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Subject: Expansions guide ?! rss

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Volker Hirscher
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(update 18 Nov 2010: added LATT expansion, only goat is missing now...

Hi all,

With more and more expansions coming out, playing with really EVERYTHING makes less sense with each new expansion. So, the last days I thought about how the different components of AH and its expansions can be combined, if there are any dependencies between components and so on. If there already is some kind of guide on this issue, a link would really be welcome. If not, your help would be appreciated to make this thread a complete listing of what can be combined with what and the existing dependencies between the different components. I will update this first post with your input (or publish a pdf or something).

I’ll try to make a start (by far not complete, as time is short at the moment - missing entries marked with '?'), sorted by expansion. Each card type lists other card types which are also required when using it (e.g., when using the Dunwich board you need the Dunwich encounters). I do not list the cards which are needed so that a card type may come into play (e.g. exhibit items only come in play when using Mythos or encounter cards from the Pharao-expansion, but this is not listed here explicitly).

Any improvement on how to better show the dependencies are really welcome, I am not satisfied with this form (and may later switch to a matrix or graph or something).

And another note: The granularity of the list here is really 'component', not card. That means: If will e.g. write "Mythos cards: require allies" even if only one ally is actually referenced in the mythos cards - I'm not going to throw in single cards, so that does not make sense, I guess (although I will sometimes mention the one card, but this is not a complete list then...)
---------------------------

General dependencies for all expansions (valid for all cards of all expansions):
Common items: -
Spells: - (exeption: KIY spells require 'magical effect' cards)
Unique items: -
Skills: -
Monster markers:: -
--> all these types of cards can be used without using any other cards from the expansions

Curse of the dark pharaoh (COTDP):
Exhibit items: - (means "no other cards required")
Allies: Require Exhibit items (for one ally: S. Danforth)
Barred Cards: -
Benefits/Detriments: Require Barred-Cards (for one benefit: private eye)
Arkham Location Cards: Exhibit items, Allies, Barred, Benefit/Detriment cards
Gate cards: Require Exhibit items, Benefit/Detriment cards
Mythos Cards: Require Exhibit items, allies (Erich Weiss)

Dunwich Horror (DH):
Dunwich Board: Mythos cards, Gate markers, Dunwich location cards, DH monster
Investigators: Some require specific cards: Common items, unique items, Injury/Madness cards
Injury/Madness cards: -
Allies: -
Gang Membership: -
Rail Pass: -
Condition: -
Ancient Ones: Children of Abhoth, Servants of Glaaki, Rubble markers
Arkham Location Cards: Gang membership, unique items, common items, Injury/Madness cards, Rail Pass, Condition cards
Dunwich Location Cards: Rail pass, Condition cards, Injury/Madness cards, Allies
Dunwich Horror monster: DH tokens, DH cards
Dunwich Horror Cards: Injury/Madness
Dunwich Horror Tokens: -
Mythos cards: DH board, Injury/Madness cards
Gate cards: (can be used without DH board and gate markers, but that makes little sense) Injury/Madness cards
Gate Markers: Dunwich Horror board, DH Gate cards
Rubble Markers: -

King in yellow (KIY):
Herald KIY: Blight cards, yellow sign tokens, riot monsters
Blight cards: -
Yellow sign tokens: -
Riot monsters: -
Act cards: -
Mythos cards: Act cards
3 Riot monsters: -
Gate cards: -
Arkham Location cards: -


Kingsport Horror (KH)
Investigators: common items, unique items, skills
Kingsport board: Mythos cards, Gate tokens, Kingsport location cards, Rift tokens, rift progress markers, Captain of White Ship/White Ship/Changed/Great Seal cards
Guardian Sheets: Bast tokens, Nodens cards, Hypnos cards, Bast cards
Allies: -
Nodens Cards, Hypnos Cards, Bast Cards: -
Captain of the White Ship Cards: -
Changed Cards: -
Ancient Ones: Brood tokens
Herald Sheets: -
Arkham Location Cards: - (one requires KH board, but that can be handled)
Kingsport Location Cards: Allies
Mythos Cards: KH board
Epic Battle Cards: Sinister Plots
Sinister Plots: Epic Battle Cards
Monster Markers: Aquatic markers for 2 specific Arkham locations
Rift Markers/Rifts: -
Gate Cards: (can be used without KH board and gate markers, but that makes little sense) Allies
Gate Markers: KH board, KH gate cards
Brood Tokens: -
Bast Tokens: -
Aquatic Markers: -


Innsmouth Horror (IH)
Innsmouth board: Innsmouth location cards, Deep One Rising tokens
Investigators: None
Personal Story Cards: TO BE CLARIFIED
Ancient Ones: Ghatanothoa's Visage tokens, Small Dust cards, Zhar token, Tendril of Nyogtha monster
Arkham Location Cards: -
Innsmouth Location Cards: Innsmouth Look
Mythos Cards: Board, Innsmouth Look
Gate Cards: None
Ancient One Plot Cards: None
Innsmouth Look Cards: TO BE CLARIFIED
Small Dust Cards: -
Herald Sheets: -
Monster markers: Aquatic markers for 2 specific Arkham locations
Uprising tokens: -
Ghatanothoa's Visage Tokens: -
Zhar Token: -
Aquatic Markers: -


The Lurker at the Threshold (LATT)
Relationship Cards: -
Herald (Lurker): Dark Pact/Reckoning Cards, Power tokens
Dark Pact: -
Reckoning Cards: -
Power tokens: -
Arkham Location Cards: -
Gate Cards: -
Mythos Cards: -
Replacement Gate Tokens: -

------------------------------------

So, what's the use of this all? Now I know that I can e.g. use all items without thinking "oh, I may need some other card if I play with the Kingsport items", or " I can use the rail passes without needing to put other cards into play".

I will try to complete this list as soon as possible, and add King in Yellow and Kingsport if anybody finds this thread useful. I do not own “goat” or “Innsmouth” yet (the latter was not published in German so far, and as I am only collecting the german expansions…). Corrections are welcome!

Cheers!
 
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Freelance Police
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I usually play with a single expansion, so don't mind keeping components in separate boxes -- just grab the base set and another box, and I'm good to go!

AH base game:
* All AOs which have no special components
* All Investigators with no cards from expansions
* All monsters except aquatic
* Injury and Madness cards (Dunwich)
* Final Battle cards (Kingsport)
* Personal Stories (Innsmouth)

Dunwich
* Investigators who start with cards from Dunwich set
* AOs with special components
* Curse of Dark Pharoah expansion set

Kingsport
* Investigators who start with cards from Kingsport set
* King in Yellow expansion set

Innsmouth
* Aquatic monsters
* Goat in the Woods expansion set

...if I get more frickin' monsters, I'm going to separate the hexagonal ones to the Goat in the Woods set for the Herald's cup!
 
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Tibs
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mavo wrote:
With more and more expansions coming out, playing with really EVERYTHING makes less sense with each new expansion.

This is fundamentally where you and I part. While not perfect (the game is complicated, and suffers from mechanics dilution and significant theme dilution), this is my preferred way to play. If you're not into that, then Sam & Max's suggestion of choosing a small and big expansion for each expansion is a fine way to guarantee that no particular components fall to the wayside. Though, this method requires "sort out" time before every game, which can be a pain.

By and large, each expansion is independent of the others. There are occasional references from one expansion to another, but for the most part expansion components are either "universal" or "expansion-specific."

I tried formatting the information as you recommended, but note that the farther down this list you go, the less experience I have with the expansion and therefore the less confident I am about my entries (I may have missed something written in a rare encounter somewhere).

Curse of the Dark Pharaoh
Exhibit Items: -
Spells: -
Allies: - Requires Exhibit items for one ally.
Barred from Neighborhood Cards: -
Benefits/Detriments: -
Arkham Location Cards: Exhibit items, a couple specific spells, Allies, Barred, Benefit/Detriment cards
Gate cards: Requires: Exhibit items, Allies, Barred, Benefit/Detriment cards
Mythos Cards: Exhibit items, a couple specific spells, Barred, Benefit/Detriment cards, and Erich Weiss ally if you really care


Dunwich Horror
Dunwich Board Mythos, Gate, and Dunwich location cards
Investigators: Some require specific item cards
Injury/Madness cards: -
Common/Unique/Spell/Skill/Ally: -
Gang Membership/Rail Pass/Condition: -
Ancient Ones: Children of Abhoth, Servants of Glaaki, Rubble tokens
Arkham Location Cards: Gang membership, Rail Pass, Condition cards, Injury/Madness
Dunwich Location Cards: Rail pass, Condition cards
Gate Cards, Injury/Madness, Allies
Dunwich Horror Cards: Injury/Madness
Monster Markers: -
Dunwich Horror Tokens: -
Gate Markers: Dunwich Horror board, DH Gate cards
Rubble Markers: -


The King in Yellow
Common, Unique items: -
Spells: Magical Effect cards
Blight Cards: Riot monsters
Magical Effect Cards: -
Arkham Location Cards: -
Gate Cards: -
Mythos Cards: Act cards
Act Cards:
Herald Sheet (The King in Yellow): Blights, Yellow sign tokens, Riot monsters
Yellow Sign Tokens: -
Riot Monster Markers: -


Kingsport Horror
Kingsport board: Mythos, Gate, and Kingsport location cards, Rift tokens, rift progress markers, KH Allies (except Zoog), Captain of White Ship/White Ship/Changed/Great Seal cards
Investigators: A couple KH Common/Unique items
Guardian Sheets: Bast tokens, Blessings of Nodens, Visions of Hypnos, Beloved of Bast cards
Common, Unique items, Spells, Skills, Allies: -
Blessings of Nodens Cards/Visions of Hypnos Cards/Beloved of Bast Cards Captain of the White Ship Cards/Changed Cards: -
Ancient Ones: Brood tokens
Herald Sheets: -
Arkham Location Cards: I can't remember, but probably nothing
Kingsport Location Cards: Allies
Mythos Cards: Kingsport board for a few Mythos cards
Gate Cards: Young Zoog ally for one of them
Epic Battle Cards/Sinister Plots: -
Monster Markers: Aquatic markers for the two specific Arkham locations
Rift Markers/Rifts:
Gate Markers: the Kingsport board and gate cards
Brood Tokens: -
Bast Tokens: -
Aquatic Markers: -


Black Goat of the Woods
Common/Unique/Spell: -
"One of the Thousand" Cult Membership Cards: Cult encounter cards
Corruption cards: Cult Membership cards
Cult Encounter Cards: Corruption cards. Unique items
Arkham Location Cards: Cult Membership, Corruption cards
Gate Cards: Probably Corruptions
Mythos Cards: Probably corroptions for one or two
Difficulty Cards: -
Herald Sheet (The Black Goat of the Woods): Corruptions, Cult Membership, Cult encounter cards
Monster Markers: -


Innsmouth Horror
Innsmouth board: Innsmouth location cards, Deep One Rising tokens
Investigators: Nothing per se, but Silas Marsh's ability and penalty are most useful with the Innsmouth board
Personal Story Cards: again, none per se, but have the Innsmouth Look cards and Deep One monsters handy for a couple of them.
Ancient Ones: Ghatanothoa's Visage tokens, Small Dust cards, Zhar token, Tendril of Nyogtha monster
Arkham Location Cards: Probably only Innsmouth Look cards
Innsmouth Location Cards: Probably only Innsmouth Look cards
Mythos Cards: Innsmouth Look
Gate Cards: Probably Innsmouth Look
Ancient One Plot Cards:
Innsmouth Look Cards: Deep One Rising tokens, Deep One monsters
Small Dust Cards: -
Herald Sheets: -
Monster markers: Aquatic markers for the two specific Arkham locations
Uprising tokens: -
Ghatanothoa's Visage Tokens: -
Zhar Token: -
Aquatic Markers: -


The Lurker at the Threshold
Common/Unique/Spell cards: Probably nothing
Relationship Cards: Probably nothing
Dark Pact/Reckoning Cards, Power tokens: The herald sheet appears to be the only way to get these components into play, so these all probably need each other
Arkham Location Cards: Probably nothing, but maybe Relationship cards
Gate Cards: Probably nothing
Mythos Cards: Probably nothing
Herald Sheet (The Lurker at the Threshold): Dark Pact/Reckoning Cards, Power tokens
Replacement Gate Tokens: -
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Volker Hirscher
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Hi, and thanks for the great input from you both.

I have to disagree, though: I don't want to play with only one expansion (because there are a few really essential expansion components, and I am too lazy to srt everything out after the game).

So, to partly agree with Kungfro, I usually play with almost all components, but feel that the Mythos deck becomes too thick and you loose the feeling of the expansions. I saw a few variants round here, but they did not work for me. So, I usually only sort the mythos deck cards, but a guide for all other cards and pieces would be nice.

Back to topic: I will take a closer look at the list and check it - thanks for the effort so far! I will put it on top of this thread at the weekend.
 
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JGT
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I don't know if this will be helpful--I'm in Sam&Max's camp, and I'm not "too lazy" to separate everything out after every game or two--and I agree that I'm the last guy that should be anywhere near this thread, but at various times while AH grew bigger, I tried something of what you seem to be attempting.

When I got fed up with Dark Pharaoh--reasons too numerous to go into here--I wanted to see how much of it was salvageable before I sealed it up with duct tape. It was easy enough to take the few Spells I liked, as well as the three dual-color Gate cards, the three double-doom-token Mythos, and a small sampling of Exhibit cards that didn't suck for the Sarah Danforth Ally; none of these cards required the rest of DP to work, and I had no desire to see Barred, Benefit or Detriment cards ever again. But what about the Allies? As it turns out, the 7 Allies each have 1 Encounter card that grants them specifically, and most of those Encounter cards do not require any of the rest of DP to be in play (with one exception, easily ignored). So I just took those 7 Encounter cards (and the rest) and adopted them into my Dunwich box. Most of those cards are shuffled into any game I play, whether I'm playing Dunwich or not.

There are three mechanics in Dunwich that can (almost) be easily separated out and integrated into any game without requiring the rest of the box in play: Conditions, Rail Passes, and Sheldon Gang Memberships. First of all, I don't know about you, but in my dozens and dozens of games, I can count on ONE HAND the number of times any of these cards entered play. Well, that's because there is ONE Encounter card to activate each Condition, TWO Rail Pass Encounters, and TWO Sheldon Gang Membership Encounters. Unfortunately, Darke's Blessing can only be activated with a Dunwich Encounter, but the other 7 Encounters can be easily shuffled into any game without Dunwich. Although I bet they'll STILL never happen. yuk

When I got fed up with Black Goat--yeah, same deal--I used the same method above to determine if the Cult Mechanic was worth keeping. As it turns out, there are only FOUR Cult Membership Encounters (spread amongst the three Cult Locations), and IIRC only two or three other Encounter cards that have anything to do with Corruptions. I don't like the Black Goat Herald, and without it, none of the Cult/Corruption stuff works. But if you really wanted that stuff in your games, that's another 4-7 Encounters easily shuffled into any game.

HOWEVER, the Black Goat Mythos are perfectly generic. What I mean is...the Dunwich and Kingsport Gate Burst Mythos all require their respective towns to be in play (they put Clues or Monsters on small boards), but the BG Gate Bursts do NOT. So when Innsmouth came out with Mythos that ONLY activate in Innsmouth, I lost any chance of an Arkham Gate Burst. Black Goat Mythos adopted into Innsmouth box: problem solved and Black Goat Expansion sealed with duct tape.

(There is every possibility that the Lurker Expansion Mythos may substitute for the BG Mythos in this regard, so I may end up using even LESS of BG permanently.)

Poor King in Yellow: its only special mechanic is the Act Deck which is diluted into oblivion with even ONE other expansion in play, and I don't care to remember the myriad of Anti-Dilution Fixes because my games change so much (in contents). I still think it has the best theme, and makes for the best Base Game-Small Box Expansion blend, but I think I've played it out now, so I've just taken out the Investigator cards, the Blights and the Herald, and the darling "Intermission" Mythos card for use in any game.

I don't think this will change how you play your games, but it might be a bit more revealing about how half of an Expansion might be reliant on a mere one to two other cards in that Expansion to work, and how easily they can be surgically removed and grafted to the base game.

P.S. Something for all to consider: When one plays with every Mythos card ever printed on the table, one will still only draw an average of 20 of them for any game. The rest of that deck is a TOWERING PEDESTAL of useless cards taking up space...
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jgt7771 wrote:
P.S. Something for all to consider: When one plays with every Mythos card ever printed on the table, one will still only draw an average of 20 of them for any game. The rest of that deck is a TOWERING PEDESTAL of useless cards taking up space...

Yes, but since you don't know which Mythos cards you're going to get during a game, it's meaningless to consider that so many of them will go to waste. Plus, I like the Mythos tower. It's intimidating cool
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jgt7771 wrote:
I

Poor King in Yellow: its only special mechanic is the Act Deck which is diluted into oblivion with even ONE other expansion in play, and I don't care to remember the myriad of Anti-Dilution Fixes because my games change so much (in contents). I still think it has the best theme, and makes for the best Base Game-Small Box Expansion blend, but I think I've played it out now, so I've just taken out the Investigator cards, the Blights and the Herald, and the darling "Intermission" Mythos card for use in any game.

...


You don't have to shuffle the KIY cards in with the rest at all; keep them separate for the "Touring Performance" variant where you use only the KIY cards at first, they're placed on top of the rest.

I guess if they're shuffled into the uber-stack of Mythos cards the "Next Act Begins" will be of little consequence. But the KIY Herald will still play a part since you'll get Blights when the terror level goes up... I've mixed the KIY items, spells and Other World cards in with the general populace but not the Mythos cards. Certain items are real game-changers (like "Press Pass" and especially "Arcane Insight")
 
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Volker Hirscher
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Just updated my first post - I checked really every card in COTDP. I found some differences to kunfro's post. I hope that my statements are correct, but if you find any errors please let me know.

Ah, and by the way: Thanks to Kungfro for the formatting - I'll take that for my updates in post 1. And thanks for the input!
 
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