Recommend
 
 Thumb up
 Hide
14 Posts

Betrayal Legacy» Forums » Rules

Subject: Haunt 49 (Disruptive wording in Secrets of Survival Tome) rss

Your Tags: Add tags
Popular Tags: [View All]
soak man
msg tools
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Hey all, we just played Haunt 49 last night, and sadly it was a bust due to some confusion in the Secrets of Survival Tome. Minor spoilers here, but pretty essential if you don't want to have a disappointing play.

Spoiler (click to reveal)
This scenario is set up with a hidden traitor mechanic. The problem is that all of the rules are in the secrets of survival handbook, but under the Hidden Traitor 'facts' information, the survival tome states, "Once the traitor is revealed, they take the Traitor card and read the text under "If you are the Traitor" on the next page. They control the monsters and normal traitor rules apply thereafter."

Well, in order to avoid having heroes read the traitor's objectives, nobody read the If you are the Traitor box, as we were instructed for the traitor to wait until he was revealed to read it.

(Having reviewed the rulebook, the very last thing in the booklet says hidden traitor boxes are public knowledge, but this seemed contradicted by the wording in the survival tome, and unfortunately, it was unclear to our group)

Unfortunately, one of the main actions the traitor can take BEFORE he is revealed, is listed in that box, as well as the traitor's win condition.

This meant that our traitor did not know what he was supposed to do, and also that a primary objective for him to lead to his victory was not known to him.

Also, in this haunt, you are only revealed as the traitor (outside of this box) if you are killed. Our traitor was under the impression that step 1 of his goals must be that he had to die so that he could read the box. The traitor was torn between trying to die and trying to think about how he could win without a clear objective as it seemed like he could not read his box until he died (and became revealed). He also did not want to ask to have the tome again and read something that he was not supposed to know yet.


I heavily recommend reviewing the rule in the Rulebook on Hidden Traitors and make sure that you follow it instead of what the haunt seems to suggest doing.

Since our traitor did not know what to do, the scenario was over before he even had a chance to form a strategy.

Again, I love this game and the story and theme but the occasional misinterpreted rule can be very disruptive.
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Nathan Rine
United States
Columbus
Ohio
flag msg tools
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Your interpretation is not how I would have played the scenario....
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
soak man
msg tools
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Good! This is here only to warn people who may interpret it similarly.

I'm not saying the game is bad or anything close, I'm just giving a heads up so people can maybe avoid a good experience turning into a disappointing one.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Thomas Koch
msg tools
mb
Thank you for this.

We almost did it wrong, too. Wanted to keep that part secret until the traitor, but one of our people took a quick peek at the page and realized we had to read that section.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Richard Lupino
United States
Rhode Island
flag msg tools
badge
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
We played it with three people last night...it 2as very quick, the heroes won easily...would love to hear from a group where the traitor won and how it happened. There have been a couple haunte now where for us the heroes won in less than 2 or three rounds.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Mark MacVicar
United States
California
flag msg tools
I think this is worthy of adding to the FAQ thread (https://boardgamegeek.com/thread/2101885/compiled-faq-spoile...)
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Syn Egg
msg tools
Spoiler (click to reveal)
Hey all

My group played this haunt tonight. We were very lucky that we had 1 neutral observer who read ahead and eventually decided they needed to point this out to avoid a potential ruined chapter.

The players initially guessed the traitor had to die and then would be revived or transform into a monster with access to new rules on the second page.

We would have felt quite disappointed if the traitor died and then the game ended and none of the extra stuff happened.

I feel if the players were allowed to read the second page right away it would be too spoilery as they may see the rules for the elder thing.

On a side note the traitor has only won 1/10 chapters in our 5 player game and about 6 of those were nail biters (last hero standing/clutch rolls/fate). This one was probably the closest as the last hero was a gambler, managed to survive the elder thing (low roll of 6 on 8 might vs 4 might on defense), limp away to kill the traitor with the crucifix sanity attack, steal the kris and hand mirror from their corpse, teleport upstairs with hand mirror and then closed the portal. Next turn the elder thing would have almost certainly destroyed them.

Would be very interested to get an official response from the creators
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Rob Daviau
United States
Unspecified
Massachusetts
flag msg tools
designer
publisher
mbmbmbmbmb
You should definitely read that box ahead of time. It's on my errata list to clarify/fix if there's a reprint.
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Syn Egg
msg tools
Thanks Rob keep up the great work! Looking forward to any expansion or sequels
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Dean Harris
United States
Tampa
Florida
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
I would have really appreciated if the traitor box dictated first how to reveal. It was an hour of wasted time.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Dean L
United Kingdom
Coventry
West Midlands
flag msg tools
We assumed that if we weren't meant to read that yet, it would have been in the Traitor's Tome, not the hero's book. It is confusing though.
1 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Kevin Elmore
United States
Missouri
flag msg tools
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
Deano2099 wrote:
We assumed that if we weren't meant to read that yet, it would have been in the Traitor's Tome, not the hero's book. It is confusing though.


That was my stance as well. Everything in the Survival Handbook is to be read by all heroes (and until the traitor is revealed, he is treated as a hero). Definitely worth mentioning to newer players since the OP's interpretation is certainly reasonable.

Our reasoning was that the traitor needed to know the information, and the heroes needed to know how to thwart the traitor. Certainly knowing the hidden traitor's goal was instrumental in arranging the board to try to stymie the traitor. I'm proud to have succeeded in my initial goal as traitor, though the sole remaining hero did manage to halt my world conquest with certain death looming just one room away. It was very close.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Danny Dawson
United States
North Carolina
flag msg tools
mbmbmbmbmb
To piggyback on this, if the traitor is revealed bc they die, and they haven’t already, do they get to summon the large monster still?
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Kevin Elmore
United States
Missouri
flag msg tools
Avatar
mbmbmbmbmb
dannydawson2001 wrote:
To piggyback on this, if the traitor is revealed bc they die, and they haven’t already, do they get to summon the large monster still?


I'm not near my books, but I wouldn't think so. Summoning is an action, right? I believe an INVOKE action? So I believe that if the traitor dies before doing the ritual, then that opportunity is lost.

Since the haunt was all about players distrusting each other while placing cultists, I took the intent of the haunt to be that the traitor bides his time until he can summon forth the necessary forces to stop the heroes. The longer the traitor takes, the more cultists he'll have, since you place N cultists per round during the hidden phase and only 1 cultist per round when the traitor is revealed. But the longer you take, the closer the heroes get to finding everything they need.

It's an interesting bluffing game, and it seems impossible (at 5 players anyway) to not have the situation where you can summon the creature. I could see some groups getting a bit trigger-happy and kill everyone else in the hopes of getting the traitor. It's a dangerous option, but it's certainly viable.
 
 Thumb up
 tip
 Hide
  • [+] Dice rolls
Front Page | Welcome | Contact | Privacy Policy | Terms of Service | Advertise | Support BGG | Feeds RSS
Geekdo, BoardGameGeek, the Geekdo logo, and the BoardGameGeek logo are trademarks of BoardGameGeek, LLC.