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Subject: Question regarding Betrayal Legacy Family Crest Tokens rss

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Jasper Geelen
Australia
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Good afternoon fellow boardgamers,

I have a quick question regarding the Family Crest Tokens (two per family) in Betrayal Legacy that I can't seem to figure out through googling or the rule book.

For example in the case of a tie which needs to be decided, the rule book states to shuffle the family crest tokens face down, then draw one at random to break the tie. However, from what I can tell, the family crest tokens are two-sided showing the crest on either side making it impossible to pick one at random.

So how would this work? Is this an error in production and should the crest tokens really only have had the image on one side? Or is there simply something I'm missing?

Thank you kindly in advance for any input.
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Sam R
United States
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Shuffle them under the table hold one in each hand (assuming they’re are only two) and have someone else pick a hand.

Throw them in a bag or cup and draw one out.

Pick your poison.
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Jasper Geelen
Australia
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LateShacka wrote:
Shuffle them under the table hold one in each hand (assuming they’re are only two) and have someone else pick a hand.

Throw them in a bag or cup and draw one out.

Pick your poison.


For shuffling this would work perfectly indeed. However there are other scenarios which call for the tokens to be kept face-down, and turned face-up to reveal information (as in the example haunt: "Take all the heroes' Crest tokens. Randomly select one and look at it but do not show it to the heroes. That hero is the Bride's Soulmate. Place the token face down on your family card.").

Now there are ways around this as well of course (keeping the token under a napkin or whatever). I was simply wondering if this was a production oversight or not. And if it is in fact an oversight, the goal would obviously be for this to be potentially fixed in future editions of the game.
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Rob Daviau
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Well, yes, the family crest tokens are double-sided.

However, the sample haunt (Haunt 0) is the only one that assumes they are one-sided. Since that haunt is never played, we narrowly averted disaster. I looked at the other haunts where there is a hidden traitor and we use a different system. I don't think that there are any haunts that have face down tokens but, if we missed one, I'll figure out a patch.

I also can't find the tie-breaking rule you mentioned in the rulebook. I'll keep looking.
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Harri Lal
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I think he may be referring to the bit on page 6 of the rules where it explains what the crest token is. It does say that the crests are to be used (face down and shuffled) to break ties between players.

Easily worked around, but I also wondered if it was an error for them to be doubled sided.
 
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Jasper Geelen
Australia
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RobDaviau wrote:
Well, yes, the family crest tokens are double-sided.

However, the sample haunt (Haunt 0) is the only one that assumes they are one-sided. Since that haunt is never played, we narrowly averted disaster. I looked at the other haunts where there is a hidden traitor and we use a different system. I don't think that there are any haunts that have face down tokens but, if we missed one, I'll figure out a patch.

I also can't find the tie-breaking rule you mentioned in the rulebook. I'll keep looking.


I'm very glad to hear that thank you.

And yea as Harry Lal said it's the bit on page 6 that explains what each token is. But I'm sure we can figure out a workaround to break ties.

Thank you again, I'm very excited to start the campaign tonight with some friends!
 
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Leonard Ash
United States
New York
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Hey Rob!

Super excited to play the c@@p of this thing! At the risk of ruining my legacy experience I flipped very VERY cursorily through the secrets of survival to see if there were any haunts that use the double sided crest tokens assuming they were one sided and alas I found one although it didn't take me too long so I didn't learn anything of import
Spoiler (click to reveal)
It's haunt 3 "Malignant"


Are there any rules that require them to be double sided? If not, do you advise blacking out one side of each token with tape or a permanent marker?

Thanks!
 
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Rob Daviau
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I’ll take a look in the morning.
 
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Rob Daviau
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The design and writing team is going to look over all the haunts and create an FAQ to address any issues we find. It may take a few days.
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Alexander T
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We ran into this on Haunt 21:
Spoiler (click to reveal)
Her Beating Heart
...which seems to expect crests are single-sided.

We wound up just blindly drawing at random from a closed fist, but it seems like the intent is that if you get drawn early you're less likely to be drawn again (because your crest is supposed to go to the bottom of the stack).

Additional issue we hit on the haunt:
Spoiler (click to reveal)
We weren't sure if an arrested player has their crests removed from the evidence stack, or if they are still placed to no effect. We wound up removing them (because it seemed unlikely you'd plant evidence for someone already in jail).
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Marlo T
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Has there been any update to whether anything requires them to be double sided? I noticed these same things about the rules i've come across, Haunt 0, and Haunt 3 also seems to assume they are single sided. We are debating gluing black paper to one side of them. But I'd hate to do that if they are suppose to be double sided, though I'm not sure what kind of situation situation would require them to be double sided.

Alas, I look to you all for guidance!
 
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Dwight Sullivan
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RobDaviau wrote:
The design and writing team is going to look over all the haunts and create an FAQ to address any issues we find. It may take a few days.

Did this happen?
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Mike
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Same thing here. They definitely need to be single-sided for Haunt 21, as they are stacked up face-down and the order of the stack matters.

We applied some duct tape to each one and cut it down to the crest shape for our game.
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Matt Dunn
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While I realize that the double-sided crests aren’t a huge issue, my wife used a black paint pen to very easily blackout one side of each token in about 15 minutes. They are found in the art sections of any big chain store, and obviously more artsy stores. So there’s one more solution in addition to other great solutions mentioned in this thread!
 
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Marius Chesney
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Unfortunately, Haunt 3 uses "face down" crest tokens. We were so confused this evening as we tried to figure it out. Still worked okay, but was confusing.
 
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Brian Powell
United Kingdom
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We assigned a number to each crest and placed a corresponding number below the crest face up. I.E. We took the 1-5 numbered tokens, face down, shuffled them, then placed a crest above the number. Then we had numbers 6-10 (minus one but we kept that number hidden) and when they looked on the tile, the player may flip the number up (6) and look at the corresponding token underneath crest (i.e. - Blue - 6, Green - 7, Yellow - 8, Purple - 9, Red - 10), and if the number 1 was beneath their crest, they were the traitor. (FYI - I had this haunt in my review and it was quite good if you have any questions on how we managed it, I am happy to discuss further)
 
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Jeremy Adkins
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Since the game assets (tiles, cards, etc) are already being marked and altered, would it be wise to take a marker and blacken out one side of each crest token, to fix this issue? Seems like the best option.
 
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Kevin Salch
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That would work.
 
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