Isidor Konrad Maier
Germany
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Besides some breaks I have been playing in the TMTour League systems since 6 years. I really enjoy playing competitively against opponents on equal level.
By the time though, it becomes more and more boring to play the same map every to months and often its also the same factions.
The Fire&Ice expansion by now is 6 years old. Why are most of its elements not present in TMTour yet?
Do you really think that there is a critical mass of league-players who are not familiar with the F&I-expansion?
I get that the auction system is hard to program properly.
I also do understand that there are concerns about volcano factions, especially dragonlords, which are very likely to influence the results of other players. They can perform an extremely aggressive playstyle towards a particular player. This player would probably be chosen with respect to the present ranking in the league, which would lead to strong interaction between different games.
But why aren't variable and ice faction introduced yet? After the patches, none of them is too overpowered anymore.
And why cannot we vary the maps a bit at least?
Is there any poll, where one can vote for the introduction of new game elements to the tournament?
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Steve Haas
United States
Mountain View
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This conversation has occurred at various points in the past - although, admittedly, its been a while, so maybe its time to have it again.

The classic argument has been that success in the tournament tends to be a matter of success over a sustained period of time, and so there's a reluctance to change the rules too frequently or dramatically. Some people (such as me) enjoy playing the same setup and trying to perfect it rather than always chasing a different target. Add to this that its profoundly unclear that any of the expansion factions or maps is actually better or just different, and similarly unclear what the balance actually looks like, and it has resulted in a desire to preserve the existing tournament and add alternatives to it rather than changing the existing tournament. The argument being, basically: if you like the stability of the tournament, we'll preserve that; if you want a broader mix of maps and factions, perhaps something like the ladder would be more to my taste.

So: we could see how people feel about introducing new elements to the game. Perhaps popular opinion has shifted. But so long as a majority (or even a significant minority) like the stability of the tournament relative to alternatives, it probably doesn't make sense to disrupt it relative to just having the people who want more diversity seek it elsewhere.
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Robin Zigmond
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Durham
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There was talk quite a while back of having an second tournament, incorporating F&I, to run every odd month (alongside the normal one which is every even month). I can't recall now who proposed that and where it got to, but clearly it never happened.

Still, I agree with Steve, the F&I ladder caters quite well to those who want to play in more varied setups. Personally I'm very happy playing in both, but wouldn't object to an F&I league as well.
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James Ataei
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North Carolina
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Yeah, we definitely need a league with the Merchants of the Seas expansion. whistle

I don't think it would be too difficult to add in the round scoring tiles from Merchants of the Seas. The 4 tiles with Trade Scoring and Ship cult reward can be substituted with 2vp per any leech offered to opponents (once per turn, not per opponent) for Trade Scoring and 1w2c cult reward per Ship.

Mixing those in would really give a much different feel to the game.

Putting it in would be up to Juho though.
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Isidor Konrad Maier
Germany
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I would be in. Would we apply different maps?
 
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Oedipussy Rex
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JamesWolfpacker wrote:
Yeah, we definitely need a league with the Merchants of the Seas expansion. whistle
It should probably wait until the game hits the US market
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OedipussyRex wrote:
JamesWolfpacker wrote:
Yeah, we definitely need a league with the Merchants of the Seas expansion. whistle
It should probably wait until the game hits the US market
It's Zman/Filosofia. That could take a while...2021?
 
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James Ataei
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candoo wrote:
OedipussyRex wrote:
JamesWolfpacker wrote:
Yeah, we definitely need a league with the Merchants of the Seas expansion. whistle
It should probably wait until the game hits the US market
It's Zman/Filosofia. That could take a while...2021?
I have a US release date but I need to check if I can announce it. It is relatively soon though.
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Dhrun
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By all appearance Juho might be roughly semi-retired and Daniel three-quarters-retired, which would be no wonder after all those years.

For all it's worth 2.5 years back I started to gather and systemise thoughts people had about an extra F&I league
How would you like to experience TMtour and a new F&Itour in parallel
and related topics
Snellman and TMtour - Ideas to make a great gaming experience even better

Nothing much came of those threads beyond a few inital ideas, but maybe this could help some of you build some momentum. I moved on myself for now, but expect to be back sometime
 
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Robert
Germany
Bocholt
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About adding Merchants:
The moderator code is readily avaialable for downloading and tinkering. However if you want your code changes to become productive, you'd either need to set up your own web site running it, or convince Juho that your code changes are of high quality. If I remember correctly, Juho wrote somewhere that he's in principle willing to accept code changes to his moderator if the changes meet his quality standards (so likely the code changes should be well designed and documented, cleanly programmed, sufficiently tested and reviewed).

Adding the Merchants expansion will likely require quite a bit of rewrite and non-trivial changes in a lot of places, plus of course adding completely new modules for ship management and trading.


About adding a new tournament/ladder:
There are already two different SW systems external to Juho's moderator (namely Daniel's for the tournament, and Chris' for the F&I ladder) which are allowed to automatically create new games. So if somebody wants to create a different tournament/ladder and wrote and hosted the management SW somewhere, I'd be surprised if Juho wouldn't allow that person to create games as well. I have no idea whether Daniel or Chris would share their SW systems with others to use as a base - I imagine they certainly would want any reuser to refrain from constantly asking them questions about their code.
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Chris Harris
United Kingdom
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(for the record, I don't have any special privileges to be able to create games remotely; if i wanted to fully automate the process I'd probably need some, or maybe just more technical competence...)
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