Martin Villemaire
Canada
Ottawa
Ontario
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Wow! This is my first-ever review, and I am also the first to review this expansion. I feel the pressure mounting already
I really enjoyed the base Mare Nostrum game, although I realise that it had its flaws. The biggest one was that it was basically impossible for the Greek player to win (although most Greek players seemed not to mind, enjoying their position as power-brokers). Other quibbles included the difficulty of building pyramids for everyone but Egypt, and the relative strength of the wonders (some were much more useful than others). Finally, Rome seemed a little overpowered compared to other nations (esp. Greece).
The Mare Nostrum: Mythologies addresses all these concerns.
What you get:
- An additional board for the 6th player (Atlantis) that sits next to Rome and Carthage, as well as a new set of black counters
- 1 temple, 2 cities, 2 markets and 5 caravans
- 3 mythological creatures for each colour
- 21 new heroes
- 11 heroes/wonders that were present in the base game, but whose power got upgraded/reworded
- New ressource cards, including the brand-new 13th ressource, ceramic
- A new rulebook that explains how it all works. The rulebook includes all the rules for the game, but all changes/additions brought by the expansion are outlined in red (very nifty).
One of the biggest changes brought by the expansion is the introduction of a 4th phase, the God phase, that takes place between the Commerce and Construction phase. The player with the most temples + markets is the Great Priest and controls this phase. Like the other phases, the Great Priest's power enables him to decide in which order players will pick a god. Picking a god's power costs 6; each god can only be selected once per phase.
Vulcan: Can destroy a caravan
Ishtar: Cannot be affected by another god this turn
Mars: Add 6 to one of your combat die roll this turn
Hermes: Produce three additional ressources next turn
Poseidon: Destroy a boat
Athena: Add 2 to your total towards obtaining a leader title
Baal: Destroy a city
Isis: Give each player a ressource of your choice from the reserve
Players can now build mythological creatures (3 per civilization) at a cost of 6. These creatures are like moving fortresses in that they roll an automatic '6' in combat. They are also decked out with assorted special abilities:
Griffon (Babylon): May move by two, can go over sea zones
Centaur (Greek): Automatically destroy an enemy legion at the beginning of combat
Phoenix (Egypt): Once destroyed, can be brought back in play for a cost of 3
Behemoth (Carthage): Opposing fortresses and mythological creatures loose their automatic '6' roll and must roll a die instead
Titan (Rome): Can participate in a combat in an adjacent region
Kraken (Atlantic): May attack in sea and coastal areas. Can disappear and reappear anywhere on the board.
I won't detail the powers of every new hero as there are 21 of them, but the ones I found most interesting were:
Spartacus: Once per turn, may build a legion at the cost of one slave
Circe: May use legions as caravans
Jason: May convert caravans (if you occupy a caravan during the construction phase, you may put it on any one of your free ressources)
Mosus: Gives a bonus of 2 for the Great Priest; can cross one sea zone without needing boats
Adonis: May buy a god for free during each god phase
A new ressource, ceramic, is added to the map, and is controlled by Atlantis who has one in his capital and one in a region right next to his capital.
Finally, the Greek and Carthage heroes have been improved; the Greek one gives a free boat when built and the allows the Greek player to conduct blockades, during which he can attack opposing boats before they get to convoy legions. The Carthage hero gives a free legion when built. Rome's hero has been downgraded and looses his ability to build fortresses for 2 (it now costs him 3 like everyone else)
Impressions after one game
The addition of a new player (Atlantis) and mythological creatures adds a lot of the base game. Greek is no longer rome's whipping boy as Rome has to contend with Atltantis and the Greek Centaur, which is much more powerful than Rome's own mythological creature and allows Greece to effectively deal with Rome's cheap labour. Greek's blockades also allows it to defend itself much more effectively. Egypt now has to contend with Babylon's Griffon and Atlantic's Kraken, who can reach pretty much all of its regions. This forces Egypt to focus more on building its army and less on its economics advantage, making it more difficult for it to get its 12 taxes.
The 13th ressource also makes the game shorter by making it easier for everyone to build the pyramids; one has to be mindful of it in the later stages of the game.
All the new heroes add interesting powers and make it much more difficult to decide which to pick when building one. Players can now focus on specific strategies and pick only heroes related to that strategy, be it attack, defense or commerce.
While 'turtling' was never much of a problem in the original game, mythological creatures add even more incentive to rampage and crush other players. All of the powers are interesting, and seem to bolster each civilization's weak points.
There is one expansion addition that I do not like; the god phase doesn't seem to add much to do and just seems to slow the game down as everyone ponders whether they want to buy a god... and decide they don't. At a cost of 5 some of the gods could be useful every now and then, but at 6, it is almost always better to buy a creature (if you're planning on attacking) or temples/markets. For example I fail to see how Mars (add 6 to a combat) can be of any use unless you've already built your three mythological creatures... which won't happen very often. Only Vulcan has a marginally better power, but it is only really useful when 1) you have 9 ressources (6 to buy the god and 3 to buy back the caravan that you just destroyed) and 2) are also the political leader/are in cahoots with the political leader (or else someone else will steal that caravan away). We found the god phase to not be a good use of our time, and will probably skip it in future games.
Overall however, this is a very good expansion. It restores balance between the nations; everyone now has an equal shot at winning. Greece is now a very strong nation, and Rome has been ratched down a notch. Thanks to the 13th ressource, a good trader can now build the pyramids, which means that games won't last 5 hours with tit-for-tat and bash-the-leader strategies. A quick, well-calculated strike to grab one or two all-important ressources (gold, gems, ceramics, papyrus), and a good trading phase, are all that are needed to get away with the game. This keeps all players on their toes and 'honest'.
Forget the god phase, but everything else is candy. A great expansion overall.
ps. I played with the French version of the game -- some of the names (esp. the Heroes) might be different in English. Sorry!! 
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Tim White
United States
Corona
California
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Nice review Martin! Very useful to me since I have been thinking of buying the base game and the expansion.
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Martin Villemaire
Canada
Ottawa
Ontario
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Gee, thanks! Mare Nostrum is IMHO a very good wargame that offers plenty of hard decisions on every turn. However the base game has some serious balance issues; so the expansion is pretty much required. That's unfortunate as the expansion costs almost as much as the original. If you have the money though, I'd say go for it!
G'day
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Martin Nelmes
Wales
Machynlleth
Powys
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Nice review, but I have a minor quibble. In my copy of the game gods definitely cost 3, not 6. Would that change your view of the God Phase?
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Martin Villemaire
Canada
Ottawa
Ontario
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Er, yes, most definitely! I double-checked my rules, and they do state that the gods cost 6. I'm curious - what version do you have? My guess is that you have the English version (I have the French one). I'll try to contact the game designer to see which version is correct!
I'm worried that at a cost of 3, some of the gods might actually be a little overpowered... There's just no good middle ground 
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Champion Eternal
Malaysia
Unspecified
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Great review!!! Now I am closer to getting these two games...
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Denis Lavergne
Canada
Gatineau
Quebec
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Quote: they do state that the gods cost 6...
I'm worried that at a cost of 3, some of the gods might actually be a little overpowered
If this is the case with the English edition, then it is probably a translation typo. 
In the base game, all Heroes and Wonders cost 9, so having Gods at 3 would make no sense. That would mean Gods costs the same as Legions, so who would need Legions? 
Martin, if you need to get the answer directly from the horse's mouth, then feel free to ask in his MARE NOSTRUM forum here: http://www.sergelaget.com/forum/viewforum.php?f=2&sid=c15aa8...
Regarding the comment that the expansion costs almost as much as the base game, it is comparable to THE GAME OF THRONES' CLASH OF KINGS expansion. They both include a mounted board, new components and cards, which allows for the addition of a 6th player.
Cheers,
Denis
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Martin Villemaire
Canada
Ottawa
Ontario
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Hawk wrote: If this is the case with the English edition, then it is probably a translation typo. In the base game, all Heroes and Wonders cost 6, so having Gods at 3 would make no sense. That would mean Gods costs the same as Legions. Who would need Legions?
You did mean to write 'all Heroes and Wonders cost 9', right? Unless you're playing that darn Finnish edition?
Hawk wrote:
Centaur's mouth??
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Denis Lavergne
Canada
Gatineau
Quebec
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Quote: You did mean to write 'all Heroes and Wonders cost 9', right?
Yes, thanks! I've edited my original post.
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Ron Magin
United States
Phoenixville
Pennsylvania
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Well, my copy of the rules from the Author (which I used to do the English Translation) states:
"...une combinaison de 3 cartes pour invoquer l'aide d'un Dieu."
or in English:
"...a set of 3 cards to invoke the aide of a God."
Perhaps the confusion is over the cost for the Mythological Creatures. These new Military Units cost a set of 6 cards.
Ron Magin
Cafegames Limited
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Bad Mojo
Sweden
Unspecified
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A confusion between myth units (cost 6) and gods (cost 3)? This seems to be the case. Both the french PDF and the english one has the cost of gods at a set of 3 cards. Martin, please check your rules again and perhaps edit the review.
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Ron Magin
United States
Phoenixville
Pennsylvania
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mnv_iii wrote: That's unfortunate as the expansion costs almost as much as the original. If you have the money though, I'd say go for it!
I'm not sure how much you paid for your copy of Mare Nostrum and the expansion, but our MSRP for each is:
Mare Nostrum - $49.95
Mare Nostrum: Mythology - $34.95
- Ron
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Martin Villemaire
Canada
Ottawa
Ontario
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I'm not sure why but the French version of the game is definitely not anywhere this cheap (esp. considering that the designers are French, hence no translation costs). And the expansion -in French - costs about as much as the base game, give or take 8$CDN (5$ US).
At the prices you listed, I think that the expansion is a terrific steal.
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Ron Magin
United States
Phoenixville
Pennsylvania
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mnv_iii wrote: I'm not sure why but the French version of the game is definitely not anywhere this cheap (esp. considering that the designers are French, hence no translation costs). And the expansion -in French - costs about as much as the base game, give or take 8$CDN (5$ US).
At the prices you listed, I think that the expansion is a terrific steal.
According the the Asmodee website, the cost for Mare Nostrum in French is 42€, and the cost for the expansion is 35€. If this is what they are selling the game for in France, then anyone buying the game from them to import to Quebec (le Valet d'Coeur, for example) would definatly be selling the games for more than we do in the US. They have to pay import costs which are quite high these days given the cost of fuel (and thus shipping). So, that would explain the higher cost.
Ron Magin
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Clay Blankenship
United States
Owens Crossroads
Alabama
That's a moray!
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Hawk wrote: In the base game, all Heroes and Wonders cost 9, so having Gods at 3 would make no sense. That would mean Gods costs the same as Legions, so who would need Legions?
Gods are cheaper, but you only get to use them for one turn.
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Danny Rasmussen
Denmark
Svendborg
Svendborg
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I have ordered the base game and the expansion before I read the review here. In the german online shops I tend to buy from you can get base game + the expansion for 29 Euro.
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Neil Pollner
United States
Beverly Hills
California
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gods cost 3, you only get to use it for that one turn (anytime it applues before the next god phase). and my groupe has found them EXTREMELY valuable and useful. the game was won because of them. IMHO it's a great addition to the game.
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Toby Falconer
United Kingdom
Unspecified
UK
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otnemem wrote: gods cost 3, you only get to use it for that one turn (anytime it applues before the next god phase). and my groupe has found them EXTREMELY valuable and useful. the game was won because of them. IMHO it's a great addition to the game.
I agree, the gods are great! And are priced at 3, which is perfect.
Only played one game with the expansion so far but the gods, along with the other additions, opens up the game so much - a lot more strategic options.
Circe got a lot of use from me - being able to basically wait till someone spends money to buy a caravan, then steal it off them and build it yourself, muahahahahahaa...
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Philip Thomas
United Kingdom
London
London
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Circe: Use Legions as Caravans
Being dense, I don't get what you mean. You can use her without anyone building caravans...
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Matthew M Monin
United States
Branford
Connecticut
8/8 FREE, PROTECTED
That guy
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He probably meant Jason.
-MMM
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Posted Sun Sep 4, 2005 1:01 pm
