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Subject: Ice Ice Baby rss

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Keith Carter
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The Icepick scenario was first published in the March/April 1984 edition of the Space Gamer and included counters for the new marine infantry units, the hidden information Ogres, and the hidden information buildings that the scenario required on the card stock Reader's Survey stapled into the center of the magazine. It was later republished in the second edition of the Ogre Book. It is worth taking a look at.

I first encountered the Icepick scenario the summer before. I was working for Steve Jackson Games and Scott Haring (of future Car Wars fame) brought me as part of a team to a convention in Houston and he took with him a 9" x 12" brown envelope containing the pages of Craig York's Icepick submission. I got to look at it during a dry spell in the Dealer's Room.

It was quite the intriguing submission. It launched itself with a great piece of fiction. It introduced marine infantry, the laser tower, and building destruction which we later incorporated into Shockwave. It was only the second scenario I had played with multiple Ogres on one side. It was the first time I had played a scenario with Mark IIs. The attacking team of Ogres had multiple viable approaches to their target and the hidden information was used well. The stand out attraction to me personally was that it introduced me to map bashing. Back then it was black and white copies colorized with highlighters and small counters. Now I have the ODE, a 36" inkjet, and almost no mounted map making experience but I do have extra GEV maps from the ODE. With a sense of Ogre revival in the air I have revisited this piece of OGREverse and personal history and made a mounted Icepick map.


This is mid-production. I have printed out the map, cut it in half and glued the two halves to the GEV map halves. The next step will be to make the sub-cuts and creases so the map can fold properly.

The map was done at 300dpi. The blue at the bottom is ice covered water and it described in the scenario as a sheet of ice which the Ogres are travelling under. It functions as just water and I went with a a white-ish blue because if I just went with white for ice it would be too close to the white for snow that dominates the Siberian landscape. The hex grid for the water hexes is blue. The blue hexes that look like a mix of land and water are swamps. For the land hexes I envision snow covered which means white but plain white also looks like empty hexes, like somebody forgot to fill in part of the map so the white snow hexes (which act as plains) have sprinkled through them brown pixels the color of cardboard to make the snow look dingy. The hex grid for the land hexes is black. The large city up to the right is played by a desaturated satellite view of part of Austin, TX. Station Andropov to the upper left houses the Ogre's targets and is played by the Exxon refinery in Baton Rouge, Louisiana. Parts of Raleigh and Greensboro, NC are featured in the other two cities. It is probably a design error to mix images and illustration like that but ... it is my map for me.

Here is a picture of the map showing how it lays out and how it folds.


There there are some production flaws in the map which are not visible in these photos. Where the map folds but is not cut the map tends to wrinkle. I don't know if this is because of the thickness of the paper I used, not enough spray glue, or I did not wait long enough for the glue to dry. I tried slicing the paper at a crease to relieve the wrinkling pressure but not the two cut ends get forced together when I fold the map and peel each other back exposing the green GEV board underneath. I wonder if I should have painted the GEV map so no green could peek through. Some exposure of the map below may be needed to get the board hinges to work smoothly. What I need to do is find out where on BGG the board making posts are so I can learn from my fellow geeks.

--Edits - corrected some typos and a factual error
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Chuck Tewksbury
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Super cool work!
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Kent Reuber
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On a related note, in Space Gamer #23, there is an article on combining Ogre with Ice War. The issue is available online: https://ia800802.us.archive.org/25/items/space-gamer-23/Spac...
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Dominique Sumner
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Nice work I like it. I'd actually like to see SJG produce an Ice Pick scenario pack that could be purchased. One clarification though. I don't recall Ice Pick being published in the 1st Edition of the Ogre Book, as it was published before Ice Pick.
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Keith Carter
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dsumner wrote:
Nice work I like it. I'd actually like to see SJG produce an Ice Pick scenario pack that could be purchased. One clarification though. I don't recall Ice Pick being published in the 1st Edition of the Ogre Book, as it was published before Ice Pick.


Right. Corrected.

Thank you
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Keith Carter
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Having made the Icepick map I want to play again and plan to do so later this week. Looking over the scenario in the Ogre Book my memory is refreshed of an issue I had with the scenario in the past. I am looking for either rules answers or suggested fixes.

The elements of the problem:

The Combine player starts with a Mark III and two Mark IIs out in the water approaching land under the ice at a pace of 1 hex per turn. The Paneuropean player does not know which is which until marine infantry enter the Ogre's hex or the Ogre comes on land. Marines and howitzers can attack the Ogres under the ice (howitzers at 1/2 strength).

The issue:
I don't know of any restriction on the howitzers on attacking an Ogre before the type is identified. However, you pick a target item on an Ogre when you attack it. What happens if the Paneuropean player declares a missile as the target but the Ogre is a Mark II? The same could also arise when targeting a secondary if two have already been destroyed on that Ogre. Do you go through the motions of the attack but the Combine player pretend to record but actually ignores any hit result since the target does not exist? This is how I have handled it. Any one know of a rule I am overlooking or have alternative approach they like better?

 
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Mike Malley
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If I were to play it tonight, I would say that you can only target what the Mk II and III have in common. If you can't even tell what type of Ogre it is, it's not much of a stretch to say that you have difficulty targeting individual weapons.
 
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David Rock

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The closest thing to a rule is the new draft rules for the Ninja attacking the ghosts, but that doesn't help a lot. It basically boils down to "you think you hit it, but you really didn't" which is pretty much what you do already. That's easy to imagine, since it would be hard to verify hits under the water and you would just have to see what comes out of the water later.

Another option is you can attack only treads, since you know all Ogres have those. You would still be on the honor system a bit if their movement drops while still under water.

Yet another option is random hits. You throw attack strength at it and roll to see what it applies to. Again, there's some trust involved, and can get a bit weird, but it's an option.

Barring any actual rule (which does not currently exist), the simplest option is to just pretend you hit what you think you hit and if it turns out it didn't have what you thought it did, it was a "wasted" shot.
 
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Keith Carter
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Thank you for the responses. I will run these past my opponent and let him pick the approach he thinks is the most suitable.

Random hits is interesting. It would be easy to set it up as a D6 die roll for target. For the Mark III it could be
1= main
2= secondary
3= missile
4 = antipersonnel
5= treads
6 = treads

with the Mark II substituting treads for the missile. One of the few occasions where anti-personnel gets targeted.

Treads only should not bring up a trust issue. Speed is always one underwater.


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Mike Baker
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Would like to see an Ice Board done for the Designer's Edition.
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David Rock

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Bounder wrote:
Thank you for the responses. I will run these past my opponent and let him pick the approach he thinks is the most suitable.

Random hits is interesting. It would be easy to set it up as a D6 die roll for target. For the Mark III it could be
1= main
2= secondary
3= missile
4 = antipersonnel
5= treads
6 = treads

with the Mark II substituting treads for the missile. One of the few occasions where anti-personnel gets targeted.

Treads only should not bring up a trust issue. Speed is always one underwater.




This is a tad necromancic [sp?], but I was curious what the results were of your game?
 
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Keith Carter
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granitepenguin wrote:
Bounder wrote:
Thank you for the responses. I will run these past my opponent and let him pick the approach he thinks is the most suitable.

Random hits is interesting. It would be easy to set it up as a D6 die roll for target. For the Mark III it could be
1= main
2= secondary
3= missile
4 = antipersonnel
5= treads
6 = treads

with the Mark II substituting treads for the missile. One of the few occasions where anti-personnel gets targeted.

Treads only should not bring up a trust issue. Speed is always one underwater.




This is a tad necromancic [sp?], but I was curious what the results were of your game?


Alas, we did not play. We ducked the issue by playing a different Ogre scenario. I don't even remember what at this point.
 
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Ron A
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Since this thread has been neccro'ed, I just had a thought: maybe SJG can make the board be a stretch goal for some future Ogre KS? Unmounted for free stretch goal, mounted for stretch add-on?
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Darin Sunley
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That'd be awesome, but a big ask. From previous conversations with Phil and Steve, we know that the retail price of an ODE-sized mounted map, when printed in ODE quantities, is about $20. If they print fewer of them, it's even more.

For myself, I would joyously drop $20 for a mounted Icepick map, but it's a safe bet there aren't another 4999 like-minded people out there. More's the pity.
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HeatDeath wrote:
For myself, I would joyously drop $20 for a mounted Icepick map, but it's a safe bet there aren't another 4999 like-minded people out there. More's the pity.


They can use Kickstarter to gauge the amount of interest. That's what they're going to do for the ODE expansion.
 
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