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Subject: Diminishing Returns Math Trade Discussion RESULTS POSTED! rss

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Jason Farris
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THE SKINNY
Trade Thread: http://www.boardgamegeek.com/geeklist/21037
List Cap: .... NONE
Max Per User: .... NONE (see special rules)
Duplicates: .... OK

SPECIAL RULES

There is only one special rules in this math trade, the Diminishing returns clause. You can post any game as your first game, but any subsequent game entered by you must have a user ranking at least 300 higher than the previous one you entered. Once you reach the top 100, you can enter as many as you like as long as they are also in the top 100.

I am aware that rankings shift around a lot, so your will be given leeway of 10 rankings.

Example: I enter Sim City: The card game (current rank 3552). My next game entered must be at least 3262 or higher.

Ignore Sweeteners when determining how high your next game should be ranked.



TRADE RULES (Stolen from Regai)

- You must accurately describe your games condition, language, etc.

- Traders from all countries are allowed. Specify your restrictions on shipping in your listing. Be prepared to have those same restricitions applied to you.

- You MUST ship your game within few days of the trade being accepted, unless you and your recipient have come to a different agreement.

- You must submit a want list for each game you are offering. If you don't want to trade, submit a blank list.

- I reserve the right to remove games from the list for whatever reason. If you are on the bad traders list, your games will be removed.

- I will use GenetiTrade.

- You are responsible for knowing these rules, violation of the rules may result in disqualification from this trade and future trades.

-I am the final arbiter! That means I accept responsibility for any errors that you do not have the opportunity to correct. The trade will be run again or cancelled if I goof up.

You are responsible for your want lists and verifying that the summary is correct. In other words, if you do not review your wants when I post the summary and there is a goof, the trade will stand. It is a no risk format only if you and everyone else double and triple checks things.

-Do not delete an entry if you choose to withdraw! I will note that the game is no longer up for trade and take it off the trade list summary.

DATES
List Closed: Tuesday, April 24th 8:00 PM Eastern Time (US)
Summary Posted: ASAP after 8:00 PM Tuesday, April 24th Eastern Time (US)
Want Lists Due: 8:00 PM Thursday, April 26th Eastern Time (US)
Want list summary posted: by 8:00 AM Friday. Review period ends 7:00 PM Friday April 26th and summary is considered final. Results posted 24 hours afterward. Play at home will be allowed.

What is a "Math Trade"? Check out Lindsey's "Math Trade Guide" http://www.boardgamegeek.com/thread/93555

Message me with the follwoing subject to your e-mail: MATH TRADE WANT LIST

Wantlists should be in the following format:

123hannibal 235dune 492antiquity 23bohnanza

Where Hannibal is your game and the games following it are the ones you want to trade for (leave one space per entry and a line between the list for each game you are trading).

There will also be a GG prize based on tips received for the person who manages to get the most games listed within the rules.
 
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David Molnar
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Re: Diminishing Returns Math Trade Discussion Forum
So, by "diminishing", you mean "the exact opposite of diminishing"? That's OK; I have a more serious question - are there any restrictions on sweeteners?

David
 
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Paul
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Re: Diminishing Returns Math Trade Discussion Forum
What about games with no ranking?
 
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Jason Farris
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Re: Diminishing Returns Math Trade Discussion Forum
molnar wrote:
So, by "diminishing", you mean "the exact opposite of diminishing"? That's OK; I have a more serious question - are there any restrictions on sweeteners?

David


Nope. One could argue that you are getting diminishing returns if you want to get rid of low ranked games.
 
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Jason Farris
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Re: Diminishing Returns Math Trade Discussion Forum
Merkles Boner wrote:
What about games with no ranking?


Consider them all to be at the lowest rank (currently 3600)
 
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Lynda Shea
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Re: Diminishing Returns Math Trade Discussion Forum
What are the rules for sweeteners? Does the sweetener need to follow the same guidelines? If so, are subsequent entries for games based on the sweetener that was added to the previous entry or the main game of the previous entry?

For example: I enter game 1264 (no idea what it is) as entry #25 on this geeklist, does my sweetener need to be 964 and higher ranking for each one in that entry? If so, does my next entry #26 on this geeklist have to be 664 or higher ranking (based on the previous sweetener) or can it be 964 and higher ranking (based on the ranking of the previous main entry)?
 
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Jason Farris
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Re: Diminishing Returns Math Trade Discussion Forum
80sGirl wrote:
What are the rules for sweeteners? Does the sweetener need to follow the same guidelines? If so, are subsequent entries for games based on the sweetener that was added to the previous entry or the main game of the previous entry?

For example: I enter game 1264 (no idea what it is) as entry #25 on this geeklist, does my sweetener need to be 964 and higher ranking for each one in that entry? If so, does my next entry #26 on this geeklist have to be 664 or higher ranking (based on the previous sweetener) or can it be 964 and higher ranking (based on the ranking of the previous main entry)?


Sweeteners are okay. Only use the actual game entered for determining ranking for your next entry. I edited the instructions to reflect this.
 
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Miguel Piette
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Re: Diminishing Returns Math Trade Discussion Forum
If all unranked games are considered being rank at 3600, that means you can only offer 1 unrank game. Is that correct?
 
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Antonio Chavez
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Re: Diminishing Returns Math Trade Discussion Forum
I'm not complaining. I have no problem with the rules, and I will probably participate.

But I am curious.

It seems like a somewhat convoluted rule, and I'm not sure what's the intended effect. Could you elaborate a bit?
 
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Ernie Lai
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Re: Diminishing Returns Math Trade Discussion Forum
Mr.Baggins wrote:
I'm not complaining. I have no problem with the rules, and I will probably participate.

But I am curious.

It seems like a somewhat convoluted rule, and I'm not sure what's the intended effect. Could you elaborate a bit?


i think the intended effect is to keep the amount of 'crap' down. each person can only submit 1 really bad game and then each item after that has to get progressively better than the last.

although i think an unintended side effect is that really good games won't get posted early on until each person is sure they don't want to add any worse games first.
 
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Lynda Shea
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Re: Diminishing Returns Math Trade Discussion Forum
I would like some clarification on whether you are allowed to enter more than one n/a ranking item as well.
 
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Paul
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Re: Diminishing Returns Math Trade Discussion Forum
On the non-ranked issues---you'll have expansions like Memoir 44 Terrain Pack, etc that are not ranked considered as bottom of the barrel (which I think wouldn't actually be the case considering the rating numbers).
 
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Jeff Michaud
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Re: Diminishing Returns Math Trade Discussion Forum
Merkles Boner wrote:
On the non-ranked issues---you'll have expansions like Memoir 44 Terrain Pack, etc that are not ranked considered as bottom of the barrel (which I think wouldn't actually be the case considering the rating numbers).

It used to be not all that long ago (up to late last year?) that expansions were given a rank just like games. Then the powers that be apparently decided that they shouldn't be ranked at all

So even expansions that were previously ranked in the top 100 are no unranked, just like the "crap"

Basing it on one of the two "ratings" is a partial solution (though then there is always the confusion of which of the two "ratings", the raw average, or the BGG/baysian rating).
 
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Jeff Michaud
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Re: Diminishing Returns Math Trade Discussion Forum
I've setup my online want list generator/editor tool to work on this (Jason's) math trade. For those who have already used it, you can go right back to it (you bookmarked it, right ), for others who haven't, see:

http://www.boardgamegeek.com/thread/159648

You don't even need to have any games in this math trade yet to start compiling your list (once you have added your games, and then after I've taken another snapshot, then you can edit which of your games to offer in trade).

The other benefit of the tool is that it keeps tracks of items by their unique item identifier, not their ordinal geeklist item number (position) that can change if items are deleted from the geeklist.
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Ron G
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Re: Diminishing Returns Math Trade Discussion Forum
Thanks a lot Jeff. That thing makes tracking potential game choices really easy.
 
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Flying Arrow
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Re: Diminishing Returns Math Trade Discussion Forum
I'm also curious as to the intended effect of the rule. It seems like a pointless sorting exercise.
 
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Stephen Buonocore
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Re: Diminishing Returns Math Trade Discussion Forum
FlyingArrow wrote:
I'm also curious as to the intended effect of the rule. It seems like a pointless sorting exercise.


This was answered already.... It forces people to list progressively better (more higly rated) games, rather than listing all "junk".

While it is a bit annoying to have to sort all the games you want to trade, and then to ensure that each one is 300+ more highly rated, I actually like the concept a lot! And the fact that there is already a number of very highly ranked games is showing that this is kinda cool...

Best,
Stephen, "The Evil One"
--TEO
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Lynda Shea
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Re: Diminishing Returns Math Trade Discussion Forum
Items #120-122 are only separated by 160 or so in ranking.
 
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Ernie Lai
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Re: Diminishing Returns Math Trade Discussion Forum
80sGirl wrote:
Items #120-122 are only separated by 160 or so in ranking.


from the rules:

Quote:
Once you reach the top 100, you can enter as many as you like as long as they are also in the top 100.
 
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Lynda Shea
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Re: Diminishing Returns Math Trade Discussion Forum
Oops! My bad! Sorry blush

laiernie wrote:
80sGirl wrote:
Items #120-122 are only separated by 160 or so in ranking.


from the rules:

Quote:
Once you reach the top 100, you can enter as many as you like as long as they are also in the top 100.
 
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Michael Leuchtenburg
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Re: Diminishing Returns Math Trade Discussion Forum
Smilinbrax wrote:
You can post any game as your first game, but any subsequent game entered by you must have a user ranking at least 300 higher than the previous one you entered. Once you reach the top 100, you can enter as many as you like as long as they are also in the top 100.


Should I interpret this to mean that, if I post a game with rank <300 (say, Domaine, with a rank of 104), I can then post any number of games with rank <100? So I can post both Domaine and Die Macher (rank 9).

That make sense to me, but I want to confirm before I go ahead and post.
 
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Re: Diminishing Returns Math Trade Discussion Forum
dyfrgi wrote:
Smilinbrax wrote:
You can post any game as your first game, but any subsequent game entered by you must have a user ranking at least 300 higher than the previous one you entered. Once you reach the top 100, you can enter as many as you like as long as they are also in the top 100.


Should I interpret this to mean that, if I post a game with rank <300 (say, Domaine, with a rank of 104), I can then post any number of games with rank <100? So I can post both Domaine and Die Macher (rank 9).

That make sense to me, but I want to confirm before I go ahead and post.


Yeah, that's the way I read it too. No restrictions in games with rank 100 or better.
 
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Michael Leuchtenburg
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Re: Diminishing Returns Math Trade Discussion Forum
I've just created a math trade mailing list, since some people expressed interest in such a thing:
http://www.boardgamegeek.com/article/1455467

http://lists.slashhome.org/mailman/listinfo/mathtrade
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Jeff Michaud
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Re: Diminishing Returns Math Trade Discussion Forum
Smilinbrax wrote:
Want Lists Due: 8:00 PM Thursday, April 26th Eastern Time (US)
Want list summary posted: by 8:00 AM Friday. Review period ends 7:00 PM Friday April 26th and summary is considered final.

Just noticed there is a 12 hour gap between when want lists are due and the draft summary is posted... why such a long gap? Usually there's less than an hour for this.
 
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Davido
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Re: Diminishing Returns Math Trade Discussion Forum
dumb question-How does one go about posting images in text body? e.g. to illustrate sweeteners. Under the new interface, clicking "image" appears to change the main item image.
 
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