Recommend
 
 Thumb up
 Hide
19 Posts

King of Tokyo» Forums » Rules

Subject: Order of dice resolution rss

Your Tags: Add tags
Popular Tags: [View All]
lufia22
msg tools
From what I gather, people around here seem to say that you can resolve the dice in any order you choose.

My question is this:

Does every die of the same type have to be resolved at the same time, or can I, say, heal, deal damage, heal, deal damage (assuming 2 hearts and 2 claws are rolled) or must ALL hearts and ALL claws (etc) be resolved at the same time?

This is important for cards like heal ray (sorry if the card name is wrong).

This game has a lot of vague ruling issues in general.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Der Einsielder
Germany
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
I would allow this because there are no such rules that restrict the order of dice resolution.

But - what a strange situation?? Where do you need this? What do you want to do?
2 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Was George Orwell an Optimist?
United States
Corvallis
Oregon
flag msg tools
Horace Silver: The Cape Verdean Blues || Horace Parlan: Happy Frame of Mind || Dexter Gordon: Doin' Allright || Hank Mobley: Roll Call
badge
mbmbmbmbmb
lufia22 wrote:
Does every die of the same type have to be resolved at the same time, or can I, say, heal, deal damage, heal, deal damage (assuming 2 hearts and 2 claws are rolled) or must ALL hearts and ALL claws (etc) be resolved at the same time?

I think you resolve all dice of one type at the same time, but I can't see why it would make any difference. Alternating claws and hearts would take longer, and be annoying. Is there a situation in which you think it would be useful?

[edit] Thinking more about it, I'm guessing you may be trying to exploit a card, e.g. using Shrink Ray twice with your two claws. I wouldn't allow that.
2 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Der Einsielder
Germany
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
Sphere wrote:

I think you resolve all dice of one type at the same time, ... I wouldn't allow that.


Do you think so because you don't like it that way or are there any hints in the rules that force players to resolve dice of one type at once?
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Was George Orwell an Optimist?
United States
Corvallis
Oregon
flag msg tools
Horace Silver: The Cape Verdean Blues || Horace Parlan: Happy Frame of Mind || Dexter Gordon: Doin' Allright || Hank Mobley: Roll Call
badge
mbmbmbmbmb
Einsiedler wrote:
Sphere wrote:

I think you resolve all dice of one type at the same time, ... I wouldn't allow that.


Do you think so because you don't like it that way or are there any hints in the rules that force players to resolve dice of one type at once?

I think so based on more than a half century of game playing, plus my experience as a playtester, and you can throw in decades of corresponding with designers and helping to answer rules questions online.

The rules say you resolve each type of dice, and various cards are designed to work with a specific type of resolution. Take Cannibalistic for instance. It says "When you do damage gain 1 heart'. That obviously means that if you do damage on your turn, you gain a heart. If you tried to rules lawyer your way into gaining two hearts on a turn by saying you had two claws and did damage twice, I'd say you earned one heart and a forehead slap instead.
devil

10 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Was George Orwell an Optimist?
United States
Corvallis
Oregon
flag msg tools
Horace Silver: The Cape Verdean Blues || Horace Parlan: Happy Frame of Mind || Dexter Gordon: Doin' Allright || Hank Mobley: Roll Call
badge
mbmbmbmbmb
Einsiedler wrote:
Do you think so because you don't like it that way or are there any hints in the rules that force players to resolve dice of one type at once?

To put it another way, do you find something in the rules that says you can break the resolution down into multiple resolutions? Rules are meant to tell you what you can do, not list everything you can't. For instance, the rules don't say that you aren't allowed to set fire to the board, but I'm telling you flat out that you can't (at least at my house).

Sometimes you have to use common sense. Do you think the game would benefit by doing it the way you suggest? There would be no net benefit, because if your group were crazy enough to allow it, they'd do the same to you in return. All you'd accomplish is wild distortion of the card values and slower game play.
3 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Patrick Sewell
United States
Palmdale
California
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
After a game tonight (6-players) we had an example this question applies to perfectly.

One player had Lightning Armor (caveat for this comment, I don't have the game in front of me so I apologize if I miss the names by a bit). Basically it allows the possibility to damage the monster who just damaged you by get a one-time rollback at the attacker. The question could be important because in our case the attacking monster also rolled hearts. The attacker hit for 4 damage so the defender could have scored up to 4 hits back at the attacker...who had 3 or 4 life. In our case the defender didn't have a crazy roll so the question became moot.

However, it was a situation where order of resolution is important because if the attacker applied hearts first it was impossible then for the attacker to be killed. But if attacks are resolved before hearts, the attacker could have died.

Before the die roll we decided to go with the order the actions are listed on the right side summary of the first page (Vp, Energy, Attack, Heal) which means hearts are the last die resolved. I was unable to find anything that specified an order, but we all agreed that using the order on the right side of page 1 seemed fair.

Finally, I don't think you can break your dice apart and must resolve them as a group. This is backed up in a general since because when the ruled talk about resolving attacks or heals it discussed applying all the dice (it's sort of implicit though). And second, a lot of cards say when you attack (shrink ray, poison spit for example) the damage is applied. The rules under resolving die rolls call it "Attack" not "attacks" which implies one occurrence to me. Also in the rules for resolving attac it states that the monsters take one damage for each claw rolled. So that seems pretty clear to me that you attack once on your turn and use all dice for that action. Same applies to the wording of Heal.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Was George Orwell an Optimist?
United States
Corvallis
Oregon
flag msg tools
Horace Silver: The Cape Verdean Blues || Horace Parlan: Happy Frame of Mind || Dexter Gordon: Doin' Allright || Hank Mobley: Roll Call
badge
mbmbmbmbmb
cycloneVB wrote:
Before the die roll we decided to go with the order the actions are listed on the right side summary of the first page (Vp, Energy, Attack, Heal) which means hearts are the last die resolved. I was unable to find anything that specified an order, but we all agreed that using the order on the right side of page 1 seemed fair.

Obviously it's fair if you agree to it in advance, but it's equally fair if you agree in advance that the active player can resolve in any order he chooses. That's the way we play; nothing in the rules says you have to stick to a particular order of resolution.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Stephan Brissaud
United States
Las Vegas
Nevada
flag msg tools
publisher
mbmbmbmbmb
cycloneVB wrote:
After a game tonight (6-players) we had an example this question applies to perfectly.

One player had Lightning Armor (caveat for this comment, I don't have the game in front of me so I apologize if I miss the names by a bit). Basically it allows the possibility to damage the monster who just damaged you by get a one-time rollback at the attacker. The question could be important because in our case the attacking monster also rolled hearts. The attacker hit for 4 damage so the defender could have scored up to 4 hits back at the attacker...who had 3 or 4 life. In our case the defender didn't have a crazy roll so the question became moot.

However, it was a situation where order of resolution is important because if the attacker applied hearts first it was impossible then for the attacker to be killed. But if attacks are resolved before hearts, the attacker could have died.

Before the die roll we decided to go with the order the actions are listed on the right side summary of the first page (Vp, Energy, Attack, Heal) which means hearts are the last die resolved. I was unable to find anything that specified an order, but we all agreed that using the order on the right side of page 1 seemed fair.

Finally, I don't think you can break your dice apart and must resolve them as a group. This is backed up in a general since because when the ruled talk about resolving attacks or heals it discussed applying all the dice (it's sort of implicit though). And second, a lot of cards say when you attack (shrink ray, poison spit for example) the damage is applied. The rules under resolving die rolls call it "Attack" not "attacks" which implies one occurrence to me. Also in the rules for resolving attac it states that the monsters take one damage for each claw rolled. So that seems pretty clear to me that you attack once on your turn and use all dice for that action. Same applies to the wording of Heal.


I play as each player can choose in which order to resolve the dice, but as Sphere said, as long as everybody agree on the way to proceed before hand, you can choose whatever seems fair to you.
2 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Patrick Sewell
United States
Palmdale
California
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
Agreed, as long as all agree ahead of time it's all good. In our case we had no idea this could occur until it happened so I offered this up as a solution for people in our situation. Of course it's highly unlikely anyone would look here until after the fact or well before the fact :)

I just found it funny that I came on here looking for an answer to this exact question because of what happened in our game...well after the fact :whistle:
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Pasi Ojala
Finland
Tampere
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
lufia22 wrote:
can I, say, heal, deal damage, heal, deal damage (assuming 2 hearts and 2 claws are rolled) or must ALL hearts and ALL claws (etc) be resolved at the same time?


Because there are cards that can add +1 to an attack, or +1 to energy, it would not be sensible/fair to allow each die to be resolved separately. (Edit: And it would have other consequences, like Tokyo potentially being yielded several times during one turn.)

But I would allow any order of resolution for each type.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Robert Stewart
United Kingdom
Newcastle-upon-Tyne
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
Any reason not to resolve them all simultaneously?
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Pasi Ojala
Finland
Tampere
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
rmsgrey wrote:
Any reason not to resolve them all simultaneously?


I don't think so, although in practise you would resolve in some order, for example add VP, then health, get the energy cubes, then attack. Then handle possible damage you get yourself (cards can for example deal damage when the attacked player yields Tokyo).

Then you can do the 'cleanup' phase, sweep and/or buy stuff before giving the dies to the next player.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Mark Turner
United Kingdom
Farnham
Surrey
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
I was wondering abou this today: can you attack a monster in Tokyo with, say, one claw, which causes him to yield, and then resolve the other claws while in Tokyo - thus damaging all the other monsters at the same time?
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Pasi Ojala
Finland
Tampere
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
No, all dice are resolved at the same time, then the effects happen. And you can't not use some die, all attack dice must be resolved (and at the same time)!

2 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Marco Yupanqui
Bolivia
La Paz
La Paz
flag msg tools
mbmbmb
Aren't you supposed to "resolve" at the end of your second reroll (if you chose to reroll of course)
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Pasi Ojala
Finland
Tampere
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
Windrunner wrote:
Aren't you supposed to "resolve" at the end of your second reroll (if you chose to reroll of course)


Yes, you resolve all dice when you decide that you are finished with the rerolls. (Did you see something to contradict this?) There are cases when you have more than 2 rerolls available. There is a card letting you reroll 3's for free. Another player may have Psychic Probe to reroll one of your dice before you resolve.

 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
John Raggio
United States
flag msg tools
mb
a1bert wrote:
Windrunner wrote:
Aren't you supposed to "resolve" at the end of your second reroll (if you chose to reroll of course)


Yes, you resolve all dice when you decide that you are finished with the rerolls. (Did you see something to contradict this?) There are cases when you have more than 2 rerolls available. There is a card letting you reroll 3's for free. Another player may have Psychic Probe to reroll one of your dice before you resolve.



This reply brings up another questions for me. If the player has a re-roll left can he use it after his opponent flipped one of his dice based on a card? In other words if he said he was done after two rolls and then changes his mind and wants to roll a third time after his opponent changed his die? I would guess not since he said he was "done".
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Pasi Ojala
Finland
Tampere
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
You can react to changes. If you move to resolve the dice, an opponent can no longer go back to the previous phase (as long as you allow ample time for the opponent to react first).

If an opponent decides to affect the dice before the resolve step, then you can as well.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Front Page | Welcome | Contact | Privacy Policy | Terms of Service | Advertise | Support BGG | Feeds RSS
Geekdo, BoardGameGeek, the Geekdo logo, and the BoardGameGeek logo are trademarks of BoardGameGeek, LLC.