Grant
United States
Colorado
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Interesting news:
I recently posted a stupid and largely ineffectual GL to try to determine the political leanings of gamers to see if there were any tendencies inherent in our collective consciousness.
While the response was...underwhelming, I found it very interesting the the great majority fell into the Libertarian camp.
What's at work here, I wonder? 
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The "Jeff" part is completely true
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Both geeks and Libertarians thrive in fantasy worlds.
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Richard S
United States
Rensselaer
New York
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I can't help you with why the distribution of those who answered your survey lean Libertarian. Maybe Libertarians like to answer surveys?
I can tell you why I didn't respond to your survey (or any other discussing religion or politics). Its pretty simple. I don't mix those topics with gaming.
I have beliefs and opinions. Others have beliefs and opinions. Those beliefs and opinions don't perfectly correlate. Discussing those differences in the correct situation can be interesting and enlightening, but I just don't view a board game website as the correct situation for such a discussion. In my experience, online discussion of such topics results in flame wars.
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Gabe Alvaro
United States
Berkeley
California
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Libertarians are more likely to answer polls about their politics on internet board game forums?
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Bob Rademaker
United States
The Colony
Texas
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Geeks/gamers tend to excel at being able to process large amounts of diverse information, glean what is most important or most relevant, and then choose or recommend a course of action based on logical conclusions. I believe that libertarians think the same way.
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Craig Duncan
United States
Ithaca
New York
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LOL -- Nice one, Jeff.
Maybe many geeks are libertarians but, well, I am not. Sorry for the shameless self-promotion, but I've written a book AGAINST libertarianism (well, co-written; the other half of the book is for libertarianism, written by my co-author, a well-known libertarian philosopher):
Libertarianism: For and Against (Rowman Littlefield, 2005).
http://tinyurl.com/222rpl
But hey, if games can be common ground between people of different political stripes, I'm all for that.
Craig
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Tom O'Keefe
United States
Richmond
Virginia
Ever buy snakes from the Egyptian, Taffey?
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Most gamers I know are very intelligent people, so it's pretty unsurprising to me.
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Nikosu Oyama
Finland
Turku
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I think that the main source of negative energy in this site are libertarian geeks. Libertarianism is worse than worshipping Satan IMHO. But everyone is free to think the way they want to. Even if I can not understand the libertarian way of thinking at all.
I don't think that most of the geeks are libertarians. On the contrary. Is there a geekbadge for the libertarians by the way? How many geeks are so much into it, that they would buy a libertarian geekbadge with their hard earned geekgold?
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Tom O'Keefe
United States
Richmond
Virginia
Ever buy snakes from the Egyptian, Taffey?
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hobitti wrote: Libertarianism is worse than worshipping Satan IMHO
Please tell me this is sarcastic.
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Nikosu Oyama
Finland
Turku
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Yes I am being sarcastic. I think it's strange that communism is thought to be satanistic but Libertarianism isn't. As I see it the core ideas of libertarianism are contrary to the Christianity. So it can be thought as satanistic. But no one does, I think.
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Bob Rademaker
United States
The Colony
Texas
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hobitti wrote: I think that the main source of negative energy in this site are libertarian geeks. Libertarianism is worse than worshipping Satan IMHO.
Thanks for this fine example of "positive energy".
hobitti wrote: Is there a geekbadge for the libertarians by the way? How many geeks are so much into it, that they would buy a libertarian geekbadge with their hard earned geekgold?
I have looked and have not found one.
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Tom O'Keefe
United States
Richmond
Virginia
Ever buy snakes from the Egyptian, Taffey?
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hobitti wrote: Yes I am being sarcastic.
Just making sure. In answer to your question, I would buy a libertarian or anarcho-capitalist geekbadge, however I think that it is better not to have political geekbadges. People here get riled up enough over boardgames without having to worry about politics. I imagine that's why there aren't any.
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Bob Rademaker
United States
The Colony
Texas
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hobitti wrote: As I see it the core ideas of libertarianism are contrary to the Christianity.
Which core ideas are you referring to?
While I agree that many libertarians are atheistic or agnostic, I believe that fact may be due more to historical events like the Crusades, where Christianity was blamed for the reprehensible actions of misguided tyrants.
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Bob Rademaker
United States
The Colony
Texas
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ExcitingJeff wrote: Both geeks and Libertarians thrive in fantasy worlds.
Yes- both groups know the path to where life is more fun and reasonable. 
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I am Jajax!
United States
Massachusetts
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thorndor wrote: In my experience, online discussion of such topics results in flame wars.
The Introduction says in BIG RED LETTERS that THERE CAN BE NO FLAME WARS. Also, you are not allowed to see who thumbed what.Please add your opinion to the list, throndor.
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I am Jajax!
United States
Massachusetts
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ulyssus wrote: the the great majority fell into the Libertarian camp.
3 is a great magority?
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Grant
United States
Colorado
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jajax wrote: thorndor wrote: In my experience, online discussion of such topics results in flame wars. The Introduction says in BIG RED LETTERS that THERE CAN BE NO FLAME WARS. Also, you are not allowed to see who thumbed what.Please add your opinion to the list, throndor.
Thank you, Jajax, for your defense, but I gave up my meager attempt at geek surveying. And as regards those you are defending me against, I'm reminded once again of why we are called "geeks."
I love you, Throndor, noble purity and all.
And as for 3 being a great majority, it was on THAT list. 
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Nikosu Oyama
Finland
Turku
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Thorwolf wrote: hobitti wrote: As I see it the core ideas of libertarianism are contrary to the Christianity. Which core ideas are you referring to? While I agree that many libertarians are atheistic or agnostic, I believe that fact may be due more to historical events like the Crusades, where Christianity was blamed for the reprehensible actions of misguided tyrants.
I think that the core idea of libertarianism is egoism and caring only for yourself. I am certain that Jesus would have opposed this political stand as immoral.
The history of Christianity is dark indeed. But the teachings of Jesus should not be dismissed because what people have done in his name. The core idea of Christianity as I see it is taking care of other people. Even loving your enemies and forgiving what they have done. Being compassionate.
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hobitti wrote: I think that the core idea of libertarianism is egoism and caring only for yourself.
The same could be said about socialism because it is not uncommon that political convictions is in the benefit for oneself.
Liberals/libertarians usually believe that the ideology will be in favour of everyone like most followers of a political ideology.
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Preston Fuller
United States
Ashland
New Hampshire
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I have found that many people will associate or speak about being Liberterian but are much more limited in that liberterianism then they think.
One example: I know so many college students who state they are liberterian because of issues like legalizing drugs. Then tell them that it would mean dropping subsidized federal student loans and it would be the end to the Land Grant college they attend, then they start to think twice.
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Vetrhus of Rogaland
United States
Milwaukee
Wisconsin
West over water I fared bearing poetry's waves to the shore of the war-god's heart; my course was set. I launched my oaken craft at the breaking of ice, loaded my cargo of praise aboard my longboat aft.
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Thorwolf wrote: hobitti wrote: As I see it the core ideas of libertarianism are contrary to the Christianity. Which core ideas are you referring to? While I agree that many libertarians are atheistic or agnostic, I believe that fact may be due more to historical events like the Crusades, where Christianity was blamed for the reprehensible actions of misguided tyrants.
Damn guys, now we are introducing religion into the dialogue about a particular political ideology. Statements are being made which are nothing short of 'fantasy'. Neither of you appear to mean to be disrespectful, but with respect, I believe you are skirting that line.
Libertarianism is not contrary to christianity, and neither is communism. In fact, it is impossible to square the core beliefs of christianity and the teachings of Jesus within any particular political party or program.
And faith cannot be boxed.
It usually only takes 15 minutes for someone to bring up the crusades when people mention christianity. That is akin putting busen memo on a geeklist... tangential at best, and a questionable truth.
Oops, I just used the word truth. Now I've revealed that I am not a post-post-modernist...
Anyway, I would prefer that people who aren't familiar with political, spiritual, or religious ideologies to not become spokespeople for the same. And reiterating tired mantras (even-half-heartedly) provides cognitive dissonance.
This is why we ought not mix gaming and politics or religion or sexuality or spirituality without ground rules and safe speech. Words spoken without context can be harmful, and I have a hypersensitivity toward such things which has been tempered by work in Northern Ireland and the inner-cities of Chicago, Milwaukee, and Los Angeles.
So, I ask you both respectfully to take this outside... heh.
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Randy Cox
United States
Clemson
South Carolina
1024x768 works just fine - Don't Wide the Site!
The Back Alley gets no respect.
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Well, since the number of libertarians out there is, what, 0.2% of the population, I doubt it's significant. What I suspect is the Ron Paul effect. Someone can be immensely popular amongst high-tech loudmouths, but that says little about the silent majority. :)
Personally, I'm far, far, far from Libertarian and the reason I didn't respond (did I?) is because I don't recall seeing the list.
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Colleen
United States
Milwaukee
Wisconsin
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diehard4life wrote: So, I ask you both respectfully to take this outside... heh.
I am a moderate and I am atheist. Were I a christian, I might be a republican. For me, there is a clear link between religion and politics. Reigion effects policy. You cannot deny that Christian.
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Grant
United States
Colorado
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Hmm...my apologies. I'm beginning to see the evolution of a flame war here, and I feel responsible. It's fascinating to read through this post and see how a request for political speculation rapidly devolves into accusations of satanism and irrational faith.
MY opinion, we spend far too much time worrying about voicing our opinions at the cost of logic and simple politeness. I think it would be wonderful to discuss issues of heavier weight than meeple composition with fellow geeks, but alas, this brave new online world seems to suck any sense of empathy out of people.
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King of All Simians — Not a Mere Diplomat
United States
Wilmington
North Carolina
Listen, this is no set of rules. I'm not tellin' you what to do, all I'm saying is I'm bringin' up three things that are, like, so important to the whole world, I don't happen to find much importance in.
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ulyssus wrote: Hmm...my apologies. I'm beginning to see the evolution of a flame war here...
Gosh, I don't think it's as bad as you fear.
I, too, think it's wonderful to discuss weighty issues with BGG folks, because in my experience this is an aggregation of thoughtful folks from across a wide range of ideologies. Part of a lusty exchange of ideas is the use of hyperbolic language. But if we maintain a level of respect for our fellow BGGers on one hand and a measure of grace for perpetrators of rhetorical excesses, we'll all be fine.
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