Recommend
3 
 Thumb up
 Hide
93 Posts
1 , 2 , 3 , 4  Next »   | 

The Dice Tower» Forums » General

Subject: Asmodee Pricing Changes rss

Your Tags: Add tags
Popular Tags: [View All]
Levi Siebens
United States
Bothell
Washington
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmb
A couple of questions I had after watching the live stream...today... For the Asmoder segment (2hr 38min in the second video of the first day) the Asmodee rep went into more detail which gave the context of "we want to protect brick and mortar by giving them a discount and making games more valuable by ensuring there cannot be a race to the bottom for price."

So questions:

1. Do you think they will succeed?
2. Will this make games more valuable, or do you think people will just not buy games?
3. Do you think the market needs the stabilization mentioned?
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Chris Knight
United States
Portland
Oregon
flag msg tools
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
I don't entirely understand your questions... But that ain't gonna stop me!

Levisiebens wrote:
1. Do you think they will succeed?


...at saving B&M stores? No. ...at making higher profits? Yes.

Levisiebens wrote:
2. Will this make games more valuable, or do you think people will just not buy games?


More valuable? Ugh, that bit of rhetoric is so vile. Will people pay more for the same quality stuff? You bet they will. FFG, Asmodee, and Days of Wonder make the stuff we can't resist.

More valuable? More valuable?!?!? Sure. Why not? If Star Wars Rebellion only cost $75, I would just put it in my closet. But if I gotta pay $100, by gum, I'll put it in the trophy case instead.

Levisiebens wrote:
3. Do you think the market needs the stabilization mentioned?


Sure. Stabilization would be nice. Of the many viable ways to work toward this, price fixing is not one of them.
9 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Andy
United States
flag msg tools
Dino DNA!
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Gee Whiz wrote:
I don't entirely understand your questions... But that ain't gonna stop me!

Levisiebens wrote:
1. Do you think they will succeed?


...at saving B&M stores? No. ...at making higher profits? Yes.



this

good talk about protecting the little guy but given that most of the sales will still be online because it's 2016, occam's razor says money grab. of course it will make games more valuable because with the extra revenue I expect we'll be seeing a lot more use of gold leafed chits. right?
6 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Bob (he/him)
United States
Lutz
Florida
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
All I can say is, the market will decide the prices. If Asmodee is only going to sell games at B&M and or the prices at online retailers are higher, then they are going to sell less product.

That's the only thing I see happening. There are other game publishers that make great games, and I'll buy there stuff instead.
2 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Maui Chris
United States
San Ramon
California
flag msg tools
Valentino Rossi Fan
badge
get this ball
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
*their devil
5 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Brett Waddingham
United States
Maryville
Missouri
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
1. Do you think they will succeed?

Hard to say, I agree that they will succeed at making a profit, well spoken Gee Whiz. I think profit is their main objective. I can't see how this move is to do anything else (yet that is just my simplistic perspective on the way a company is run). If the way a company makes money is to move product (at some sort of profit, whether minor or major) then it wouldn't matter to asmodee, FF, or DoW who was moving their product the most. In short, I am still thinking about this, just not seeing what they are driving toward.

2. Will this make games more valuable, or do you think people will just not buy games?

I liked their idea of getting away from materialism and such (when the rep said that they would just as soon have you play the game you bought rather than it just get it to balance out your order for free shipping).

There is something that I have wondered about regarding this mindset though...if they are a company that makes and sells games, why does it matter to them whether it is a display thing or a play thing? Yet again, I don't get what they are trying to do here.

3. Do you think the market needs the stabilization mentioned?

This I am unsure about, I've only been in the hobby for a couple of years. A stable market is good to have and a growing one is better, but we want a hobby that is growing for the right reasons: more people are gaming --> more games are being bought to start their collections.

Side note: One thing that stuck out to me that I found puzzling during the interview was this: The rep stressed that they did not set the prices of the games for the stores, yet, isn't giving bigger discounts to B&M retailers than online retailers going to indirectly set the price in the long run?
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Bonnie Doiron
Canada
London
Ontario (ON)
flag msg tools
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Honestly I don't think it's going to have as huge an impact on online sales as people are thinking. At the end of the day, it means something like a higher percentage off to B&M then to online retailers, which might cause some smaller online retailers to raise the price they sell for in order to maintain their own current profits. Though I have not seen facts or figures as to the percentages, my initial thought is if the publisher were going to sell to store a for 20% off, then the online equiv might only get a break of 15% or whatever the actual breakdown equals out to.

At the end of the day consumers will still be getting the games around MSRP or lower in some places, it just means we have to hunt for that bargain a bit more possibly. Living in Canada right now with the weak dollar a lot of games I buy are much higher than MSRP, but then there are some that are lower too. I try to buy from three local stores but also twice a year make bigger purchases online. It all comes out in the wash. I buy the games I want and know that the publisher, the designer, the artist, the manufacturer, the retailer... etc all need their piece of the pie. I'm fine with that.

But it is not going to cause a downfall of online sales. The bigger online sellers might use them as loss leaders and take a hit on the profit end knowing that most people will fill their carts with several titles of many different publishers.

Just my humble opinion.
3 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Chris Knight
United States
Portland
Oregon
flag msg tools
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
waddinghambrett wrote:
Side note: One thing that stuck out to me that I found puzzling during the interview was this: The rep stressed that they did not set the prices of the games for the stores, yet, isn't giving bigger discounts to B&M retailers than online retailers going to indirectly set the price in the long run?


Yes. This is interesting. For whatever reason, they are adamant that they are not price fixing. I am not sure why. That would be meddling too much? Or too much like Mayfair? Or the over-under is that price fixing would actually yield smaller profits in the long run?
2 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Chris Knight
United States
Portland
Oregon
flag msg tools
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Madbonna wrote:
Honestly I don't think it's going to have as huge an impact on online sales as people are thinking. At the end of the day, it means something like a higher percentage off to B&M then to online retailers, which might cause some smaller online retailers to raise the price they sell for in order to maintain their own current profits. Though I have not seen facts or figures as to the percentages, my initial thought is if the publisher were going to sell to store a for 20% off, then the online equiv might only get a break of 15% or whatever the actual breakdown equals out to.

At the end of the day consumers will still be getting the games around MSRP or lower in some places, it just means we have to hunt for that bargain a bit more possibly. Living in Canada right now with the weak dollar a lot of games I buy are much higher than MSRP, but then there are some that are lower too. I try to buy from three local stores but also twice a year make bigger purchases online. It all comes out in the wash. I buy the games I want and know that the publisher, the designer, the artist, the manufacturer, the retailer... etc all need their piece of the pie. I'm fine with that.

But it is not going to cause a downfall of online sales. The bigger online sellers might use them as loss leaders and take a hit on the profit end knowing that most people will fill their carts with several titles of many different publishers.

Just my humble opinion.


I agree with all of this. I do not think the sky is even close to falling. However, I do get the sense that Asmodee is, to use a phrase, pissing on my hat and telling me it's raining.
8 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Elias
United States
Seattle
Washington
flag msg tools
badge
Give us lettuce or give us death (or carrots).
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
I feel like I'm the only one who doesn't think this is evil. I think encouraging people to buy from stores in their actual community is great. Sure, Asmodee might make more money, but so will a business in your community, rather than those funds being lost to some other community or going somewhere tax-free Via the internet.
3 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
X. Nostradunwhich
United States
New Hampshire
flag msg tools
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
EliasDKehr wrote:
I think encouraging people to buy from stores in their actual community is great.

So obviously you have some number of stores in your area? Not everyone does and for those that do not this just means the cost of all their games is going to go up. So since income is relatively fixed (or at least assuming a relatively stable budget for games), that would be fewer games bought by those with only Online options.

9 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Chris Knight
United States
Portland
Oregon
flag msg tools
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Nostradunwhich wrote:
EliasDKehr wrote:
I think encouraging people to buy from stores in their actual community is great.

So obviously you have some number of stores in your area? Not everyone does and for those that do not this just means the cost of all their games is going to go up. So since income is relatively fixed (or at least assuming a relatively stable budget for games), that would be fewer games bought by those with only Online options.



I bet Minneapolis-St. Paul has the same number of FLGS's as the entire state of New Hampshire.
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Perry Clayton
United States
Hanceville
Alabama
flag msg tools
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
EliasDKehr wrote:
I think encouraging people to buy from stores in their actual community is great.


I think it's interesting that a company who wants to impose the morality of local economy has their games printed in China.
29 
 Thumb up
1.25
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Chris Bender
United States
New River
Arizona
flag msg tools
Rebellion to Tyrants is Obedience to God
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
EliasDKehr wrote:
I feel like I'm the only one who doesn't think this is evil.


I was more concerned early on, but in the end I don't see this as changing anything significantly.

People who buy online for convenience and a discount will still receive convenience and a discount, albeit a smaller discount on certain games. I don't expect any online retailers will shut down.

People who buy in game stores will continue to do so. I do not expect game stores to get a larger discount than they do now, so they probably won't make much more money. I think game stores will end up getting better prize and promo support for Asmodee games.

What I really think is interesting is that Asmodee seems to want to go after Hasbro. I think it could be great for gamers to see more competition in mainstream games.

1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Upkar Gata-Aura
Sweden
Järfälla
Stockholms Län
flag msg tools
Aaaaahhh'm the best singer!
badge
Bbbbbut that's not fair!
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Can someone please explain to me why they are allowed to price discriminate in this way, without running into Anti-Trust issues?

Also, didn't Tom mention on the podcast that despite what people think, the vast majority of board games sales, do not come from online retailers, but from B&M stores?
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
eric hanuise
Belgium
Unspecified
Unspecified
flag msg tools
designer
publisher
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
zippy1979 wrote:
Can someone please explain to me why they are allowed to price discriminate in this way, without running into Anti-Trust issues?

Also, didn't Tom mention on the podcast that despite what people think, the vast majority of board games sales, do not come from online retailers, but from B&M stores?


Antitrust is about preventing several providers of a type of goods to collude to artificially fix prices. Say all petroleum producers or all lcd screen manufacturers.
Here, Asmodee is but one distributor in the landscape. They are free to sett whatever policies they will, included tiered discounts (low discount for e-tailers, larger discounts for retailers).
What would become an antitrust issue is Asmodee and ALL OTHER PUBLISHERS/DISTRIBUTORS enforce a single common pricing policy, and a single common MSRP grid for all products.
With regards to antitrust aspets, this is still a free market, no problem.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Christian Gienger
Germany
Germany
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
zippy1979 wrote:
Can someone please explain to me why they are allowed to price discriminate in this way, without running into Anti-Trust issues?

Also, didn't Tom mention on the podcast that despite what people think, the vast majority of board games sales, do not come from online retailers, but from B&M stores?


I'm sure this is true, but this includes Monopoly, Risk, Snakes & Ladders, Uno, Phase 10 and whatever people buy at Toys R US, Walmart and other mainstream stores. Also the number of B&M stores is so much higher than the number of OLGS that it would be really weird if they sold less together than the others. But if you include amazon it might change.
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Elias
United States
Seattle
Washington
flag msg tools
badge
Give us lettuce or give us death (or carrots).
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Nostradunwhich wrote:
EliasDKehr wrote:
I think encouraging people to buy from stores in their actual community is great.

So obviously you have some number of stores in your area? Not everyone does and for those that do not this just means the cost of all their games is going to go up. So since income is relatively fixed (or at least assuming a relatively stable budget for games), that would be fewer games bought by those with only Online options.



I remember a poll a while back that indicated a large number of people don't actually budget for games and just impulse buy, so I'm not sure the conclusion your reaching is accurate. And if it is, Asmodee will probably change their policy, because they will lose money.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Justin Davis
United States
Sewickley
PA
flag msg tools
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
I'm curios about what Coolstuff, Inc. thinks about this. If what Anton says is true across the board, CSI will have to decide to either sell ANA stuff Online OR at their B&M store. I guess they would go with what will bring in the most money, but this decision is basically taking money away from them, isn't it?
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
DomaGB
United States
Green Bay area
Wisconsin
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
zippy1979 wrote:
...

Also, didn't Tom mention on the podcast that despite what people think, the vast majority of board games sales, do not come from online retailers, but from B&M stores?


He has said it again, just this week I believe. A few people on BGG think he is wrong. but Tom has more knowledge of these things than most of us.

I trust Tom.
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Joe White
United States
Elkridge
Maryland
flag msg tools
Collector
badge
Collector
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
I'm trying to think of this like a price hike with a company policy of giving B&M stores a large discount to encourage their community building function.

As a prior Games Workshop junky, price hikes are just a part of life, companies should increase their prices to what the market will bare or they are leaving money on the table.

I feel like this whole thing boils down to sticker price, if the publisher didn't put an MSRP on the box we'd all feel less entitled to paying less than that magic number. Online and B&M stores setting their own prices based on margins and market would allow us to all make better judgements on the real value a game provides.

Personally, if Asmodee games are more expensive to acquire they will need to be of higher quality and appeal to compete for my money. I won't be boycotting them, I'll just be trying to get the most value/fun for my money. If that happens to be from buying some hot new Asmodee game, cool.

2 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Justin Davis
United States
Sewickley
PA
flag msg tools
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Bulkoth wrote:
I'm trying to think of this like a price hike with a company policy of giving B&M stores a large discount to encourage their community building function.


The impression I'm getting is that B&M stores wouldn't be getting a larger discount for the most part, instead the online stores would be getting a lesser discount than what they get right now. The goal being to force the online retailers to up their price so that it is more in line with what the B&M stores sell the games for.
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Joe White
United States
Elkridge
Maryland
flag msg tools
Collector
badge
Collector
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
I know that B&M prices will be mostly flat but if you consider it in the context I suggested, an overall price hike coupled with a new company policy to give discounts to B&M you get the same end point, higher online prices, flat B&M prices.
2 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Bob (he/him)
United States
Lutz
Florida
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
EliasDKehr wrote:
I feel like I'm the only one who doesn't think this is evil. I think encouraging people to buy from stores in their actual community is great. Sure, Asmodee might make more money, but so will a business in your community, rather than those funds being lost to some other community or going somewhere tax-free Via the internet.


I don't think it's evil at all. I think they feel what they are doing will bring them the most profits. It's a bit disingenuous to say they are trying to help FLGS though.
4 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Bob (he/him)
United States
Lutz
Florida
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
zippy1979 wrote:
Can someone please explain to me why they are allowed to price discriminate in this way, without running into Anti-Trust issues?


Because they are not a monopoly.
3 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
1 , 2 , 3 , 4  Next »   | 
Front Page | Welcome | Contact | Privacy Policy | Terms of Service | Advertise | Support BGG | Feeds RSS
Geekdo, BoardGameGeek, the Geekdo logo, and the BoardGameGeek logo are trademarks of BoardGameGeek, LLC.