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Subject: What are your toughs on inserts (like broken token and Daedalus) rss

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Re: What are your toughs on inserts (like broken token)
For me they're not worth it because they're too expensive. I'd rather buy a n M:tG holiday gift box and store several games inside.
 
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Re: What are your toughs on inserts (like broken token)
While I appreciate a decent insert if provided with the game, such as the one for Viticulture Essential Edition, I don’t have any trouble at all putting everything in ziplock bags.
The advantage of no insert is that multiple expansions fit in the base box.
 
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Re: What are your toughs on inserts (like broken token)
If you think they're expensive, try Etsy. I found this guy called TowerRex, from Kiev in the Ukraine, who makes pretty cheap inserts.

The one for Dead of Winter is like €16!

I purchased the one for Patchwork and 7 Wonders Duel (with expansion), because those games can really benefit from a good insert. Especially Patchwork, where everything is just thrown into the box.
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Re: What are your toughs on inserts (like broken token)
Tanori wrote:
Hello guys, i just like to know what are everyone toughs on this inserts.

What i think is that most of the time they are very very expensive.

With the money you use to buy one you could easily get a new game or some expansions.

Of course if there is one particlar game you really enjoy, it could be a good investment as set up and tear down time would be hipotetically reduced.


I love them and if I could afford it, I would get custom inserts AND custom component upgrades for all my games. I have a custom insert for Castles of Burgundy and one for Twilight Struggle. Set up time is 0, tear down time is reduced by about half.

I wish I were handy, I'd make my own custom inserts as some do, but I'm not and can but buy them for the games I feel that I am unlikely to get out if the components are a huge jumble of baggies.
 
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Re: What are your toughs on inserts (like broken token)
rvervuurt wrote:
If you think they're expensive, try Etsy. I found this guy called TowerRex, from Kiev in the Ukraine, who makes pretty cheap inserts.

The one for Dead of Winter is like €16!

I purchased the one for Patchwork and 7 Wonders Duel (with expansion), because those games can really benefit from a good insert. Especially Patchwork, where everything is just thrown into the box.


Brilliant! I am going to get that 7 Wonders Duel insert! I've sent him a message asking if he could do reduced shipping for combined items or certain amount spent. I'm in the UK and the shipping is more than the item.
 
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Re: What are your toughs on inserts (like broken token)
rvervuurt wrote:
Especially Patchwork, where everything is just thrown into the box.


Serious?
That insert is simply a smaller box you throw everything into.
You’d need only two baggies: one for the buttons and one for the three wooden pieces together with the five 1x1 patches. That’s all.

Combined with shipping the insert costs more than the game itself. Madness.
 
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Re: What are your toughs on inserts (like broken token)
Tsaar wrote:
rvervuurt wrote:
Especially Patchwork, where everything is just thrown into the box.


Serious?
That insert is simply a smaller box you throw everything into.
You’d need only two baggies: one for the buttons and one for the three wooden pieces together with the five 1x1 patches. That’s all.

Combined with shipping the insert costs more than the game itself. Madness.


Yes, serious I really like the idea of inserts. Also, I hate baggies.
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Re: What are your toughs on inserts (like broken token)
I got Terraforming Mar's Broken Token insert and it was pretty nice. Clearly not future proof, but it made setup easy and gave you player boards which were desperately needed. Then I got Xia's and it was fantastic. Not only does it condense the game comfily down to one box after adding the expansion, but it dramatically helps with setup time. The outfit shop is pre organized and ready to go, the ships are all on their stands already, everything players need can get placed easily in reach.

After that I learned not all inserts are made equal. Got one insert from Broken Token to fit 7 Wonders into 1 box. Well I had to buy extra dividers because it didn't come with enough by default, there aren't NEARLY enough token boxes for all the tokens in the game, and worst of all the great projects all have to sit on top with the rulebooks. Like there's no real spot for them, just had to improvise. Since that day, I've been a LOT more careful not to get burned, but I would say generally I like them. Maybe overpriced and something I would only consider at this point for my most favorite games in which could REALLY benefit from it, but I don't mind them on the market.
 
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Re: What are your toughs on inserts (like broken token)
The first one I bought was for Marvel Legendary, simply to store and separate the cards more economically. Then came the insert for Imeprial Settlers, which reduced setup and tear down time to under a minute each.

Expensive? They can be, but now I can setup a game in the time it would normally take to empty a few baggies.
 
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Robbert Vervuurt
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Re: What are your toughs on inserts (like broken token)
Solanum wrote:
rvervuurt wrote:
If you think they're expensive, try Etsy. I found this guy called TowerRex, from Kiev in the Ukraine, who makes pretty cheap inserts.

The one for Dead of Winter is like €16!

I purchased the one for Patchwork and 7 Wonders Duel (with expansion), because those games can really benefit from a good insert. Especially Patchwork, where everything is just thrown into the box.


Brilliant! I am going to get that 7 Wonders Duel insert! I've sent him a message asking if he could do reduced shipping for combined items or certain amount spent. I'm in the UK and the shipping is more than the item.


Just remember it's from outside the EU, so you have to make sure it's below the UK's import-amount, to avoid extra charges.

Because of this, I purchased both inserts in two purchases, to keep it below the £9.5 limit (yes, it's that low in Denmark).
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Re: What are your toughs on inserts (like broken token)
Tanori wrote:
Dostradamas wrote:
I think they are a unnecessary expense.

Most custom inserts cost as much or more than I want to pay for a game.

Either using the original insert or tossing it and bagging is plenty for me.

In my Scythe base box I have

Scythe: Invaders from Afar
Scythe: Promo Pack #1
Scythe: Promo Pack #2
Scythe: Promo Pack #3
Scythe: Promo Pack #4
The expansion board
All the metal coins
All cards sleeved

I splurged for storage and bought 10 of the plastic bit containers (under $1.00 ea)for storage once I realized they help fit everything perfect.

The BT insert is $49.99 + S&H. It is nice but the game was under $60 for me so it just seems too much for me.

I would rather spend my limited budget on more games, that's me.


Id love to see how do you put every thing in the box.

In the original Scythe box i have all the miniatures, tokens, resources and board (and the extension).

And in the Invaders from a far box i have all the player and factions mats.



I start with both boards on the bottom

Then both mini trays go on those. Large cards all fit perfect on the end of the expansion tray.
Notice the brilliant tray design that stores both combat wheels as well.

Then all the faction boards up against the end
All the other cards fit in the gap left at the end of the boards. I tuck the 6 end game scoring tiles in with the cards.

Then the 3 coin boxes and 1 of the resource boxes next.

All action boards go on top of mini trays as well as 7 player bit boxes and the final resource box.
Instructions and such on top.

All with the lid closing just tight.
I swear there was plenty of thought put into this because it just works so well, or I got luckycool

Of course when The Wind Gambit shows up I will have another box but I got all I could in there I think.
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Re: What are your toughs on inserts (like broken token)
Dostradamas wrote:
Tanori wrote:
Dostradamas wrote:
I think they are a unnecessary expense.

Most custom inserts cost as much or more than I want to pay for a game.

Either using the original insert or tossing it and bagging is plenty for me.

In my Scythe base box I have

Scythe: Invaders from Afar
Scythe: Promo Pack #1
Scythe: Promo Pack #2
Scythe: Promo Pack #3
Scythe: Promo Pack #4
The expansion board
All the metal coins
All cards sleeved

I splurged for storage and bought 10 of the plastic bit containers (under $1.00 ea)for storage once I realized they help fit everything perfect.

The BT insert is $49.99 + S&H. It is nice but the game was under $60 for me so it just seems too much for me.

I would rather spend my limited budget on more games, that's me.


Id love to see how do you put every thing in the box.

In the original Scythe box i have all the miniatures, tokens, resources and board (and the extension).

And in the Invaders from a far box i have all the player and factions mats.



I start with both boards on the bottom

Then both mini trays go on those. Large cards all fit perfect on the end of the expansion tray.
Notice the brilliant tray design that stores both combat wheels as well.

Then all the faction boards up against the end
All the other cards fit in the gap left at the end of the boards. I tuck the 6 end game scoring tiles in with the cards.

Then the 3 coin boxes and 1 of the resource boxes next.

All action boards go on top of mini trays as well as 7 player bit boxes and the final resource box.
Instructions and such on top.

All with the lid closing just tight.
I swear there was plenty of thought put into this because it just works so well, or I got luckycool

Of course when The Wind Gambit shows up I will have another box but I got all I could in there I think.


Thank you

Great, now i see what i need: Those mini boxes.
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Re: What are your toughs on inserts (like broken token)
Custom inserts are really useful for games with similar pieces that have to be sorted. The Castles of Burgundy insert I made is a great example -- my wife and I spend more time choosing boards and colors than we do setting up the rest of the game. That's the one insert I'm sure has been a net time saver, but I've designed and posted several others to the foam core geeklist.

Recently I purchased the Broken Token insert for 7 Wonders, partly to try them out and partly because I'd never been able to come up with a good foam core design on my own. It works fine; I agree with the earlier comment that more trays would be nice, but the frequently used chits are sorted well and the ones that end up mixed are only used with half of Babel, so I'm OK with the design compromise. The insert took me an hour and a half to build, although I later found out that I was gluing a lot more than people typically do with these. Just means mine is extra durable!
 
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Re: What are your toughs on inserts (like broken token)
Tanori wrote:


Thank you

Great, now i see what i need: Those mini boxes.


They fit just right
I got them from top shelf gamer

They are not the easiest to open.

I noticed another version called zen bins I think.

 
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Re: What are your toughs on inserts (like broken token)
Tanori wrote:

For me the relative cost to the game is what makes it expensive.

For example, for Scythe I paid 55 usd.

And the prices of the inserts are:
Broken token: 49.99 (plus shipping and tax)

First, Scythe has an $80 MSRP. So sellers undercutting this isn't really related to the relative cost of an insert.

The more important thing though... if you LOVE Scythe and want to play it a lot, you're going to be spending ages setting up and tearing down if you just keep things in the default stored approach. It seriously takes 20+ minutes to set this thing up. With an insert your setup is now ~5 minutes on a slow day.

Nicely engineered inserts have saved me several hours of setup time in just the last year. That's a lot more time I get to spend actually playing Scythe, Caverna, and soon to be Gloomhaven.

Time has value. It also doesn't hurt that the wooden inserts look really nice.
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Re: What are your toughs on inserts (like broken token)
boardgamesdotEXE wrote:
Tanori wrote:

For me the relative cost to the game is what makes it expensive.

For example, for Scythe I paid 55 usd.

And the prices of the inserts are:
Broken token: 49.99 (plus shipping and tax)

First, Scythe has an $80 MSRP. So sellers undercutting this isn't really related to the relative cost of an insert.

The more important thing though... if you LOVE Scythe and want to play it a lot, you're going to be spending ages setting up and tearing down if you just keep things in the default stored approach. It seriously takes 20+ minutes to set this thing up. With an insert your setup is now ~5 minutes on a slow day.

Nicely engineered inserts have saved me several hours of setup time in just the last year. That's a lot more time I get to spend actually playing Scythe, Caverna, and soon to be Gloomhaven.

Time has value. It also doesn't hurt that the wooden inserts look really nice.


MSRP means nothing to the consumer. Actual out of pocket cost is what I look at. MM with free shipping is generally the best price around.

If you look at how my scythe is stored 5 minutes setup is easy without an insert.

Many games can benefit from storage improvements and yes custom inserts are sweet but not needed in my experience (especially for scythe.)
 
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Re: What are your toughs on inserts (like broken token)
Dostradamas wrote:
boardgamesdotEXE wrote:
Tanori wrote:

For me the relative cost to the game is what makes it expensive.

For example, for Scythe I paid 55 usd.

And the prices of the inserts are:
Broken token: 49.99 (plus shipping and tax)

First, Scythe has an $80 MSRP. So sellers undercutting this isn't really related to the relative cost of an insert.

The more important thing though... if you LOVE Scythe and want to play it a lot, you're going to be spending ages setting up and tearing down if you just keep things in the default stored approach. It seriously takes 20+ minutes to set this thing up. With an insert your setup is now ~5 minutes on a slow day.

Nicely engineered inserts have saved me several hours of setup time in just the last year. That's a lot more time I get to spend actually playing Scythe, Caverna, and soon to be Gloomhaven.

Time has value. It also doesn't hurt that the wooden inserts look really nice.


MSRP means nothing to the consumer. Actual out of pocket cost is what I look at. MM with free shipping is generally the best price around.

If you look at how my scythe is stored 5 minutes setup is easy without an insert.

Many games can benefit from storage improvements and yes custom inserts are sweet but not needed in my experience (especially for scythe.)


This, the MSRP means nothing in this equation, what matters its what i paid for it (wich in every case for me, is never msrp).

Scythe, thats and inser i may get, but considering that my set up time is like 10 minutes, im not sure if i really need it...
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Not really, because it's not a fair comparison. If I sell you Scythe for $5 out of my closet, now every game ever is bad value.
It's not Broken Token's fault if someone sells the game at a loss to move product.
 
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boardgamesdotEXE wrote:
Not really, because it's not a fair comparison. If I sell you Scythe for $5 out of my closet, now every game ever is bad value.
It's not Broken Token's fault if someone sells the game at a loss to move product.


I still think its a fair comparison on how much each individual would be willing to spend on an insert.

In your example the price is ridiculous, besides it would be an used game, but even if it was new you can search for the price of the game, wich, right now pretty much every online reitailer sells it for les than 60.

 
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boardgamesdotEXE wrote:
Not really, because it's not a fair comparison. If I sell you Scythe for $5 out of my closet, now every game ever is bad value.
It's not Broken Token's fault if someone sells the game at a loss to move product.


You sure are hung up on MSRP are you affiliated with a manufacturer? They seem to be the ones that care about that magic number.

Selling below MSRP does not mean selling at a loss.

Manufacturers Suggested Retail Price is a fictitious number that has nothing to do with profit.

Profit is what is leftover after buying the item, selling it, then deducting all the transaction costs.

When I see a large retailer for years able to sell at a greater discount than most I understand they probably are buying better than most.

In resale it is not how much you sell for it is how much you bought it for.

Unless you have all the numbers involved you are just guessing.

A underpriced game from a closet is not what we are comparing.

Two real world costs today.
$58.98 for broken token scythe insert shipped to me

$60.99 for copy of scythe shipped to me from MM

Real world for me. BT insert is $2.01 less than the base game.
 
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For me, I couldn't care less what the game cost, absolute, relative, or otherwise. For me it's a matter of how much I value order and tidiness. And in my case I value those things an awful lot.
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ct5150 wrote:

No need to guess. Just figure the cost of the insert relative to the cost the game itself.


The cost of the insert to the game isn't a fair comparison though.

The board game publisher has a much wider market audience: People who play board games.

Broken Token has a much smaller audience: People who play board games who also like to keep their stuff organized.

So when ... lets say... a game like Arcadia Quest comes out, CMON knows how many copies of Arcadia Quest has been made. Hypothetical number: 10,000 copies.

Broken Token now has to decide if it's going to be worth their time creating an insert for Arcadia Quest. Perhaps it takes several days, to make a prototype, test it out on an Arcadia Quest box, make adjustments, etc... Lets say about 1 week.

So Broken Token spent a week on an insert for Acradia Quest, and even if they have the manufacturing capability to produce them en-masse (10,000 inserts). They also have a much smaller audience.

People who play board games > Who also own Arcadia Quest > Who also like to keep their games organized.

They're certainly not going to make 10,000 copies of an Arcadia Quest insert, because they know most people won't buy one, so they produce 500. Now they need to re-coup the cost of that 1 week development time as well as the cost of the physical material for the insert, as well as any money spent to advertise the insert, etc... Those 500 inserts need to cover the cost of everything INCLUDING the worker's salary so god-forbid they can actually pay their rent and buy groceries.

That's I see absolutely zero issue with paying for an insert no matter what the comparative cost to the game.

It's unfair to judge the cost of an insert with the game because the two are completely separate and unrelated from each other.
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Dostradamas wrote:
boardgamesdotEXE wrote:
Not really, because it's not a fair comparison. If I sell you Scythe for $5 out of my closet, now every game ever is bad value.
It's not Broken Token's fault if someone sells the game at a loss to move product.


You sure are hung up on MSRP are you affiliated with a manufacturer? They seem to be the ones that care about that magic number.

Selling below MSRP does not mean selling at a loss.

Manufacturers Suggested Retail Price is a fictitious number that has nothing to do with profit.

Profit is what is leftover after buying the item, selling it, then deducting all the transaction costs.

When I see a large retailer for years able to sell at a greater discount than most I understand they probably are buying better than most.

In resale it is not how much you sell for it is how much you bought it for.

Unless you have all the numbers involved you are just guessing.

A underpriced game from a closet is not what we are comparing.

Two real world costs today.
$58.98 for broken token scythe insert shipped to me

$60.99 for copy of scythe shipped to me from MM

Real world for me. BT insert is $2.01 less than the base game.


Still, at those priced i think is too much, 2 dollars less? you can buy the 2 expansions instead of the insert.
 
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Tanori wrote:
Still, at those priced i think is too much, 2 dollars less? you can buy the 2 expansions instead of the insert.

You can do a lot of other things with money besides buy something.

I think the problem is that you're dismissing the idea that time has value. If I really enjoy a game, cutting down setup time and/or having things well organized can have real value. I could figure out a solution myself -- and I have for many games -- or I could pay someone who's gone to the trouble to do that for me. Either way there's a tradeoff between time and money.
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Tanori wrote:
Hello guys, i just like to know what are everyone toughs on this inserts.

What i think is that most of the time they are very very expensive.

With the money you use to buy one you could easily get a new game or some expansions.

Of course if there is one particlar game you really enjoy, it could be a good investment as set up and tear down time would be hipotetically reduced.


I have never had an issue engineering my own solutions for much cheaper.

So would mever consider it. But I like figuring out ways to store things.
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