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Subject: Name a few games where long term strategy really pays. rss

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Eddie B
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I have noticed that generally I like games that are low on luck (or no luck at all), little to no tactical decisions, don't allow you to mess with other players and require a fair amount of medium to long term planning. Then, if you plan it right, somewhere halfway through the game your machine really starts to work and you start to rake in vp's/money or whatever else is required to win.

Which game (or games) meets this requirement?


I mean, Puerto Rico has some of that but you still depend on the other players and their choices. Also, certain buildings can be gone already by the time you want to buy them.

Agricola has some of it as well, but you still have the constant food problem and the fact that other players take certain actions prohibiting you from taking that action.

Any suggestions??
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Joe Norris
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Don't know of a game that fits your criteria perfectly, but Roads & Boats might be pretty close.
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Got two game tables and a microphone
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Age of Steam and Advanced Civilization, Through the Ages...
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Nomadic Gamer
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Drive on Stalingrad tracks VPs as you go (for cities captured & other events); when the ratio is 3 to 1
for Germany she wins.....
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Andrew
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Sounds like you want economic engine games like Homesteaders, Phoenicia, Dominion, or Race for the Galaxy. Indirect interaction (auctions, card-dependent in Dominion, positive-only in RftG), construction of VP-generation engines, and planning over tactics. If you know what you're doing there's interaction, but it's mild until then.
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Dwarf Bashful the 6th
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hmm...I would say Chess
Or you could try with 4+ players Warriors & Traders pure strategy no luck game..
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Sam Carroll
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agnieszkaemilia wrote:
hmm...I would say Chess
Or you could try with 4+ players Warriors & Traders pure strategy no luck game..


No, Chess definitely does not fit the qualification of "little to no tactics." As I contended in my blog post, Chess is heavy on strategy, but needs a good amount of tactical skill as well.
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Sam Carroll
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Caylus is pretty close to your qualifications. You can screw other players with the provost, but it's zero-luck and more strategic than tactical.
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Nathan Kovner
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Caylus does have a good deal of tactics, and has much more of the blocking the OP wants to avoid. Le Havre sounds perfect, it is much looser than Agricola in terms of upkeep, and blocking is much less restrictive.
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Eddie B
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Thanks for all the comments so far!

I do like Caylus, Homesteaders, Race for the Galaxy and Through the Ages indeed.

I have tried Advanced Civ but I prefer regular Civ. I feel the disasters in Advanced Civ are a major pain in the neck. With regular Civ it seems far more manageable.

I need to look into Roads and Boats, Le Havre, Warriors and Traders and Age of Steam (I do like Railroad Tycoon btw).
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Matt Davis
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Ora et Labora might be one to consider too. It's a lot like Le Havre, but even more removed from Agricola and its upkeep. People tend to "draft" into a strategy by the buildings they build. (It's somewhat like Caylus, but your buildings are closer to being exclusively YOURS in OeL.) It definitely takes time to learn the buildings, but then there's a lot of room for very long-term planning.

And how about The Princes of Florence for an offbeat answer? Most of the luck comes very early in the game, and its conceivable to plan out your entire strategy from the jump.
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Eddie B
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I have been looking into Ora and Labora. I might get it.

PoF I am familiar with and have played it 5 or 6 times. The game really hinges on the first two rounds getting the artists and/or recruit cards if memory serves me right.
 
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chearns
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Eddie,

It's hard to be sure with these things, but I'm pretty sure that Antiquity matches your criteria.
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Eugene
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This sounds like a plea for games where you do your best against the game and everyone else does the same without trying to hinder anyone else and whoever does the best overall wins. Have you looked into the recent Ora et Labora? Trajan might merit attention.

As an aside, what do you find fascinating with such test-then-grade games?

Edit: I just looked at your Top 10. The top four games are Santiago, Caylus, Imperial, and Löwenherz. Are you now disillusioned with these games? Because every one is what I would call rife with destructive interference from opponents.
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Eddie B
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garygarison wrote:
This sounds like a plea for games where you do your best against the game and everyone else does the same without trying to hinder anyone else and whoever does the best overall wins. Have you looked into the recent Ora et Labora? Trajan might merit attention.

As an aside, what do you find fascinating with such test-then-grade games?

Edit: I just looked at your Top 10. The top four games are Santiago, Caylus, Imperial, and Löwenherz? Are you now disillusioned with these games. Because every one is what I would call rife with destructive interference from opponents.



Haha, I agree. That top 10 is from 5 years ago or so. I still enjoy games like Santiago and Imperial. I also enjoy games like Eclipse, Wiz-War or War of the Ring from time to time.

You know how some of us gamers go through these moods (I do at least). Currently I am just looking for something high on strategy and indeed I have been eying games like Ora and Labora, Le Havre and Antiquity.

Ora and Labora is the easiest to get right now but I am little concerned about the misprints and wonder if I should wait for the new release.

Le Havre is still being sold by several of the local shops here.

Antiquity I might wait for the reprint that is supposed to come out any time now.
 
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Philip Thomas
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Ora et Labora seems to be a game where you can muddle through taking tactical advantages as and where they can be found. Although it does matter which buildings you build and in what order, there are several ways of using other players' buildings, the most mundane of which is a simple down payment (1 or 2 coins depending on whether it is early or late game).

However, I have only played it with relatively inexperienced players (and only the Ireland side). It may be that a real strategic player could easily defeat a tactical improviser.
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Keith

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1960: The Making of the President - The whole thing is centered around election day. Everything you do needs to have an impact on that single turn. You can lose A LOT of battles and still win the war in 1960.

Hansa Teutonica - The entire early game is building your position for long term gain. There are many strategies, but ultimately if you don't focus on building up for long term gain in the multiple winning conditions...you're hosed.
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Art Bugorski
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burrie wrote:
don't allow you to mess with other players


You are basically describing multi-player solitaire. You want not to be effected by the actions of other players while wanting no randomness in the system. Such a game would quickly degenerate once someone finds the best engine, and since the game you describe is deterministic, they would win with it every time.
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Rich Charters
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Here's my 2 cents on strategy and tactics:

The interaction between tactics and strategy is key to many games. IMO, superior tactics will always beat good strategy. If the tactics are relatively equal, then a superior strategy will often provide the edge needed to win.

 
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Joachim Pehl
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Another vote for the Splotter games (Antiquity, Roads & Boats), they sound perfect for the OP's requirements.

Ora et Labora is a very good game, but imo it is also rather tactical and does not meet the OP's criteria.

Sid Meier's Civilization: The Board Game might also be a good choice, since you have to foucs on a long-term strategy.

Wealth of Nations could also be an idea.
 
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Bill Eldard
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coolpapa wrote:
And how about The Princes of Florence for an offbeat answer? Most of the luck comes very early in the game, and its conceivable to plan out your entire strategy from the jump.


I second that recommendation. Many gamers criticize that it doesn't have enough player interaction, but if that's what the OP is looking for, PoF fills the bill.
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I'm surprised this hasn't been mentioned, but this one is very strategic and rewards tactical play.

Dominant Species
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Art Bugorski
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CM Randall wrote:
I'm surprised this hasn't been mentioned, but this one is very strategic and rewards tactical play.

Dominant Species


I think you missed the "little to no tactical decisions" part of the OP's post.
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Keith Ibsen
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Similar in theme to Race for the galaxy is Eminent Domain

While your actions affect the other players they don't mess with them, for the most part. It involves strategy and some luck.
 
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eryn roston
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Dungeon Petz is more strategic in terms of what you need to do to win. Dealing with the more immediate problems of actualy keeping your petz happy is more tacticle tho.
 
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