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Subject: Space Alert with a traitor rss

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Danny Leenders
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Variant rules for playing space alert with a traitor in the middle

Use the you are a cylon cards from battlestar galactica. And in a 5 player game use 1 you are a cylon and 4 you are not a cylon cards(humans).

Shuffle the cards, and every player gets a hidden role.
Players are not allowed to show each other there loyaltie cards. There is a secrecy rule not to show your true identity! You can always bluff about it!

The game starts like normal with all the same rules from the normal game. Except for one thing; cards in phase 2 from the game are all played face down on the gameboard, so player can only see if they plan a action or a move order (back side of the card).

There is a change in your role:
The mission for the humans is to survive the attack, and find out who is the cylon. And help the other humans.

The mission for the cylon is to let the sitting duck get destroyed bye the enemy attacks, and convince every one on the ship that he is a human and is there to help each other. And the best thing to do is convince every one else that some one else is the cylon.

After the game ends all players must discuss who may be a cylon, and in secret write their vote down. Every player must vote on one player, they can not vote on their self. The player with the most votes is throwed in jail.

The person in jail can not vote anymore in the evaluation phase.

The reason he can't vote anymore:

In the evaluation phase players will replay the game bye the action cards every one has played. The cards in phase to will be kept phase down until the evaluation is at the corresponding number.
Every time the player in jail must perform the action he played on his time track all players not in jail must vote if they:
A: perform the action as played.
B: Not play the action
C: reverse the card/do the action on the bottom.

If there is a tie, they will always perform option A.



Actions played bye people outside the jail are permanent, just like in the base game.

The humans win when the sitting duck survives the mission.
The cylon can only win when he is not in jail, and the sitting duck gets destroyed.

This variant is for people who have played the game a lot, and want a new challenge, and like the traitor mechanisme.





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Simon Lundström
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Idea is cool but have you tried it?

To win, the humans have to:
1) not make mistakes
2) find out who is cylon without any real clues
3) Even if they get 1) and 2) right, they must be able to save the ship without relying on this guy.

Sound downright impossible to me. Depending on what mission you play, of course.
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Danny Leenders
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Bakel
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Zimeon wrote:
Idea is cool but have you tried it?

To win, the humans have to:
1) not make mistakes
2) find out who is cylon without any real clues
3) Even if they get 1) and 2) right, they must be able to save the ship without relying on this guy.

Sound downright impossible to me. Depending on what mission you play, of course.


Hi Zimeon,

We have tried it 6 times now, and it is a lot of fun. I think we will only play the game from now on with a traitor.

It is indeed very difficult for the humans, bud they have one advantage: even if they throw a human in jail. They still have a majority in votes when they vote on to perform the action of the player in jail. So they still can use this to their advantage.

Loyaltie cards are only shown after the evaluation phase. So it's excited until the game ends, unlike in the base game.

We had for one instince a human in the brig, and we all thought he was a cylon, we then evaluated the game and the person in jail as a human made a mistake, and then we all thought for sure he was the cylon. And so the cylon player wo wanted to waste a feul core excidently helped us, and we survived just barely because of that.
Then at the end after the evaluation phase we showed our cards, we were so suprised that he was a human!


The humans can still win even if they got the wrong person in jail!shake
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Simon Lundström
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Awesome. I wouldn't dare try it though. With the skill we have, we don't need traitors to kill us.
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A. Mandible
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DanLeeDR01 wrote:
The game starts like normal with all the same rules from the normal game. Except for one thing; cards in phase 2 from the game are all played face down on the gameboard, so player can only see if they plan a action or a move order (back side of the card).


Isn't that the normal rule? We always play with our cards face down.
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Danny Leenders
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You should read: play all cards fase up in phase 1 and 3, play all cards in phase two down..
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Sight Reader
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Here's an idea off the top of my head:

DanLeeDR01 wrote:
Variant rules for playing space alert with a traitor in the middle

Instead of having Cylons or Traitors, what if you give everyone a secret Agenda?

"Prevent [draw random player] from taking any action in [draw random zone].

Use Heroic Action cards to determine the zone. If you draw yourself as the random player, then look at the room on that card instead of the zone and prevent anyone from taking actions there except you.

Not my image

With hidden agendas, people start obstructing group decisions for mysterious reasons but still need the mission to succeed. You lose points every time someone violates your Agenda, so force violations on others to win.

I'm sure the idea can use refinement. Thoughts?

EDITS: numerous refinements to idea
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Brian Modreski
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Ok, I'm not a fan of traitor games personally, but kudos to you for making a variant if that's what you want.

But...I'm kinda with Zimeon here. I'm pretty confident that as a traitor with this setup I could wreck things really darn easily.

Hell, I can probably manage to wreck things when NOT as a traitor and trying to play well.
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Danny Leenders
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I wish you and Zimeon had tried the variant, it is not difficult, and because the cards are played open in phase 1 and 3. A traitor can't do a lot of damage.

Please try it just once, with a simple simulation mission, and comment.

I would love to heir your experience.
 
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Robb Effinger
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I haven't tried this, and when I first read it, it seemed crazy, but upon more reflection I could see it working. You'd have to get your mission difficulty right, but it may be a reasonable game. I'd probably start by tuning the mission difficulty to an easier mission then your team of 4 people can normally handle.

The (Loyal) crew members have a lot of advantages that they don't normally have - open cards is pretty big. They also have a 5th member of the crew for at least phase 1. Not the most important phase, true, but it's something. And they have an easier mission then they normally would.

The traitor, on the other hand, also only has 4 actions in which they can be super-destructive. And they only get those actions if they convince the rest of the crew that they're helping. Really, you're playing a game of werewolf in the middle of your game of space-alert. And you have a lot of information to play that game with - the talk of the crew members thoughout the planning phase, and the face up (and backs of the face-down) action cards that were played - along with what players claim their face-down cards are. Remember - if you correctly find the traitor, his actions don't necessarily happen. It may be actually difficult to sabotage - especially if the players are a little paranoid, and add some redundancy (which may be possible due to the easier mission).

I don't know. Certainly this game would require an experienced group, who also want to play a game of werewolf. But I'd probably try it.
 
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Brian Modreski
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Quote:
Please try it just once, with a simple simulation mission, and comment.

Well, with a sim half the time the ship won't be getting destroyed anyway.

Quote:
...and because the cards are played open in phase 1 and 3. A traitor can't do a lot of damage.

One missed action can chain out to have catastrophic effects. Plus, going the wrong direction once in hidden phase 2 means all your phase 3 cards are just as damaging. Your phase 3 cards can look perfectly helpful...but if you are really in red and not in blue...

There are a number of threats that will outright kill a ship. Unless you assign double duty on all of them, all a traitor needs to do is skip one action on defeating them.

I suppose if only one "lethal" threat comes up, you can brig whoever deals with it so at least if the person who handles it is a traitor, they can't win. This would discourage traitors from handling the lethal threats.

But if you get two...big trouble.

Quote:
And they only get those actions if they convince the rest of the crew that they're helping.

But you can do lots and lots of damage simply by NOT pushing a button. The other players can't stop that.

Plus, I would imagine I could cause a lot of mayhem just by doing little things like pushing a B button (helpfully) and then later (helpfully) changing to a different action...but forgetting to remove the energy cubes from the ship. My action can be completely helpful...but in the chaos, it's likely people will miss that they are spending energy that's not really there.
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Andrzej Stewart
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Haven't tried this yet, but this seems like the traitor has a major advantage. Seems to me that it'd be fairly easy for the traitor to position somewhere near the white lower deck in phase one, then secretly waltz over in phase 2 and dump all the remaining tanks, rapidly burning spare energy and leaving the ship power-deficient in phase 3, if not earlier. Unless that player is jailed, that seems like it'd be pretty crippling.

Also, as StormKnight discussed, it seems like it'd be easy for a traitor to screw the team over simply by skipping an action. Serious threats, and even some of the better regular threats, really require coordinated fire to deal with effectively. All the traitor has to do is hit B/C/Battlebots when he says he's hitting A, and a what should have been a precision kill turns into that relatively minor threat in zone blue effortlessly tearing the ship in half.

Energy threats and Maelstrom could be particularly nasty in this regard: "Oh look, I forgot to fire the pulse cannon, looks like all our shots bounce off the shields. Oops!" I guess the crew could place a second crewmember at the pulse cannon to make sure it fires, or fire a few extra salvos...but then the mere presence of the traitor is causing the crew to either tie up crewmember actions or burn energy, both of which are valuable commodities.

Even something as simple as skipping the second phase mouse jiggle could cause delays that can completely throw off crew timings. Again, just the mere presence of the traitor means you have to displace a second crewmember just to make sure the screensaver gets kicked.

Any thoughts?
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Erik R.
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I arrived to this thread over a year too late, but what if a 'traitor' (one of the players losing their minds and going rogue) was part of an internal threat that happens on the ship, with its own timing and marker on the time track?
 
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