Bryce K. Nielsen
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When the Overlord plays his rumor card, it happens during the Travel phase, and so the heroes are forced to go to the rumor.

-shnar
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Chris J Davis
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shnar wrote:
When the Overlord plays his rumor card, it happens during the Travel phase, and so the heroes are forced to go to the rumor.

-shnar


As far as I am aware, this is not correct. Rumour cards only become available options for players to choose as quests; they are not forced to go to that quest immediately.
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Andy Stout
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bleached_lizard wrote:
shnar wrote:
When the Overlord plays his rumor card, it happens during the Travel phase, and so the heroes are forced to go to the rumor.

-shnar


As far as I am aware, this is not correct. Rumour cards only become available options for players to choose as quests; they are not forced to go to that quest immediately.

This is stated explicitly in the rulebook; the quest just adds to the heroes' options. Shnar might have imagined the rule differently because, well, unless there's something I'm missing, the rule is utter nonsense, to the point where it undermines my faith in the development of the entire franchise.
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Phil Christiansen
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dragonstout wrote:
So other than being forced to play Rumor cards sometimes, is there still no answer to the "why would the Overlord ever play a new quest card" question? I think people seem to be missing that even if the new quest has incredibly great rewards for the Overlord, it still does nothing but help the heroes to give them an extra option. Is there a mechanic that punishes the heroes for not choosing it or something? Are these cards literally *only* going to get played by a rational Overlord when the choice is taken out of his or her hands?


In Descent 2, this is not even a LotW rule, the person who won the previous quest chooses the next one. I.e. if the Overlord wins he chooses the next quest, and could choose a rumor card quest. Also, even if he didn't win the last one he may feel he can tempt the players into choosing a rumor quest. Lots of reasons an overlord might do it.
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SomewhatDamaged wrote:
dragonstout wrote:
So other than being forced to play Rumor cards sometimes, is there still no answer to the "why would the Overlord ever play a new quest card" question? I think people seem to be missing that even if the new quest has incredibly great rewards for the Overlord, it still does nothing but help the heroes to give them an extra option. Is there a mechanic that punishes the heroes for not choosing it or something? Are these cards literally *only* going to get played by a rational Overlord when the choice is taken out of his or her hands?


In Descent 2, this is not even a LotW rule, the person who won the previous quest chooses the next one. I.e. if the Overlord wins he chooses the next quest, and could choose a rumor card quest. Also, even if he didn't win the last one he may feel he can tempt the players into choosing a rumor quest. Lots of reasons an overlord might do it.


How do you account for the fact that the heroes certainly will acquire more gold and an extra shopping opportunity via the extra quest, whereas all the OL gets is the opportunity of the reward at the end (which may also go to the heroes)?
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Phil Christiansen
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If the overlord gives them a good stomping they won't gain gold or anything else. Gold is not a given for the players. And if they don't get any money to spend, what does a shopping trip matter. The Overlord even has a card now that makes it so that in the store they have to buy almost all of the draws blind if they want to make a purchase. Pretty big risk for the players IMHO. So it is a tactical decision for whoever is choosing the quest. Is the risk worth the reward? This is all just my opinion though, take it as you will
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Dustin Whitmire
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Don't both sides go up 1 experience regardless, just as in the basic quests?
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dustwhit wrote:
Don't both sides go up 1 experience regardless, just as in the basic quests?


Not for the Act I quests, no.
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Darren Nakamura
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None of the Lair of the Wyrm sidequests award experience when played as an add-on to a campaign.
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Dexter345 wrote:
None of the Lair of the Wyrm sidequests award experience when played as an add-on to a campaign.


I think the Act II ones do, but my memory may be failing me.
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Darren Nakamura
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I just checked, and you're right. The Act II quests reward the heroes with 1 XP if they win, rather than the usual "everybody gets 1 XP and the winner(s) get(s) something extra.

The Overlord's potential reward doesn't seem all that great to me. It's sort of like the Level 3 Warlord card Reinforce, but much less powerful.

Since most of us haven't played the quests yet, it's difficult to tell, but I'm curious if Armed to the Teeth favors the Overlord more than At the Forge. It seems like the main outcome of the Act I rumor quests is to determine which Act II rumor quest is put into play. If Armed to the Teeth is better for the Overlord, then that may give him incentive to play an Act I rumor that he thinks he can win.

I think I agree though. It seems like simply giving the heroes extra money through searches would be the biggest reason for me not to play a rumor quest as the overlord. If the overlord wins, the heroes still get better gear than they had before. If the overlord loses, the heroes get better gear AND extra bonuses.
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Dexter345 wrote:
I think I agree though. It seems like simply giving the heroes extra money through searches would be the biggest reason for me not to play a rumor quest as the overlord. If the overlord wins, the heroes still get better gear than they had before. If the overlord loses, the heroes get better gear AND extra bonuses.


First, the heroes getting extra gold through searches is not a foregone conclusion. Even is the players go hard after the search tokens it has a good chance of costing them the quest. And we're talking a handful of gold here even if they do. They may manage to upgrade a piece of gear from that, but if they lose the quests the Overlord will net 2 relics and an overlord card in rewards. I'm not saying it is always a good idea, but it sure can be. But I guess it really is a matter of opinion, and anyway my group plays em just for the fun of it.
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Paul Newby
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Just a thought and I realise this may sound sacrilegious... Is it to move the direction of the game incrementally (at glacier speed) towards an RPG stylee as opposed to the current direct confrontation between Overlord and Heroes?

Please don't hit me...
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Darren Nakamura
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SomewhatDamaged wrote:
Dexter345 wrote:
I think I agree though. It seems like simply giving the heroes extra money through searches would be the biggest reason for me not to play a rumor quest as the overlord. If the overlord wins, the heroes still get better gear than they had before. If the overlord loses, the heroes get better gear AND extra bonuses.


First, the heroes getting extra gold through searches is not a foregone conclusion. Even is the players go hard after the search tokens it has a good chance of costing them the quest. And we're talking a handful of gold here even if they do. They may manage to upgrade a piece of gear from that, but if they lose the quests the Overlord will net 2 relics and an overlord card in rewards. I'm not saying it is always a good idea, but it sure can be. But I guess it really is a matter of opinion, and anyway my group plays em just for the fun of it.


The problem I have with Relics, and have had with the base game, is that in general, the Overlord can only use one per quest, and sometimes not even that if no Lieutenant is available. Gaining more Relics isn't really a huge benefit for the Overlord; the best thing about him gaining Relics is that he kept the heroes from getting them, and with this, he can do that by not ever playing the rumor to unlock the quest.

I'm not really trying to argue that these quests won't get played. My group's natural curiosity will lead to them being played. I am, however, joining the side that is questioning whether it's actually a smart move for the Overlord to play them.

An extra XP for the heroes is huge. Over the course of a normal Shadow Rune campaign, the heroes will get 8 XP (more if the heroes win particular Act II quests). As an Overlord, I think it may be unwise to give the heroes a chance at even one more XP, especially when my potential reward is a Relic that I will either not use or will obsolete one of my current Relics and an Overlord card.
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Phil Christiansen
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Well you make some good points. Personally I think that making sure you have the right relic at the right time is a boost, not to mention the card. But for those in your camp I guess they could just tweak the rewards a little. Gotta love house rules. Its been fun debating with you guys
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Chris J Davis
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SomewhatDamaged wrote:
Well you make some good points. Personally I think that making sure you have the right relic at the right time is a boost, not to mention the card. But for those in your camp I guess they could just tweak the rewards a little. Gotta love house rules. Its been fun debating with you guys


Not tweak the rewards; I'll be putting special ability text beneficial to the OL on my rumour quest cards. devil
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Where were you hiding when the storm broke?
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Good review

But is the wyrm white?
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Jeff
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WizardHowl wrote:
Good review

But is the wyrm white?


If it is I hope Stoker's estate is getting roylaties.
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Phil Christiansen
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She's orange, sorry
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This is what I came up with to add to each of the rumour quest cards to give the OL an incentive to play them:

What's Yours Is Mine

Play during the shopping step. Any axes, hammers, blades or shields drawn during this Shopping step are returned to the current act's shop deck (do not draw replacements).

Gold Digger

Play this card during any Choose Next Quest step of Act I, immediately after the heroes have chosen a quest. The heroes may choose to attempt this quest next instead. If they do, their original choice of quest becomes unavailable for the rest of the campaign (mark this on the campaign sheet). If they do not, discard this card and draw 1 overlord card per hero.

Rude Awakening

Play this card at the start of any Set Up Quest step (except for the Interlude) during Act I. While this card is in play, the overlord may always choose Hybrid Sentinels as one of his Open Groups (regardless of traits) and all attacks by Hybrid Sentinels gain [surge]: Burn.
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Darren Nakamura
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bleached_lizard wrote:
This is what I came up with to add to each of the rumour quest cards to give the OL an incentive to play them:

What's Yours Is Mine

Play during the shopping step. Any axes, hammers, blades or shields drawn during this Shopping step are returned to the current act's shop deck (do not draw replacements).

Gold Digger

Play this card during any Choose Next Quest step of Act I, immediately after the heroes have chosen a quest. The heroes may choose to attempt this quest next instead. If they do, their original choice of quest becomes unavailable for the rest of the campaign (mark this on the campaign sheet). If they do not, discard this card and draw 1 overlord card per hero.

Rude Awakening

Play this card at the start of any Set Up Quest step (except for the Interlude) during Act I. While this card is in play, the overlord may always choose Hybrid Sentinels as one of his Open Groups (regardless of traits) and all attacks by Hybrid Sentinels gain [surge]: Burn.


How do you have this interact with the Travel Event card that forces the Overlord to play one? Since it would necessarily happen during the Travel Phase, does that mean he wouldn't receive these listed benefits?
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Dexter345 wrote:
bleached_lizard wrote:
This is what I came up with to add to each of the rumour quest cards to give the OL an incentive to play them:

What's Yours Is Mine

Play during the shopping step. Any axes, hammers, blades or shields drawn during this Shopping step are returned to the current act's shop deck (do not draw replacements).

Gold Digger

Play this card during any Choose Next Quest step of Act I, immediately after the heroes have chosen a quest. The heroes may choose to attempt this quest next instead. If they do, their original choice of quest becomes unavailable for the rest of the campaign (mark this on the campaign sheet). If they do not, discard this card and draw 1 overlord card per hero.

Rude Awakening

Play this card at the start of any Set Up Quest step (except for the Interlude) during Act I. While this card is in play, the overlord may always choose Hybrid Sentinels as one of his Open Groups (regardless of traits) and all attacks by Hybrid Sentinels gain [surge]: Burn.


How do you have this interact with the Travel Event card that forces the Overlord to play one? Since it would necessarily happen during the Travel Phase, does that mean he wouldn't receive these listed benefits?


I would have the Travel Event ignore this text.
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D6Frog wrote:

It sounds like you were not aware that there is a downloadable mini-campaign as well...

http://www.fantasyflightgames.com/ffg_content/descent-second...



Thanks for the down-n-low on this mini-campaign! I just got my copy of the expansion recently, but have not yet gotten it to the table. This looks like a nice way to break in the new goodies.
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Paul Doherty
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Thanks for the review - I must say this second edition of Descent is going strong; me and my friends I play with love it and I now have the base game plus four expansions. Keep up the good work, FFG!
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