connecting 1-3 cities.

edit: just a hint: make some use of that "uparrow"-key left and right of your keyboard

Reply: Power Grid:: Reviews:: Re: Dutch Review - Spannend!

Mr Thijs — Tue, 27 Oct 2009 13:24:41 +0000

by Mr Thijs

Fidoh wrote:
Is Power Grid schokkerend goed of biedt het toch te veel weerstand?

:shake: maar toch ook weer :D

File: Power Grid:: 3 TO 6 PLAYER AID SHEET

hiimken — Tue, 27 Oct 2009 12:32:28 +0000

by hiimken

3 TO 6 PLAYER AID SHEET for Board Game: Power Grid ]]>

Review: Power Grid:: Dutch Review - Spannend!

Fidoh — Tue, 27 Oct 2009 11:53:08 +0000

by Fidoh

Hoogspanning is een tijdje geleden uitgegeven door 999 Games als Nederlandse vertaling van Funkenschlag/Power Grid. Het is een redelijk zware gamer's game voor 3 tot 6 spelers. Iedereen speelt een electriciteitsmagnaat die probeert om zoveel mogelijk steden te voorzien van stroom. Electrabel vs Nuon of iets dergelijks. Misschien schuilt er onder dit weinig aanlokkelijk thema toch een dijk van een spel. Het staat immers op nummer 3 in de ranking op Board Game Geek. Is Power Grid schokkerend goed of biedt het toch te veel weerstand?

Het speelt zich af op een kaart van Duitsland waar allerlei steden zijn op aangeduid. Op elke stad is slechts beperkt plek voor elektriciteitsbedrijven. In de eerste fase van het spel past er zelfs maar één speler op elke stad. Tussen de steden lopen verbindingen met een bepaalde kostprijs. Als je een nieuwe vesting wil stichten, moet je de basisprijs van zo'n fabriek betalen samen met de kostprijs van die verbinding. Het spelbord wordt kleiner als je met minder dan zes spelers bent. Op die manier is het altijd krap genoeg om elkaar in de weg te lopen, maar niet zo krap dat het frustrerend wordt.

Geld verdienen doe je door steden onder stroom te zetten. Om dit te kunnen doen heb je elektriciteitscentrales nodig. Er zijn er die op steenkool werken, andere werken op olie, afval of uranium. Er zijn zelfs windcentrales die geen grondstoffen nodig hebben. Deze centrales worden per opbod verkocht. Elke ronde kan je er een kopen in een veiling. Elke volgende ronde worden de beschikbare centrales steeds krachtiger. Je hebt dan minder grondstoffen nodig om meer steden elektriciteit te bezorgen.

Grondstoffen hebben natuurlijk ook een kostprijs. Er zit een mooi uitgewerkte mechanic in het spel die ervoor zorgt dat grondstoffen die weinig gekocht worden ook goedkoper zijn. Vraag en aanbod, dus. Als je ziet dat niemand anders in steenkool gaat, is het bijvoorbeeld misschien slim om zelf steenkoolcentrales te kopen, hoewel die iets minder efficiënt zijn.

Per stad die je power bezorgt, krijg je in een volgende fase geld, waarmee je later nog meer fabrieken kan bouwen, centrales kan kopen of grondstoffen kan inslaan. Het is een organisch geheel. Je krijgt meer geld, je centrales worden krachtiger, je powert meer steden en je krijgt nóg meer geld. De winnaar is de speler die op het moment dat iemand zijn 17de fabriek bouwt, de meeste steden van stroom kan voorzien.

Er komt nogal wat rekenwerk kijken bij Hoogspanning. Je bent voortdurend op zoek naar de goedkoopste plek om nieuwe steden te bouwen, terwijl je rekening moet houden met hoeveel geld je nodig hebt voor grondstoffen. Daarbij moet je dan ook nog zien dat je genoeg geld overhoudt voor de veiling op nieuwe centrales. Het voelt bij momenten meer aan als een oefening wiskunde. Berekeningen als 133-(45+19+14+9) zijn echt geen uitzondering. Het zal dus misschien niet echt aanslaan bij niet-gamers. Als je echter wel van het wat zwaardere spel houdt, zal je Funkenschlag best wel weten te smaken. Ohm nohm nohm.

Plus
- Interessante veilingen
- Supply and demand
- Gevoel van vooruitgang
- Geen tekst. Je kan dus gerust een goedkopere Duitse versie kopen.

Min
- Veel rekenwerk en analysis paralysis.
- Zal niet aanslaan bij niet-gamers/meisjes

New Image for Power Grid

Guantanamo — Mon, 26 Oct 2009 23:09:29 +0000

by Guantanamo

]]>

Alex, Mike, Dan, Pat and Neil (Thoia) at Mike's Mini Meet VII

Reply: Power Grid:: Rules:: Re: cities

DaveD — Mon, 26 Oct 2009 21:23:11 +0000

by DaveD

50 should be plenty, the first city only costs 10 so you ought to be able to place at least 2 (including a connection cost), if you want to, on the first turn, after that you will have earned more money to place more cities.

Reply: Power Grid:: Rules:: Re: cities

crambaza — Mon, 26 Oct 2009 21:22:11 +0000

by crambaza

hammertime7777 wrote:
how do place cities in the beginning of the game if you only have 50 dollars?

Buy a power plant first, everyone has to buy a power plant in the first round.

Then, when it comes to city building, your first city can be anywhere in the regions agreed to before the start of the game. It will cost you 10 elektro. For all future cities, you need to pay the connection cost between an existing city, and your new city.

Thread: Power Grid:: Rules:: cities

hammertime7777 — Mon, 26 Oct 2009 21:19:28 +0000

by hammertime7777

how do place cities in the beginning of the game if you only have 50 dollars?

Reply: Power Grid:: General:: Re: Electro

proclaimed — Mon, 26 Oct 2009 20:01:09 +0000

by proclaimed

I would try an additional 24-48 hour wait to hear from any company's customer service.

Reply: Power Grid:: General:: Re: Electro

asmiles — Mon, 26 Oct 2009 19:58:09 +0000

by asmiles

Essen justed ended yesterday. Jay is either, still in Germany, in transit or barely recovering from the trip. His costumer service is very good. Just give it a little time.

Reply: Power Grid:: General:: Re: Electro

capthowdy_00 — Mon, 26 Oct 2009 19:48:00 +0000

by capthowdy_00

I tried emailing RGG and have not heard back. What would it take for me to get my hands on the Electro?

File: Power Grid:: More Custom Electro Chips for Power Grid v1.0

TheEngineer — Mon, 26 Oct 2009 17:29:13 +0000

by TheEngineer

More Custom Electro Chips for Power Grid v1.0 for Board Game: Power Grid ]]>

Reply: Power Grid:: General:: Re: Electro

Karlsen — Mon, 26 Oct 2009 15:51:59 +0000

by Karlsen

pijll wrote:
Power Grid - Factory Manager uses the same money as Power Grid; you can buy that and share the money between both games.

(I prefer poker chips as well, by the way.)

So does Funkenschlag - EnBW Edition and Mégawatts. Plenty of choices really :devil:

File: Power Grid:: Fuel Restocking Cards

Barticus88 — Mon, 26 Oct 2009 13:07:34 +0000

by Barticus88

Fuel Restocking Cards for Board Game: Power Grid ]]>

Thread: Power Grid:: General:: One copy of Flux-Generator up for grabs in geekgold lottery

Faerun — Mon, 26 Oct 2009 07:07:57 +0000

by Faerun

See here: http://boardgamegeek.com/geeklist/47353/item/1081069#item108...

Happy bidding!

P.S. It's item 47 on the list =]

Reply: Power Grid:: General:: Re: Electro

eightbit — Mon, 26 Oct 2009 02:50:48 +0000

by eightbit

The BGG chips are nice but pricey.

Reply: Power Grid:: General:: Re: Electro

Barticus88 — Mon, 26 Oct 2009 02:50:08 +0000

by Barticus88

capthowdy_00 wrote:
Also can anyone tell me how many of each denominaton there should be?

40, 16, 40, and 24.

Reply: Power Grid:: General:: Re: Electro

pijll — Sun, 25 Oct 2009 21:44:22 +0000

by pijll

Power Grid - Factory Manager uses the same money as Power Grid; you can buy that and share the money between both games.

(I prefer poker chips as well, by the way.)

Reply: Power Grid:: General:: Re: Electro

Bagherra — Sun, 25 Oct 2009 20:40:33 +0000

by Bagherra

you really should reconsider on the poker chips.
If you must have the paper money and you get no joy from the publish let me know, I might be willing to let you have my paper money as I enjoy my "poker to go" chips so much more.

Reply: Power Grid:: General:: Re: Electro

Eric Brosius — Sun, 25 Oct 2009 19:44:33 +0000

by Eric Brosius

Write to the publisher. They'll probably help you out. After all, OCD is responsible for most of their profits!

Reply: Power Grid:: General:: Re: Electro

Cinnibar — Sun, 25 Oct 2009 18:28:48 +0000

by Cinnibar

capthowdy_00 wrote:
I have an issue of a OCD type, so in order for me to be able to play the game I have to replace the money with the same type that the game came with.

Sorry to hear that. The poker chip idea is a good expansion for the game, as game publishers will typically choose to hit a marketable price point by selection of mass-producible components...which typically means paper/cardboard 'money' for games. Most gamers tend to like the 'feel' of more hefty and solid 'cash'.

Contact the publisher via their web-site. It is likely their support will include the ability to order replacement parts. These will be exactly as needed in the game in quanitity and quality as the originals. :)

They'll likely charge for the replacements and S&H, of course. Such is the evils of procurement.

Reply: Power Grid:: General:: Re: Electro

capthowdy_00 — Sun, 25 Oct 2009 18:22:38 +0000

by capthowdy_00

I have an issue of a OCD type, so in order for me to be able to play the game I have to replace the money with the same type that the game came with.

Reply: Power Grid:: General:: Re: Electro

crambaza — Sun, 25 Oct 2009 18:12:17 +0000

by crambaza

russ wrote:
It doesn't matter how many you have of each denomination; you're not limited by the money supplied. Indeed some people play with poker chips of various denominations.

And some people will only play with poker chips instead of paper.

Try it, you'll like it!

Reply: Power Grid:: General:: Re: Electro

russ — Sun, 25 Oct 2009 18:03:28 +0000

by russ

It doesn't matter how many you have of each denomination; you're not limited by the money supplied. Indeed some people play with poker chips of various denominations.

Thread: Power Grid:: General:: Electro

capthowdy_00 — Sun, 25 Oct 2009 17:51:15 +0000

by capthowdy_00

Can any one let me know how to find replacement electro? Some of my electro went through the lodery and i would like to replace it. Also can anyone tell me how many of each denominaton there should be?

Thanks

New Image for Power Grid

cobalto — Sun, 25 Oct 2009 15:54:09 +0000

by cobalto

]]>

Collector's box with all official maps

New Image for Power Grid

TheEngineer — Sun, 25 Oct 2009 06:07:57 +0000

by TheEngineer

]]>

A set of Power Grid chips based on stoobush's chip set.

Thread: Power Grid:: General:: One copy of "umspannwerk" up for grabs at geekgold lottery!

Faerun — Sat, 24 Oct 2009 19:26:16 +0000

by Faerun

Heya!

One copy of this expansion is up for grabs at the geekgold lottery. Check out this geeklist: http://boardgamegeek.com/geeklist/47353/page/2

Happy bidding!

Session: Power Grid:: 3-game Session/Observations

Anjohl — Sat, 24 Oct 2009 04:15:17 +0000

by Anjohl

Ok, so we had "Power Grid Bonanza" tonight, playing THREE games in a row, all two-player.

Game one was full map US, games and 2 and 3 were full map Germany, We used my NEW power plant deck (yay!) for all games, using variant 3, the full new deck.

Game one was Jay in the northeast, with my building a "wall" down the center of the US, to cut off key areas. This was my first time trying such a strategy, and jay certainly tried to retaliate. What was interesting was the fact that we were neck and neck again, with the game coming down to money AGAIN, with me winning (I think) by less than 30 dollars!

Game two was me in the North of Germany, Jay in the Middle Eastern section. I moved down from my position for my early expansions, which seemed to puzzle him, since the two city line I purchased was more expensive than readily accessible areas in "my" area. However, that move forced him to head farther south into the pricier connection areas. How devious of me eh? But...he won.

Third game was reversed, with me in/around Essen and Jay in the north. He tried to use my earlier strategy to box me in with a north-south expansion that I just barely avoided. We had an interesting stalemate with 2 jank plants in the market, 2 1-city green plants, and an impending 2-city hybrid #13 going to the second bidder. So, I just decided to not buy a plant, to force him to buy one, so I could get #13. Well, he thought the same way. We both had 4-city capacity, and were both up to around 7 cities before the stalemate was broken by one of the lower plants being removed due to being lower than the amount of cities.

In addition, I realized halfway through that I had a LOT of hybrid plants, and that jay had just purchased a 3-coal for 5 city plant...so I started stockpiling all the coal I could, to the point that I actually denied him a turn of powering, which was the equivalent of the WW2 atom bomb for us strategically…it changed everything

It opened our eyes to the fact that there were definite advantages to playing dirty, and just how crippling a competitive market can be.

He was forced to buy a new plant to get "out of the coal business", and I made it costly, with that plant and his next costing him 70 for a 32, and I believe 90 for a 40. I used the savings on plant costs to buy up more resources and to steadily expand for the win on money.

So, since we have gotten back into PG, we are 2-2, which I think is perfect. The game is becoming very "number crunching" for both of us however, so I think a new board, or a new player will be required soon. We have both gotten so good at it, that the game almost becomes a chess match. It's a testament to good game design however, that despite certain areas having cheap connection costs it has balanced out so well.

My main issue with PG is that it ends too fast! I really like the step 1-mid step 2 phase, because you are really just defining your style of play. Mid-late game tends to be somewhat pre-determined IMHO. We may consider trying a game with modified rules to expand the overall length, perhaps also pushing step 3 off a bit. Step 3 in two-player seems somewhat anti-climatic at times. That being said, it's incredible that right after a game, I could tell both of us were thinking the same thing...one more! And *I* feel that even when you lose, it's still so close that you rarely feel cheated. I can't wait to try the Italy/France map and to playing a 3 or 4-person game!

Reply: Power Grid:: General:: Re: Power Grid Storage problem

Capt_WaRPed — Fri, 23 Oct 2009 16:37:26 +0000

by Capt_WaRPed

For my part, I just left the insert in, used baggies for the pieces, then start piling on the maps. Does the cover close all the way? No. Does it close and lie flat without smooshing things? Yes. The insert protects the pieces and the top of the cover just stands quite a bit proud.

Reply: Power Grid:: General:: Re: Fiddly paper elektros > paper spreadsheet ?

Wraith — Thu, 22 Oct 2009 15:33:05 +0000

by Wraith

Actually, I'd have much less of a problem using the original paper elektros if the darned notes didn't tend to stick together. It's the static cling I really don't like.

Reply: Power Grid:: General:: Re: Fiddly paper elektros > paper spreadsheet ?

tmredden — Thu, 22 Oct 2009 14:49:16 +0000

by tmredden

mmacmartin wrote:
What's wrong with the paper money? Works quite well for my family and me. In fact, I think the experience would be somewhat lessened (in this and 18xx and other similar games) by removing one of the themey elements.

Perhaps I'm just strange?

No, you're not STRANGE. Chips are for poker. Games based on economy should use paper money or paper stocks, etc. Everybody else is STRANGE! :p

Reply: Power Grid:: General:: Re: Fiddly paper elektros > paper spreadsheet ?

PrairieBoy — Thu, 22 Oct 2009 12:05:51 +0000

by PrairieBoy

DaveD wrote:
Neither my hands nor my pockets are big enough to hold the sort of numbers you're probably talking about in a power grid (or any other money intensive) game. I wouldn't allow hiding things in pockets anyway, everything must be at or above table level.

Held in hand below the table is acceptable in our group, so poker chips work quite well.

As for holding too many chips in hand, you don't need to hide all your chips to keep your financial status hidden. I keep some of my chips on the table almost all the time. I usually start off with all my chips on the table as if playing open money. Then as the game progresses I start hiding some portion of the chips. (Others do this too.) Why not leave $17 on the table and hold another $12 in hand? Other players still don't know what we have. In our group what is on the table may or may not reflect our financial status... so play accordingly! :p

Reply: Power Grid:: General:: Re: Fiddly paper elektros > paper spreadsheet ?

Wraith — Thu, 22 Oct 2009 11:10:59 +0000

by Wraith

DaveD wrote:
Neither my hands nor my pockets are big enough to hold the sort of numbers you're probably talking about in a power grid (or any other money intensive) game.

I rarely find myself holding more than ten chips when I play.

Setting the denominations appropriately is important. I find 1, 5, 10, 20, 50 works well (with my set of chips in five colours). Even when I collect over 100 elektros in income, I'll still only receive maybe six chips.

I wouldn't allow hiding things in pockets anyway, everything must be at or above table level.

If you're concealing the paper money anyway, it really doesn't matter at what height you conceal it. If you can get a hold of some extra notes, you can still slip them into your bundle. Also, shirt pockets are easier to access than trouser pockets when playing at a table.

The surety that everything is above-board comes with the limited supply of currency, whether that be chips or notes. Don't permit people to bring their own supply of chips, and keep the bank orderly and well out in the open, and there's no problem.

Reply: Power Grid:: General:: Re: Fiddly paper elektros > paper spreadsheet ?

DaveD — Thu, 22 Oct 2009 10:19:05 +0000

by DaveD

Wraith wrote:
DaveD wrote:
I guess I may be in the minority, but I think Poker chips are an abomination and would never want to use them if money was to be secret.

It's not like it's hard to hold your poker chips in your hand when you need to conceal them. You can even put them in a pocket if that's not enough (which you really can't do with the paper money, not if you want to keep your money in decent condition).

Neither my hands nor my pockets are big enough to hold the sort of numbers you're probably talking about in a power grid (or any other money intensive) game. I wouldn't allow hiding things in pockets anyway, everything must be at or above table level.

Reply: Power Grid:: General:: Re: Fiddly paper elektros > paper spreadsheet ?

Wraith — Thu, 22 Oct 2009 10:12:00 +0000

by Wraith

DaveD wrote:
I guess I may be in the minority, but I think Poker chips are an abomination and would never want to use them if money was to be secret.

It's not like it's hard to hold your poker chips in your hand when you need to conceal them. You can even put them in a pocket if that's not enough (which you really can't do with the paper money, not if you want to keep your money in decent condition).

Reply: Power Grid:: General:: Re: Fiddly paper elektros > paper spreadsheet ?

DaveD — Thu, 22 Oct 2009 10:05:03 +0000

by DaveD

Werbaer wrote:
tmredden wrote:
No, the rules clearly say money is private.

Really? Did they rule it in the english version?

The original german edition is silent about this issue. The designer has stated that each group may play the way they like it, although he thinks the game is a bit better with hidden money.

The FAQ on the publisher's site states that money is secret and I can't imagine any other way.

I guess I may be in the minority, but I think Poker chips are an abomination and would never want to use them if money was to be secret.

Reply: Power Grid:: General:: Re: Fiddly paper elektros > paper spreadsheet ?

mmacmartin — Thu, 22 Oct 2009 09:32:42 +0000

by mmacmartin

What's wrong with the paper money? Works quite well for my family and me. In fact, I think the experience would be somewhat lessened (in this and 18xx and other similar games) by removing one of the themey elements.

Perhaps I'm just strange?

Reply: Power Grid:: General:: Re: Fiddly paper elektros > paper spreadsheet ?

Werbaer — Thu, 22 Oct 2009 09:10:56 +0000

by Werbaer

tmredden wrote:
No, the rules clearly say money is private.

Really? Did they rule it in the english version?

The original german edition is silent about this issue. The designer has stated that each group may play the way they like it, although he thinks the game is a bit better with hidden money.

Reply: Power Grid:: General:: Re: Fiddly paper elektros > paper spreadsheet ?

Chipacabra — Thu, 22 Oct 2009 08:47:21 +0000

by Chipacabra

We've found it's faster and easier for everyone to just track their own money on scratch paper. The threat of going back to the paper money is enough to keep anyone from cheating.

Reply: Power Grid:: General:: Re: Fiddly paper elektros > paper spreadsheet ?

Anjohl — Thu, 22 Oct 2009 07:28:26 +0000

by Anjohl

Poker chips is the correct answer. I had been eyeing the World Poker Tour official set of 100 chips for AGES, but couldn't justify the price...well, Power Grid made for a great excuse! We played a game after re-acquiring the game, and I forgot the chips. NOT fun. The paper electros go into the box permenantly as a collectable.

Reply: Power Grid:: Sessions:: Re: I "mavericked" my way to victory...

Aeopile — Tue, 20 Oct 2009 12:34:54 +0000

by Aeopile

mwdalrymple wrote:
Aeopile wrote:

I "mavericked" my way to victory...

You sound like John McCain :)

If you knew me, you'd know how you are definitely the first person to ever suggest that I sound like John McCain. :laugh:

I was actually referring to Mel Gibson at the end of the movie "Maverick" when he wills the Ace of Spades to the top of the deck.

Reply: Power Grid:: Rules:: Re: connection fees

perfalbion — Tue, 20 Oct 2009 12:05:26 +0000

by perfalbion

LarsGertsen wrote:
As I read it you want to build a 2nd house in the city you already build the 1. house. As far as I remember it, you can only have one house in each city.

lars

No, he's not. Say you have cities A-B-C. During stage 1, he cannot build in B from A because someone built there already, so he pays for A-B and B-C to build in city C. But in stage 2, an additional slot in city B opens up. His question is - since he already paid the A-B and B-C connection costs, does he pay either (the cheaper) again to build in the second spot in B that opened up with stage 2?

And the other posters gave the correct answer - you pay the connection cost again to build in B.

Reply: Power Grid:: Rules:: Re: connection fees

LarsGertsen — Tue, 20 Oct 2009 09:19:08 +0000

by LarsGertsen

As I read it you want to build a 2nd house in the city you already build the 1. house. As far as I remember it, you can only have one house in each city.

lars

Reply: Power Grid:: Sessions:: Re: I "mavericked" my way to victory...

game_boy — Tue, 20 Oct 2009 01:50:52 +0000

by game_boy

Yee-hah! :)

Reply: Power Grid:: Rules:: Re: Choosing Areas

ColtsFan76 — Tue, 20 Oct 2009 01:47:29 +0000

by ColtsFan76

2) See, I slipped up as well. Like I said, most people select a region at a time so we have just gotten into the habit of keeping them adjacent as we pick them.

I guess technically you could pick non-adjacent regions as long as they were all contiguous by the end.

Reply: Power Grid:: Rules:: Re: Choosing Areas

game_boy — Tue, 20 Oct 2009 01:47:18 +0000

by game_boy

kwesalz wrote:
ColtsFan76 wrote:
2) The areas must be adjacent as you select them.

This one is definitely not true. The chosen areas must all be contiguous (form one "landmass" with no islands), not necessarily adjacent. In fact you'd be hard pushed to find five adjacent areas on most maps.

Also the "as you select them" bit implies some sort of timing element which is simply not the case. Just pick the right number of regions (by whatever method you want) and then check they are all connected together somehow.

Reply: Power Grid:: Rules:: Re: Choosing Areas

game_boy — Tue, 20 Oct 2009 01:43:25 +0000

by game_boy

russ wrote:
See Power Grid FAQ. This is a very frequently asked question indeed... :)

And for games that don't have an FAQ, please try the "search" feature (which being a new user you could be forgiven for not knowing about). For example, searching the "Power Grid -> Rules" forum alone for threads with "areas" in the title yields 6 pages of results.

Or to put it another way, the chances of someone coming up with a completely new rules question for a game ranked in the top 10 are about the same as me winning a game of Power Grid between four or more people. :)

Reply: Power Grid:: Rules:: Re: Choosing Areas

kwesalz — Tue, 20 Oct 2009 01:39:40 +0000

by kwesalz

ColtsFan76 wrote:
2) The areas must be adjacent as you select them.

mrorwell wrote:
I believe that in the tournament at WBC, the only requirement was that all regions had to be adjacent by the start of the game.

This can be very strategic if someone wants to further limit the board. If the first player chooses the southeast, the second player could choose the Southwest on the US map, forcing the other players to connect the two regions. A lot of players don't like going west (because of the high connection costs) early in the game, so you have more congestion in the three other areas chosen.

Which one is true??? I'm confused, LOL....

Reply: Power Grid:: Rules:: Re: Choosing Areas

ozmatt — Mon, 19 Oct 2009 23:21:06 +0000

by ozmatt

In a six-player game we usually come to a census on which region we will not be using.

Reply: Power Grid:: Sessions:: Re: I "mavericked" my way to victory...

MurrayL — Mon, 19 Oct 2009 22:53:25 +0000

by MurrayL

It's always a great feeling when that one awesome plant comes up and you're last to bid - especially if you thought all was lost.

The only problem, of course, is that everyone else will then complain about the game having too much luck :surprise:

Reply: Power Grid:: Sessions:: Re: I "mavericked" my way to victory...

mwdalrymple — Mon, 19 Oct 2009 22:38:05 +0000

by mwdalrymple

Aeopile wrote:

I "mavericked" my way to victory...

You sound like John McCain :)

Reply: Power Grid:: Strategy:: Re: Power Grid Play Ethics?

chadsteam — Mon, 19 Oct 2009 22:29:39 +0000

by chadsteam

1st, no one is at fault. 2 gambled that there would be no coal. The 3rd person got lucky because the 4th didn't buy all the coal.

2nd, after playing many PG games, I've come to the realization that King Making is an absurd concept for this game. I am neither arguing for or against it. The game so cleverly integrates all the players actions that you can't avoid affecting other players on any turn. From the auction, to the resources, to the cities, every aspect is cutthroat. Each player fighting for a better position that will influence the next round.

3rd, see #5 in my post dated Feb 14th, 9:09

Reply: Power Grid:: Rules:: Re: Choosing Areas

eightbit — Mon, 19 Oct 2009 19:02:29 +0000

by eightbit

The reason for this is to increase replayability by making the same map playable with lots of variations and to allow the same map to balance with different numbers of players.

Reply: Power Grid:: Strategy:: Re: Power Grid Play Ethics?

eightbit — Mon, 19 Oct 2009 18:56:56 +0000

by eightbit

chadsteam wrote:
JoeRickard, you have hit it on the nose. All four players clearly understood that the person who ended up with the coal plant would not be able to fire it, so the bidding on the two non-coal plants was furious. Once the coal was not bought, as was assumed, we all knew who would win. Had the 4th player announced before the power plant bidding that he would not be buying the coal, it would have been more fair for us all because we would have bid differently. And he would have less influence on the outcome...which was his intent.

The thing here was its the fault of the person relying on coal to change his turn order or buy a different plant. Not the fault of the person buying the coal. How is it any different in the last round for the 4th player to announce what resources he's planning to buy before the auction than it is in the 1st round? How does that make it fair? The last game I played I went into the last round in last place. It was close, had I not built out to 17 cities I probably would have lost the game because I was gambling on being able to end it there.

chadsteam wrote:

Regarding the absurd king making arguments...yes, every turn each player will make decisions about what actions to take. The point of playing with human beings instead of computers is that we all make different decisions based on thoughts and emotions. Not some programmed logic. Because we are humans we won't always make the best decision each turn and someone else may benefit. Playing with humans is more fun.

I can't tell you the number of times I would have loved to have had a mulligan because I made a mistake which was not in my best interest. Calling someone a king maker is bad sport as long as everyone is putting forth a reasonable effort to win. Some players are better than others and usually it's quite clear when someone is not playing to win.

So are you arguing for king making or against it? By not buying the coal wouldn't he be king making the other player?

chadsteam wrote:

I once played a game of Settlers where my brother was upset that I blocked him in with my initial two settlements. He spent the rest of the game only focused on getting soldier cards and putting the robber on me. It was a miserable game. I wouldn't wish that type of gameplay on anyone.

What else could he do? He picked a bad start and you tried to exploit it. Who is being unsportsmanlike? At what point should players that have no chance of winning bow out of the game? That will also affect the outcome.

Session: Power Grid:: I "mavericked" my way to victory...

Aeopile — Mon, 19 Oct 2009 17:45:12 +0000

by Aeopile

I played another game of Power Grid this past weekend. It was my old man, my wife, and myself.

Towards the end of the game, my Dad caught on to the fact that if you buy up all the commodoties you can really screw someone. Both he and I were heavily in coal/oil - with all 3 of his plants able to run coal (one of them a hybrid). Myself I had the 3 Coal for 6 Cities, 1 Coal/Oil for 4 Cities, and 2 Garbage for 3 Cities.

My wife is in Garbage and Nuclear, so she is in good shape buying cheap commodities.

Anyhow, luckily for me, my dad can't buy up all the coal in the next to last turn, because he didn't have enough capacity to store it all. So, I'm able to buy up the last 5 of them, leaving me with 2 after firing up plants. But, I planned it so I would be in last place going into the last turn of the game (I could go from 14 to 16 cities, not quite 17).

So, power plant buying comes up, and in step 3, there are nothing but oil/coal plants - and one garbage plant (3 for 6). My dad buys a coal plant I think it is 3 for 7, and I cannot buy it, because I'm going to have to get rid of my garbage plant, and even if I buy up all the coal, I can't run both it and my other 3 for 6 plant... so I let him have it. Now he has enough capacity to power 15 cities - because he can move around his coal that he was hoarding.

I have capacity for 13 cities, and can get rid of the 2 garbage for 3 cities for 3 garbage for 6 cities to get up to 16 cities. This is my exit strategy. I can bid up to $63 on it, and still have enough to buy up the necessary commodities, grow into 3 more cities, and win by powering 16 cities to my dad's 15.

Then for some reason, my wife out bids me for the garbage plant! I guess it was for her exit strategy too. She picked it as her choice plant (she was second to act) - and quickly it became apparent that we were bidding it up because we both realized it was our only shot to win the game. She gets it for 64 - I have no choice but to let her have it, because if I spend more than 63, I can't trigger the end of the game, which would give my dad another turn to increase his capacity from 15 to maybe 17.

So, it looks like all is lost, but we have to replace the power plant that my wife just bought. And what comes up? 3 garbage for 7 cities!

Booyah! I get it at face value, and that seals the deal (the sugar on top is I have to buy up enough garbage that now my wife cannot fire both her garbage plants).

Definitely a great game - this one, I put way more effort in expanding to cities smartly, and making sure I wasn't always in the winning position.

Reply: Power Grid:: Rules:: Re: Choosing Areas

trippercook — Mon, 19 Oct 2009 15:32:08 +0000

by trippercook

kwesalz wrote:
1. Assuming that the game is played by 6 players so only 5 areas used right? it means that 1 person doesn't choose a region?? how to decide who is not choosing?? how to determine who is the 1st,2nd,3rd,4th and 5th chooser?

Just to be clear.....The areas chosen are NOT starting areas. People can start in any area (that's in play). So, Everyone could choose to place their first house all in the same colour if they wanted. So choosing the areas that are in play isn't that big of a deal. I usualy just tell everyone where we can't build.

Reply: Power Grid:: Rules:: Re: Choosing Areas

EvanMinn — Mon, 19 Oct 2009 14:55:16 +0000

by EvanMinn

mrorwell wrote:
ColtsFan76 wrote:
2) The areas must be adjacent as you select them.

The rules don't specifically state that they be adjacent as you select them.

Probably because the rules don't state that players individually and sequentially choose areas.

They just say that collectively the players should decide the areas before the game starts and leave the method up to the players.

Reply: Power Grid:: Rules:: Re: Choosing Areas

mrorwell — Mon, 19 Oct 2009 14:25:48 +0000

by mrorwell

ColtsFan76 wrote:
2) The areas must be adjacent as you select them.

The rules don't specifically state that they be adjacent as you select them.

In each game, the players choose which areas they will play in. We recommend one area per player. Of course, the areas chosen must be adjacent.

I believe that in the tournament at WBC, the only requirement was that all regions had to be adjacent by the start of the game.

This can be very strategic if someone wants to further limit the board. If the first player chooses the southeast, the second player could choose the Southwest on the US map, forcing the other players to connect the two regions. A lot of players don't like going west (because of the high connection costs) early in the game, so you have more congestion in the three other areas chosen.

Edit for badly wrapped quote.

Reply: Power Grid:: Rules:: Re: Choosing Areas

russ — Mon, 19 Oct 2009 13:53:03 +0000

by russ

See Power Grid FAQ. This is a very frequently asked question indeed... :)

Reply: Power Grid:: Rules:: Re: Choosing Areas

DaveD — Mon, 19 Oct 2009 13:51:37 +0000

by DaveD

We usually do a random selection or a collective agreement which areas to use, I don't recall we have ever followed the "each player chooses an area" method. The only rule as such is that whatever method you use, the selected areas must be contiguous.

Reply: Power Grid:: Rules:: Re: Choosing Areas

ColtsFan76 — Mon, 19 Oct 2009 13:48:59 +0000

by ColtsFan76

1) Most people pick one region per player but this is not exactly what the rules say. Collectively, you should select the 5 regions.

2) The areas must be adjacent as you select them.

Thread: Power Grid:: Rules:: Choosing Areas

kwesalz — Mon, 19 Oct 2009 13:45:21 +0000

by kwesalz

I want to ask questions about choosing colored areas that are played when game starts...

1. Assuming that the game is played by 6 players so only 5 areas used right? it means that 1 person doesn't choose a region?? how to decide who is not choosing?? how to determine who is the 1st,2nd,3rd,4th and 5th chooser?

2. The way to choose colored areas: (the rule stated : the areas chosen must be adjacent)
Question : After 1st player chooses an area, then must the 2nd player choose the area which is next to the first area chosen??? or is it ok that the 2nd player chooses an area which is not adjacent or next to the area that the 1st player chose (but after all players have chosen the areas, the areas chosen are adjacent each other) ??

Reply: Power Grid:: Strategy:: Re: Assessing the importance of starting city

chadsteam — Mon, 19 Oct 2009 04:41:25 +0000

by chadsteam

Yes, I too have won games by avoiding the area that's crowded. This strategy only works if you can inject yourself into the borders of their areas before they creep towards you. Typically "crowded" means that one or two players will only be able to to get 4 cities before step 2.

My favorite play is to buy the highest plant, usually the 08 in a 4 player game and put down 2 plants in Denver and Colorado Springs??? and then build east first to isolate the west for later.

Reply: Power Grid:: Strategy:: Re: Power Grid Play Ethics?

chadsteam — Mon, 19 Oct 2009 04:33:46 +0000

by chadsteam

JoeRickard, you have hit it on the nose. All four players clearly understood that the person who ended up with the coal plant would not be able to fire it, so the bidding on the two non-coal plants was furious. Once the coal was not bought, as was assumed, we all knew who would win. Had the 4th player announced before the power plant bidding that he would not be buying the coal, it would have been more fair for us all because we would have bid differently. And he would have less influence on the outcome...which was his intent.

Regarding the absurd king making arguments...yes, every turn each player will make decisions about what actions to take. The point of playing with human beings instead of computers is that we all make different decisions based on thoughts and emotions. Not some programmed logic. Because we are humans we won't always make the best decision each turn and someone else may benefit. Playing with humans is more fun.

I can't tell you the number of times I would have loved to have had a mulligan because I made a mistake which was not in my best interest. Calling someone a king maker is bad sport as long as everyone is putting forth a reasonable effort to win. Some players are better than others and usually it's quite clear when someone is not playing to win.

I once played a game of Settlers where my brother was upset that I blocked him in with my initial two settlements. He spent the rest of the game only focused on getting soldier cards and putting the robber on me. It was a miserable game. I wouldn't wish that type of gameplay on anyone.

Reply: Power Grid:: Strategy:: Re: Power Grid Play Ethics?

eightbit — Sun, 18 Oct 2009 15:29:47 +0000

by eightbit

Everyone keeps focusing on the kingmaking in the last round. In powergrid there are many single choices throughout the entire game that can swing the game. Buying fuel when you don't need it, building citys that you can't power. Bidding a plant up that you don't want. Why is it that everyone focuses on that last round?

So what if I don't need that extra coal and I know the game is going to end. My buying it takes the game away from x and gives it to y. I guess x should have been nicer to me. This is just how power grid plays and if x didn't plan for it then he should lose.

New Image for Power Grid

maomaomao — Sun, 18 Oct 2009 10:40:59 +0000

by maomaomao

]]>

Home Make Money, including a home make 20$

Reply: Power Grid:: Strategy:: Re: Power Grid Play Ethics?

quartersmostly — Sun, 18 Oct 2009 07:09:47 +0000

by quartersmostly

DaviddesJ wrote:
mikoyan wrote:
If the differential between your cities and the person in 1st is 5 or 6, you can buy enough resources to make it so you can power all of your cities and if he can't power that one plant, he might not be able to power those 5 cities. Therefore you can power more cities.

Exactly. So, by buying extra resources, you pull ahead of the (former) 1st place player, but you fall even farther behind the 2nd and 3rd place players.

You still haven't given any explanation of why you would want to do this.

From what it sounds like the other 3 players got into a heated auction over 2 non coal plants thinking that player 4 who could buy up all the coal would to try and help his position. Which it would have.

Had he bought up the coal he wouldn't have been able to power 17. The other two players couldn't get to 17. So the game would go on another round. Where the 4th place player may be able to improve his position even further?

Is this right or did I miss something?

If it is then he absolutely should buy the coal. He may not have known that the other players couldn't buy 17 cities but you at least have to play like there is a chance or you are just giving up. You have to penalize the player who got the cheap plant if you can or you are just giving him the game.

Reply: Power Grid:: Strategy:: Re: Power Grid Play Ethics?

DaviddesJ — Sun, 18 Oct 2009 06:24:01 +0000

by DaviddesJ

mikoyan wrote:
If the differential between your cities and the person in 1st is 5 or 6, you can buy enough resources to make it so you can power all of your cities and if he can't power that one plant, he might not be able to power those 5 cities. Therefore you can power more cities.

Exactly. So, by buying extra resources, you pull ahead of the (former) 1st place player, but you fall even farther behind the 2nd and 3rd place players.

You still haven't given any explanation of why you would want to do this.

Reply: Power Grid:: Strategy:: Re: Power Grid Play Ethics?

perfalbion — Sun, 18 Oct 2009 03:56:27 +0000

by perfalbion

Except there are players in second and third ahead of you so your resource purchase also needs to prevent them from powering more cities than you. That's a much, much harder thing to arrange both in terms of resources you can buy in the first place, capacity to buy enough, and funds to do it.

A 4th place player might be able to play kingmaker through resource purchases, but it's very unlikely they will be able to win the game. A second place player has a far greater likelihood of being able to do what you suggest, which is why it may often be better to be in 2nd as the game approaches the finish than first, particularly when your plants overlap with the player ahead of you.

Reply: Power Grid:: Strategy:: Re: Power Grid Play Ethics?

mikoyan — Sun, 18 Oct 2009 03:44:30 +0000

by mikoyan

DaviddesJ wrote:
mikoyan wrote:
In most of the games I have played, there isn't that much of a difference between the winner and the person in last place. If this game was similar, I can see the case where the 4th person may have been able to power more cities than anyone else.

If you can spend extra money just to buy resources you don't need to take them away from the first place player, and you can still power more cities than the other two players, then you definitely weren't in fourth place.

If the differential between your cities and the person in 1st is 5 or 6, you can buy enough resources to make it so you can power all of your cities and if he can't power that one plant, he might not be able to power those 5 cities. Therefore you can power more cities.

Reply: Power Grid:: Strategy:: Re: Power Grid Play Ethics?

DaviddesJ — Sat, 17 Oct 2009 00:53:28 +0000

by DaviddesJ

mikoyan wrote:
In most of the games I have played, there isn't that much of a difference between the winner and the person in last place. If this game was similar, I can see the case where the 4th person may have been able to power more cities than anyone else.

If you can spend extra money just to buy resources you don't need to take them away from the first place player, and you can still power more cities than the other two players, then you definitely weren't in fourth place.

Reply: Power Grid:: Strategy:: Re: Power Grid Play Ethics?

perfalbion — Fri, 16 Oct 2009 19:51:48 +0000

by perfalbion

This surprises me. I've seen very close games, yes. But often there's a 4+ city different between 1st and 4th or 5th. A lot has to do with the plants in play, but I'd expect larger differences than smaller ones more often than not.

Reply: Power Grid:: General:: Re: Power Grid Storage problem

Karlsen — Fri, 16 Oct 2009 19:47:52 +0000

by Karlsen

tongalad wrote:
Buy the EnBW limited edition....then carry both boxes around! PERFECT!

That's what I did. Funkenschlag - EnBW Edition had all the bits including Power Grid - Power Plant Deck 2and Funkenschlag - Flux-Generator which left my original Power Grid with nothing but maps. All worked perfectly.

Note the subtle use of past tense in the above paragraph.

I recently bought Mégawatts, the extra map is not going to fit in the other two boxes, so I need to start a third box for my Power Grid set. Now with Power Grid - Brazil/Spain & Portugal coming along next week I will have two choices of which box to put the last two maps in :cool:

Oh and Funkenschlag - Umspannwerk can go in the bits box.

Reply: Power Grid:: Strategy:: Re: Power Grid Play Ethics?

mikoyan — Fri, 16 Oct 2009 19:04:24 +0000

by mikoyan

DaviddesJ wrote:
mikoyan wrote:
If I am remembering correctly, the number of cities you have on the map are irrelevant if you can't power them all. The winner is the person who ends up powering the most cities. If the person is 4th place can power more cities than either person in 1,2 or 3rd places, he wins. The 17th building only triggers the end. Now if by buying that extra coal, that doesn't happen, then I can understand not buying it.

If you're in 4th place, and you buy the extra coal that the 1st place player needed, then maybe you will power more plants than him, but you'll still likely be behind the 2nd and 3rd players. So you're just playing a kingmaker role.

That said, it's certainly your choice to do this or not and if the 1st place player is counting on you leaving the resources he needs in the market, he has no right to complain if you don't.

In most of the games I have played, there isn't that much of a difference between the winner and the person in last place. If this game was similar, I can see the case where the 4th person may have been able to power more cities than anyone else.

File: Power Grid:: Fuel Restocking Cards

Barticus88 — Fri, 16 Oct 2009 12:51:25 +0000

by Barticus88

Fuel Restocking Cards for Board Game: Power Grid ]]>

File: Power Grid:: Fuel Restocking Cards

Barticus88 — Fri, 16 Oct 2009 12:51:23 +0000

by Barticus88

Fuel Restocking Cards for Board Game: Power Grid ]]>

New Image for Power Grid

cnidius — Fri, 16 Oct 2009 08:36:56 +0000

by cnidius

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wooden elements part2

New Image for Power Grid

cnidius — Fri, 16 Oct 2009 08:21:01 +0000

by cnidius

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wooden elements