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Subject: GW Raising Prices rss

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Hunter Shelburne
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http://www.games-workshop.com/gws/content/article.jsp?aId=16...

Pretty basic. They are raising the prices, yet again, but now are moving to no metals at all (not in that announcement, but has been mentioned already).

I am well into a Fantasy and 40K army and I play (and enjoy) with my friends, plus buying from the secondary market it won't hurt me as much, but it seems counter productive when people view plastic/resin as cheaper than metal, however accurate that is I don't know. I will be getting some more things to flesh out my armies, but probably nothing after that until something changes. Just thought I'd mention it for anyone who doesn't check out the site.
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Chris Geggus
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Being cynical (as I am) it would probably be bigger news if they weren't raising their prices!

I pulled out of Warhammer years ago, before I needed a second mortgage on my home. Now I wish I had bought shares in GW when they first went public. Then I might be showing a profit!
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Marius Roth
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The plastic kits GW has published lately were all awesome one way or the other, especially as GW started to make the kits pretty modular or able to build one of two different models out of the kits (like the Empire organ gun/rocket launcher, or the most recent Tomb Knight kits).

The grade of detail within these kits is also pretty high and plastic is in general more friendly for customization than metal, but raising the already high prices might not contribute to higher sales. Especially if you count in all the stuff from the kits that you can not use at all and will never do, makes you wonder why you pay for it at all.
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Hunter Shelburne
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Personally, I really enjoy the models, and I have fun with the game, I just wanted to post it. I am just going to stock up before the price increase.

After seeing some videos from distributors, there are some price increases to mainly stuff that won't affect me: Battalions, Army Books and larger models/Elite troops. If you are looking to start the game, those prices are going up, a battalion is going up, and your army book is. But as I have an army and will need to add to it, very little will affect me. Still don't agree with it, and I feel that this will give other games a foothold, like Privateer Press hopefully. I don't want GW to go under, but I definitely want a serious competitor to keep them on their heels.
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Mik Svellov
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Astartus wrote:
... but raising the already high prices might not contribute to higher sales.

I don't think they would want higher sales, if it meant losing money.
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Ahiksking wrote:
Being cynical (as I am) it would probably be bigger news if they weren't raising their prices!


Seconded, I was in a local game shop a couple of weeks ago and looking at some of the warhammer sets, some of them were surely price twice a reasonable price, I got into it about 6 years ago and it seems the price have taken leaps and bounds ever since. When I look at the prices its easy to make the decision that there are many better gaming options.
Whenever i think about getting back into warhammer/40k I see some new overpriced development (and probably 6 more on the horizon). Like codexs/army books (latest orcs and goblins) becoming so big that they cost more, and more, and more.
If it goes too far hopefully GW will make some changes for the better.
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John "Omega" Williams
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This isnt really any surprise as we saw it coming over a year ago. As their sales keep slipping and they lose more older players while not drawing in the supposed younger players. GW will continue its downwards spiral.

Their prices have been absurd for over a decade now and their sculpts, while good, are not the best around nore have they been since at least 95.

Expect this trend to only get worse in the next few years. Thats assuming GW doesnt just grind itself into the gutter.
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Robert Loblah
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Weapon wrote:
...people view plastic/resin as cheaper than metal, however accurate that is I don't know.

Really, you have no idea how much cheaper plastic is. Whenever that's mentioned, there is a hue and cry raised against the offender, usually about how expensive it is to start plastic moulding. That ship has sailed, however, and those are sunk costs for GW. Over any significant production run, plastic is an order of magnitude cheaper (or more). Did you really think that GW would switch to plastics out of the goodness of their heart? GW goes plastic because it pads their bottom line, maintaining their profit margins as their market-share declines.
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Eric Etkin
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Call me cynical, self-serving bastard, but as a designer who's hedging on disgruntled mini-players to jump ship to cheaper, more convenient alternatives, I don't entirely unwelcome this sort of news...


It's a pity though that the hobby in general has to see this sort of increase - which will probably ripple through to other lines eventually as well. Jeez, I remember being able to buy metal D&D minis for about $1.25 a pop.
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Bryan Jensen
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LordHellfury wrote:
Agreed. Even GW's own end of year statements reflect this. (which as a publicly traded company they are required to disclose)

Plastic manufacturing, packaging, graphic design, (but excluding initial design costs and shipping costs to distributors) is all of...

*drumroll*

...3% of their MSRP.

Lets be generous and call it 5% for the sake of easily divisible numbers.

Now does this constitute an increase in prices for the models that were formerly made in metal but are now cast in plastic?

Before answering, keep in mind that all design has already been done and they are using cheaper materials. It even weighs considerably less and thus is cheaper to ship by weight.

The excuse that that oil prices are high and thus plastic prices of models are high is a false argument since the plastic is an oil by-product and not the main reason why the resource is collected.


In my business (consumer entertainment) we are now seeing some sizeable surcharges from vendors, to the tune of 15-20%, due to "oil, shipping and plastic" surcharges. Then they tell us things like "we haven't raised prices for the last two years" to justify the change. We'd usually see an annual price increase from 3-5%, so they didn't do us any favors nor pass on any advantages over those last two years, when we get hit with 15-20% price increases now.

The truth is closer to (and we see it too) that consumers are still pinched in their discretionary spending, and on the whole are just buying physical media less now, which means we do less printing, manufacturing, and plastic buying than we once did. Our vendors, hoping to preserve their margins while still increasing revenue for short-term stock gains that mean bonuses for those at the top, are just restarting the chain of passing on the cost of this mix of greed and necessity to consumers. I expect GW is feeling the same pinch (as we are) of a sputtering American economy and a weak dollar, that is hardly more stable than it was two years ago.
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LordHellfury wrote:
...their rules have ceased to be relevant for quite a long time now with very few exceptions.


Their rules are very relevant if you want to play their games.
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MOTHDevil wrote:


I remember being able to buy metal D&D minis for about $1.25 a pop.


Oh God, me too!

Am I that freakin' old?

I missed my mid-life crisis! I didn't get my new corvette, and newer, younger blonde.

I know what happened.

My money went toward GW models instead.

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Bossko B.
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Not happy about the proposed 20% rise, especially as I have been defending GW prices recently.

Not very surprising though. Fuel prices have gone up about that, if not more, in the last two years. And we're supposed to be getting a 50% gas hike in the UK in over the next two year too, and that will hit me a lot harder than optional GW price rises. I say optional because I don't have to buy from GW.

The whole economy is basically screwed and I for one don't have an answer. So I guess I'll do what I always do, carry on and buy what I want to from what I can afford. That may be GW products, it might be someone else's.

But until I hear more about the safety of these new GW resin models, mainly from resin dust, I won't be buying any of them.
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Hunter Shelburne
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Bobloblah wrote:
Weapon wrote:
...people view plastic/resin as cheaper than metal, however accurate that is I don't know.

Really, you have no idea how much cheaper plastic is. Whenever that's mentioned, there is a hue and cry raised against the offender, usually about how expensive it is to start plastic moulding. That ship has sailed, however, and those are sunk costs for GW. Over any significant production run, plastic is an order of magnitude cheaper (or more). Did you really think that GW would switch to plastics out of the goodness of their heart? GW goes plastic because it pads their bottom line, maintaining their profit margins as their market-share declines.


No, I just personally didn't know and don't keep up with the discussions, so I didn't want to just throw a random opinion out there. I ASSUMED it was much cheaper, but I just didn't know for a fact, so I didn't want to fashion myself an expert or something.
 
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Robert Loblah
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Weapon wrote:
No, I just personally didn't know and don't keep up with the discussions, so I didn't want to just throw a random opinion out there. I ASSUMED it was much cheaper, but I just didn't know for a fact, so I didn't want to fashion myself an expert or something.

Hey Weapon, sorry. I think my initial post came off wrong. I'm just trying to say that the price difference is unbelievable once you find out how much it is, not that there was anything wrong with your post. Again, my apologies for wording that so poorly.
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Eduard Navratil
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LordHellfury wrote:
Plastic manufacturing, packaging, graphic design, (but excluding initial design costs and shipping costs to distributors) is all of...

*drumroll*

...3% of their MSRP.
Well that legion of lawyers surely costs some bucks (for they are many)...
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M@tthijs
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Longshanx wrote:
LordHellfury wrote:
Plastic manufacturing, packaging, graphic design, (but excluding initial design costs and shipping costs to distributors) is all of...

*drumroll*

...3% of their MSRP.
Well that legion of lawyers surely costs some bucks (for they are many)...
Indead. What % of their MSRP goes to the lawyers?
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MOTHDevil wrote:

Call me cynical, self-serving bastard, but as a designer who's hedging on disgruntled mini-players to jump ship to cheaper, more convenient alternatives, I don't entirely unwelcome this sort of news...


It's a pity though that the hobby in general has to see this sort of increase - which will probably ripple through to other lines eventually as well. Jeez, I remember being able to buy metal D&D minis for about $1.25 a pop.


All in all it's not necesarily all abad thing that GW is raising it's prices.

No! Hear me out before you get the pitchforks and torches.

I too am a disgruntled GW game player and echo the miniature costs/annual rules change etc etc complaints.

I guess what I've seen in the days since I started playing (early 1980's) is an increase of companies that produce wargaming systems and the miniatures to go with them.

There is now much more choice and a better ability to mix and match armies from one system to another (as quite a few new lines of miniatures are made for a particular game system, but seem "really well suited" to GW game systems).

IMHO GW's marketing strategies, while ultimately a fail for them, have been a good thing for the industry as a whole.
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John "Omega" Williams
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The problem is that GW's loony price jacks have caused a trickle down effect in other companies raising prices too. Not many. And not to the absurd levels GW has. But its notable in a few corners.

On the other hand its emboldended other miniatures companies to keep their prices at a more sane rate and at equal or often much better quality than GW puts out.

This not even taking into account the scale increase thats creeped into minis.
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Bossko B.
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Price rises are nothing new. Over a couple of year period Wizards of the Coast raised the price of Star Wars miniatures 50%. It's just seems to be the in thing to bash GW nowadays and it's getting boring. I say let them carry on, they will either thrive of fail. It's their marketing plan, they have all the figures and I guess market research data. If they fail I'll move on like I did when WOTC cancelled Star Wars, if they thrive I guess I'll have more 40K to play with. Either way I don't lose.

Personally I'll carry on spending the same on my hobby of Board Games and RPGs, just means I get less for my buck from Games Workshop, so is life.


Longshanx wrote:
Well that legion of lawyers surely costs some bucks (for they are many)...

If people would stop infringing their intellectual property they wouldn't need those lawyers in the first place

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John "Omega" Williams
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Oh they have marketing reseaerch data. Problem is. They are ignoring that data and intend to jack the prices even higher. The latest proposal is to switch over possibly fully to plastic but keep the prices as if it were all metal. Which they pretty much do anyhow.
And gradually their sales are failing.

As for WOTC. They are their own sort of problem and its little wonder they went down and were bought out by Hasbro. And now Hasbro is tightening their leash so we see "budget" products more where WOTC cant even afford differing art on the backs of two diffrent sets of cards. etc.

Its common to bash GW simply because they are so frequently blatant and crackheaded about it all.
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Sean Westberg
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LordHellfury wrote:

If it wasn't for the income they gather from licensing (video games and FFG to name a couple) they would be in more dire straights. With such decline in their consumer base, the value of their IP is likewise lessened, and with it their licensing fees.


Let's be honest, FFG and Relic and the other sources of GW source material other than the figs is actually growing as a market share, and growing fairly significantly. Dawn of War 2 & it's expansion were in the top five best sellers for Steam for months at a stretch. FFG's rpg offerings are among the top sellers in the RPG industry. The IP is viable enough to launch an entire card game off of, and multiple successful board games.

That the tabletop game's market share is essentially shrinking steadily means that GW is on a crap business model.
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Aswin Agastya
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Price rising is normal. Trade embargo is not .
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Sevej wrote:
Price rising is normal.
This alone, is a bold statement.

It may be normal to raise prices. But not all price raises are normal.
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Bossko B.
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_Kael_ wrote:
Sevej wrote:
Price rising is normal.
This alone, is a bold statement.

It may be normal to raise prices. But not all price raises are normal.

I'm sure someone will point something out, but in 20+ years of gaming I don't recall seeing price drops in Board Games, RPGs or miniatures.

Price rises on the other hand...

Heck, even the local sandwich shops are putting the prices up near me.

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