Recommend
 
 Thumb up
 Hide
16 Posts

Panzergruppe Guderian» Forums » Rules

Subject: Soviet Supply rss

Your Tags: Add tags
Popular Tags: [View All]
Joe Wert
United States
Corydon
Indiana
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
I'm a little confused about how Soviet Supply works.

The rules talk about tracing "lines of communication" to leaders from units but don't seem to clarify how that's done, or if they do I missed it.

Also, it says the Leader must be able to trace a line of supply of any length to the eastern edge of the map. If my assumption is correct then the only way to cut off the Soviet Leaders line of supply would be for the German player to control enough hexes in the East to completely interrupt all Soviet leader's lines of supply simultaneously?
Having not played the game yet it seems like this is a purposely difficult task that spells the end for the Soviet player?

I was just confused as to whether the Soviet player needs to create a web of units to leapfrog all the way to the eastern edge or whether tracing line of supply from a Leader is usually easily accomplished.

Thanks for any help.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Joe Wert
United States
Corydon
Indiana
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
It somehow didn't dawn on me last night that a Leaders supply could be cut off by surrounding them. I think I have a handle on it now.
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Joe Wert
United States
Corydon
Indiana
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
Hmm, I'm also now wondering about Soviet Interdiction.

Can it be placed on the road leading to hex 0120 (i.e. hexes 0219, 0319, or 0418) and completely shut off German supply for that turn?
My intuition says no, as it seems far too powerful, but I don't see it forbidden in the rules.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Paul Ciorra
United States
New York
flag msg tools
mbmb
Of course you can do that! Its exactly what its for!
2 
 Thumb up
0.25
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Joe Wert
United States
Corydon
Indiana
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
pacabn wrote:
Of course you can do that! Its exactly what its for!


Haha, good to know. I forsee the Germans having a tough last few days of battle next time I play. devil
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Alan Richbourg
United States
Arlington
Texas
flag msg tools
This is Kyoshi, our adopted Shiba Inu.
mbmbmbmbmb
Think about what the Germans can do to counter that move ...
1 
 Thumb up
0.25
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Joe Wert
United States
Corydon
Indiana
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
chargetheguns wrote:
Think about what the Germans can do to counter that move ...

Hmmm, admittedly I'm a beginner, both at this game and wargames in general (though I have become fascinated with them quite quickly) so this seems to be escaping me at the moment.

I'll consider this a little puzzle and will do another thorough rules read-through and play session to try and find the answer.
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Paul Ciorra
United States
New York
flag msg tools
mbmb
Joe, its easy, cover that hex and a few others with units so the planes cant be put there!!
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Alan Richbourg
United States
Arlington
Texas
flag msg tools
This is Kyoshi, our adopted Shiba Inu.
mbmbmbmbmb
It would have been so much cooler of you not to point that out. The fun in this game is solving the puzzle for yourself.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Joe Wert
United States
Corydon
Indiana
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
chargetheguns wrote:
It would have been so much cooler of you not to point that out. The fun in this game is solving the puzzle for yourself.

I happened to read your post first so I hid the answer without reading it, no harm done.
I plan on figuring it out myself.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Paul Ciorra
United States
New York
flag msg tools
mbmb
You are right Alan, sorry I got carried away! Im glad Joe didnt read my post first in hindsight. Paul
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Joe Wert
United States
Corydon
Indiana
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
pacabn wrote:
You are right Alan, sorry I got carried away! Im glad Joe didnt read my post first in hindsight. Paul


Don't worry about it, if I'm still stumped after the next time I play, now I can just unhide your post rather than having to sheepishly ask someone to destupify me.thumbsup
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Joe Wert
United States
Corydon
Indiana
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
Looks like it didn't matter in the end.
In preparation for my next game I was raptly reading SPI Revival No. 1 and it seems I've spoiled it for myself. shake

Bonus Section - "My Variant Rules for Panzergruppe Guderian" - by Ronald J. Wright

"I have never particularly liked the impact of the Soviet 'air interdiction' rule, because it often leads to the ludicrous, ahistorical placement of a string of German units 'guarding' the supply road to area E."

But that's alright, I have a feeling I'll get plenty of strategic pondering out of the game despite having that one handed to me.
Well... I suppose there were quite a few handed to me while reading this magazine.
In any case I'm sure there'll be more decisions and insights to be had.
3 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Joe Wert
United States
Corydon
Indiana
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
Alright, a few years later and I have a nice physical copy of the AH version. I'm also a bit more experienced with wargames in general. Nonetheless my friend and I have played a few games and still have one nagging rules question.

Does a unit that retreats into an unoccupied hex get eliminated if it suffers another combat result?

The rules state that if a unit retreats into a "Friendly occupied" hex and then suffers another combat result, it is eliminated. What if the unit retreats into an unoccupied hex and is then attacked again and suffers a combat result?

We have been playing that it can just continue to retreat. It seems alright logically, as a single division could feasibly retreat indefinitely, but if it ran into a formation of allied forces it would be difficult to assimilate sufficiently to defend against another attack in quick succession.

If anyone has any clues as to the correct interpretation please let me know.

It would also be nice if anyone knew for sure if Soviet leaders contribute to defense, as I have read contradicting answers in a couple threads.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Alan Richbourg
United States
Arlington
Texas
flag msg tools
This is Kyoshi, our adopted Shiba Inu.
mbmbmbmbmb
See my post on ConsimWorld about leader defense. The 'official' consensus is that Leaders combat defense value is only used when not stacked with a non-leader unit. I think that's wrong and silly and should be changed.

I don't have my rule book out - does it say that a unit cannot be attacked twice in the same turn, or is it that the same hex can't be attacked twice? If the former, there's your answer. Except for overrun. It might be answered on CSW.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Steve Fitt
Thailand
Chang Mai
flag msg tools
Hohbogehnomoztan wrote:
Alright, a few years later and I have a nice physical copy of the AH version. I'm also a bit more experienced with wargames in general. Nonetheless my friend and I have played a few games and still have one nagging rules question.

Does a unit that retreats into an unoccupied hex get eliminated if it suffers another combat result?
The rules state that if a unit retreats into a "Friendly occupied" hex and then suffers another combat result, it is eliminated. What if the unit retreats into an unoccupied hex and is then attacked again and suffers a combat result?


Your question does not make it clear if you are talking about combat or overruns. You keep referring to "combat result", but you might mean "overrun result from the CRT". You also say "and is then attacked again", but you might mean "overrun again".

As I understand the rules, this can't ever happen in a combat phase. It has been a long time since I played, but as I remember ZOC extend across rivers. Since they do, a unit that retreats into an unoccupied hex adjacent to an enemy unit would be eliminated by retreating into an enemy ZOC. If the "unoccupied hex" is not adjacent to an enemy unit then it can't be attacked again in that combat phase.

Therefore you must be asking about overruns.
. . As you said the rules clearly say, "Overruns are not combat" -- I would argue that being retreated from an overrun onto a friendly unit and then that hex is overrun [by the same or a different stack] is a different situation and the combat rule you quoted does not apply. In this case the units are added together because they become 1 stack.

A unit can be overrun repeatedly if it is retreated into an empty hex, by the same or different stacks, and it just keeps being pushed around. Again the rule for combat you quoted does not apply.

The enemy player should just avoid retreating a unit onto a friendly unit or live with the result.

You also asked about -- Do Leaders add to the defense of combat units?
. . My answer is NO. The rules clearly state that they do NOT add to the defense, only attacks. Any argument otherwise must 1st start by explaining away the clear wording that says they don't add to the defense. Also, 2 Leaders are not added together either, only the largest is used [but this is just my opinion of/on the rule that a Leader does not add to the defense].

 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Front Page | Welcome | Contact | Privacy Policy | Terms of Service | Advertise | Support BGG | Feeds RSS
Geekdo, BoardGameGeek, the Geekdo logo, and the BoardGameGeek logo are trademarks of BoardGameGeek, LLC.