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Subject: Building limit on English map? rss

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Andrew Swan
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Randwick
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The rules don't explicitly say how many track tiles each company may build per turn on the English map. I'm assuming it's three, being the default building limit in the Base and Standard games?
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Jack Neal
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That's how I've always played it. I think it is on the second page of the rules, but I could be way off base. I think the US map is described because it is different.
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Rusty Patterson
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Ras Tanura
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Raiderjakk wrote:
That's how I've always played it. I think it is on the second page of the rules, but I could be way off base. I think the US map is described because it is different.


This is how I've played it as well but I did wonder about that specific difference between the two maps. Three track tiles per turn seemed rather limiting to me. It almost seemed as if that side of the board was intended as a transitional map between the base game and the Steam Barons expansion with the Eastern U.S. map implementing additional track laying rules (port cities,additional track, etc.)

Thoughts anyone?

 
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Malachi Brown
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The question never occurred to me. Having played lots of Age of Steam where the 3 track tiles per turn rule is the default unless otherwise stated for an expansion map, that became my assumption for Steam maps as well.
 
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Dick Ruck
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We asked the same question and decided that, as the SB rules do not explicitly say three track tiles, but just refers to building track, that you could build any amount of track. This also means that you are putting a lot of shares into the Available Shares market, and depending on your strategy you may be putting ownership of a lucrative company at risk.

It appears there are three potentially different ways of playing this:
1. A limit of three tiles per turn
2. The Eastern USA map method of being limited to laying the number of tiles equal to the turn number + 1
3. No limit per turn

I remember in a conversation with Francis Tresham (the Daddy of 18xx) that he considers his rules to be a framework, and that groups can vary them as they wish. In that vein I am happy to explore the different games these variants give and adopt the one that suits our group best.

Edit: added "+ 1"

Dick
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Rusty Patterson
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Crabro wrote:
We asked the same question and decided that, as the SB rules do not explicitly say three track tiles, but just refers to building track, that you could build any amount of track.


Hmmm. I never thought of that. I guess you could interpret it that way. I'll have to go back and read the rulebook again from that perspective and see if I can make that jibe with my internal rules lawyer. I understand what you're saying about the rules merely being a framework, but I like to know that I've interpreted them correctly first before I start fiddling with them.
 
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Malachi Brown
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From Steam Barons rules, p.4:
Quote:
Phase two: Build track
All companies now have the opportunity to build track. The rules governing track construction are the same as in base and standard Steam unless contradicted by any rules below.


From Steam rules, p.7:
Quote:
You may build up to 3 track tiles in a single turn unless you took the Engineer Action tile.
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Dick Ruck
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Malachi wrote:
From Steam Barons rules, p.4:
Quote:
Phase two: Build track
All companies now have the opportunity to build track. The rules governing track construction are the same as in base and standard Steam unless contradicted by any rules below.

From Steam rules, p.7:
Quote:
You may build up to 3 track tiles in a single turn unless you took the Engineer Action tile.

Yep, I read that too. However it is possible to argue that there is an implication in the SB rules that many tracks can be built because it is not explicitly excluded.

Anyway, I am very happy for anyone to play the game how they wish. Today I will be exploring the three track limit. Possibly next week we will try the "Turn Number + 1" track limit.

Whatever, we will be having fun
 
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Malachi Brown
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Crabro wrote:
Yep, I read that too. However it is possible to argue that there is an implication in the SB rules that many tracks can be built because it is not explicitly excluded.

I really do not see how. The original rules say the limit is 3. The SB rules say to check the original rules for anything that is not explicitly overridden in the SB rules, which only documents changes to the limit for the Eastern USA map. Basically, anything not explicitly included in the SB rules defaults to whatever the Steam rules say. I don't really see any wiggle room here.

The absurd extreme of your argument would seem to be that since cheating isn't explicitly excluded in the SB rules then it is allowed. I realize there are sometimes situations where the rules don't stipulate something (open vs closed money in many games, for example), so the players have to decide what their convention is going to be, but I don't see this as that type of situation, the rules seem very clear to me.

Crabro wrote:
Anyway, I am very happy for anyone to play the game how they wish. Today I will be exploring the three track limit. Possibly next week we will try the "Turn Number + 1" track limit.

Whatever, we will be having fun :D

Indeed, you should feel free to play with whatever house rules you want and to enjoy yourself! Feel free to post your results in the Variants forum, I would be interested to read them.
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K P
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For the sake of others wondering, I played a 2-player game where we didn't even think of the track limit, so we allowed as much building as desired.

What ended up happening was every company issued all its shares immediately, and went hog-wild building as much as they possibly could. This made the first couple turns take forever, and the available share market box was overflowing with tokens.

For what it's worth, this didn't seem like the "right" way to play, although as has been discussed above everybody can make house rules however they like.
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