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Eclipse: Rise of the Ancients» Forums » General

Subject: Simultaneous play research blocking question rss

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Bil McGee
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We will be playing our first 9 player game with the simultaneous play variant soon and I was wondering if anyone has run into a situation where the players taking actions late in the rotation either don't get the opportunity to research or don't get it often enough.

For example

Player 1 (primary) and player 5 (secondary) start their turns. Because the first to pass gets the starting player and primary action marker, does that mean that for the rest of the round after the first player passes, no matter how many more turns each player gets, no one can research for the rest of that round?

If this is the case, has anyone run into players getting mad at the first player to pass because they can no longer research?
 
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Purple Paladin

California
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We were wondering the same thing. We are playing a 5-6 player game soon, going to try Simo-turns as a house rule, but are not sure why exactly we should not let the secondary player research.

If it's game breaking, we won't let him of course, but playtesting in my head, I just can't see why they could not allow this to happen (just as long as the primary player get first chocie).

 
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Jim Richardson

Pennsylvania
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Purple Paladin wrote:
We were wondering the same thing. We are playing a 5-6 player game soon, going to try Simo-turns as a house rule, but are not sure why exactly we should not let the secondary player research.


I imagine it's due to the conflict that could happen with both players attempting to research the same tech at the same time, or players racing through their turns (or being angry at other players being slow) to get the techs before the other active player can get them. Seems like it would be mass pandemonium to allow both to research.

That said, it also seems nonsensical to turn off all research just because the primary player has passed. I can't believe they wouldn't have made rules for that situation, maybe you should check again.
 
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Bil McGee
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I definitely agree that only the player with the primary marker should be allowed to research.

We were thinking that we might tweak it so that the first player to pass gets the starting player marker only and the primary/secondary markers continue to move around the table until the round is over. Once everyone has passed, then the primary marker goes to the starting player and the secondary to the player across the table.
 
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Josh Lacey
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I actually think the simultaneous play variant could create all sorts of issues, and I can't imagine ever playing with it.

Players intentionally slowing down to have a little more knowledge before making their move etc. I just foresee it creating a lot of issues. I do agree it would speed up pace of play though...maybe if you could set a timer where both players have to finish their turn within 2 minutes and then the tokens pass and both players have to finish their moves within 2 minutes and then the tokens pass etc etc.

Even then, if direct conflict were to potentially be in play with the two active players do you then make the pink token research player have to decide first. Warp portals alone make this a very real possibility, let alone the potential for expansion conflict.
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Bil McGee
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ParticleMan wrote:
[q="Purple Paladin"]We were wondering the same thing. I can't believe they wouldn't have made rules for that situation, maybe you should check again.


Checked again, the rule book doesn't provide these details.

Rule book page 13:
"Only the player with the Primary Action Marker may
take the Research Action
.

First player to pass gets the Primary Action Marker and the
Starting Player Marker
. The Secondary Action Marker goes
to the player opposite (4 steps from the Starting Player in
the 7–8 player game, 5 steps in the 9 player game), as in
the beginning of the game."

It does note that using this variant can cause some "timing issues that some players may feel uncomfortable with" but it doesn't go into any details about any of these issues or how to address them. We'll give it a try and report our findings. I was just wondering if anyone else had run into any issues.
 
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Klaus
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It's just imprecise wording. I'm 99% certain this is how it's supposed to happen:

First player to pass gets the Primary Action Marker on the next turn and the Starting Player Marker.

Both action markers remain in circulation until everyone has passed. (If there's only on player left, he'd only need the primary marker.)
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Bil McGee
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Hannibal Rex wrote:
It's just imprecise wording. I'm 99% certain this is how it's supposed to happen:

First player to pass gets the Primary Action Marker on the next turn and the Starting Player Marker.

Both action markers remain in circulation until everyone has passed. (If there's only on player left, he'd only need the primary marker.)


That sounds like the way that would make the most sense.
 
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Philip Morton
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If one player passing caused him to immediately take the primary action marker, and the secondary action marker to go to the opposite player, how would you continue tracking the player turns during the current round?
 
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Forrest & Ryan Driskel
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Hannibal Rex wrote:
It's just imprecise wording. I'm 99% certain this is how it's supposed to happen:

First player to pass gets the Primary Action Marker on the next turn and the Starting Player Marker.

Both action markers remain in circulation until everyone has passed. (If there's only on player left, he'd only need the primary marker.)


This is correct.
 
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Agent J
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What if you don't want to do a non-research action during your turn with the secondary action marker, but you don't wish to pass because you want to research?
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JT Call
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Jythier wrote:
What if you don't want to do a non-research action during your turn with the secondary action marker, but you don't wish to pass because you want to research?


This question has been asked a lot in some other forums posts. My solution: you can take the research action when holding the secondary action marker, BUT whoever is initially holding the secondary action marker should allow the person initially holding the primary action marker to choose his research tech first (if he even wants to research). Once you've passed the marker on though, both action markers can research in any order they choose.

YMMV.
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