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Subject: Battles Lost, Supply Exhausted rss

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Jim Temple
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I've got the Valley edition, and just need a little clarification on a couple situations:

1) The rules state
Quote:
A player may not be able to place all of a card's blocks...in which case he places as many as he can. A player may not, however, voluntarily place fewer blocks than shown on the card.
Suppose I wanted to play a card with no Cannon and 3 Red blocks so it's in my display as a tie-breaker, but the Red supply is exhausted. Is it legal for me to play that card and place zero blocks, or do I need to be able to place SOME blocks for it to be legal?

My guess is this is legal, and sneaky.

2) Is the Battle considered lost only in the event of an unresolved tie? What about if nobody placed anything in the Battle Box that turn, or if there were no Generals in our displays during the Battle Phase?

My guess is that the Battle is considered lost unless there is a definitive winner, and this can create interesting situations!
 
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brian
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1) REVISED: Yes, this is legal. You may play a card and place zero blocks if there are none left in the supply.

2) Yes. In the event of a tie, it is only lost if a tie remains unresolved. A battle is lost if no tokens or generals are present.
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Jim Cote
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Wow. In all my playing of this game, #1 has never come up. Good question.
 
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Eugene
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We had a variant of #1 just the other day in our 3p game. One player had used all his control markers and wanted to play a personality card just to get it into his display. We deemed it a legal play.
 
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brian
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aaxiom wrote:
Can't the phrase, "...as many as he can." mean zero?
Yes, I think that is how we decided. However, I am having a hard time finding the email thread that took care of this. I still have a sneaking suspicion that zero = can't play that card. In other words, to choose this option, at least one block has to be placed.
 
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brian
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OK, finally found it.

Yes, we left the wording that way because "as many as he can" may mean zero. So you could play the card down placing zero blocks if zero were available.

With the variant situation above, we did not run into this before. But my leaning would be the opposite as players have a little more control over their own pieces and they are limited.
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Kevin Nesbitt
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Hmm... how would this situation ever arise in a game? In the original rules for Liberte, the minute any one faction's blocks were exhausted the round ended, meaning it would be impossible for the next player to be in such a situation.

Is this a change in the current edition?
 
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brian
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otrex wrote:
Hmm... how would this situation ever arise in a game? In the original rules for Liberte, the minute any one faction's blocks were exhausted the round ended, meaning it would be impossible for the next player to be in such a situation.

Is this a change in the current edition?
No it is not a change. It is true that the ROUND ends once a supply is exhausted but the round is completed in full with all players getting equal turns. That was part of the original rules.

So Player one could exhaust the supply, and Players 2+ might run into this situation if they are trying to place the exhausted blocks.
 
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Kevin Nesbitt
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Now that I think about it, I must be confusing it with a house rule or tournament rule (where the round ends immediately).

Very good, thanks for the answer!
 
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Jim Temple
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Awesome, thanks so much for clearing these up!!
 
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Juan Carlos Goyes
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Bogota
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It’s true hard work never killed anyone, but I figure, why take the chance? - Ronald Reagan
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juliki wrote:
that's the way we played it two days ago: the round ended immediately! We have to read the rules again.

Yeah It Seems we played that rule wrong.
 
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Mr Cricket
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juliki wrote:
so if nobody has a general in display (we had that situation two days ago) or if nobody placed anything in the battle box, the battle is not considered to be lost an no white block is placed on the battle? So it doesn't count towards royalist counter revolution sudden death victory?
thanks
That's incorrect according to the first edition rules where it states that

Quote:
Every battle for which no player gained VPs is regarded as a lost battle and counts as a single controlled CR province, which reduces the number of provinces that need to be controlled on the map.
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brian
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juliki wrote:
so if nobody has a general in display (we had that situation two days ago) or if nobody placed anything in the battle box, the battle is not considered to be lost an no white block is placed on the battle? So it doesn't count towards royalist counter revolution sudden death victory?
thanks
No, that was not our intent. Reading back over where you got that from, it seems I did not read the rest of the question and my answer implied something I did not mean it to imply.

When I said "only" I meant that in the event of a tie, it is "only lost" if the tie remains unresolved. If no one sends any forces or generals, the battle is still lost. I will clarify my answer above.
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Jim Temple
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Ah, thanks for the correction!
 
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Kinley Engvalson
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You say, "Suppose I wanted to play a card with no Cannon and 3 Red blocks so it's in my display as a tie-breaker, but the Red supply is exhausted. Is it legal for me to play that card and place zero blocks, or do I need to be able to place SOME blocks for it to be legal?"

But I do not read the rules as authorizing the placement of blocks when a player puts a card in his display for later use. Am I misunderstanding something?

Thanks.
 
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Jim Temple
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In the rules for the Valley Games edition, it's in the "Clean-up" sidebar.

After playing a card you can either discard it or save it in your Personal Display. The rules regarding the Display are in the same sidebar.
 
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Kinley Engvalson
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Thanks!
 
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