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Puerto Rico» Forums » Reviews

Subject: All the fun of Imperialism! rss

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Tibs
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Amherst
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Guys. It's literally been years since this topic was brought up. Can we drop it now?
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kungfro wrote:
Guys. It's literally been years since this topic was brought up. Can we drop it now?


The problem is that it's never resolved, as there is no way to resolve it. PR and other games, if you look at them in the right/wrong light, have components/themes which are historical in nature and if you look closely enough (sometimes, that doesn't require looking all that closely at all), you can find something objectionable.

Those games, if they have good mechanics, are probably not going away anytime soon and just as many, if not more people don't see/don't care about what components are representing, as long as the game is fun.

So, every now and then, something like this will be brought up, rabble rabbled about for a little while, some will get angry, some will put up walls o' text to defend their side, and eventually, everyone will just get bored and walk away, till someone stirs the pot again. The way I figure, just popcorn.gif it up and let it run its' course.
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StephenM wrote:
EmperorZeb wrote:


I'm probably irritating the piss out of everybody



Yes, you are, but who knows, maybe now I won't have to get up 3 times during the night because of a full bladder.


The only reason this is irritating at all is because this is the 9,001st thread on the subject. How you missed that is...suspect.
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Stephen McHale
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markgravitygood wrote:
StephenM wrote:
EmperorZeb wrote:


I'm probably irritating the piss out of everybody



Yes, you are, but who knows, maybe now I won't have to get up 3 times during the night because of a full bladder.


The only reason this is irritating at all is because this is the 9,001st thread on the subject. How you missed that is...suspect.


I did not miss it, I was attempting to be humorous, attempting being the key word.
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Not you, StephenM, the OP!
 
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Jonathan Harrison
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So long ...
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... and thanks for all the fish.
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Tut_613 wrote:
For example, the wargame Small world is all about Genocide.
(Just trolling the wargamers a bit... )

Yes. You are. What's Small World? we say, in unison.
 
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Jonathan Harrison
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So long ...
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... and thanks for all the fish.
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kjamma4 wrote:

Next time, quote.
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Sean Shaw
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kjamma4 wrote:
..., my next stop in a time machine is to go back to the drawing board sessions during Puerto Rico's inception and convince them to make it a space exploration game.

Seriously - did your group really have nervous laughter over this game?


So that's how the ideas for Race for the Galaxy were actually born...
 
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Todd McCorkle
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Just to add fuel to a stupid flame-war...

What about the nobles expansion? In that, little red disks, representing nobles, ride the same colony ship and can still wind up working in the fields.
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Beer be with you.
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Northlake
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Settlers of Catan does not improve with your house rules. The best option if you don't like the rules as written is to just select another game.
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HuginnGreiling wrote:
kjamma4 wrote:

Next time, quote.


It works better if you go in blind.
 
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Sam Carroll
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HuginnGreiling wrote:
Tut_613 wrote:
For example, the wargame Small world is all about Genocide.
(Just trolling the wargamers a bit... )

Yes. You are. What's Small World? we say, in unison.


Not a wargame, that's for sure.
 
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Tom K
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I do think this is somewhat problematic, because Puerto Rico seems to at once acknowledge the issue and shuffle it under the rug. There's no reason why this game had to be Puerto Rico or why it had to have brown discs, so in that sense it seems like a way of acknowledging the situation. But by calling them "colonists," it recognizes them and then disenfranchises them. If they are recognized then they must be recognized fully for what they actually are, and it's mildly problematic to disenfranchise them and then make a purely fun board game around the issue.

I would be fine if the game called it "slavery," and therein marked it as bad or deplorable. By being set in this location and calling it "colonization," it's misrepresenting a hard period of cultural history. I think a lot more people in the US would be upset with a game set in the American South featuring colonists who peopled the cities and seemed to happily work on plantations for their own gain/employ, with players taking the role of plantation owner in a fun game of scrounge the cash and goods. The creator of such a game would have to make it clear that the game was about slavery and that slavery was not a system they'd happily fictionalize into a fun little world. There would have to maybe be some acknowledgement of the reality of the situation, an indication that yes, what the players are doing is wrong, but we are fictionalizing this for more purpose than your entertainment.

Imagine this in another medium: a book, movie, or videogame in which the Puerto Rican slaves were depicted as colonists seeking gainful employ, and the kindly plantation owner gives them jobs. It would be laughable and deplorable.

Puerto Rico is a very fun game, which is likely why this mishandling of the issue is tolerated. But it would be a better game if it didn't weakly raise and then dismiss these issues.
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Zigi Hogan
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You very much need to find another outlet for your white guilt. Not sure if you are aware... IT IS A GAME, not a broad social comentary.
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