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Subject: My take on naval units in the Ogre-verse rss

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Darin Sunley
United States
Draper
Utah
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Current naval cruisers are eggs with sledgehammers. An Arleigh Burke or a Ticonderoga carries enough firepower to turn a ship it's own size into fist-sized chunks of shrapnel several times over. Adding an Ogreverse Laser Tower and even just a foot or so of BPC completely eliminates the naval cruise missile (and the strike aircraft, for that matter) as a viable weapon and takes you right back to the WW1 dynamic: BIG ships with as many big guns as you can stack on them, where each individual shot is vanishingly unlikely to do any real damage against the overwhelming amount of armor your opponent has hung on the hull, pouring fire into each other for hours just to try to strip off the external weapons and sensors and claim a mission kill.

In other words, a dynamic fairly similar to land-based Ogre. Indeed, simply painting the map blue and changing the scale of the hexes gets you a good first approximation of naval ogre combat, with one tiny exception:

Big battleships in the OGREverse will be virtually impossible to immobilize. Unlike land-based Ogres, whose treads are by necessity external, exposed, and composed of large numbers of moving parts, an Ogreverse battleship's thrusters could be mounted deep within the hull, with literally a dozen or more meters of BPC between them and any incoming weapons fire. You can hang enough BPC on an Iowa-class-sized hull that, after literally hours of direct hits, you'd have no sensors, no external weapons [and the entire thing is glowing brightly in the infrared] but it can still make 20+ knots under it's own power.

Regarding weapons, I see an Ogreverse naval unit as mounting one or more laser towers or batteries, something akin to Paneuropean-style missile racks only with cruise missiles - large numbers of them with very deep magazines, and a significant number of guns similar to the Ogre's main and secondary batteries only much longer ranged. Ogre-sized missiles would be mounted in genuinely large numbers (again, fired through missile racks from deep magazines) as anti-missile missiles, like their modern day counterparts.

Unlike land based Ogres, which top out at 50 meters long in order to be transportable and to avoid being such a large concentration of force that they become cruise missile bait, Ogreverse naval units provide their own transportation and provide their own laser battery coverage, meaning that the ideal size is as much bigger than the other guy's as you can afford. The pre-WWI race for larger and larger battleships would be on again with a vengeance, with laser towers and BPC preventing any embarrassing incidents like the sinking of the Bismarck or Pearl Harbor.

Larger battleships might be escorted by significant numbers of screening escort ships - small ships carrying only a laser tower and as much BPC as can be carried while still being able to keep up with the battleships.

One thing I'm not certain about is whether even a cruise missile would be a one-shot guaranteed kill to an Ogreverse BB the way it is to a land-based Ogre. Land based Ogres can carry meters of BPC - Ogreverse battleships could carry 10 times that thickness.

The dynamics that would still carry forward from modern day combat would be the enormous importance of superior sensors range [modified by the extreme difficulty of engaging meaningfully from more than a few km away] and the almost complete irrelevance of manoeuvre once contact has been made.

Ok, now I totally want to write up some ship designs and start experimenting with them.

//Originally posted to the SJG Forums, June 2012: http://forums.sjgames.com/showthread.php?t=92220&page=6 . one of my first Ogre articles, presented here for new players.
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Jason Kendelhardt
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Clarksville
Tennessee
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What about submarines? I'd expect almost EVERY naval unit to have some level of submersible capability, if not be totally underwater with surfacing just for resupply in port.

A traditional surface vessel, no matter how well armored, would be toast when faced with 200+ knot supercavitating nuclear tipped torpedos that, even if they can't crack the hull directly, would drop the ship into an expanding cavity that would either snap it in half or drown it (again, assuming a ship designed to live on top of the water).

Reminds me of David Mace's (?) "Demon 4" novel, about a sentient sub (maybe had a cyborg brain, I don't recall) going after a sentient "ogre-like" oceanic defense array. Rather than having the Ogre as the offensive unit, it is a distributed DEFENSIVE unit, acting as an area denial force.
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David Damerell
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jason10mm wrote:
What about submarines?


Well, in the OGRE universe, we get the technology that makes the game work; so let us propose that, for all BPC is fine stuff, it is very easy to detect underwater?
 
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Charles Hildebrandt
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Fort Washington
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Have you taken a look at Kraken?

http://www.sirdinglydang.com/kraken.htm
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Martin Gallo
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O'Fallon
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Kraken looks interesting. Are there rules for it somewhere?
 
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