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Subject: BGG.Con 2009 Math Trade Actual Discussion rss

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Mischa D. Krilov
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BGG Con Math Trade Sitrep
(color denotes current status)

Defcon 5. Add your game and stuff offers to the Actual Geeklist. Try to find the balance between quantity and quality. Check out the Request Geeklist periodically.

Defcon 4. Midnightish CST Sunday, November 1st, 2009 (or whenever Halloween gaming/festivities conclude late late): I close the Geeklist to further additions. Sunday, November 1st, 2009: I'll have the official summary done and JeffyJeff's Online Wantlist Generator ready for use. Yes, I plan to use Google Docs again for posting.

Defcon 3. Midnight CST Saturday, November 7th, 2009: Wantlists are due! Wantlists are due! Wantlists are due! Sunday November 8th, 2009: Results and all wantlists will be posted after I wake up and before noon Central Time. At this point in time, we make sure I didn't make any mistakes. Make sure all your items are marked as "for-trade" on BGG.

Defcon 2. Monday November 9th, 2009: Assuming all goes well, Ill declare the results official! Givers and getters, submit your trade requests through the BGG trade system. Feel free to make secondary trades.

Defcon 1. TRADE! Saturday, November 21st, noon to 1pm in Sunnyside (Still in Dallas; same room as last year.)

Defcon 0. Welcome home, gang! Postmortem time! "Ship" anything needed, update your collection, leave feedback for your trade partners, and generally discuss.
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Mischa D. Krilov
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Mischa's Newbie Guide to Math Trades

What the hell is a math trade?

A math trade is a way to orchestrate trades between people without requiring direct, one-for-one trades. Example: I give you a game, you give Aldie a game, and Aldie gives me a game. We all give; we all get. We didn't trade directly with each other. Now scale that up to several hundred games and dozens of people.

cry What do I do?

Read the rules as posted on the Actual Geeklist. If you're cool, inventory your games and add them to the list with a good description.

gulp Wait, I don't want to trade my signed Sid Sackson/Reiner Knizia RAcquire colaboration prototype with custom Rodin Fimo bits and get a slightly used travel chess set from the 1995 World's Fair Wheaties box!

No worries. All Math Trades are "No Risk" by definition. It's mathematically impossible for you to get a trade you didn't ask for. So just be mindful of your wantlists and only add games you're actually willing to accept for a given item.

blush Okay, now what?

Wait for further instructions, familiarize yourself with the deadlins and the Online Wantlist Generator. Subscribe to this thread! Ask questions! Tip!

This newbie guide is not to supplant Awesome Lindsey's Guide or the wiki entry. JeffyJeff's Online Wantlist Generator has its own wiki page, too.

Mischa
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Mischa D. Krilov
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The Official Summary is here.
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Mischa D. Krilov
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Prizes!

Once again, prize time in the BGG.Con Math Trade! We've got three choices.

Sweet: A variety of Hubig's pies.
Spicy: A selection of Tabasco goodness.
Jumpy: One pound of whole bean coffee from PJ's. Your choice of blend, decaf prohibited.

Cash value of all prizes will be less than ten bucks. Void where prohibited. I will not play.

To play, Geekmail me the answer to this question:

What is the percentage of successful trades for this year's Math Trade? Feel free to go to whatever decimal place you feel comfortable with. Remember, there's 1174 total items available for trade.

Once again, we're going with the Price is Right rule: Closest to the actual percentage without going over wins.
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Mischa D. Krilov
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Official Results

All right, we've had twelve hours to review and nobody has found foul with the results. (JeffyJeff has also already closed the OLWLG for this trade.) I'm going to call these the official results!

http://bgg.activityclub.org/olwlg/46943-results-official.txt

Amazing Jeff's Prettified human-readable summary:

http://bgg.activityclub.org/olwlg/trades-summary.cgi?listid=...
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Michael Schwerdtfeger
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I highly encourage you to change the rules about no geekgold, gift certificates, etc. Personally, I am more likely to trade games for these things than for other items. Since more trades is better than less trades, adding more items that people want is definitely in the spirit of this trade list.

If I can bring a game to BGG.Con that someone else wants, and not necessarily schlep one home, that is a good thing . I will, of course, happily carry new games home too, but I just don't see any downside of including gift certificates, etc.
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Daniel Corban
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Funny. I just came to the discussion thread to thank the mod for disallowing the usual gift certificates, etc. I seriously do not want people to jump in here and argue why they should be included, so I am not going to give my reasons why I feel how I do other than it is a breath of fresh air to me.
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Daniel Corban
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I want to start listing my items, but I am waiting for it to be added to the OWL.

There are some seriously teeny tiny things listed. Games that cost $5 retail. Either that is some serious trading up hopes or there are other highly desired $5 games out there of which I am not aware. We need some meat. I will be providing some ASAP.
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Mischa D. Krilov
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Hi, Michael.

I understand your reasoning, but I don't plan to change my moderation with a no-shipping trade, much less the BGG.Con trade. Here's why:

If you want to change games into money, then just plan to set up at the flea market. It's a no-brainer IMHO.

If you want to change money into games, then go to the vendors. These guys are committing to supporting the con and I want to see people support them in return. I feel very strongly about this. (Again, you have the option of the flea market.)

If you want to change games into geekgold, then I don't think a no-shipping trade is very efficient. (I could be wrong.) More importantly, I think it's boring and unexciting to physically hand a physical object to someone and get virtual currency in return. I'm not proud to admit that I got burned with Geekgold arbitrage, but that event doesn't factor into my decision/opinion: I want to see people trade games.

I don't mind people including a few non-boardgame items (RPGs, computer games, DVDs, etc), but most people are here to trade games, not stuffs. The 3:1 limit has worked in the past for this and other trades and causes few visible complaints.

I hope this makes sense. We can gab more about it at the con.

Mischa
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Michael Schwerdtfeger
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rossum wrote:
Hi, Michael.
If you want to change games into money, then just plan to set up at the flea market. It's a no-brainer IMHO.
Mischa
One more comment on this. Because it is a pain carrying games on planes (particularly with all of the increasing restrictions), I would rather only carry games that I know I will trade or otherwise get rid of. So, it is more attractive to me to know I have a trade (including for gift certificates) worked out in advance than to carry a game to the flea market and find out that I'm going to end up carrying it home again.
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Steve Duff
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dcorban wrote:
There are some seriously teeny tiny things listed. Games that cost $5 retail. Either that is some serious trading up hopes or there are other highly desired $5 games out there of which I am not aware. We need some meat. I will be providing some ASAP.
Meat is great of course, but it's also good to have small crap. I've got duplicates of some small crap, maybe it'll trade for someone else's small crap. Without small crap listed, there's zero chance of getting rid of it.
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Daniel Corban
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Well, I was hoping to trade away (and receive) some rarer, higher value lots. So far, its dinky little things like FFG silver line games. Maybe that is just how this trade will go, since a lot of people are traveling far and can't carry a lot of normal sized games.
 
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Mischa D. Krilov
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It's not even 24 hours since I opened the trade list, man. Give it some time!

Also, math trade strategy: Add your crazy rare high-value things. If you see nothing you want, blank wantlist time and no loss to you. When people see others offering high-value lots, you get a snowball effect and more high-value lots will show up.
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Randy Shipp
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rossum wrote:
It's not even 24 hours since I opened the trade list, man. Give it some time!

Also, math trade strategy: Add your crazy rare high-value things. If you see nothing you want, blank wantlist time and no loss to you. When people see others offering high-value lots, you get a snowball effect and more high-value lots will show up.
I kinda hoped Code 777 and a few of my offerings might have that effect. Guess I overestimate my stash's coolness. :-)
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Daniel Corban
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Code 777 will be on my want lists, do not doubt.
 
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Daniel Corban
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rossum wrote:
Also, math trade strategy: Add your crazy rare high-value things. If you see nothing you want, blank wantlist time and no loss to you. When people see others offering high-value lots, you get a snowball effect and more high-value lots will show up.
I know this brother. I also know that it is much easier to add entries using the OWL.

*edit* I have added my first wave of items.

Note that every item I have entered is using an image of the actual item. Yes, I am just that cool.
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B Orr
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Added a bunch of items this morning. Geekmail me if there is something on my trade list that you are interested in that I did not upload.

Is it November yet ?

We should create a BGG.CON 'math trade veteran' microbadge for everyone that has participated each year.
 
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UPDATE! The Math Trade is on the con schedule for NOON SATURDAY in Sunnyside.

Sunnyside's the same room as last year, the same room as the flea market. We should have enough tie to schlep our shopping haul up to the room, grab trade items, and be back in time for the trade.

PS: Feel free to trade games before zero hour.

PPS: Is it November yet?
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Tim Gilberg
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rossum wrote:

If you want to change money into games, then go to the vendors. These guys are committing to supporting the con and I want to see people support them in return. I feel very strongly about this. (Again, you have the option of the flea market.)
But the vendors available are rather limited in what they stock, and likely won't have some of the older games available in the Math Trade. I'll be honest and say that, looking at the lack of space on my shelves, I'd love to trade away a few games and get something intangible in return.

I'd at least like to see listings of Gift Certificates/Geekgold allowed as part of that 3:1 ratio. (Again, not as I'll list them, but because I'd love to add them to my want lists.)
 
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Flavio Jandorno
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For those wanting to trade games for $$$, I remember that last year a couple of guys did geeklist auctions, delivering the games at the con. Sounds like an option for those who want to get rid of some games and get some shelf space but don't want to take chances on the flea market (and end up not selling their games)
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rossum wrote:
UPDATE! The Math Trade is on the con schedule for NOON SATURDAY in Sunnyside.

Sunnyside's the same room as last year, the same room as the flea market. We should have enough tie to schlep our shopping haul up to the room, grab trade items, and be back in time for the trade.

PS: Feel free to trade games before zero hour.
For a lot of trades I make, I will request a trade before the specified time. I sometimes trade and then sell at the flea market, so I would need them before the flea market.
 
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Steve Duff
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Just put a few small things on the list, would like to see some more added.
 
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Mischa D. Krilov
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A friendly reminder from your moderator: Inventory your games before listing and accurately describe any missing bits, damage, or storage scuffs. When in doubt, imagine that you are giving the game to the craziest most exacting person you know and describe the game to them.
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Randy Shipp
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Mischa, how often does the Want List Generator get refreshed to include new items on the list?
 
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Mischa D. Krilov
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rshipp wrote:
Mischa, how often does the Want List Generator get refreshed to include new items on the list?
Manually. I try to do it at least twice a day; Once in the morning over coffee and comics, and once in the evening when I'm seeing if the internet still exists.
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