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Subject: The Less than Fantastic Four rss

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Dave Lartigue
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Wow. You determined the status of an entire medium from a single issue of a single book? That's pretty amazing.
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Ken B.
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Legomancer wrote:
Wow. You determined the status of an entire medium from a single issue of a single book? That's pretty amazing.



It is pretty telling that every comic book treatment we've seen over the past several years have consisted of storylines or continuity that goes from the mid-90's to farther back, but rarely anything more modern than that. Even Spawn's 1997 movie was rooted way back in issue #1.


1. Batman Begins (Year One, 1987)
2. Fantastic Four 2 (Surfer, issue #48 (!!))
3. X-Men films (all have mostly been reflective of the early 90's continuity at the latest, with very minor nods to newer characters in part 3)
4. Superman Returns (notably no mention of Electric Red or Blue Superman; passing nod to "Death of Superman" from 1992)
5. Daredevil (Elektra/Bullseye saga, 1983)
6. Hulk (....okay, it's obvious Ang Lee was just winging it here, making up stuff as he went along, including an ending he imagined people actually wanted to see).



I have a pretty hard time reading any comics today either.
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Eddie the Cranky Gamer
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The problem is that mainstream comics as a medium has never consider the fact that any story worth a damn has an END.

Instead they just redo the stories over and over with spinoffs, alternate universes, and general wierdness.

This is why the good comics are the stuff by Moore and Gaiman and Ennis, etc.

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Dave Lartigue
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Oh I get it now. When you said "comics" what you meant was "superhero-genre comics produced solely by DC and Marvel."

I follow you now. Sorry for misunderstanding.
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Sean Franco
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Legomancer wrote:
Wow. You determined the status of an entire medium from a single issue of a single book? That's pretty amazing.


My apologies. However, when a staple of the industry does something like that... It's like having a Bugs Bunny cartoon, call it a Bugs Bunny cartoon, credit Bugs Bunny in it, and then make it all about Daffy.

I realize that the medium and industry shouldn't be represented by this single action. But I find it pretty damn indicative.
 
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The reason behind the change is actually pretty interesting. The "Marvel Civil War" story line was a good read. You might be able to find the trade at a library. Pretty interesting take on the "neo-cons" taking over the Marvel U.
dvs
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Ken B.
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Legomancer wrote:
Oh I get it now. When you said "comics" what you meant was "superhero-genre comics produced solely by DC and Marvel."

I follow you now. Sorry for misunderstanding.




That pretty much covers it, doesn't it?


laugh
 
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Carl Parsons
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From now on I'm going to only listen to 30 seconds of any new songs, and I'm only going to watch the middle 15 minutes of any new movies coming out. That way I will be an expert on the music and movie industry.

The standard comic format used for decades now is an ongoing monthly serial. It's the format FF uses. Each comic book ties into the one before it and the one after it. I'm sure the subscribers to FF who have read the issues prior to the one you read and plan to read subsequent issues find the situation you describe to be incredibly interesting. It's part of a complex and involved story line that takes more than one issue to relate.

Whether you like the contrived continuity in comics or not is a matter of opinion. It certainly doesn't mean that comics aren't any good any more. There are some incredibly talented writers and artists putting out some really good stuff who may have something to say about that.

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Based upon my poor understanding of history, science, and ethics...
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I know how you feel.

I watched the news last night for the first time in a while. What's this? NO CRONKITE. How can they even call it "news" if Walter Cronkite isn't the head guy?
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Jim Patterson
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franklincobb wrote:
Legomancer wrote:
Wow. You determined the status of an entire medium from a single issue of a single book? That's pretty amazing.



It is pretty telling that every comic book treatment we've seen over the past several years have consisted of storylines or continuity that goes from the mid-90's to farther back, but rarely anything more modern than that. Even Spawn's 1997 movie was rooted way back in issue #1.


1. Batman Begins (Year One, 1987)
2. Fantastic Four 2 (Surfer, issue #48 (!!))
3. X-Men films (all have mostly been reflective of the early 90's continuity at the latest, with very minor nods to newer characters in part 3)
4. Superman Returns (notably no mention of Electric Red or Blue Superman; passing nod to "Death of Superman" from 1992)
5. Daredevil (Elektra/Bullseye saga, 1983)
6. Hulk (....okay, it's obvious Ang Lee was just winging it here, making up stuff as he went along, including an ending he imagined people actually wanted to see).



I have a pretty hard time reading any comics today either.


I won't knock the whole comics industry, of which I was a heavy partaker in the mid/late 80s, but I think Ken's got a good point. The comic book-based movies lately are largely nostalgia trips. Arguably, the standard comic book, which is, for example, a very small part of, say, Marvel's operations, exists not so much for itself but as a product that can be repackaged as a graphic novel or a movie somewhere down the road.
 
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Morgan Dontanville
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logopolys wrote:
Okay, I figured a long while ago that comics in general had jumped the shark. I haven't really read any serial comics since the 90s, and the only comic that I've read recently was Preacher... only when my friend gave me the complete trade paperbacks.

But I love the comic mythos, so, while in my local Books-a-Million on Sunday, I picked up a recent issue of Fantastic Four to see what was happening. I soon found out that Reed and Sue had quit the team, to be replaced with Storm and Black Panther.


If you were reading the FF in the early 90's you would note that this is not entirely new. Sue and Reed had a son and retired. Crystal and She-Thing joined with Johnny and Ben. (Before that She-Hulk was on the team instead of The Thing). I rather liked those issues at the time, and didn't feel that they "jumped the shark" then.

There are a number of good titles right now, but much like anything good you have to spend a little time asking the right questions.
 
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Ray
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franklincobb wrote:
It is pretty telling that every comic book treatment we've seen over the past several years have consisted of storylines or continuity that goes from the mid-90's to farther back, but rarely anything more modern than that.

How much of that is due to the average age of the people involved with making the films? I think we all have a nostalgia for the comics of our childhood and if the film people are in their 40+s your going to see older influences.
 
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Ken B.
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wtrollkin2000 wrote:
franklincobb wrote:
It is pretty telling that every comic book treatment we've seen over the past several years have consisted of storylines or continuity that goes from the mid-90's to farther back, but rarely anything more modern than that.

How much of that is due to the average age of the people involved with making the films? I think we all have a nostalgia for the comics of our childhood and if the film people are in their 40+s your going to see older influences.



Possibly. But also, Hollywood sees $$$; if they thought there was money in newer material, they'd be pushing for it.


I keep trying periodically to get back into comics but find them overpriced and thin these days. I do still like to read the occasional TPB, which seems honestly the only way to read comics these days. I'll admit there has been some excellent work done on Teen Titans over the past few years, and I have thumbed through the Superman/Batman title and there is some interesting stuff in there (though still overpriced).
 
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Jorge Montero
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Ignore modern American superhero comics. They are rarely ever worth it. The 'Ultimate' series is more readable, because it doesn't need two tons of background before you can make sense of what's going on, but that's about it IMO.

I'd recommend looking at the alternative that is taking over American bookstores: Japanese Manga. Any bookstore in my area dedicates more space to it than to the science fiction section, and for good reason. The stories tend to be pretty good, they tend to actually end at some point or another, and each 200+ page book costs under $10 in most cases. The best part is that most stores will carry an entire series, so instead of looking at the current issue of X or Y, you can get the first issue and 'catch up'. Much easier than catching up to the X-Men and their 20 thousand crossovers.
 
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Morgan Dontanville
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hibikir wrote:
Ignore modern American superhero comics.


Captain Quebec) wrote:
For me comics just can't compete with a good book anymore. I do like the artwork but I find that most of the writing just doesn't do it for me anymore.


Why must it compete? For me American superhero comics are unlike anything else. When they are good, I find nothing else their substitute. I enjoy continuing story lines and recurring casts of characters. There are a number of great comics out right now.
 
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