Nate Straight

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mateooo wrote:
Setting.
Hardcore gaming friend coming into town. Friend since highschool. This is a guy who, when we get together, we create a gestalt of competitiveness that typically leads to bitter arguments. (We have warred over Monopoly.. literally).

Don't you mean "conflicted over Monopoly", though?

And, hey... conflicts don't count, so you're good.
 
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mateo jurasic
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jimtwo wrote:
mateooo wrote:

For example:
"How I learned to stop worrying...": What is this? some Oprah Winfrey book of the month?


some sort of KGB mind control device... can't... stop... watching...
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Rastak wrote:
DaviddesJ wrote:
sbauer9 wrote:
I am hoping my humor detector is failing me.

If your humor detector didn't budge, then I think it's working perfectly. I'm guessing he meant to include some humor but just forgot.


Maybe it's a generational thing? Every ounce on the humor (humour) eluded me.


I totally disagree with this review. TS is an AWESOME game. I have played more than 14 games, some in person and some on wargamegeek.com, and even THOUGH I have only won like 2 games, I keep wanting to play again and again. And not only was the game one of the best I have ever played, it taught me a LOT about the Cold War, particularly regarding what a GREY war it was (not at all black and white like I have been taught to believe).

Amazing game! On this so-called rating scale, I would have to give it a 0.5, for totally awesome.
My only caveat, being, the potentially HUGE effect of dice on the game.



In regards to these comments... i truly dont understand the point of someone feeling the need to post a comment about a review that doesnt disagree with the review in any ways, but simply says "I dont find it funny"

What is the point of this? If you find the humor offensive, well sure, state that. If you dont enjoy it, well, stop reading and X it out. Seriously then, stop reading the dozens of responses to the review.

If you dont find it funny, and lots of other people seem to find it funny... well, going out of the way to criticize someone's attempt at levity and fun seems like kind of a DOUCHEBAG thing to do. Not only are you insulting the reviewer, but potentially all of the people who have found a little joy and humor in the review.
What kind of person tries to prevent someone from trying to make others laugh in a way that is not offensive or hurtful to, well, anyone that I know of?

Why not just find a picture someone posted of their wife playing a game and say "I don't find your wife attractive", or a game session post of someone's kids playing a game for the first time and say "Your kids are stupid since they suck at Castle Panic".



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David desJardins
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Alter Ego wrote:
If you dont find it funny, and lots of other people seem to find it funny... well, going out of the way to criticize someone's attempt at levity and fun seems like kind of a DOUCHEBAG thing to do. Not only are you insulting the reviewer, but potentially all of the people who have found a little joy and humor in the review.

What about the people who do think it's funny? Is it ok for them to say so? It seems to me a DOUCHEBAG thing to say, because they are insulting the people who don't think it's funny. Why is that ok?

I am still not sure whether it is intended to be funny, although I am leaning in that direction simply because others think so. But even knowing that it is intended to be funny, I have no idea what people would think is funny about it. I was hoping someone might explain, but I'm not holding my breath.
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DaviddesJ wrote:
Alter Ego wrote:
If you dont find it funny, and lots of other people seem to find it funny... well, going out of the way to criticize someone's attempt at levity and fun seems like kind of a DOUCHEBAG thing to do. Not only are you insulting the reviewer, but potentially all of the people who have found a little joy and humor in the review.

What about the people who do think it's funny? Is it ok for them to say so? It seems to me a DOUCHEBAG thing to say, because they are insulting the people who don't think it's funny. Why is that ok?

I am still not sure whether it is intended to be funny, although I am leaning in that direction simply because others think so. But even knowing that it is intended to be funny, I have no idea what people would think is funny about it. I was hoping someone might explain, but I'm not holding my breath.
This is like saying applauding a stand-up comedian is just as rude as booing him.

Though I can no longer identify the trolls or meta-trolls in this topic.
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DaviddesJ wrote:
What about the people who do think it's funny? Is it ok for them to say so? It seems to me a DOUCHEBAG thing to say, because they are insulting the people who don't think it's funny. Why is that ok?


My guess would be because you're that guy...

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theory wrote:
DaviddesJ wrote:
Alter Ego wrote:
If you dont find it funny, and lots of other people seem to find it funny... well, going out of the way to criticize someone's attempt at levity and fun seems like kind of a DOUCHEBAG thing to do. Not only are you insulting the reviewer, but potentially all of the people who have found a little joy and humor in the review.

What about the people who do think it's funny? Is it ok for them to say so? It seems to me a DOUCHEBAG thing to say, because they are insulting the people who don't think it's funny. Why is that ok?

I am still not sure whether it is intended to be funny, although I am leaning in that direction simply because others think so. But even knowing that it is intended to be funny, I have no idea what people would think is funny about it. I was hoping someone might explain, but I'm not holding my breath.
This is like saying applauding a stand-up comedian is just as rude as booing him.

Though I can no longer identify the trolls or meta-trolls in this topic.
Nobody can insult the comedian, but the comdian can insult anyone he wants?

I didn't find it funny. Just saying.
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shrug... nothing with insulting a comedian who insults you first, unless the joke doesnt insult anyone.

But picture this.
You are telling a joke, to a group of people (lets say 10). Its not an offensive joke. Insults no one. 8 people laughing, and 2 don't, they just dont find it funny, but politely walk away, say nothing or say:

"I dont get it can you explain?"

or

"eh, not my kind of humor"

or

"oh yeah, i heard that one before"

nothing wrong with that.

Now, lets say you tell a joke, to a group of people (lets say 10). Its not an offensive joke. Insults no one. 8 people are laughing. 2 people don't, they just dont find it funny. One says nothing, but the other says

"I'm guessing you meant to include some humor but just forgot."

Be honest... how would you respond to that person?

c'mon... im looking at YOU.




but again, my arguement has already been succintly championed wittlessly by the very person I am arguing against,

to quote "David desJardins (DaviddesJ) verbatum
"If you're not interested in such reviews, it takes you three seconds to skip over them. Meanwhile, 35 different users who aren't you have thumbed it as a good review for them. Which is more important, your three seconds of "wasted" time, or the useful information for those 35 users plus the hundreds of others who didn't bother to thumb?

You must really be bummed out, then, that 35 people thumbed the review, while you're tilting at windmills.
"

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David desJardins
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Alter Ego wrote:
"I'm guessing you meant to include some humor but just forgot."

Be honest... how would you respond to that person?

Honestly? I'd probably chuckle.
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David desJardins
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Alter Ego wrote:
You are telling a joke, to a group of people (lets say 10). Its not an offensive joke. Insults no one.

BTW, I'm pretty sure the humor in the OP, if it exists, is intended to insult people.
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mateooo wrote:
Rastak wrote:
DaviddesJ wrote:
sbauer9 wrote:
I am hoping my humor detector is failing me.

If your humor detector didn't budge, then I think it's working perfectly. I'm guessing he meant to include some humor but just forgot.


Maybe it's a generational thing? Every ounce on the humor (humour) eluded me.

There is nothing humorous about the THREAT of a RED REVOLUTION.

Perhaps it is a "generational thing." We need more people not of this generation to see this. They are not distracted by the allure of communist chicanery like "irony" or "sarcasm", and instead stolidly plod ever forward, with a grim determination to exterminate all contrary philosophy. I embrace you, brothers, with your more traditional ways of thinking.


I stand by my rating for this subversive propaganda.

On a scale of 10 to 1, with 10 dangerous Marxist rhetoric and 1 being The Word of Palin.

9.5, right above the truly nightmarish Stalinistic Dystopia of Agricola.


You start off very amusing and sort of clever but then you go to far and it is just uncomfortable and maybe a little frightening, but maybe that's just me.
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mateo jurasic
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DaviddesJ wrote:
Alter Ego wrote:
"I'm guessing you meant to include some humor but just forgot."

Be honest... how would you respond to that person?

Honestly? I'd probably chuckle.



Honestly, this could end in a chuckle. It would go something like this. Lets call the commenter Dan.

after the comment, the other nine people look awkwardly at eachother, one rolls his eyes and nods his head subtly toward Dan, another chuckles at that, and the others edge away from Dan, and the next time they all go out, a few more people dont want Danto come along.. maybe they all agree not to mention to Dan that they are going out for drinks after work. When they are drinking together they wonder where he got his social skills and if he had a very domineering, overprotective mother.

of course, people like Dan tend not to have 9 other people hanging around them, telling jokes. They tend to be alone, writing bitter posts on the internet, so really, its sort of a fictional scenario and shouldnt really be applied to real world situations.


I think it might be time you Xed this thread, since im a little concerned about the inordinate amount of attention you direct toward me.
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Matt Pappathan
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DaviddesJ wrote:
Alter Ego wrote:
If you dont find it funny, and lots of other people seem to find it funny... well, going out of the way to criticize someone's attempt at levity and fun seems like kind of a DOUCHEBAG thing to do. Not only are you insulting the reviewer, but potentially all of the people who have found a little joy and humor in the review.

What about the people who do think it's funny? Is it ok for them to say so? It seems to me a DOUCHEBAG thing to say, because they are insulting the people who don't think it's funny. Why is that ok?

I am still not sure whether it is intended to be funny, although I am leaning in that direction simply because others think so. But even knowing that it is intended to be funny, I have no idea what people would think is funny about it. I was hoping someone might explain, but I'm not holding my breath.

David,

I appreciate your rules comments throughout BGG. One more than one occasion your posts have helped me out. Thank you for that. I'll attempt to answer your question "I was hoping someone might explain, but I'm not holding my breath."

You don't find it funny... I don't see a problem with that. I love the Monty Python Dead Pirate Sketch... when my wife see's it she just shrugs.

I would venture a guess that some people find it funny for the same reason some people like the Colbert Report - the review takes a similar approach. He's pretending to believe one way but the rating he assigns and the comments throughout indicate that he believes the opposite of the strong negative statements he is making. Some people enjoy that style of humor - and you may, you may just feel it wasn't done well.

As I'm grateful for a number of your posts I thought I'd assume your question was genuine and answer to the best of my ability why some may find it amusing. I laughed at a few parts, I like the approach. That said I'm far from being an expert on humor, on people or really anything for that matter so take it for what it is, one person's opinion.

Regards,
Matt
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mateo jurasic
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to end the flaming, and get back to talking about the game twilight struggle.

There is nothing wrong with not finding a joke funny. If you feel the need to tell the joke teller you dont find it funny, well, thats your perogative. Its not a particullarly constructive comment, especially if a lot of people seem to enjoy the joke. Personally, I dont see the point of doing it, and, to me, it seems a socially innapropriate thing to do, unless of course the joke was made at someone's expense or was truly offensive.
That sort of comment, to me, would be a buzzkill. At a party, it would create what people call an "Awkward Silence"

To say that the joke had NO HUMOR (not just that you dont get it, dont think its funny, heard it already, or just dont appreciate that kind of humor) is blatantly rude and instigative.
At a party, that might induce what people call a "punch to the face".

Personally, I believe that you have something against me stemming from a prior conflict on BGG, and so no joke I could make would ever make you laugh... Thats fine too, but I will respond to uninstigated rudeness. so take your own advice, make whatever parting jabs you feel the need to make, and press that pretty little red x.



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mateooo wrote:
Honestly, this could end in a chuckle. It would go something like this. Lets call the commenter Dan.

after the comment, the other nine people look awkwardly at eachother, one rolls his eyes and nods his head subtly toward Dan, another chuckles at that, and the others edge away from Dan, and the next time they all go out, a few more people dont want Danto come along.. maybe they all agree not to mention to Dan that they are going out for drinks after work. When they are drinking together they wonder where he got his social skills and if he had a very domineering, overprotective mother.

of course, people like Dan tend not to have 9 other people hanging around them, telling jokes. They tend to be alone, writing bitter posts on the internet, so really, its sort of a fictional scenario and shouldnt really be applied to real world situations.

I would scream ad hominem except you have painted the truest picture of my life and I can't see past the tears in my eyes! I have a lot of apologetic phone calls to make. Maybe I can set this right...which once went wrong.

In all seriousness, I stand by my original comment. Not a review. Now that your post is the second most popular review of Twilight Struggle, your audience has changed. It's no longer the hardcore geek who is hip to what you're doing--it's the noob who's reading about Twilight Struggle. I hope they can figure it out for the game's sake.

If you'd posted this in general, or as a geeklist, I would have thumbed it.
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David desJardins
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mateooo wrote:
Personally, I believe that you have something against me stemming from a prior conflict on BGG

Your ego is running away with you. I have no idea who you are or what kind of previous interaction we had, and don't really care. Given your response here, it's not surprising that you responded in some similar way on some previous occasion, with threats of violence or whatever, but no, it didn't rise to the level that I taped a picture of your avatar above my monitor to remind myself of your threats.
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David desJardins
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mathaos42 wrote:
I would venture a guess that some people find it funny for the same reason some people like the Colbert Report - the review takes a similar approach. He's pretending to believe one way but the rating he assigns and the comments throughout indicate that he believes the opposite of the strong negative statements he is making. Some people enjoy that style of humor - and you may, you may just feel it wasn't done well.

This helps a bit, thanks. I tried re-reading it from this point of view and I can see some of what you're getting at. A lot of it is a question of framing. Colbert works a little better because he's caricaturing a particular stereotype that already exists. This seems like it's caricaturing something that doesn't exist (the redneck game reviewer?) but if you read it that way then I can see what he's trying to do.
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I beg to differ: Colbert has not nor ever will be funny.

Except for the Olympics.

Ok, I just contradicted myself....damn...Ha! I got your hat! Take that, hatless!
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Imagine yourself in a room with 19 other people. Somebody asks a question where the answer is either "A" or "B". You think the answer is "B", but everyone else says "A".

Most people would start to rethink and see if they missed somthing, then come to a conclusion to either change to "A" or stick with "B".

Some people would wonder why everyone else is wrong, but never change their mind.

A few people would wait until everyone else said "A" and then yell "B" as loud as they can, just to see how many people are annoyed by this and how they will react. If someone starts discussing why they would do this, they would try to come up with creative "arguments", just to keep the discussion going. That's just their kind of fun.
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David desJardins
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ogrim wrote:
Imagine yourself in a room with 19 other people. Somebody asks a question where the answer is either "A" or "B".

Are we talking about, "Is it funny, or not?" The answer to that is not either A or B. It can be both. Some people will think it's funny and some people won't.
 
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Wow. As I read through this thread, I got the same feeling I get when I pass a road accident. This is just sad. I totally agree with David.

Not about anything he's said in this thread of course, but when he said "If you're not interested in such reviews, it takes you three seconds to skip over them."

That made tons of sense. That is basic social skills, right there: Just because one has an opinion, doesn't mean it's always appropriate or meaningful to tell everyone about it. For example: It's ok to laugh in a cinema, but people don't want to hear you whine and complain about plotholes. This is of course something that all normal persons instinctively know. You'd have to be a complete sociopath to walk in on a group of laughing people just to say "hey, just so you all know: Personally, I didn't find that joke to be funny at all."

If one is offended by the joke (or believe that others may be), hey, then it's serious business; and one should definitely talk about it. No arguing about that. But if it's just that you happened to be lukewarm about something that many others enjoyed - then, I'd say that David's earlier comment was absolutely spot-on: It takes less than three seconds to click on something else and read that instead.

That advice is such a fundamental part of social skills, I expect everyone to follow it. Even the guy who said it in the first place.

To OP I just want to say "thanks for the chuckles." I enjoyed it quite a lot.
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I'm pretty sure that if you REALLY think it's sociopathic to post opinions to a discussion forum, as opposed to just saying such offensive things to get a rise out of people, then there's something wrong with your perceptions of reality.
 
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Thanks to the OP for a quite clever and funny review.

I know you can Red-X peoples' posts, but is there a universal ignore button on BGG?
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turbothy wrote:
I know you can Red-X peoples' posts, but is there a universal ignore button on BGG?

Yes; if you check under a persons name you have a menu (to the right) where you have the option of hiding all posts from that user.

Beware! - it's against the rules to *say* which users you have put on your ignore list. So don't do that. Check the forum rules for more information.

DaviddesJ wrote:
I'm pretty sure that if you REALLY think it's sociopathic to post opinions to a discussion forum...

I certainly don't. If you want to know what I think, go read my post. No need to guess or make stuff up.
 
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Everyone has the "right" to put there opinion on this forum. Thats the point of it. Its a forum. But that doesn't mean everyone should.

Let me give an example, again.

Lets say I put a picture of my wife playing a game with me on the forum.
I think shes beautiful, and Im so proud she's willing to play some of these games with me, whether or not she is just humoring me (she loves anything with zombies... btw).

so I put it up, and under it a little quote that says
"Guys, I am so lucky, check out this beautiful girl who's charitable enough to play a game with me on a regular basis."

So 10 people look at the picture. 6 people look at the picture, think that indeed she's a pretty person, and post nice comments like "you are a lucky dude", or, "excellent, shes a true beauty", or even "jeez dude, she's must be really slumming it to hang out with you" (HUMOR NOTIFICATION a light hearted tease,actually sort of a compliment.)


One person doesn't think she is pretty, but he is polite and says "A very fine wife you have" (This is called polite behavior, and this is a socially appropriate lie.)

One person doesnt think she's as pretty as all that, so he moves on to the next post, not making a comment, and RED Xing the thread. (APPROPRIATE BEHAVIOR)

Another person doesnt think she's pretty, and posts "Well, she's allright, but nothing compared to my wife" (STILL APPROPRIATE, but only maybe if he softens the comment with something like "my wife frequents the forums so I have to say this)

A third person types "I think he meant to find a beautiful wife, but then forgot and found this girl instead"





This is simply wrong, even if you think this wife is the ugliest wife in the world, and in fact IS NOT BEAUTIFUL.
No one wants to hear this comment. Not the OP. Not the other people on the forum. It is not constructive. Its not improving the forum experience. Its not improving the picture/post/thread. It is a douchebag thing to say. It might be intended as a joke, but it is bad taste. It also reflects terrible social skills.

If the picture had a caption like "My wife is hotter than yours" or "Check it out suckers, you could never get a wife like mine" or "And shes great in the sack too." well, those would deserve some less polite responses.


The only way you can rationalize this behavior

A) the commenter and the OP dont like eachother for some reason (I wrongly assumed this, trying to find some rationale behind why this guy would make such a post)

B) the commenter lacks the knowledge about social skills to realize this is inappropriate behavior, (maybe they are autistic, or socially delayed due to prior experiences)

C) the commenter is a douchebag

I assumed B was wrong, and wanted to believe C was wrong, but I have been told that A is DEFINITELY WRONG, so now i am stuck with B and C. Is there a fourth option? Maybe, but I can't think of one now. Feel free to offer one. Im at a loss.

If anyone thinks this last response is appropriate to make to a stranger's posted picture of his wife, well then, post right now and say so.


So what does this have to do with this thread?
Well, Humor, like beauty, is SUBJECTIVE. there is no joke that everyone finds funny, just like not everyone will find the same woman beautiful.

As long as the humor is not perverse, insulting, offensive, or condescending, its generally harmless, and can make things fun.
In normal society, it is not appropriate behavior to stand in front of a group of strangers who are laughing at a joke and tell them "The joke is not funny" Or "That joke has no humor".

It is alright to not laugh along, to say "I dont get it", to say "I heard it before" (BTW that other thread about TS was WAY FUNNIER THAN MINE, but I only read it after it was pointed out in this thread, so any similarities are coincidental... go check it out... im kinda proud we had some of the jokes), or to say "Not really my sense of humor"

Those are appropriate responses.


Commenting on the points of the review... appropriate
Disagreeing with the points of the review... appropriate.
Saying its not really a review... appropriate, (hey, I did describe the components, the gameplay, the theme, the objectives, the strategies, my problems with the game (too much reliance on swings of dice), my favorite parts of the game (wonderful history lesson and theme, always able to make a comeback, great cards) and I gave it a rating and explained my rating system)
Pointing out grammatical and spelling errors... appropriate, but a little lame
Pointing out gameplay mistakes... absolutely appropriate
Saying you dont find it funny... appropriate, i guess, but I would never do it. Its just not constructive, might hurt feelings, and doesn't add anything to the discussion
Saying you dont get it... totally appropriate, maybe someone will help you appreciate it.


Saying its a Bad Joke, or that it has no humor whatsoever... What is the purpose of this comment? (A, B, or C?)

Do you not want people to spend the time and effort making a review more than just a boring list of rules and complaints? Don't you WANT people to add some flavor and humor to a review, even though it might not work 100% of the time. God, we are gamers, not comedians. The fact that we can make a review that makes 10% of the people laugh is near miraculous. What do you get from telling a bunch of laughing people that the joke wasnt funny? I wouldnt...


Even I can identify a joke I dont find funny... And Im clearly no genius, i assure you. I can't even handle long division or match my socks to my belt. But I am usually polite enough to chuckle, or make a humorous groan and shake my head (Jean Luke Picard... god i miss you), just to acknowledge the brave attempt at a public joke told to countless strangers, a joke exposed to potential scorn and ridicule... people clap when a skater falls but gets up and finishes their routine.

I simply would never tell any of the brave souls who post on this forum that their jokes had no humor (unless they were hurtful), that their wives had no beauty, that their kids had no cuteness. Even if I believed differently.

If you agree, please post. If you disagree. please post.
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