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David F
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Pretty sure it's yes, just didn't find anywhere in the Hades rulebook that said so.
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It should be in the regular rulebook (or perhaps in these threads), but once you take control of an island, you can't lose it until someone else enters and takes control, either by leaving you with no troops on the island, or just by being there if you have no troops on it at all. You put one of your colored cardboard tokens on there to show it is under your control (and still get the benefits from cornucopias and buildings).
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David F
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The Hades rules never really establish clearly if a pure-Undead army takes control of an opponent's island, or an opponent still holds the island since the Undead don't really belong to the other player.

It only says to 'follow the rules for Ares and Poseidon'... ugh, not good rules-writing when I have to flip between 2 rulebooks.

I'm sure it's as you say. Just wanted to make sure everybody was playing the same way as me.
 
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Michael Chandler
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The rules in the center of page three "to move troops and/or fleets" One rule must be followed "at least one undead unit must join each move." If you take casulties with your undead army first you should never be in a scenerio where you win, but only have undead troops.
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David F
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If I attack with a pure-undead army, then I could only have undead troops after I win.

I can attack with a pure-undead army, right?
 
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Michael Chandler
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Under Ares page 5 of the main rules. A player may move troops to another island. If they land on an island with enemy troops present combat takes place. According to the Hades rules of the undead, You must move the undead troops with at least one regular unit. I cannot think of a scenerio that will break that rule. So you should never start combat without at least one normal unit. Meaning you will never have a pure undead army at teh beginning of your turn. In general the hades units die at teh end of the turn so you would want to select them first anyway.

I hope this helps. This is such a great game and I hope you are enjoying it.
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David F
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Hmm, I see why we interpret differently now:
Hades rulebook wrote:
The rules of movement and combat are exactly the same as for the movements associated with Poseidon and Ares. There is only one additional requirement: At least one undead military unit must join each move, regular troops can join but are not mandatory!


1. I interpreted this as you can attack with a pure-Undead army, and having regular troops/fleets join is optional.

2. You interpreted this as you can attack with a regular army as long as at least 1 Undead troop/fleet is in the movement, and you can add as many regular units as you want.

Which one is right?

I think I am right, which once again begs the question... does a pure-undead army that successfully hops onto an enemy-controlled island take control of it for the Hades player?

Regardless, this is shoddy rules-writing, and what I've grown to expect from Asmodee and Iello .
 
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Michael Chandler
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Hopefully someone will reply that can explain it better than I can. I am only recieting the rules.
 
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Adam Fenrick
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You can attack with pure undead. All that is being said is that if you use the hades move option undead have to be involved either as pure or accompanying regulars. So, my understanding is that you can win a battle with your hades troops. When they go poof, you maintain control...after all, why go through the hassle of attacking(of course, unless you were doing it just to kill your enemy).
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Matagot Contact
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Hi all,

If you take control of an island, regardless of whether it is with regular troops or with undead troops, that island is yours.

If later on all troops on that island are removed (either because the undead return to their graves, or because of the harpy, or the sphinx, or whatever), you keep control of that island.

That's the basic rule.

So in your case, the answer is yes, you do keep that island !
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selwyth wrote:
Hmm, I see why we interpret differently now:
Hades rulebook wrote:
The rules of movement and combat are exactly the same as for the movements associated with Poseidon and Ares. There is only one additional requirement: At least one undead military unit must join each move, regular troops can join but are not mandatory!


1. I interpreted this as you can attack with a pure-Undead army, and having regular troops/fleets join is optional.

2. You interpreted this as you can attack with a regular army as long as at least 1 Undead troop/fleet is in the movement, and you can add as many regular units as you want.

Which one is right?

I think I am right, which once again begs the question... does a pure-undead army that successfully hops onto an enemy-controlled island take control of it for the Hades player?

Regardless, this is shoddy rules-writing, and what I've grown to expect from Asmodee and Iello .


You are both right. Under Hades, you can move a group of armies or fleets, as long as it contains at least one undead. A regular army with one undead troop contains at least one undead, so it can move and attack. A group entirely made of undead can move and attack, because it contains at least one undead. A regular troop or fleet is not mandatory, so it can contain all undead.
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David F
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chanms wrote:
You must move the undead troops with at least one regular unit. I cannot think of a scenerio that will break that rule. So you should never start combat without at least one normal unit. Meaning you will never have a pure undead army at teh beginning of your turn. In general the hades units die at teh end of the turn so you would want to select them first anyway.


chanms is playing it wrong, unless he explained it wrongly.

If not, RESOLVED. Thanks!
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Paul Sinkovits
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selwyth wrote:

chanms is playing it wrong, unless he explained it wrongly.

If not, RESOLVED. Thanks!


I've been playing it wrong too. Somehow I've always read that bit about having at least one undead involved in the attack, the complete opposite as chanms did. A common mistake I guess.
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Paul210 wrote:
selwyth wrote:

chanms is playing it wrong, unless he explained it wrongly.

If not, RESOLVED. Thanks!


I've been playing it wrong too. Somehow I've always read that bit about having at least one undead involved in the attack, the complete opposite as chanms did. A common mistake I guess.


No, you've been playing it right. You must have at least one undead troop/fleet in a group if using Hades to move and attack. A group may contain living troops/fleets, but does not have to.

Also note that if in a battle using a mix of undead and living, if you suffer casualties and decide to kill off the undead first (which makes sense, they are going to disappear anyway), you can still finish the battle, even though the rest of the troops are living. But without undead, they are unable to move further once the battle is won.
 
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David F
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Luck in games, in measured doses, is the catalyst which enables shocking game-changers that you'll remember and talk about forever.
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Let the Lord of Chaos rule.
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Playing it that way (that pure-Undead armies cannot move) makes the Undead a lot less powerful, which I thought might make sense since Hades was really good when I've played with him.

But now we get confirmation Hades indeed is GOD OF THE UNDERWORLD. I like that.

DoomTurtle: I think the others are saying they thought you couldn't attack with a pure-undead army. Unfortunately, my 1. and 2. weren't clear either.
 
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selwyth wrote:
Playing it that way makes the Undead a lot less powerful, which I thought might make sense since Hades was really good when I've played with him.

But now we get confirmation Hades indeed is GOD OF THE UNDERWORLD. I like that.

DoomTurtle: I think the others are saying they thought you couldn't attack with a pure-undead army. Unfortunately, my 1. and 2. weren't clear either.


I got confused by him saying he did the opposite of the guy that got it wrong, but that he had been playing it wrong.

Hopefully everyone that's gone this far through the thread understands it by now.
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David F
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Luck in games, in measured doses, is the catalyst which enables shocking game-changers that you'll remember and talk about forever.
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Let the Lord of Chaos rule.
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Adding this clause in the Hades rules would remove all ambiguity, I think?

The Undead troops and fleets you recruit this turn are considered as your own, for all game effects. The only difference is that at least 1 Undead troop or fleet must be part of any troop or fleet movement (but any number of regular troops or fleets, including 0, may join).
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Paul Sinkovits
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Paul210 wrote:
selwyth wrote:

chanms is playing it wrong, unless he explained it wrongly.

If not, RESOLVED. Thanks!


I've been playing it wrong too. Somehow I've always read that bit about having at least one undead involved in the attack, the complete opposite also, as chanms did. A common mistake I guess.


Ah! Not what I meant, fixed it. Chanms and I both incorrectly read the obvious rule.

You must have at least one undead unit involved in the invasion. Got it. An all undead army is allowes.
 
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